Why do you say God exists?

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: NightSkyeB4Dawn

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

For every person who says god saved them, there's a dozen bodies who died wondering why he didn't.

Maybe that dozen just didn't recognize when he did.

You just said that information is beyond your knowledge so your "maybe" is optimistic at best. Giving credit for credits sake is not reassuring.

What I said was, I did not have the answer for why I received God's blessings, when you claimed that so many did not.

I said that I too had asked myself that question. I admitted, I could not answer your question, and it is likely beyond my comprehension, or it has not been revealed to me yet.

I offered that all those people you are saying did not receive blessings, may have indeed received blessings, though you or they may have not recognized them as blessings.

I understand your confusion and your lack of understanding. I understand your doubt, and I understand your vitriol. I walked that same path for a number of years.

I didn't stray from that path. I was pushed off. I admit that my reckoning, was not gentle, and came with much pain, and my eyes were not opened until I stopped fighting, and just gave up.

It was then that I realized that very little was in my control, and when I stopped trying to make things happened and learned to handle things when they happen.

Everyone's walk is different. All outcomes are not what we expect, or even what we think we want. Sometimes the greatest gift, and the best answer to a prayer, is when God says "no".

a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

Do you mean to say that this god has literally walked up to you on the street and said "No, sorry" after you prayed?

a reply to: TzarChasm

I want to debate. You know my thoughts on God by my posts.

What I've learned so far from yours is you appear to be bitter towards God.

But do you know God?

Have you read His words?

Do you understand the difference between the Old Testament and the New Testament?

I'm all for conversing about God with you. I don't mean to agitate or aggravate, I want know why you think God is responsible for death.

I will say this, if you read the book of Job, it will open your eyes. It did for me. But that's up to you.

People die for various reasons and at times people are spared through divine intervention. I believe I was spared, more than once, because there's quite a few people in my life that pray for me.

That's not to say I won't die tomorrow. And if I do, that's not to say their prayers were not heard.

Sometimes an early death is a blessing for the one who dies.

Sometimes a person can do more dead than they can alive.

There are still mysteries out there.

You can't focus on the unknown and ignore the known.

You are alive. What benefit are you to others?

You have voice. When did you last give thanks or say something positive?

What impact do you have on those closest to you?

How do YOU feel about you?

Do you ever look in the mirror and smile? If not, why?

Your question should be, with all the innocent lives being lost minute by minute around the world, why are YOU still here?

I'd say you're here because someone somewhere is praying for you and someone somewhere needs you and God sees you have potential, some sort of gift or talent, that maybe you shrug off as being no big deal. But anything you can do to positively impact another human IS a big deal.

Optimistic or pessimistic.

Which one invokes peace and happiness?

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: EdisonintheFM

The question is whether you have better answers than the previous forum users who have tried to solve the Epicurus riddle.

Finally, you put some meat on the hook.

Read the book of Job.

It's not easy. Only a tamed mind can read it. And do not read the King James version, he's been dead for centuries.

Read the NIV or NKJV. Unless you speak old English.

Read it and you'll understand how God works when He's sitting on His throne. And I'm thinking....you...would relate to Job's wife....maybe she's an ancestor of yours.



Good luck, if you dare.

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

Do you mean to say that this god has literally walked up to you on the street and said "No, sorry" after you prayed?

If you are asking me has he had no to me, the answer is yes. He does not have to walk up to me.

I can think of a time that he said no, right away, and it took me almost ten years before I was shown how much of a blessing, that no was for me. At the time I thought I being punished, but was the catalyst for so many other things to come.

Are you really looking for answers, or have you already made up your mind, so you are only looking to challenge those that believe what you have rejected?

I am a poor target because, I can't give you what you are looking for. I hope someone else will provide you what you need. I am still learning and growing. I can only share my experiences, I can't provide with reasons or with understanding.

originally posted by: EdisonintheFM

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: EdisonintheFM

The question is whether you have better answers than the previous forum users who have tried to solve the Epicurus riddle.

