Election meddling, either it's OK or it's not, which is it?

We can start with the question. Without any other discussion, just a really really basic question.

Is it OK to meddle in US elections?

We chastised Russia for it in two elections, was said it was bad, the worst. Is that still the case?

a reply to: network dude

NOT okay.
But, also, NOT okay to prove it's existence.
Same for election fraud.

originally posted by: network dude
We can start with the question. Without any other discussion, just a really really basic question.

Is it OK to meddle in US elections?

We chastised Russia for it in two elections, was said it was bad, the worst. Is that still the case?

Define meddling

a reply to: network dude

Hey man, if we check the voting machines for fraud, the warranties will be void and we won't be able to be screwed again!

a reply to: network dude

Absolutely not ok not at all.

I am also against changing election laws without the legislation.

I am also against kicking out poll workers of a certain political affiliation.

I am also against blocking windows so people cant see what you are doing.

Not ok with any of it.

originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: network dude
We can start with the question. Without any other discussion, just a really really basic question.

Is it OK to meddle in US elections?

We chastised Russia for it in two elections, was said it was bad, the worst. Is that still the case?

Define meddling

I'm going to give one example that I believe was extreme election meddling and it continues to have catastrophic effects.

The censoring of the Hunter Biden laptop contents. If you look at the emails regarding the business dealing with China, and Joe's obvious involvement, you see that a major story with major implications was censored and not allowed to be discussed before the election, having the result of few who voted for Joe Biden, knowing the full extent of his level of ownership from China. When it was speculated that Trump may have done business in Russia, and he may be beholden to Putin, it was a big deal. And rightfully so if that was true. Turns out, it wasn't, but it was allowed to be talked about for over 4 years.

a reply to: network dude
100% NOT, which by the way is 100% verfified in Maricopa County now.

a reply to: BlueJacket

was there news on that front?

a reply to: network dude
It seems to be okay as long as it is bi-partisan meddling, otherwise, no.

In what world would election meddling be considered OK??

That having been said, we have to define "meddling".

To me, meddling isn't buying ad space in magazines, newspapers, online websites, etc... Supposedly, people are capable of deciding for themselves on issues of concern to them.

Meddling is usually from within. County/Citywide election fraud, as has occurred throughout the history of elections in the United States...Chicago and New York being somewhat infamous in that. The current Maricopa County situation is a classic example of this.

The medias inability, or unwillingness, to cover/investigate voter fraud, or election shenanigans, should be condemned from all sides, not just the losers--though I can quite understand the winners being somewhat unwilling to do so...I mean who wants to be called a cheater, right?? Of course, who wants to win under a cloud of suspicion, either...right, Dems??

Yoo-hoo...Dems??

Anyway...fraud is, unfortunately almost endemic in politics--its the nature of the beast, and it'll always be there. However, it should be punished, and harshly, at that, when discovered and investigated--that's something we should all want.

Regardless of whether an Orange Man lost, or even won. Cheating is bad. By any means necessary should not be the rule book.

a reply to: network dude

Is it ok for The US to meddle in other countries elections ?

They have been doing it for 60 years.

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: network dude
We can start with the question. Without any other discussion, just a really really basic question.

Is it OK to meddle in US elections?

We chastised Russia for it in two elections, was said it was bad, the worst. Is that still the case?

Define meddling

I'm going to give one example that I believe was extreme election meddling and it continues to have catastrophic effects.

The censoring of the Hunter Biden laptop contents. If you look at the emails regarding the business dealing with China, and Joe's obvious involvement, you see that a major story with major implications was censored and not allowed to be discussed before the election, having the result of few who voted for Joe Biden, knowing the full extent of his level of ownership from China. When it was speculated that Trump may have done business in Russia, and he may be beholden to Putin, it was a big deal. And rightfully so if that was true. Turns out, it wasn't, but it was allowed to be talked about for over 4 years.

I thought you were going to come up with something like that.

US entities have a constitutional right to participate in US elections and try to influence the outcome—including by lying, distorting facts, or ignoring facts. Non US entities have no such rights. So when Fox News tried to play up the Hunter Biden laptop issue in order to favor Trump’s election, they were not “meddling”; they were exercising their right to try to affect the outcome of the election. By the exact same logic, MSNBC was not meddling when they tried to play down the issue.

