Aliens or what?

originally posted by: Waterglass
a reply to: Arbitrageur

I saw what I saw.

I'm not sure if you are talking about your own UFO sighting or the drawings of the Ariel School children. I was talking about the latter.

I am also not paid to post here.

There might be paid posters in politics trying to influence elections but I'd be surprised if someone is paying people to post UFO comments on ATS. I'm not paid to post either.

My mind is made up and I wrote my opinion. You wrote yours. As this is basically a conspiracy site you response is way way over the top. In fact it doesn't align with normal human behavior. So what are you concerned about.

Most of that is a copy and paste from a previous post I made when I researched what I could of the drawings. I'd still like to see the rest of the drawings but I can only see glimpses of them in the stack Cynthia Hind leafs through in the video I posted.

Mensa accepted me, does that mean I'm not normal? I was looking for intelligent conversation when I joined.

originally posted by: Waterglass
So heres another incident since your on a roll. My oh my look at all the text with pictures. Seems to me you wrote your responses in record time. Just as fast as those alien space ships.

Did Stanton Friedman even touch it?

Turkey Govt Confirms Authenticity of UFO Sighting in 2009

Speaking of "over the top", that applies to some of the language in your link, implying the government confirms the video shows aliens, but when I looked for actual quotes from the government, I clicked the link in your article that says "READ ENTIRE ARTICLE" and this is what it shows:

"Even though a detailed analysis of the footage is conducted, it might still remain unidentified. Hence, other reference objects need to be recorded in the same frame with a disputable object and further shootings need to be done by ourselves with special equipment in the same locations and conditions," said the government agency, reports Disclose TV.

So despite the nearly hysterical commentary implying the government of Turkey confirms an alien UFO, it sounds to me like they are saying it's still unidentified, and "further shootings need to be done", so it doesn't sound like their investigation was complete as of the 2018 date of that article. Is there a further update? I would say let's see the results of the "further shootings need to be done" mentioned in your link and see what they have to say after further investigation.

I think it's a UO, unidentified object, not a UFO. I don't think it's flying, because the video doesn't seem to show it flying and it seems to be in the same position in two other videos over the previous year. Here's the video the link in your link shows, at time index 1:08, and it mentions the sightings ran from 2007-2009:



The folks on Metabunk were looking into this. The photographer was shooting these videos from 2007-2009 so I think the Turkey Government investigators are a decade late if they are only looking into it in 2018. They had from 2007 to 2009 to investigate it. In three videos during that time he shot the same object in the same position, and one of those three videos is the one your link talks about:

www.metabunk.org...

*The UFO witness and videographer in this case is sometimes identified as Murat Yalcin and sometimes as Yalcin Yalman, for some reason.

www.metabunk.org...

Over the months he sees the same exact object 3 times in exactly the same position, at the same distance.

That photographic record doesn't seem consistent with a flying object to me. I'm wondering why photographer Yalcin didn't get on a boat and get closer to it to get better images of it; he had a year to do it from May 2008 to May 2009, it doesn't appear to have moved or changed at all.

originally posted by: Arbitrageur
That photographic record doesn't seem consistent with a flying object to me. I'm wondering why photographer Yalcin didn't get on a boat and get closer to it to get better images of it; he had a year to do it from May 2008 to May 2009, it doesn't appear to have moved or changed at all.

If you look at all the footage, including the stuff that doesn't look like a convertible flying saucer, it often looks distorted and compressed. And if you speed up the footage, you can get a better idea about what it really is, which is some kind of odd misalignment of the crazy rig he was using to do the filming. He was holding a cheap telescope up to the lens of his camera, and the "UFO" is a reflection off one of the edges of the lenses or lens mounts. With this one, the far-off light (probably a boat) is likely reflecting off (or refracting through) the top of the telescope lens.

That might also explain why it's green and has concentric circles. After he made some money with this, he got better equipment including a camera with a real telephoto lens. Not surprisingly, the aliens stopped showing up.

As someone who uses a monocular regularly, I can attest that misalignment is a recurring issue.

