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Will Amazon go Union If so Then What

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posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 06:55 AM
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a reply to: AdmireTheDistance

That's like when McDonalds was forced to raise their wage in certain states and they replaced part of the work force with robots. Except they already had the robots ready to go.

They clearly were already planning on replacing workers. They were just waiting for an excuse to roll them out that would minimize PR blowback.

Automation is coming. The question is, is it better to have a job and be expected to be as efficient as a robot or demand to be treated like a human at the risk of being replaced?

I actually know someone that's been working with the Amazon employees in Bessemer and Amazon is pulling out all the dirty tricks they can to make sure this vote doesn't pass.



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 07:09 AM
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originally posted by: AaarghZombies

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: JAGStorm

I’m always torn on the concept of unions.
They are great for preventing workers from being abused.
Unfortunately they also force companies to waste tons of money on stupid rules.

Detroit was built by unions and destroyed by unions.


I'm pretty sure that this union is only really concerned with getting its members things like longer bathroom breaks and less dickendian conditions. Seriously, Amazon treats its staff like robots, their quota are murderously tight. It's not a happy place at all.


It always starts that way.
Then they demand more and more.



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 07:56 AM
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a reply to: Bluntone22

So they just shouldn't fight for better conditions in the first place?



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 08:44 AM
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a reply to: Xcalibur254

Did I say that?

Unions always start with good intentions and the they tend to become corrupt and power hungry.

Ford just announced a factory moving to Mexico.
$60hr union employees are the reason.

When you go to the well to often you risk it running dry.



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 10:49 AM
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originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: Bluntone22

So they just shouldn't fight for better conditions in the first place?


Whenever I think of Unions I think of the Illinois Teacher Unions. That’s probably not fair to other unions but it show how badly it can go.
The Illinois teachers unions have held kids and parents hostage so many times and so many years. It is always, always always about money. Well that turnip has no blood and the parents are just about broke. Illinois will reap with it sows. I know that’s a lot of cliches but if the shoe fits...



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 12:24 PM
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The unions, the unions, you all shout like they are a separate entity. The unions ARE the people. Just because the vast majority of people are too scared to fight for themselves, too scared to speak up, so they let the union heads rule the roost. The majority can stop any process that they don't like, but they don't because they are afraid to stand up for themselves. So they get railroaded into places they don't want to be.



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 12:35 PM
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originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: Xcalibur254

Did I say that?

Unions always start with good intentions and the they tend to become corrupt and power hungry.

Ford just announced a factory moving to Mexico.
$60hr union employees are the reason.

When you go to the well to often you risk it running dry.


There are two sides of that. Can an amazon employee making 15 dollars an hour, supporting a family, afford to buy a new truck?

Is Ford going to lower the prices of the trucks produced in Mexico? Are the vehicles produced in Mexico cheaper now?

There won't be a middle class able to afford new vehicles and goods, if companies don't pay good wage.

The well needs to water everyone. Corporate conglomerates want the whole damned well for themselves.


edit on 31-3-2021 by liejunkie01 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 12:57 PM
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a reply to: Bluntone22

There are two reasons for that.

First, most unions are hierarchical. Eventually, they are dominated by professional union leaders who just want to enrich themselves. The solution is for unions to adopt a more democratic system, where everything has to be approved by popular vote. The IWW follows this model.

Second, unions don't have much of a stake in how the business performs. It sounds counter-intuitive, but I think that if employees got bonuses directly tied to the performance of the company as a whole, and if the union itself had a say in how the company was run, then they might gain a better understanding. For example, the Mondragon Corporation in Spain is run democratically. When the 2008 recession hit, the employees voted to take a pay cut because it was the only way to keep going without laying off workers.



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 01:53 PM
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Hopefully amazon can just fire them - they should be able to but tyrants will try to prevent it.

edit on 31-3-2021 by Ringsofsaturn777 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 01:59 PM
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a reply to: liejunkie01

The American consumer is not innocent in this scenario.
They will buy the cheapest products or a specific product at the cheapest price instead of supporting companies employing Americans.

Should I buy a Ford?
It's an American company right...built in Mexico.
Or
Should I buy a Toyota built in indiana?

Which is a better choice for Americans?



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 02:03 PM
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a reply to: Ringsofsaturn777

People trying to make their working conditions humane should be fired?



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 02:13 PM
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originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: Ringsofsaturn777

People trying to make their working conditions humane should be fired?


If the job was so horrific they would just leave.. they dont because most other similar jobs have even worse conditions, pay and benefits.. its a zero skill job. Dont be such a gullible drama queen. They know amazon has a shet ton of cash and they want some, that doesnt mean they deserve it.

Employers should definately be free to fire ppl for supporting a union (or for just about any other reason).

edit on 31-3-2021 by Ringsofsaturn777 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 02:29 PM
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originally posted by: liejunkie01

There are two sides of that. Can an amazon employee making 15 dollars an hour, supporting a family, afford to buy a new truck?



Not when the guys making the truck are being paid $60 an hour.
edit on 31-3-2021 by JIMC5499 because: typo



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 02:46 PM
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originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: JAGStorm

I’m always torn on the concept of unions.
They are great for preventing workers from being abused.
Unfortunately they also force companies to waste tons of money on stupid rules.

Detroit was built by unions and destroyed by unions.


