PHE report, more vaccinated people are dying of COVID than unvaccinated

originally posted by: nonspecific

If everyone waited to see if it was safe then how would we find out it was safe?


a reply to: incoserv

Good point! I concede.

You take the shot and I'll watch.

originally posted by: nonspecific
I spend time allover the internet and I'll tell you this as a nice bit of anecdotal evidence.

The number of ATS members that know far more people that have died from a vaccine than have died from covid is far higher on average than any other place I've seen by a vast amount.

There's multiple people who know tens of people that have died from a covid 19 vaccine, one member knows over fifty.

I've not seen these kinds of numbers anywhere else.



a reply to: MiddleInsite

Because they're flat out lying.

a reply to: MiddleInsite

It feels like "conspiracy" has become weaponized (and commercialized) over the last decade, it is rapidly becoming the new MSM and TPTB know how to use it against us. What we are seeing here on ATS (and in the general conspiracy "community") in regards to this virus and the vaccines for it is a combination of the "dihydrogen monoxide parody" and the "Dunning-Kruger effect" and I honestly don't know how to bridge that gap.

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: NeoSpace
theconversation.com... lobal-en-GB

More vaccinated people are dying of COVID than unvaccinated people, according to a recent report from Public Health England (PHE). The report shows that 163 of the 257 people (63.4%) who died of the delta variant within 28 days of a positive COVID test between February 1 and June 21, had received at least one dose of the vaccine.

Even this article is trying to defend the jabs even when the official data show the jab is useless.

This has been posted before and the link even explains why there would be more deaths amongst the vacinated

Try reading it's good for you.

wait, so the article says what the OP says, but your have to put on the dick shoes? Why?

Because the article says the complete opposite of what the OP is claiming.

I only put my dick shoes on when people are lying, then I find them both stylish and comfortable.

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: DarkestConspiracyMoon

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: oddnutz
a reply to: ScepticScot

explains why there would be more deaths amongst the vacinated

because its working?
I thought the point of the vaccine was to provide the vaccinated immunity?


So the vaccinated are still dying because the vaccinated are still catching and spreading the virus while trying to bring in laws to segregate themselves from the unvaccinated?

There is a much smaller chance of dying after being vacinated than without.

I would say that is working.

Wow, you're so brainwashed. Vaccines were promised to keep people from severe illness and death and now you're saying it"s totally fine if a few die from the clot shots, it's worth it because it's a small percentage. But if anybody said the same thing about natural herd mmunity last year, you would for sure flip out.
The fact is it isn't a small percentage.
People have been dying and getting severely injured since January 2021. I know of more people who've died or been injured from the clot shot then from covid, THIS is the REAL pandemic.

Brainwashed because I understand maths?

Vaccinated people are dying at much much lower rate than the unvacinated .

www.cnn.com...

we are told if you get the vaccine, you won't get as sick, won't die, and won't need hospitalization.
If we speak other than this online, we are accused of spreading misinformation.

a reply to: nonspecific

Do you understand the concept of fragility?

Not everyone over the age of 65 is susceptible to death from this. In fact. The vast majority of all people will recover from this virus. Even those well above 65.

The same people that died of covid by and large, Are the same people that would have died from pneumonia or their chronic disease they were suffering with within the year.

So at the beginning of an epidemic you will have larger numbers dying in general and those numbers will wane over time as immunity increases. I’m talking real immunity. Not A vaccine induced hyperactive immune response to a single antigen.

In countries that had lower deaths in previous years in this population we saw higher numbers of death early on. Those leveled out and the other countries that didn’t tended to have increased deaths the following season comparatively. Sweden and Denmark are an example.

Either way the amount of susceptible people will decrease over time. Yes more people will get sicker and older in the year since, but that happens every year.

What we are seeing with the variants are due to vaccine escape, just like antibiotic resistance. Which is why there are only 1% reinfection for natural immunity and 40% for vaccine induced “immunity”.

We aren’t even into the fall season yet. Just wait. Those numbers will increase dramatically for the vaccinated. Right now most people have enough sunlight to help their poor health along through the summer. When sugar and dark season aka cold and flu season hit and all these people with weak vaccine immunity hit the death toll will be immense.

Did you see that the effectiveness of Pfizer is now just 60% instead of the 99% they touted. By the end of the year it will be in the 10’s maybe. Just like the worthless flu shot. That’s RRR btw. ARR which is what you were referring to by basing numbers on the entire population (above 65) is less than 1%.

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: DarkestConspiracyMoon

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: oddnutz
a reply to: ScepticScot

explains why there would be more deaths amongst the vacinated

because its working?
I thought the point of the vaccine was to provide the vaccinated immunity?


So the vaccinated are still dying because the vaccinated are still catching and spreading the virus while trying to bring in laws to segregate themselves from the unvaccinated?

There is a much smaller chance of dying after being vacinated than without.

I would say that is working.

Wow, you're so brainwashed. Vaccines were promised to keep people from severe illness and death and now you're saying it"s totally fine if a few die from the clot shots, it's worth it because it's a small percentage. But if anybody said the same thing about natural herd mmunity last year, you would for sure flip out.
The fact is it isn't a small percentage.
People have been dying and getting severely injured since January 2021. I know of more people who've died or been injured from the clot shot then from covid, THIS is the REAL pandemic.

Brainwashed because I understand maths?

Vaccinated people are dying at much much lower rate than the unvacinated .

www.cnn.com...

we are told if you get the vaccine, you won't get as sick, won't die, and won't need hospitalization.
If we speak other than this online, we are accused of spreading misinformation.

Alk the data shows you are less likely to get sick and far less likely to get seriously ill or die.

If you speak other than online this you are either misinformed or lying, so spreading misinformation seems an accurate enough description.

Already have done.