I don't know why people are so enthralled with this video. This one and the Salida, Colorado video are so often presented as some of the best proof of possibly alien UFOs, yet they are both just garbage.

a reply to: Arbitrageur

50 drawings, does anybody have those archived/available or are they being withheld from us? Who has them

I am going to guess Gunter Hofer? or will least know.

originally posted by: Blue Shift
And if you speed up the footage, you can get a better idea about what it really is, which is some kind of odd misalignment of the crazy rig he was using to do the filming.

That was sort of one of the hypotheses on the metabunk thread I cited, though I didn't see total proof of that, but it does seem like a plausible explanation.

After he made some money with this, he got better equipment including a camera with a real telephoto lens. Not surprisingly, the aliens stopped showing up.

I didn't know that part of the story. It seems like the Turkey government investigators should have been interested in that information, but I don't know if they were aware of that.

I don't know why people are so enthralled with this video. This one and the Salida, Colorado video are so often presented as some of the best proof of possibly alien UFOs, yet they are both just garbage.

I did some analysis of the Salida, Colorado UFO and have a pretty good guess of what it is, and that too is not a flying object IMO. You could call it a UAP, unidentified aerial phenomenon, since it is a phenomenon seen in the air, but I don't think it's an object, and the fact that it's partially transparent and fades away should be enough confirmation of that, presuming we are talking about the same video.

originally posted by: Baablacksheep
a reply to: Arbitrageur

50 drawings, does anybody have those archived/available or are they being withheld from us? Who has them

I am going to guess Gunter Hofer? or will least know.

Possibly he might know. If he has them he should post them.

I'm actually more interested in UFOs that have better evidence than just eyewitness statements so I'm not sure it would be worth the time to try to chase them down. I was hoping someone might say they are already online and post the link.

originally posted by: Arbitrageur

I don't know why people are so enthralled with this video. This one and the Salida, Colorado video are so often presented as some of the best proof of possibly alien UFOs, yet they are both just garbage.

I did some analysis of the Salida, Colorado UFO and have a pretty good guess of what it is, and that too is not a flying object IMO. You could call it a UAP, unidentified aerial phenomenon, since it is a phenomenon seen in the air, but I don't think it's an object, and the fact that it's partially transparent and fades away should be enough confirmation of that, presuming we are talking about the same video.

I've seen -- and even created with my own little phone -- a video that essentially accounts for all of the odd movements of that UFO and I'm very sure that it's a sun reflection off a strand of spider silk. Weird lateral movement that never goes past the edge of the building and mirrors the camera movement. The way it bounces and sways with the breeze, and when it blows too hard the thing "vanishes" because it loses the reflection, etc.

People get stuff in their head though and won't let go. We're all like that I guess. Hurts to say, "I was wrong about that one."

a reply to: Blue Shift
I was also thinking sun reflection. I've seen other UFO videos where the UFO is related to spider silk reflections, but I'd have to re-watch the Salido video to consider that hypothesis about spider silk. I was thinking about other possible sources of the sun reflection but regardless of what the sun reflected from, I do think some people got a little too excited about some sun reflections.

a reply to: Arbitrageur

Mensa accepted me, does that mean I'm not normal? I was looking for intelligent conversation when I joined.

Your quite normal. My brother and his son are in MENSA. I cant make the cut as my short term memory sucks as my IQ is higher than his. I still disagree on the Ariel situation. I also sent you some stuff on that Kumburgaz, Turkey UFO.

So take a look at this.

The little bastards hole up subsurface inside the fault lines and fissures beneath the oceans and earth?

Here me out.

[1] Two reported US Navy incidents off the coast of California with UFO's. Could be anything but the story did finally leak out. Does ET think we are rocking the boat with respect to seismic activity which collapses their Hives?

