It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

What if "Karma" and "Reincarnation" actually works backwards

page: 2
11
<< 1    3 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 11:57 AM
link   

originally posted by: TerryMcGuire
a reply to: dandandat2


Not until the soul has learned to endure the greatest hardships this plane of existence can create does it then move to the next.


What if a soul needs to repeat a challenge, say, a dozen times, might we think that it has little to no memory of the eleven times is has not succeeded? Should this scenario be I think that it would not have that memory as we have only a few stories of people who claim to have those memories. See where I'm going with this ?

There are these stories if, how to put this, miracle kids who have proven knowledge of the life of some dead person for a few years until they themselves grow up. There are a few of those I have read. Likewise there are many examples of people who seem pulled to this or that that seems to express familiarity with some other life or time or place? Right? But mostly we live, and mostly here is ''way mostly'', without knowledge or even attraction to any other life than our present life.

This then would mean that for the vast majority of anyone's lives, make that ''everyone's'' lives we go though those lives unconscious of what is really happening to us. A baker a book salesman, a soldier, what ever , does those things we do and somehow, that challenge holds over from one life to the next until it is met. I think that coincides with what you are suggesting.


Perhaps the physical reality of the hardships are less important than the mental or spiritual hardships. The soul doesn't remember its past physical life but it does retain the mental and spiritual capacity that it has learned.

The man doesn't remember that in his past life he went hungry as a penny less vagrant but his soul does remember how to effectively deal with that hunger. A tool it will need to use in its new more impoverished life.




The next question I arrive at is the nature of these ''challenges''. Who or what sets them. Do you think they might be set by some kind of unconscious and automatic law or function of existence? Might they be conscious challenges established by a larger ''soul'' that is an accumulation of all those previous lives looking to continue on this path of progression.

This leads me to consider that maybe these challenges are not challenges so much as goals. These challenges or goals seem to be met for the most part unconsciously from this standpoint.

I think I might have gone on rambling here trying to get to a thought that has eluded me. Maybe next time.


I hadn't thought that far ahead.

The goal vs challenge argument is just a matter of perspective and so is the question of "who sets the goals".

The sports franchise sets the challenges of the game, but the athlete still needs to push himself to exceed those challenges; he does so by setting even more more finite goals for himself.

With my limited understanding of the universe; that contains concepts such as conservation of energy, causality, entropy to name a few; I would guess the question of "who sets the goals or challenges" is probably a lot more complex and likely woven into the fabric of the universe itself. Who sets the goals? No one; the goals just exist as a substance of the universe to be understood and over come.

This is not to discount the possibility of higher "god like" forms of the soul. When the soul has endured all the challenges of this plane of existence it might move on to a higher plane.



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 12:17 PM
link   
a reply to: pthena
There is no separate I.
That's why Zen benefits no one



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 12:33 PM
link   
a reply to: TerryMcGuire



I think I might have gone on rambling here trying to get to a thought that has eluded me. Maybe next time.



It happens. I like where it seemed to be heading though.



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 12:39 PM
link   
Hinduism an some extent Buddhism usually include incarnations other then humans, which are mid tier. Thing is about reincarnation versus reincarnation, Canon wise, is you die from a bunch of different angles fighting Diablo. While Resurrection mean you beat the game, an are happy, only to come back from higher plane of existence, because you screwed on one stat point, an waste to tonnes of hours again.
edit on 1-8-2021 by Proto88 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 12:46 PM
link   
a reply to: dandandat2
I thought it was about resting in peace.....watching a movie.


Experience all the fun of the fair but be untouched.
Enjoy the ride...... it's just a ride.

Be in the world but not of the world so to speak.




posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 12:58 PM
link   

originally posted by: dandandat2
What if "Karma" and "Reincarnation" actually works backwards from the traditional idea that good deeds and good life choices bring about a better next life?

What if instead the point of "Karma" and "Reincarnation" is to subject a soul to an ever increasing set of challenges. Like a cosmetic version of a 1980s video game; if you find a way to master this level you will find the next level to be even harder.

When a soul first starts out its journey its treated to an easy life full of resources and wealth; And as the soul progress its skills it's treated to more and more hardship in order to test and push the soul to become more versatile and strong.

The soul inhibiting Jeff Bezos' body is but a infinite and could never withstand a life in inner-city squalor.

Not until the soul has learned to endure the greatest hardships this plane of existence can create does it then move to the next.


In my home country there used to be an old folk belief that if a child was born disabled it was because they did something wicked in a past life and their disability was a punishment.

There was a similar belief that if a child was born disable it was a punishment for their community for something wicked that they had done.

Come to think of it, my culture has a lot of folk beliefs about things like this.



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 12:59 PM
link   
a reply to: Proto88



only to come back from higher plane of existence, because you screwed on one stat point.

The Christians have a story.

Matthew 7:21 NIV
“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’


And then there is that famous saying that ninth-century Chinese Buddhist monk Linji Yixuan told his disciples, “If you meet the Buddha on the road, kill him.”

Then there is that old famous story told by pthena: In a Dream.

I got to thinking: What if a Zen Buddhist or follower of Advaita Vedanta happened upon a person who had actually reached all there is to reach in the way of nothing? And then later that Zen Buddhist or follower of Advaita Vedanta died.

So Brahman is like: "So when you met me you tried to convert me? You gotta go back."

edit on 1-8-2021 by pthena because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 01:11 PM
link   
a reply to: Itisnowagain

I have been appreciating these Peter Brown vid's you've been dropping around ATS lately.

