Has an Mrna vax ever been used on humans before now

a reply to: Hecate666

Of course those that had the jab will find anything to make it seem like a good idea. Otherwise the fear of the consequences would drive them insane.

It's a bit like 'sunk cost fallacy' isn't it? Except they've bought into it, and they can't get out now. Once jabbed, can't be un-jabbed.

a reply to: 1947boomer

I mean, I appreciate your response, but it may do you well to look back at the comment to which I responded, which reference "vaccines" in a generic way, so I replied in a generic way.

a reply to: Xtrozero

I've been on Reddit like twice in my lifetime, so if that's what you think, then you're not thinking.

Again, for the hard of reading, I will ask you to consider the fact that I was responding to a comment that mentioned "vaccines" in a generic way, so my comment is valid, since some vaccines do result in ADE.

Sorry that I didn't get overly specific so that some people on here didn't get confused, I guess. I hope that I didn't ruin any 75-year-olds' perception with my comment. Maybe you should instead go complain to Nonspecific for being...well...not specific in their comment about vaccines as well.

ETA: In fact, show me where I said that ADE is happening with COVID-19 vaccine recipients at all (hint: I didn't). Instead, you seem to relish in misconstruing things that are actually said by me and others, and honestly, it's getting rather old. And your cute little jab about Reddit is nothing but an ignorant personal attack because you really have nothing of substance with which to argue against my comment. Also, if you're going to quote something, you need to provide the link. You're doing a "disservice" to everyone on here otherwise.

a reply to: new_here

There's a lot of that fallacy happening around here. Even when people are introduced with white papers and other evidence to support an opposing position, they still basically fold their arms and say, "Nuh-uh!"

originally posted by: Itisnowagain

Can you supply a source for the bit you quoted please?

I can't remember the search I used, but here is another saying the same thing from the National Library of Medicine. The reality is that it is kind of well known that ADE is related to very specific viruses that have some weird variants where getting sick with one screws up your body fighting another variant, but the makeup of the virus is much different for that to be possible, so a great example of what I'm talking about with the untruths and hyperbolic points about the vaccine that pretty much has flood all of media lately.


NLM

originally posted by: SlapMonkey

There's a lot of that fallacy happening around here. Even when people are introduced with white papers and other evidence to support an opposing position, they still basically fold their arms and say, "Nuh-uh!"

I think there are people unwilling to even listen and that is a big issue on both sides of the argument, and both sides are relying on anything they can pull off the net as proof. The problem is pretty much all that is pumped on the net is not really science. To get really creditable and accurate results/conclusion is really hard, and even when they do things basically right they can still get it wrong. That is why RCT is extremely important to really come up with any answer.

As example even when they want to do right it can go wrong. Recently two major studies for Ivermectin have been retracted by the writers and these were peer reviewed, posted in two major science magazines etc.

In these studies over 90,000 electronic records were used and after the fact investigations found many inconsistencies. These were teams that have done good studies in the past, so not someone doing something crazy, but people trying to do it the right way. The problem was basically everyone wanted answers right now and so everything was pushed to within a very short period, like the peer review was days and not months as example.

So in the end we really need to be carful what we see as true information and what is just social media BS.

a reply to: Xtrozero

Which is why, when I generally make claims and OPs, I link to white papers and even the CDC and the WHO to back my claims. And I tend to do it when more than one study has found similar findings. If that changes in the future, I will change my take on it (assuming that I find the new studies as credible).

But since you didn't address my post above that one, I will re-address the issue: please don't ever accuse me of getting my information from Reddit again--that is the tactic of laziness. You also didn't show me where I ever once claimed that ADE is happening in COVID-vaccinated patients. Basically, what I'm saying is that your initial response to me was out of line and based on a false premise that I was claiming something that I was not. And then you respond to me again ignoring these points.

originally posted by: SlapMonkey

Again, for the hard of reading, I will ask you to consider the fact that I was responding to a comment that mentioned "vaccines" in a generic way, so my comment is valid, since some vaccines do result in ADE.

Sorry that I didn't get overly specific so that some people on here didn't get confused, I guess. I hope that I didn't ruin any 75-year-olds' perception with my comment. Maybe you should instead go complain to Nonspecific for being...well...not specific in their comment about vaccines as well.

OK fair enough, but the only vaccine I know of is the Dengue vaccine which the Dengue virus can do the same. We are talking about mRNA COVID vaccine in this post so unless you specify then maybe I'll think you are referencing what the post is about, and if you Google "does mRNA vaccine cause ADE" and you will get a 1000 hits saying it does, so ya it isn't unusual for someone to think this too.

Instead, you seem to relish in misconstruing things that are actually said by me and others, and honestly, it's getting rather old.