[2] Type into Google UFOs observed before earthquakes. Volcanos too. Tons of stuff

[3] Seems like those buggers hole up "down under" They can obviously sense when an earthquake or volcano is about to happen so they get out and buzz around as [A], they need a new home or [B] they return to the old one. Hence they don't care for Nuclear tests

Reference: The 2004 Nimitz Tic Tac encounter was reported to be “off the coast” of San Diego, California. The July 2019 Channel Islands are located around 100 miles as the crow flys up the coast from the Nimitz. In terms of UFO’s that's a miniscule distance. In terms of Trump and back in the day 2019, it was obvious that the USN is “disturbed” about something. Since all INTEL is compartmentalized it could be as follows: The entire situation could be a INTEL controlled psyop. It could also be a faction within or located in the USA attempting to get the USA to engage in a military action so as to probe the total capability of the Aegis Ballistic Missile Defense System. The same goes for Aliens as in ET. I believe that ET is here and has been for 1000’s of years. I have my videos and pictures. Apparently THEY DONT want disclosure. I also believe they have cirquids technology as that's why they enter our oceans as what I witnessed on 18Dec18 was one HUGE mother of a black triangle flew right over me. The thing had 100’s of geometric projections on its belly. Others in South Carolina have also seen, videoed and swear by what I saw. I am the only one writing about it. Since there are apparently fissures beneath the ocean along the fault line in that region, who knows. It could be their Hive. 2nd Reference: www.express.co.uk...

a reply to: Arbitrageur

So what about this one?

he Missouri Democrat dated October 19, 1865

gives an account of the sighting of an unknown flying object under the headline of “A STRANGE STORY-REMARKABLE DISCOVERY.” The story was reported by one James Lumley, who was a trapper. The report stated that “if” what Lumley reported was true, it would shake the foundations of the scientific world. Lumely claims that in the middle of September, he was trapping in the mountains at a location about 75-100 miles above the Great Falls of the Upper Missouri River. Just after sunset, Lumley saw a “bright, luminous, body” in the skies. This body moved very quickly to the East. After five seconds, the unknown object burst into pieces. He soon heard a thunderous explosion followed by a “rushing sound.” This explosion shook the ground. He could smell sulphur in the air. Though impressed by what he had seen and heard, the next day would bring even more remarkable discoveries. About two miles from his campsite, he could see a path cut through the forest. Whatever had come through the area had leveled everything in its path. He soon discovered the cause of the great destruction, a giant object which was made of a rock-like material. This object had been driven into the side of a mountain after ripping through the forest. This was much more than an asteroid or comet: the object was divided into compartments. Also, hieroglyphic-like symbols could be seen carved into the object’s surface. He also discovered fragments of what appeared to be glass, and strange liquid-like stains located in several places on the object.

a reply to: Arbitrageur

Plus this one from 1878:

A second newspaper report on a strange airship was included in the Denison Daily News of Denison, Texas on January 25, 1878.


A Texas farmer, John Martin, was credited with one of the first uses of the term “flying saucer.” Martin had actually seen a “balloon-shaped” UFO, but used the saucer term to describe the size of the object from his perspective. Martin’s sighting was January 2. What he saw was a dark object high in the sky. The object was moving closer to him all the while. Because the object maintained a dark color, there was speculation that the object was solid and backlit. The headlines of the 25th would read, “A STRANGE PHENOMENON.” A portion of the report is listed here: “From Mr. John Martin, a farmer who lives some six miles south of this city, we learn the following strange story: Tuesday morning while out hunting, his attention was directed to a dark object high up in the southern sky. The peculiar shape and velocity with which the object seemed to approach riveted his attention and he strained his eves to discover its character.” “When first noticed, it appeared to be about the size of an orange, which continued to grow in size. After gazing at it for some time Mr. Martin became blind from long looking and left off viewing it for a time in order to rest his eyes. On resuming his view, the object was almost overhead and had increased considerably in size, and appeared to be going through space at wonderful speed.” The most enduring account of early air ships occurred in the small Texas town of Aurora in 1897. This account would also be carried in newspapers, preserving details of an alleged UFO crash and the burial of an alien being. This ongoing legend would cause the state of Texas to declare the town a “historical site.”

Idk, if there was a giant red dragon that could bring the end of a kingdom an ravage the land, that was sleeping, is it a good idea to tickle it tail.

