Johns Hopkins: U.S. Death Rate Remains NORMAL Despite COVID-19

a reply to: starviego

That's the spirit!

I don't like the data so I reject it! Just like in the presidential election. What a surprise.

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
a reply to: ScepticScot

Again...
Apart from that more than enough evidence has been presented in these forums showing that the numbers of COVID-19 patients getting infected and dying from it are being exaggerated, mostly by unscrupulous hospital directors and doctors whom were/are more interested in getting more money by exaggerating/lying about the numbers, and it hasn't stopped.

With billions more dollars recently added to the U.S. medical industry's Covid-19 kitty, expect upward-curving hospitalization and death rates to defy all logic, considering the 110 million vaccinations that have been administered.

Money rules....

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: UKTruth

They are deaths 'confirmed or presumed' Covid-19 and you (or I) simply don't know how many were BECAUSE of Covid-19.

Not precisely, of course. But that "presumed" means the the person did not have a COVID positive test before death. The physician used their expertise to determine it.

There must be some reason that there were large increases in deaths attributed to heart disease, stroke, diabetes, and pnuemonia. Maybe COVID had something to do with it. Or maybe it was something else.

There must be some reason there was a 15.9% increase in the death rate from 2019. But maybe it wasn't the pandemic.

Maybe those people didn't die. Maybe the deaths were fabricated.

If's, buts, and maybe's - that's about the only accurate representation of the Covid death numbers.

Do you have the same issue with other causes of death being determined this way or just specifically covid?

No. Not at the moment.
If the Govt decided to overreach based on other deaths and then publish unreliable numbers that gave credence to their overreach, I would.

Can you suggest have a more reliable source of numbers than the medical professionals actually issuing the death certificate?

If I am reading your poor English correctly, you want another source?
If so, no. I don't believe any of the published numbers.

Thankfully public policy isn't based round your paranoia.

Yes, yes - we should never ever mistrust the Govt... except of course if you don't like what they are doing.
I still remember your ridiculous EU posts. Paranoia indeed.

So when the data doesn't support your position just decide the data is wrong?

That seems a solid rational position...

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
a reply to: ScepticScot

Again... Since the start people whom had COVID-19, but died of something else, like a car crash, were still counted as dying of COVID-19... in other threads other members and myself have shown this has been happening from the start. There have been doctors, even democrat doctors, whom have stated they have been forced to put pretty much every death as if it was from COVID-19 despite dying of something else.

There have been many reports of, for example, people staying in line to get tested for COVID-19. Their names were written down but were waiting for hours and still had to wait more and left without being tested. Yet those people received mail claiming they were tested and had COVID-19.

Recently I was in south Florida again and visited family and friends. Everywhere i went family and friends knew of someone whom was claimed to have COVID-19 through the tests, but when their doctors examined them and tested them themselves these people didn't have COVID-19.

An elderly former neighbor, which we visited to see how she was, told us that one of her friends was going to go on a trip for elderly people to Georgia, but she was required to be tested for COVID-19. She had already paid for the whole trip. She was tested, and the test came back positive. But she went to her own doctor whom also tested her and she was negative. Even though she had the report of her doctor she was denied from going on the trip and lost all the money she had already paid.

I heard stories like that everywhere we went.

Apart from that more than enough evidence has been presented in these forums showing that the numbers of COVID-19 patients getting infected and dying from it are being exaggerated, mostly by unscrupulous hospital directors and doctors whom were/are more interested in getting more money by exaggerating/lying about the numbers, and it hasn't stopped.

Covid death numbers can be taken from the death certificate data. If you can explain how you know more about what killed the person thsn the medical professional issuing the death certificate then will happily consider it.

Also worth noting that Covid is a world wide situation, including places where hospitals are not private profit making organisations.

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

There was increase in Covid19-releated deaths and a decrease in accidental deaths.

More people under age 70 lived, instead of dying due to an accident outside the home. (Lockdowns saved these lives)

More older people with health issues died a few years sooner, due to Covid-19 pushing them over the cliff.

Most people over 70 died? Really? There’s almost no over 70 year olds left? Just biden and pelosi?

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
a reply to: ScepticScot

Again... Since the start people whom had COVID-19, but died of something else, like a car crash, were still counted as dying of COVID-19... in other threads other members and myself have shown this has been happening from the start. There have been doctors, even democrat doctors, whom have stated they have been forced to put pretty much every death as if it was from COVID-19 despite dying of something else.

There have been many reports of, for example, people staying in line to get tested for COVID-19. Their names were written down but were waiting for hours and still had to wait more and left without being tested. Yet those people received mail claiming they were tested and had COVID-19.

Recently I was in south Florida again and visited family and friends. Everywhere i went family and friends knew of someone whom was claimed to have COVID-19 through the tests, but when their doctors examined them and tested them themselves these people didn't have COVID-19.