So have maybe 150 plus people I know. Most likely more if I included work related people.

No one's dead yet.

Ask me again next week and I'll keep you updated.


a reply to: incoserv

I'd like to see some of the evidence about the vaccine escape if that's ok with you.



a reply to: zardust

So, this is what I call cherry-picking data and glossing over the obvious -- no offense. Let me explain.

1) During the COVID-19 pandemic, 95% of all COVID deaths were in people 50+. Nearly 80% of all deaths were in people 65+. The argument then was that we needed to get it under control to "save grandma." 0-39 year olds made up only 1.8% of the deaths. In Australia, 90% of deaths were in those 65+.(see "source" link underneath quote in #2)

2) They told us that EVERYONE needed to be vaccinated to keep grandma from dying:

All this leads to benefits for the community. If vaccine uptake is high enough and transmission is reduced, our collective (or herd) immunity can be used like a fire break. It blocks pathways of virus transmission and protects vulnerable people from infection, even when those people are not vaccinated.

Source

Then when grandma kept dying, despite reaching the alleged "herd immunity threshold" in the UK (90% have 1 dose, 70% have both), either the unvaccinated are blamed, or, the old trope that "but they're old" gets used, despite people bringing that up before were met with "but whataboutgramma!"

3) You stated:

The number of vaccinated older people dying is still far lower than the number of older people that would be dying if there was no vaccinations.

So, based on your version of a 'vaccine working', old people will still die because they're old, but their rate of death is still far lower than if no vaccines were used. So, what you're saying is that the vaccines are CURRENTLY working, yeah?

Then we're done. Even in the US, where the alleged 'herd immunity' threshold hasn't been met, they continually claim old people just aren't dying much anymore because while the "vaccines aren't perfect," they're working.

We cannot keep every human from dying, I hope you realize. Never. Less than 300 deaths in a 28-day period for a virus during a pandemic is a NON-ISSUE, wouldn't you say?

So would you then agree that we can stop with the "everyone needs a vaccine" nonsense? Can we now stop with the talk of mandatory vaccinations since it's working and grandma has been saved?

4) Despite all of what I just said, you're missing one crucial data point: time of year. No one seems to want to talk about this, but it's a fairly huge factor and it's being attributed solely to the vaccine's functionality. Summer ALWAYS sees a reduction in viral outbreaks and overall sickness. Always has and most likely always will.

It happened last year too. Everyone knew there would be a summer lull, just like last year. Everyone knew this summer would see fewer deaths/cases BECAUSE transmission wanes. Don't believe me? Just go look at any chart from pretty much any country on Earth and you'll see that even after the first wave, there was a massive drop in cases during the summer.

The drop was always going to be larger during the 2nd summer because by then, a good portion of the populations around the world developed natural immunity (to some degree) from the virus.


So again, I say that your own data suggests where we're at now is working, should we ignore the fact that it's summer and we always knew we'd see lower cases & deaths. And when winter comes and case #s spike, the Jabberwocks will cry out that the unvaccinated are to blame and that grandma is dying because of us and that we don't care, blah blah blah.

Sorry but your argument is both contradictory and dismisses a huge variable, which I've just outlined. I guess I'll hear from you this winter when I'm being blamed for grandma dying.

a reply to: nonspecific

originally posted by: NeoSpace
a reply to: ScepticScot

I don't care how they spin it, the vaccinated are dying.

No we're not actually. Nobody in my highly vaccinated part of the world, where I know a LOT of people have had any nasty side effects.

Ive yet to see any real facts or figures for this nonsens.

Try reading more than just things that bend to your confirmation bias.

originally posted by: ZED332L
a reply to: oddnutz
I will not take the shot. But it is Deemed " Experimental"

You know this went through the trials that all vaccines go through, only faster because of the money that was pushing it?

a reply to: djz3ro
So no one that has been jabbed has died???
Have you a link to go with your claim?

So I guess they just added a myocarditis & pericarditis warning for no reason? They added GBS for no reason? They added Bell's Palsy for no reason?

Dang, and all this time I thought they were "following the science."

I've been duped!
a reply to: djz3ro

originally posted by: djz3ro

originally posted by: ZED332L
a reply to: oddnutz
I will not take the shot. But it is Deemed " Experimental"

You know this went through the trials that all vaccines go through, only faster because of the money that was pushing it?

How do you speed up long term effects trial?
Time can't be pushed by money.

a reply to: nonspecific

Search leaky vaccines.

Or viral escape.

I’m traveling so just commenting on my phone. I’d like to say that I’ll get to it when i get to my computer to get you the info but I won’t promise anything

One topic we haven’t even touched on is ADE or pathogenic priming. That is why nearly all the previous coronavirus vaccines have failed.

originally posted by: Breakthestreak
Remember when the polio vaccine came out and everyone who got it still contracted polio?

Me neither.

Everyone who received it, technically, got polio because the vaccine contained some polio to prompt the immune response.

Thanks to mNRA tech, which was conceived at King's College in Cambridge in 1960

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: djz3ro
So no one that has been jabbed has died???
Have you a link to go with your claim?

Don't be absurd. Show me where I said this? Imagine putting words in my mouth and then trying to use them to make it look like I'm in the wrong. Such a dirty, low blow.

There is the same risk as with any vaccine.

originally posted by: BatSars
So I guess they just added a myocarditis & pericarditis warning for no reason? They added GBS for no reason? They added Bell's Palsy for no reason?

Dang, and all this time I thought they were "following the science."

I've been duped!
a reply to: djz3ro

What are you even talking about? You think these were added deliberately? Can you tell me what the risk of the things you mentioned are in normal vaccines compared to the Covid ones?

I'll have a look when I get some time.

If your able to point me in a particular direction at some point is appreciate it.


a reply to: zardust