The Battle of L.A is such a story regarding ufo flying in controlled airspace, an if the more fanciful details offer anything. It was quite a show, where said object was being shot at from all angles with no effect, while soldiers were hit by friendly fire or heart attacks.

Then there the Tehran story, where one was being targeted, an the iranian pilots supposedly lost power an regained it when it disappeared.

Whatever it is, it knows full well, humanities fear of the unknown, an it might keep it that way.

originally posted by: Waterglass
I also sent you some stuff on that Kumburgaz, Turkey UFO.

I haven't seen anything in my inbox here. I am lucky if I check my inbox 4 times a year but I checked it after reading that and nothing there from you.

So take a look at this.

I'm not sure I want to respond to a continuing gish gallop of accounts from sources that seem to lack critical thinking skills, but in the context of this being the aliens and UFO forum where UFO means alien vehicle to many people, I can't say I see anything compelling in your posts suggestive of any aliens. If they are unexplained and you make a list of possibilities you could of course put aliens on the list but I don't see why they would be high on the list.

Your first source sounds irrational and out to lunch and can't even spell "hear me out":

"Here me out.

[1] Two reported US Navy incidents off the coast of California with UFO's. Could be anything but the story did finally leak out. Does ET think we are rocking the boat with respect to seismic activity which collapses their Hives?

[2] Type into Google UFOs observed before earthquakes. Volcanos too. Tons of stuff "

How did he get from UFOs off the coast to seismic activity collapsing (alien?) hives? I don't follow the logic, it seems pretty out to lunch.

UFOs off the coast, the more recent sightings have stories about sailors with personal consumer cameras photographing what they call "drones" near the channel islands. The Navy owns one of those islands and uses it for training purposes, apparently can be classified and maybe Navy seals have some capable drones in their arsenal of recon tools, I don't know why they wouldn't.

Earthquake lights:
There are numerous possibilities.
As with UFOs, it's hard to say what they are sometimes without something like video evidence.
One possibility mentioned on the USGS site is that power lines shake during an earthquake and this could create some lights from electrical arcing though I'm skeptical of that explanation too. There are even numerous scientific papers written to suggest possibilities but they aren't at all consistent. I don't have any reason to believe any of them without further evidence, so as with UFO sightings, we need more than eyewitness accounts to come to any conclusions about sources of earthquake lights. I'm reminded of claims of ball lightning. We didn't understand that until we captured it on video, which occurred after a lightning strike, for a few seconds.

Volcanic lights are easier to understand and explain to some extent because we have photographic evidence of those. The volcanic eruptions appear to create electrical imbalances in the gases surrounding the volcano and we see electrical discharges (maybe think of it as small lightning, could even be small ball lightning though I'm not sure anybody has confirmed that).

"Seems like those buggers hole up "down under" They can obviously sense when an earthquake or volcano is about to happen so they get out and buzz around as [A], they need a new home or [B] they return to the old one. Hence they don't care for Nuclear tests

Reference: The 2004 Nimitz Tic Tac encounter was reported to be “off the coast” of San Diego, California. The July 2019 Channel Islands are located around 100 miles as the crow flys up the coast from the Nimitz. In terms of UFO’s that's a miniscule distance. In terms of Trump and back in the day 2019, it was obvious that the USN is “disturbed” about something. Since all INTEL is compartmentalized it could be as follows: The entire situation could be a INTEL controlled psyop."

That's the first thing that source said that makes any sense to me. I can't confirm it's an intel psyop, but it sure has enough very suspicious characteristics to suggest that possibility. Some details of all the suspicious signs pointing to an intel operation are discussed at length in the previous and ongoing threads relating to TTSA (who claim to have disclosed the nimitz video, but they didn't, it was actually leaked on this site, ATS, in suspicious circumstances). This is the latest thread link if you want to read more, which also links to the previous two long threads, which also discuss the possibility of TTSA and Tom DeLonge getting played as part of an intel psyop, and TTSA was heavy with (former?) intelligence staff in plain sight.