"The hereness of you is a prime fact ... your actual experience is you're always here, and your actual experience is the world moves," ref: youtu.be...

And the idea that this "hereness" is the being incarnate, so what would reincarnation mean... that we are not being here, that our minds are focused on imaginary things outside of the hereness? Idk. Yeah, I like him.

Thanks for sharing!



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 01:24 PM
link   
a reply to: geezlouise


And the idea that this "hereness" is the being incarnate, so what would reincarnation mean... that we are not being here, that our minds are focused on imaginary things outside of the hereness? Idk.


Re- in- carn ate.
Carn.....in this aspect is meat. He says...are you in a body? As in; are you in the meat suit?

And later he states 'the body moves in me'.

There's only here even if here appears as thoughts and stories about other.
Here appears as everything


Edit:
Hereness does not depend on being in a meat suit...... there's no one in a meat suit now.

edit on 1-8-2021 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 01:45 PM
link   
a reply to: dandandat2


Perhaps the physical reality of the hardships are less important than the mental or spiritual hardships. The soul doesn't remember its past physical life but it does retain the mental and spiritual capacity that it has learned.

The man doesn't remember that in his past life he went hungry as a penny less vagrant but his soul does remember how to effectively deal with that hunger. A tool it will need to use in its new more impoverished life.


This makes sense to me in the context of our speculations.


Who sets the goals? No one; the goals just exist as a substance of the universe to be understood and over come.

This is not to discount the possibility of higher "god like" forms of the soul. When the soul has endured all the challenges of this plane of existence it might move on to a higher plane.


This point for me is prime. Is our very existence a product, because human existence IS after all a product, of an agency of free will or just a product of a never ending mechanical happenstance. I guess that for those who do not ask these questions, the question is moot, hence the importance of an answer is minimal.

The answer that most easily comes to me is that ''if'' we postulate that we humans have have free will then we must understand that free will is to whatever degree an ingredient of existence itself. And there's the rub.

From my vantage point I find very little free will manifest. In my own life very little if any and in others the same. This to me indicates that if I do have this agency, it is just a little bit, but that again is prime. Maybe this is all about attaining free will? Life after life slowly inching towards more and more free will.

And while this free will may not be prominent in these, our incarnated lives, it may be that on that higher plane it is.
Maybe the final goal is understanding all of the ramifications of free will. The effects of free will.

Oh man, that's too much for me at this point. I need to take a break cuz my (quoting the Gumbies from Monty Python)
''my brain hurts''.



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 01:47 PM
link   
a reply to: pthena

I heard no one knows the hour except Father Time when the loading screen is done.



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 01:53 PM
link   
a reply to: Itisnowagain

Yeah I haven't personally subscribed to the idea that we're "spirits" operating meat suits for a long time now, there's too much of a separation happening, where a disregard for the body/flesh can happen, leading to guilt, shame, the idea of sin, and a general disconnection to ourselves and disregard of this life hereness now, in reasoning that when one dies, one's spirit will go somewhere better to a better afterlife, so what happens here and now doesn't matter all that much and who cares about these bodies because we can dump them like used condoms and leave them behind for something newer and better and etc. I'm not about any of that anymore, but I once was.

I'm now inclined to be my body, and love it. Not be inside it, not be outside of it, but be it. I have been saying for awhile now that we are our bodies, literally. People do not like it when I say such things, lol.

I don't know what he means by "the body moves in me" though... so that's a new thing for me to explore.
edit on 1-8-2021 by geezlouise because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 01:55 PM
link   
a reply to: pthena
Yeah, me too. I find though that these speculative strings become very fragile with a high probability of snapping well before any real conclusive summations can be achieved. I guess were we to reach those conclusions we could be at that point of departure our OP was mentioning.



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 01:59 PM
link   
a reply to: Proto88

Choices choices: Hour Glass or Spinning Circle?

Then the rolling brown out.
Damnit!
The blue screen said "Updating. Do not turn the power off"



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 02:08 PM
link   
a reply to: geezlouise



I'm now inclined to be my body, and love it. Not be inside it, not be outside of it, but be it. I have been saying for awhile now that we are our bodies, literally. People do not like it when I say such things, lol.


That's it.

I had a soul once, but I lost it.
I'm afraid to link to the story now, because I've linked to myself too much already. People might not like it.



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 02:15 PM
link   
a reply to: pthena

I am interested in the story, link it! Or send it to me pvtly if that is more comfortable for you.



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 02:16 PM
link   
a reply to: geezlouise
He said "my hand is moving in my consciousness .....my consciousness never goes anywhere"

It's always right here....it is the scenery that moves and changes.



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 02:27 PM
link   
a reply to: geezlouise

Sometimes I have a hard time remembering the titles. This one was easy though.
A Lost Soul
It really goes with the theme of my first post in this thread about trying to fuse one Worldview with another.



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 07:31 PM
link   
Does it come with a Snake swallowing its own tail, if not, the wheel. Just pray the whole thing doesn't freeze or crash before connecting with the cloud for a back up.

a reply to: pthena

edit on 1-8-2021 by Proto88 because: (no reason given)

edit on 1-8-2021 by Proto88 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2021 @ 08:05 PM
link   
a reply to: Proto88

In the Blizzard game Starcraft there's this one scenario in which a limited number of marines must infiltrate a space station and turn off a Zerg Attracting Emitter.

So the marine is having some trouble with the computer. "Which is the any key?"

Boy! The Simpsons seem to have stolen all the good jokes.



new topics

top topics



 
11
<< 1    3 >>

log in

join