An elderly former neighbor, which we visited to see how she was, told us that one of her friends was going to go on a trip for elderly people to Georgia, but she was required to be tested for COVID-19. She had already paid for the whole trip. She was tested, and the test came back positive. But she went to her own doctor whom also tested her and she was negative. Even though she had the report of her doctor she was denied from going on the trip and lost all the money she had already paid.

I heard stories like that everywhere we went.

Apart from that more than enough evidence has been presented in these forums showing that the numbers of COVID-19 patients getting infected and dying from it are being exaggerated, mostly by unscrupulous hospital directors and doctors whom were/are more interested in getting more money by exaggerating/lying about the numbers, and it hasn't stopped.

Covid death numbers can be taken from the death certificate data. If you can explain how you know more about what killed the person thsn the medical professional issuing the death certificate then will happily consider it.

Also worth noting that Covid is a world wide situation, including places where hospitals are not private profit making organisations.

Simple, follow the $$ come on Scott

originally posted by: Rob808

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
a reply to: ScepticScot

Again... Since the start people whom had COVID-19, but died of something else, like a car crash, were still counted as dying of COVID-19... in other threads other members and myself have shown this has been happening from the start. There have been doctors, even democrat doctors, whom have stated they have been forced to put pretty much every death as if it was from COVID-19 despite dying of something else.

There have been many reports of, for example, people staying in line to get tested for COVID-19. Their names were written down but were waiting for hours and still had to wait more and left without being tested. Yet those people received mail claiming they were tested and had COVID-19.

Recently I was in south Florida again and visited family and friends. Everywhere i went family and friends knew of someone whom was claimed to have COVID-19 through the tests, but when their doctors examined them and tested them themselves these people didn't have COVID-19.

An elderly former neighbor, which we visited to see how she was, told us that one of her friends was going to go on a trip for elderly people to Georgia, but she was required to be tested for COVID-19. She had already paid for the whole trip. She was tested, and the test came back positive. But she went to her own doctor whom also tested her and she was negative. Even though she had the report of her doctor she was denied from going on the trip and lost all the money she had already paid.

I heard stories like that everywhere we went.

Apart from that more than enough evidence has been presented in these forums showing that the numbers of COVID-19 patients getting infected and dying from it are being exaggerated, mostly by unscrupulous hospital directors and doctors whom were/are more interested in getting more money by exaggerating/lying about the numbers, and it hasn't stopped.

Covid death numbers can be taken from the death certificate data. If you can explain how you know more about what killed the person thsn the medical professional issuing the death certificate then will happily consider it.

Also worth noting that Covid is a world wide situation, including places where hospitals are not private profit making organisations.

Simple, follow the $$ come on Scott

Good idea.

How do statistical agencies and health services profit from the supposed inflation of covid deaths in countries with universal health care?

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: dug88

a 0.001% increase

No.

In 2019, a total of 2,854,838 resident deaths were registered in the United States

www.cdc.gov...

In 2020, approximately 3,358,814 deaths† occurred in the United States.

www.cdc.gov...

That is an increase of 16%.

Yes, deaths increased by 16%. But that's total deaths.

We're not talking simply about deaths. We're talking death rate, which has to take population into account by default. Otherwise, it's not a rate.

So for a population of 328,200,000 in 2019 with 2,854,838 deaths is a death rate of 0.8698%

And for a population of 331,002,651 in 2020 with 3,358,814 deaths is a death rate of 1.0147%

If you really want to punch holes

Look at previous years to 2020 ... Say 2018, 2019

What else was rising ? Heart attacks, Kidney, liver, TB ... Now comes 2020 and its all covid ....

An illusion towards the reality of control thru fear ... You know what's Safe and Effective ? My Immune System ...

Carry on

originally posted by: poncho1982

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: dug88

a 0.001% increase

No.

In 2019, a total of 2,854,838 resident deaths were registered in the United States

www.cdc.gov...

In 2020, approximately 3,358,814 deaths† occurred in the United States.

www.cdc.gov...

That is an increase of 16%.

Yes, deaths increased by 16%. But that's total deaths.

We're not talking simply about deaths. We're talking death rate, which has to take population into account by default. Otherwise, it's not a rate.

So for a population of 328,200,000 in 2019 with 2,854,838 deaths is a death rate of 0.8698%

And for a population of 331,002,651 in 2020 with 3,358,814 deaths is a death rate of 1.0147%

Your numbers show an increase of 16.7%.

a reply to: Phage

Phage,

You make me laugh. You really do.

Your initial post in this thread is about how we cannot trust statistical measures, and then you proceeded to post statistic after statistic.

That's kind of awesome. Thanks for the amusement.

a reply to: Thejaybird

Your initial post in this thread is about how we cannot trust statistical measures, and then you proceeded to post statistic after statistic.

You are mistaken. Here is my initial post. I said nothing about not trusting statistical measures. I said that the source used is not valid for the purpose it was used for. Especially when, as it turns out, that data specifically excludes COVID data.

originally posted by: Phage
Mortality data comes from death certificates. Compilation of that data takes time. Attempting to project annual from data available in November is nonsensical especially when there is more current data available.

