Fl districts requiring masks up to four times lower COVID-19 cases per capita 

originally posted by: DaCook

Do masks work? Yes. You are a damn fool to think they don’t. Are they 100% percent effective in all situations. Obviously not or they would not go to such extreme measures in orthopedics.

Why do you think we basically did not have a flu season? Answer: Masks! You are a damn fool to think they do not help. And a damn fool to not want to protect children.

I don't think the debate is over whether or not masks "work". Clearly masks work at something or they would have never been invented or used prior to this pandemic.

And its quite clear that people on both sides of the debate want to "protect children". It is an example of extreme hubris to think that only one's own political and/or idealigcal camp has children in mind and that the other camp simply does not give a crap about children. The only difference I see on this subject is in what people believe best serves their children.

When we get past the extreme hubris that the "other" doesn't want to protect children and when we get past the fact that masks do in fact work in some capacity to protect the health of those who interact with the user than the debate becomes one of risk and cost analysis.

As you pointed out masks dont work 100%. So at what percentage do they work? 5% 20% 40% 60% 80% 95%?

And at what costs are involved in their mandate and use? As a parent myself I can tell that mask mandates do have a real world negative impact on the development of children. I can see first hand the alienation and social detriment that mask mandates and other covid measures have caused in my children and their peers.

And what about more phisophical costs where this thread began; parental and states rights over federal mandates? Technocratic rule over democratic rule.

Are mask mandates worth these costs if mask are only 5% effective at stopping the spread of covid? Are they worth these costs if they are 95% effective?

What I find most fascinating is that no one in authority is even trying to quantify these costs vs benefits. And that the rest of us are allowing them to so spectacularly fall down on that job. Instead we make this all a tribal political debate who's goal is not necessarily helping children but instead more about being "right" in a national and global social media debate.

originally posted by: Mark08
How about this:
www.oann.com...

Ooff! Gut punch with a knee to the face for a follow up.

originally posted by: DaCook

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: DaCook

Do you wear masks during surgery made out of T-shirts? Or cotton masks made by Hanes purchased from Walgreens?

Masks are required for entry into an operating room. Wore a mask on average 3 days a week for 30 years, n guess what? I somehow survived. What grade are you in to ask a question like that?

Denny

Yes. I agree that masks make a difference if they seal like in N-95 mask, are N-95 masks or better rated, worn by professionals training how to don, wear, remove, and have a proper waste stream.

What does that have to do with elementary children wearing cheap a$$ masks with no training made from old clothing coming home with food stains from when they ate lunch? While they do strenuous activities in the gym like play tag.

originally posted by: chr0naut
So, if terrorists spread a biotoxin or deadly pathogen, they are terrorists, but if others willfully do exactly the same thing, but believe they have a political right to do so, it isn't?

People will die.

Humans evolved social behavior that encourages getting sick, such as massive partying, subconsciously touching face and picking nose. Without frequently getting sick the immune system is dangerously low and that can be lethal. Even a cold can be lethal without a frequently boosted immune system. These Democrats are going up against human nature. Very dangerous.

Why Everyone Has the Worst Summer Cold Ever

a reply to: neutronflux

IMO it's mainly to hide their faces to make them look submissive and make sure they cannot recognize each other indoors.

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: dandandat2

What kind of scientific study was done? Based on what? And how was the cause isolated down to masks?

Anyway. There was a real scientific study…. On a large scale.

Report: CDC Downplayed Scientific Finding that Masking Children Not Effective in Schools


According to the NYM, the study published by the CDC covered more than 90,000 elementary-school students in 169 Georgia schools from November 16 to December 11. The study, according to the CDC, was the first of its kind to compare COVID-19 incidence in schools with certain mitigation measures in place to other schools without those measures.


tallahasseereports.com...

The NYM spoke with scientists who” believe that the decision not to include the null effects of a student masking requirement (and distancing, hybrid models, etc.) in the summary amounted to ‘file drawering’ these findings, a term researchers use for the practice of burying studies that don’t produce statistically significant results.”

from the article.

that's very interesting considering Lord Fauci declared that masks do not work (rare video get it before it gets removed!)

a reply to: network dude

I also have to wonder. Are those kids masking everywhere in the area or just at school? If they are only masking at school but then going out into public and not being masked, how can the schools really claim that only wearing a mask at school is instrumental in anything? It isn't like these are quarantine days where the kids would be coming straight from home to school and going straight back again day in and day out. Instead, they go who knows where and mix with any number of people, none of whom would necessarily be masked at all.

a reply to: dandandat2

Listen, I don’t spend hours researching medical data on the effective of masks as I lived the life. Can only you tell masks are required in the OR, they are no big whoop to wear, and I have almost never seen an infection. Those extremely few that I am aware of are most likely linked to a break in sterile technique. Do me a favor, google or YouTube hip replacement surgery. If you have a ball, watch the whole procedure. Think you may have a different prospective on why orthopedic physicians go beyond normal.

Masks are a no brainer, if not, say you require surgery, tell the physician, his staff, and the OR supervisor that masks are a scam, and you refuse anyone in the OR to wear one. See how that works n get back to me.

Also, to the guy who asks how do you teach a 5 year old to wear a mask. Poorly wearing a mask, is better than not. Plus, kids can learn, appears unlike a whole bunch of ATS people. I used to respect this website, certain people have informed and educated me. No longer, way too many flakes n pure idiots. And I am honestly disappointed to say that.


Denny

a reply to: DaCook

Poorly wearing a mask, is better than not.

Tell that to personnel working industry in forced air respirators working in oxygen free atmospheres.

Or personnel working in an arsenic area.

Or military personnel in a chemical / biological attack.