Once again what is the post about... I assume people are talking about the post and not the Dengue vaccine....

a reply to: Xtrozero
This is what I found when I did a search.....

Given past data on multiple SARS-CoV-1 and MERS-CoV vaccine efforts have failed due to ADE in animal models (75, 81), it is reasonable to hypothesize a similar ADE risk for SARS-CoV-2 antibodies and vaccines. ADE risks may be associated with antibody level (which can wane over time after vaccination) and also if the antibodies are derived from prior exposures to other coronaviruses. In addition, ADE with mast cells likely plays a role in MIS-C for infants and possibly older MIS-C and MIS-A patients. While expanded trophism of SARS-CoV-2 represents a possible ADE risk in the subset of COVID-19 patients with disease progression beyond the mild disease stage.

www.frontiersin.org...

There's a lot to read in the link, I have just provided the summary.

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: Xtrozero
This is what I found when I did a search.....

Given past data on multiple SARS-CoV-1 and MERS-CoV vaccine efforts have failed due to ADE in animal models (75, 81), it is reasonable to hypothesize a similar ADE risk for SARS-CoV-2 antibodies and vaccines. ADE risks may be associated with antibody level (which can wane over time after vaccination) and also if the antibodies are derived from prior exposures to other coronaviruses. In addition, ADE with mast cells likely plays a role in MIS-C for infants and possibly older MIS-C and MIS-A patients. While expanded trophism of SARS-CoV-2 represents a possible ADE risk in the subset of COVID-19 patients with disease progression beyond the mild disease stage.

www.frontiersin.org...

There's a lot to read in the link, I have just provided the summary.

I know of this, and read it before... It is based on animal studies suggesting that the virus may cause ADE which means if the virus could then the vaccine could too.

it is reasonable to hypothesize a similar ADE risk for SARS-CoV-2 antibodies and vaccines.

It has been proven that flu, cold, SARS-CoV-2 and so on viruses can not cause ADE, so what is actually your point you want to express here?

Now as we have 4+ billion vaccinated there is no cases of ADE, so I think that kind of supports all this too. They did see this with the Dengue vaccine that killed like 600 kids in the Philippines, but then the Dengue virus can do the same.

a reply to: Xtrozero

Now as we have 4+ billion vaccinated there is no cases of ADE

If there are causes of ADE i doubt a number of them would be reported as a result of the vax. Even now you have the media defending the BCs saying its not due to the vaxs dispute the connections made before.

originally posted by: HawkEyi

If there are causes of ADE i doubt a number of them would be reported as a result of the vax. Even now you have the media defending the BCs saying its not due to the vaxs dispute the connections made before.

OK whatever, they hiding it, everyone is in on it, so on and so forth. Why would they not list it as they have done everything else.

We are also back to the problem that it is a specific virus to cause this and COVID and like viruses are not one of them.

They also say they are monitoring for possible Thrombosis with thrombocytopenia syndrome, Guillain-Barré Syndrome and Myocarditis, but not ADE if it was observed? That one they need to keep it a secret...lol

a reply to: Xtrozero

There are already some shills in the MSM coming out now saying things like well if you got heart inflammation its problary not from the vax but from covid.

Yet they cant prove that it was covid if you tested negative for the virus and yet still have inflammation.

They also say they are monitoring for possible

But MSM in some cases will never make link it to the vax. They will in some cases.

originally posted by: HawkEyi

There are already some shills in the MSM coming out now saying things like well if you got heart inflammation its problary not from the vax but from covid.

Yet they cant prove that it was covid if you tested negative for the virus and yet still have inflammation.

CDC is following these cases as is other places like Israel, so they are straight forward it has happened, but still want to figure out the relationship with the vaccine. CDC is saying 778 and Israel is saying 275 as to their numbers. They both have said pretty much all have returned to normal within a short period too.

One thing to remember is the same protein in the vaccine is in the virus, so both seem to have a chance to cause this.

a reply to: Xtrozero
I wouldnt have any faith or trust in agys like CDC or FDA. The same FDA that approved Pfizer when it showed that 95% effectiveness..


The only reason i think FDA approved the vax was to push these vax mandates all across the states. But your somewhat right about the Israeli case and have you noticed how many of the western news outlets are staying quiet on Israeli covid surge of cases?

originally posted by: HawkEyi

I wouldnt have any faith or trust in agys like CDC or FDA. The same FDA that approved Pfizer when it showed that 95% effectiveness..
The only reason i think FDA approved the vax was to push these vax mandates all across the states.

You are kind of limiting your options to some idiot on YouTube or Reddit. Someone that talks real sense is a doctor that goes by ZDoggMD on You Tube. He is a straight shooter and will call out the FDA when they screw up too. Maybe give him a go.

Delta is extremely infectious....