During January–December 2020, the estimated 2020 age-adjusted death rate increased for the first time since 2017, with an increase of 15.9% compared with 2019, from 715.2 to 828.7 deaths per 100,000 population. COVID-19 was the underlying or a contributing cause of 377,883 deaths (91.5 deaths per 100,000). COVID-19 death rates were highest among males, older adults, and AI/AN and Hispanic persons. The highest numbers of overall deaths and COVID-19 deaths occurred during April and December. COVID-19 was the third leading underlying cause of death in 2020, replacing suicide as one of the top 10 leading causes of death (6).

www.cdc.gov...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: UKTruth

They are deaths 'confirmed or presumed' Covid-19 and you (or I) simply don't know how many were BECAUSE of Covid-19.

Not precisely, of course. But that "presumed" means the the person did not have a COVID positive test before death. The physician used their expertise to determine it.

There must be some reason that there were large increases in deaths attributed to heart disease, stroke, diabetes, and pnuemonia. Maybe COVID had something to do with it. Or maybe it was something else.

There must be some reason there was a 15.9% increase in the death rate from 2019. But maybe it wasn't the pandemic.

Maybe those people didn't die. Maybe the deaths were fabricated.

If's, buts, and maybe's - that's about the only accurate representation of the Covid death numbers.

Do you have the same issue with other causes of death being determined this way or just specifically covid?

No. Not at the moment.
If the Govt decided to overreach based on other deaths and then publish unreliable numbers that gave credence to their overreach, I would.

Can you suggest have a more reliable source of numbers than the medical professionals actually issuing the death certificate?

If I am reading your poor English correctly, you want another source?
If so, no. I don't believe any of the published numbers.

Thankfully public policy isn't based round your paranoia.

Yes, yes - we should never ever mistrust the Govt... except of course if you don't like what they are doing.
I still remember your ridiculous EU posts. Paranoia indeed.

So when the data doesn't support your position just decide the data is wrong?

That seems a solid rational position...

The trouble with data is that it can be manipulated, as humans have done for eons.

a reply to: Salander

The good thing about science is that it tends to be self-correcting. Bad data can be determined.

Or you can just live in a world where nothing is real but what you think is real.

originally posted by: Salander

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: UKTruth

They are deaths 'confirmed or presumed' Covid-19 and you (or I) simply don't know how many were BECAUSE of Covid-19.

Not precisely, of course. But that "presumed" means the the person did not have a COVID positive test before death. The physician used their expertise to determine it.

There must be some reason that there were large increases in deaths attributed to heart disease, stroke, diabetes, and pnuemonia. Maybe COVID had something to do with it. Or maybe it was something else.

There must be some reason there was a 15.9% increase in the death rate from 2019. But maybe it wasn't the pandemic.

Maybe those people didn't die. Maybe the deaths were fabricated.

If's, buts, and maybe's - that's about the only accurate representation of the Covid death numbers.

Do you have the same issue with other causes of death being determined this way or just specifically covid?

No. Not at the moment.
If the Govt decided to overreach based on other deaths and then publish unreliable numbers that gave credence to their overreach, I would.

Can you suggest have a more reliable source of numbers than the medical professionals actually issuing the death certificate?

If I am reading your poor English correctly, you want another source?
If so, no. I don't believe any of the published numbers.

Thankfully public policy isn't based round your paranoia.

Yes, yes - we should never ever mistrust the Govt... except of course if you don't like what they are doing.
I still remember your ridiculous EU posts. Paranoia indeed.

So when the data doesn't support your position just decide the data is wrong?

That seems a solid rational position...

The trouble with data is that it can be manipulated, as humans have done for eons.

In this case it would involve thousands of researchers, medical professionals and data scientists across multiple countries and independent organisations.

Or we could go with completely unsupported opinion based on how someone feels about it.

Think I will stick with the data thanks.

a reply to: Phage

True science demands there be serious and open discussion regarding the validity of theories.

Today censorship rules the airways and the internet even more. Censorship and true science cannot coexist.

a reply to: ScepticScot

Do you remember when everybody on earth believed that earth was the center of the universe?

Sadly, scientists are mere humans, complete with foibles and a weakness for temptation with money and power.

a reply to: Salander

Today censorship rules the airways and the internet even more. Censorship and true science cannot coexist. .

There is all sorts of science published on the internet. Some of it good. Some of it absurdly bad. But regarding the "airways", what specifically do you mean? Alex Jones?

a reply to: Salander

Do you remember when everybody on earth believed that earth was the center of the universe?

I wasn't around then. Neither was much in the way of science. But there was the Church.

Some say Galileo was the first scientist.

a reply to: Phage

No, by airways I mean public communication in general. It was a figure of speech.

The point is that scientists and physicians who dissent from a predetermined narrative are quickly censored. That is not science at all, it is arrogant pseudo-science.

Any claims to practicing science are quickly denied if censorship is being practiced.