Or tell that to doctors working in an Ebola hot spot.


You haven’t answers if you surgeon’s wear cheap masks made out of old T-shirts? Or cotton masks made by Hanes bought from Walgreens….

originally posted by: neutronflux

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: chr0naut

Really?

Then why the call to double mask.

I dunno. Do surgeons double mask?

Do we have any historical use of double masks, showing effectiveness?

I thought that the idea of double-masking was invented by those trying to deny the effectiveness of masks, as part of their nonsense disinfo campaign?

You know that’s utterly false and totally BS.

'Double Masking ‘Makes Common Sense,’ Fauci Says

Jan. 26, 2021 -- Anthony Fauci, MD, says wearing two masks is better than one when it comes to warding off the coronavirus.

www.webmd.com...

No, he said that it was common sense that a second layer should give more protection. He never instructed anyone to double mask.

I do know what Fauci said, a few days after the claims alleging that he'd advised to double mask were all over the Internet: "The CDC does not recommend that you should wear two masks, nor does the CDC recommend that you have to wear an N95 mask. They just say, 'The most important thing is get everybody to wear a mask,'" This was from a CNN Town Hall on January 27.

Watch the entire CNN coronavirus town hall

For Joe Biden, two face masks are better than one in the era of COVID-19

The former vice president said he arrived at the National Constitution Center in Philadelphia for his separate town hall with an N95 mask under the blue surgical mask that he wore onto the stage.

"I walked in here with this mask, but I have one of the N95 masks underneath it. And I left it in the dressing room, the room I was in before I got here," Biden said when talking about the importance of masks to stop the spread of COVID-19 – and the importance of modeling good behavior.

www.usatoday.com...

... and a previous President advised people to take HQC (contrary to his own doctor's, and the CDC's advice), and that the sound of windmills cases cancer.

It is clear that US Presidents do, and say, dumb stuff.

a reply to: DaCook

I am not a "guy". It's a common mistake, and even though you are an arrogant jackwagon, I'll forgive you for making it.

Do you know how many times I've tried to "teach" my kid to wear a mask properly? I am forever telling him to pull it up over his nose, and forever hiking it up for him. But every time I turn around, it's right back under his nose.

Not only him though, everywhere I go, even into restaurants and their staff, people are wearing masks under their nose. They have been since this started.

As to masks being "no big whoop", maybe for you they aren't. But try being hearing impaired and relying at least in part on lip reading. That's my kiddo.

Meanwhile, I have both mild asthma and claustrophobia. I tolerate masks, but only just. Generally speaking, I simply don't go much of anywhere anymore. It's easier than wearing a mask which is highly uncomfortable, and no ... I don't adjust to them. I think I would have by now if I was going to.

Thankfully, I work in a non-masking county and my employer doesn't require them, so the only place I wear one with any regularity as required is at practice. It's a measure of how much I want to practice that I put up with it there.

a reply to: chr0naut

You

No, he said that it was common sense that a second layer should give more protection. He never instructed anyone to double mask.

Dr. Fauci demonstrates how to wear 2 masks correctly on TODAY

www.today.com...

Got any other false propaganda

a reply to: DaCook

You seem like an intelligent person DaCook; but I am not really sure why you are providing information about mask use by surgins in an operating room in a thread dedicated to mask use by children in schools.

I understand that you don't spend hours researching medical data ... most people don't; but do you have any relivent information regarding mask use by students in schools? The effectiveness of mask use by children in schools and more importantly the cost benefits analysis of their use?

a reply to: chr0naut

What to maintain credibility while posting….

Don’t use absolute terms like never….

a reply to: ketsuko

It's been my current experience that most people aren't even trying to ware their masks correctly; and its been that way for a long time.

Maybe in the first few months of this pandemic when people didn't fully understand what we are dealing with people "tried" to ware them correctly.

But now everyone save for a few are just wearing them any which way just because they are told they have too.

originally posted by: YongSu

originally posted by: chr0naut
So, if terrorists spread a biotoxin or deadly pathogen, they are terrorists, but if others willfully do exactly the same thing, but believe they have a political right to do so, it isn't?

People will die.

Humans evolved social behavior that encourages getting sick, such as massive partying, subconsciously touching face and picking nose.

Such highly evolved behaviors. LOL

Without frequently getting sick the immune system is dangerously low and that can be lethal. Even a cold can be lethal without a frequently boosted immune system. These Democrats are going up against human nature. Very dangerous.

Why Everyone Has the Worst Summer Cold Ever

So, are the masked kids (the ones the OP talks about) getting sick, or not getting sick?

a reply to: dandandat2

We went into Chipotle to grab something when we were on the road, and not a single one was wearing it over their nose. LOL.

No I will admit that I wear one as loose as I can get away with because when it impedes my breathing or sucks in against my face, it triggers the panic response and I tend to hyperventilate which causes me issues, but I always make sure it's going to stay hooked over my nose.

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: chr0naut

You

No, he said that it was common sense that a second layer should give more protection. He never instructed anyone to double mask.

Dr. Fauci demonstrates how to wear 2 masks correctly on TODAY

www.today.com...

Got any other false propaganda

Did he not say, in the article that you linked, "The recommendation is not that you have to wear two masks"?

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: chr0naut

You

No, he said that it was common sense that a second layer should give more protection. He never instructed anyone to double mask.

Dr. Fauci demonstrates how to wear 2 masks correctly on TODAY

www.today.com...

Got any other false propaganda

Did he not say, in the article that you linked, "The recommendation is not that you have to wear two masks"?

It's not always common sense that more is better too.

With a lot of things, more can actually be a bad thing even if so much is very good. Water, oxygen, etc. ...