When Russia tried to affect the outcome of the 2016 election, they were “meddling” because they have no right under US law or the Constitution to do that.

The distinction between “meddling” and lawfully trying to influence the outcome of the election is the distinction between foreign nationals and US nationals.

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: network dude

Is it ok for The US to meddle in other countries elections ?

They have been doing it for 60 years.

That wasn't the OP's question. Stop derailing and go take the time and create your own post about it. You do have a point but not in this OP.
Its whataboutism you seem to embrace.

a reply to: alldaylong

I think the thread title can be safely used to discuss that topic...

...and, no. It isn't.

Again, however, you have to define "meddling". Do we, or do we not, trust people to make their own choices??

I was besieged by a never ending avalanche of Biden ads during the last go 'round...the occasional Trump ad appeared, too. Biden ads were, for me anyway, almost 4, maybe 5, to 1, over the Trump ads.

Yet, not once, was I even inclined to consider voting for either one. I make no claims to great intelligence, and was able to ignore, save for being somewhat irritated by some of the ads blatant lies, them.

Can't others do the same?? Or are we all suffering the fate of Pavlov's puppie-dogs??

originally posted by: americanbuffalo1

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: network dude

Is it ok for The US to meddle in other countries elections ?

They have been doing it for 60 years.

That wasn't the OP's question. Stop derailing and go take the time and create your own post about it. You do have a point but not in this OP.
Its whataboutism you seem to embrace.

You are funny.

The OP goes on about election meddling, The US needs to get it's own house in order.

Hypocrites one and all.

originally posted by: network dude
We can start with the question. Without any other discussion, just a really really basic question.

Is it OK to meddle in US elections?

We chastised Russia for it in two elections, was said it was bad, the worst. Is that still the case?

The problem with your thinking is that you believe hypocrisy proves your point and will sway those that believe differently. Be aware they, nor anyone, cares. Win by any means necessary and if you are not willing to fight by those rules then you have already lost.

a reply to: alldaylong
Create a thread if you feel the need to explore this. That's all. I agree with you by the way. The US does need a good long hard look into the mirror!

originally posted by: alldaylong

originally posted by: americanbuffalo1

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: network dude

Is it ok for The US to meddle in other countries elections ?

They have been doing it for 60 years.

That wasn't the OP's question. Stop derailing and go take the time and create your own post about it. You do have a point but not in this OP.
Its whataboutism you seem to embrace.

You are funny.

The OP goes on about election meddling, The US needs to get it's own house in order.

Hypocrites one and all.

I believe you have a point and you are correct. If it's wrong, then it's wrong and shouldn't be done. After watching a movie on that topic, which was based in fact, I wrote a thread on it.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: BlueJacket

was there news on that front?

Yes, they can prove the destruction, or removal of 10k+ ballots

originally posted by: alldaylong

originally posted by: americanbuffalo1

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: network dude

Is it ok for The US to meddle in other countries elections ?

They have been doing it for 60 years.

That wasn't the OP's question. Stop derailing and go take the time and create your own post about it. You do have a point but not in this OP.
Its whataboutism you seem to embrace.

You are funny.

The OP goes on about election meddling, The US needs to get it's own house in order.

Hypocrites one and all.

There isnt a country on the planet that doesn't meddle in other countries' elections. It's human nature to choose a side and self-interest will cause you to choose. If its better for your country to have one person elected over another you will support them. As long as it nothing more than buying ad space and showing support your fine. If it involves undermining the process that is meddling. For example, Israel really likes Trump if they wanted to say they supported him that was fine. If they send people here to rig the vote that is an act of war.

So on Russia buying adds on facebook is not meddling as much as everyone tried to convince us it was. Most people didn't see the ads and those that did have the free will to evaluate what is being said. For most, it was just confirmation bias as they already agreed with them.

Should the US meddle in other elections if that means supporting a candidate that we see as beneficial yes. For example an election in say North Korea we could show support to a candidate if we thought it would help. Kim Jong-un wouldn't allow an election but nonetheless, if he did it, would be in our best interest for him to lose.