The social club that I'm an officer of has a lot of people who work at a local steel mill. The mill is union. Some of the things that I have seen them do would blow your mind. A crane operator, sitting there drinking until 10 PM and then leaving saying that he has the Midnight shift. He's not worried about it. The Union's got his back. If he gets found out by management, he gets a week off unpaid. A week or so later, they have a hearing, the guy goes back to work and gets paid for the week.

Last October, a guy gets a call from his wife. His kid was hit by a car. He looks for his Supervisor and can't find him. The guy leaves a note on the supervisor's desk and goes to the hospital. When the supervisor gets the note, he fires the guy. The guy couldn't find the supervisor, because he was sitting at our club drinking beer. He went in, punched in, walked out, went to the club, went back to work to punch out. He didn't want anybody investigating the incident because they might have found out where he was. The Union didn't support him, because, the freaking Union representative was there drinking with the Supervisor. The guy ended up getting a different job at the mill after a security video showing the day, date and time of the Supervisor and the Union representative sitting at the bar mysteriously made it's way to Senior management. Neither the Supervisor or Union rep. were disciplined.



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 02:48 PM
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originally posted by: JIMC5499

originally posted by: liejunkie01

There are two sides of that. Can an amazon employee making 15 dollars an hour, supporting a family, afford to buy a new truck?



Not when the guys making the truck are being paid $60 an hour.


Yet outsourced labour never leads to cheaper vehicles. All the savings are pocketed by the executives. Who continiously grow wealthier while the purchasing power of everyone else has been in decline for decades.

I call it corruption. Corruption and economic sabotage.



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 02:50 PM
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originally posted by: Ringsofsaturn777

originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: Ringsofsaturn777

People trying to make their working conditions humane should be fired?


If the job was so horrific they would just leave.. they dont because most other similar jobs have even worse conditions, pay and benefits.. its a zero skill job. Dont be such a gullible drama queen. They know amazon has a shet ton of cash and they want some, that doesnt mean they deserve it.

Employers should definately be free to fire ppl for supporting a union (or for just about any other reason).


They can’t leave as thanks to Amazon there are no other jobs avaliable, and Amazon boasts some of the worst worker conditions in the western world.

Firing workers for unionising should lead to arrest of the corporate policy makers who made the decision. A grotesque violation of workers’ rights.



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 03:11 PM
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originally posted by: Ohanka

They can’t leave as thanks to Amazon there are no other jobs avaliable, and Amazon boasts some of the worst worker conditions in the western world.


Riiiight... everyone in the country works for amazon they are the only employer.. you are just a silly person i see.



originally posted by: [post=25826378]Ohanka[/post
Firing workers for unionising should lead to arrest of the corporate policy makers who made the decision. A grotesque violation of workers’ rights.


And an unapologetic tyrant as well.

Employment is a voluntary relationship between 2 parties. An employer should not be forced to continue employing someone they dont wish 2, any more than an employee should be forced to continue working someplace they dont want to work.
edit on 31-3-2021 by Ringsofsaturn777 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 03:15 PM
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originally posted by: Ohanka

Yet outsourced labour never leads to cheaper vehicles. All the savings are pocketed by the executives. Who continiously grow wealthier while the purchasing power of everyone else has been in decline for decades.

I call it corruption. Corruption and economic sabotage.


If it wasnt for outsourcing the prices you pay for everything would be shocking.. weve had low inflation despite printing trillions of dollars for exactky this reason.

The savings are passed along.. any company who didnt wouldnt last long (because their competition will in order to steal their customers).
edit on 31-3-2021 by Ringsofsaturn777 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 03:34 PM
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For the record, there are a lot of really good points in this thread, on both sides.

I'm going to hold off with my opinion for a bit, a couple posts here have actually given me some pause.

S&F!



posted on Mar, 31 2021 @ 03:46 PM
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Unions are a double-edged sword. In some cases, they are absolutely necessary and have been historically, but today not so much.

For my father, born in 1913, they saved the day. He worked to help form the first coal miners union in Utah. He went on to changing jobs during WW2 and learning welding and pipefitting, building warships in the San Diego shipyards then helped found a Welder/Pipefitters union also in Utah. Union wages made it possible for him to buy a house and land which became fruit orchards and we grew all our own food in the 50s/60s.

He died on the job when I was 15. A bad heart and he was struggling with black lung from his youth working in coal mines. The union denied my mother and me anything and claimed he needed another year of hours to get anything. He helped found the damn union as well as watching friends killed by strikebreakers in Utah's version of the coal wars at the Anthracite mines in Utah. We got nothing except a 1lb coffee can full of spare change and small bills they dropped off one day. As the union president drove off that day in his new Cadillac, I learned what rage felt like, and I learned what corruption truly is.

The unions bankrupted General Motors and yet people do not understand where the money is going.

I tried to join the IBEW in the 70s after having four years as an apprentice on non-union jobs. I passed the test with the highest score recorded at that time, so they said yes. To join I had to give them over $800 (a lot of money then) and agree not to work on any non-union jobs. I asked how long before I could get a job and was told the usual wait was for 18 months to 3 years and I'd have to pay my dues the whole time or I could not work. I passed.

I quickly found a job in a right-to-work state. That's when I found out not only did non-union pay more and have better benefits, there were no dues or sitting on a bench. I could work steadily based on my own work and my own reputation. I could also work oilrigs between construction jobs, so no unemployment. Where I was during that time it was stupid to join a union.

Yes, they were once upon a time necessary, but not anymore. Now they are just organized crime under the guise of unions.


edit on 3/31/2021 by Blaine91555 because: (no reason given)



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