Finally, you put some meat on the hook.

Read the book of Job.

It's not easy. Only a tamed mind can read it. And do not read the King James version, he's been dead for centuries.

Read the NIV or NKJV. Unless you speak old English.

Read it and you'll understand how God works when He's sitting on His throne. And I'm thinking....you...would relate to Job's wife....maybe she's an ancestor of yours.

Good luck, if you dare.

Before I tell you what I think, maybe you could share the most useful and relevant ethical instruction you found in that story?

originally posted by: NightSkyeB4Dawn

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

Do you mean to say that this god has literally walked up to you on the street and said "No, sorry" after you prayed?

If you are asking me has he had no to me, the answer is yes. He does not have to walk up to me.

I can think of a time that he said no, right away, and it took me almost ten years before I was shown how much of a blessing, that no was for me. At the time I thought I being punished, but was the catalyst for so many other things to come.

Are you really looking for answers, or have you already made up your mind, so you are only looking to challenge those that believe what you have rejected?

I am a poor target because, I can't give you what you are looking for. I hope someone else will provide you what you need. I am still learning and growing. I can only share my experiences, I can't provide with reasons or with understanding.

I'm not here because I "need" anything. I'm curious and I ask questions that typical society finds very off putting because they don't like to look too close at certain topics. This forum is made for exactly that reason.

So god talks to you? That's fascinating.

a reply to: TzarChasm

Satan goes humbly before God and asks for permission to screw with one of God's children.

And God allows it because He has faith in His child.

Faith....is a two way street.

a reply to: TzarChasm

God talks to you, too.

You're not hearing Him.

Psalm 46:10 "Be still, and know that I am God."

originally posted by: EdisonintheFM
a reply to: TzarChasm

Satan goes humbly before God and asks for permission to screw with one of God's children.

And God allows it because He has faith in His child.

Faith....is a two way street.

So you interpreted a story about murder, torture and sadism as a spiritually inspiring anecdote that confirms gods love and benevolent leadership? Curious. I don't see it but maybe you left out the part where god is a hero who saved a man's family instead of throwing them under the proverbial bus to win a bet.

a reply to: TzarChasm

I agree with her. You've made up your mind. I hope it works out for you.

And you never read Job. If you had, you would try harder to not sound like his wife.

It must be miserable to see nothing but doom and gloom. I thought the emo fad faded years ago.

Now go cast your bait in another thread.

originally posted by: EdisonintheFM
a reply to: TzarChasm

I agree with her. You've made up your mind. I hope it works out for you.

And you never read Job. If you had, you would try harder to not sound like his wife.

It must be miserable to see nothing but doom and gloom. I thought the emo fad faded years ago.

Now go cast your bait in another thread.

Insults instead of answers. Typical.

"Man suffers, because he takes to seriously, what the God's take for fun."- Allan Watts

I don't deny that there could or would be a higher order or power. However to say that any of the religions is the true religion is going to require alot more evidence that would be tantamount to said believes.

If anything, Science would be the closest thing to a true religion, with all the doctrine an arrogance. Science might bring the end of the world, while the religious will say it bring about the Wrath of God in a way.

I dare say I've seen the invisible man in the sky, an I do prefer my God's tyrannical an savage, an my fellow mortals civilized.

originally posted by: Proto88
"Man suffers, because he takes to seriously, what the God's take for fun."- Allan Watts

I don't deny that there could or would be a higher order or power. However to say that any of the religions is the true religion is going to require alot more evidence that would be tantamount to said believes.

If anything, Science would be the closest thing to a true religion, with all the doctrine an arrogance. Science might bring the end of the world, while the religious will say it bring about the Wrath of God in a way.

I dare say I've seen the invisible man in the sky, an I do prefer my God's tyrannical an savage, an my fellow mortals civilized.

Science only shows what is possible and what is probable. It doesn't tell us how valuable technology or knowledge is, nor what kind of sacrifices are worth what kind of gain, nor how to live with what we have lost and what future we should make to honor those regrets. That is where arrogance makes itself known, Machiavellian arrogance for example. The end justifies the means.

a reply to: TzarChasm

I answered your questions.

Now answer mine that I asked hours ago.

Don't be scared.

Scroll up and answer them, if you can't, won't, don't, then everyone sees you for what you are.

Now go ahead and leave another witless one liner.

a reply to: Proto88

Really?

Science flip flops, it's never concrete, it's never engraved in stone.

But it's your choice.

And Allan Watts wrote books. Automatically makes him invalid.




But really he wasn't a guru of religions, he threw spaghetti at walls and went with what was popular wherever he stopped to sell his placebo snake oil.

In others words

originally posted by: EdisonintheFM
a reply to: TzarChasm

I answered your questions.

Now answer mine that I asked hours ago.

Don't be scared.

Scroll up and answer them, if you can't, won't, don't, then everyone sees you for what you are.

Now go ahead and leave another witless one liner.

Sorry but I'm not satisfied with your responses. Another charmingly hostile dialogue that goes nowhere.

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: EdisonintheFM
a reply to: TzarChasm

I answered your questions.

Now answer mine that I asked hours ago.

Don't be scared.

Scroll up and answer them, if you can't, won't, don't, then everyone sees you for what you are.

Now go ahead and leave another witless one liner.

Sorry but I'm not satisfied with your responses. Another charmingly hostile dialogue that goes nowhere.

I am sorry if I misunderstood your posts. I answered your questions as honestly as I could. As I said, I can only tell you about my personal experiences. I too have questions still, but my questions are not based on doubt. My desire is for better clarity and understanding.

I understand your doubts. I am sure you have a lot of valid questions. Unfortunately, I cannot provide you with those answers. I don't think anyone can, because you are so convinced that your own beliefs, are the only right ones, that any information given to you, will be rejected or ridiculed. It has not seemed to me that you are sincere in your quest for answers. Forgive me if I am wrong about that.

Your dialogue has appeared hostile, but not charming. I also agree there is likely no sense in continuing this type of dialogue, because it will indeed, go nowhere.

a reply to: EdisonintheFM



I choose to believe God exists because I can't imagine such a vast, ancient and beautiful universe without a creative intelligence bringing it into being. And the same goes for this little ball of rock we share with all these amazing living creatures on it. A planet just the right distance from its sun, with just the right gravity, atmosphere, water, and chemistry to allow me to come into being and be here to ponder this. I can feel the existence of God. Some people will understand that, some wont. There is an old saying "to the believer no explanation is nessisary, to the non believer no explanation is possible"

And lastly, some times God lets us know He is there if we pay attention, sometimes its subtle, sometimes its not. Like the day I was driving and said a prayer that wished for things to get better in the world, for COVID to go away, for the hate some were feeling to go away, and a moment later I saw a rainbow form down the road in front of me as I was driving. It might just be a rainbow yes, but the fact it chose that moment to form in front of me, is significant to me. Some people might just see a rainbow, some might see a cross in the way the wisp of cloud crosses it near the top, and some might find it significant that the car in the bottom of the rainbow, just happens to be a police car. Maybe there is no message in that, but to me there is because I believe in God and I believe from time to time, in ways of His choosing, he lets us know he is here. Say or think what you want, I can do the same.

a reply to: TzarChasm

Ok i have a question for you. can you prove you are actually alive? you cant because life is a mystery and has never been proven 100 percent. Its a theory. You have "faith" you are alive because science says so right?

With a universe that runs on mathematics,it cannot be random. I think of God as a scientist. His tech is so far beyond ours it looks like magic. Just because you cannot see something or touch it does not preclude its reality. Oh but how about the 7 days? A day to God is billions of trillions of years to us humans. God evolved humans during this time.

Nor all beings are able to die from age. some evolved past that i am sure.

Anyway,it seems you are not here to actually learn.