Breaking BAASS, Assessing AATIP and Doubting Thomas ‘DeLonge’

One of the Tom DeLonge supporters in that 2nd thread even posted a strange tweet by Tom DeLonge saying he realized the intelligence influence, but it seems to have been deleted like so many of DeLonge's other things.

originally posted by: Waterglass
a reply to: Arbitrageur

So what about this one?

"This was much more than an asteroid or comet: the object was divided into compartments. "What object? Where is the object? If it's gone, how does he know anything about it? If there are remains, where are the remains? Even if it was just a space rock that fragmented or exploded, the fragments are still worth something, collectors or even universities will pay for them.

"Also, hieroglyphic-like symbols could be seen carved into the object’s surface. "

Cool, but don't tell me there were hieroglyphics, show them to me.

There was a famous witness talking about alien hieroglyphics, when I'm pretty sure that's not what they were based on his co-worker's account (Source: The Roswell Report, 1995)

originally posted by: Waterglass
"Martin had actually seen a “balloon-shaped” UFO, but used the saucer term to describe the size of the object from his perspective. "

I don't understand why this is even interesting, seems irrational. It's not clear how he ruled out that the "balloon-shaped" UFO was actually a balloon. Balloons are thought to account for some percentage of UFO sightings and they (or photos of them) even seem to be used in the TTSA psy-op.



It seems to me like either pentagon analysts are completely incompetent or the psy-op continues with leaks of this supposed cube shaped UFO which the analysts say isn't a balloon but it looks like a balloon and I have no reason to doubt it's a balloon, so either it's a psy-op or people are far more incompetent at recognizing balloons than I would have guessed:

Leaked Photo Surfaces of Purported Unidentified Aerial Phenomena

The Debrief has learned of the leak of an unclassified photo, said to have been widely distributed in the Intelligence Community, which purportedly shows what the DoD has characterized as “Unidentified Aerial Phenomena.”

Reminds me of the Chris Mellon drama showing us a balloon with implied extraterrestrial capabilities, but now instead of Chris Mellon it's the same intelligence community he worked for "leaking" the photo of a balloon which apparently nobody in the entire intelligence community can identify as a balloon, but balloon vendors on social media immediately recognized it as a balloon.

Some discussion about that from the thread linked above:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

So the relevance of this to the 1878 "balloon-shaped" UFO is that the entire US intelligence community apparently can't recognize a balloon even when they have a photograph of the balloon (that balloon vendors recognize as a ballooon), but you think it's significan't that a farmer in 1878 who has no photo of the "balloon-shaped" UFO he saw can't tell if it was a balloon? I don't even understand why you would ask about this or think it's significant. Maybe the significance is an early use of the word "saucer" though I question even the relevance of that since it's not even clear why that word was used, because the explanation given doesn't seem to make much sense.

a reply to: Nickn3

You say this but have zero proof. lol

a reply to: Arbitrageur

I haven't seen anything in my inbox here. I am lucky if I check my inbox 4 times a year but I checked it after reading that and nothing there from you.

So put a call into the ATS help desk. Many times when others write me back it also doesn't show up in my in box. Big whoopie.

Your first source sounds irrational

So when you spoke to your mirror this morning what did it say back to you? Are you employed as INTEL as this is a conspiracy site and guys like you offer nothing, tamp down the possibilities and simply try to put this site of of business.

There was a famous witness talking about alien hieroglyphics, when I'm pretty sure that's not what they were based on his co-worker's account (Source: The Roswell Report, 1995)

So where did you get this from. Its a FAKE. Every official government form has a number. DD something for Department of Defense and others.

Too much asteroid dust between the ears? I just love it when you "guz" write a way over the top book in an attempt to debunk. Complete with illustrations, FAKE reports and the rest of the illusion.

The key is you never address the actual story as reported.

a reply to: Arbitrageur

WTF?

I DIDN'T WRITE OR POST THIS as follows:

originally posted by: Waterglass "Martin had actually seen a “balloon-shaped” UFO, but used the saucer term to describe the size of the object from his perspective. "

Really WTF ATS

originally posted by: Waterglass
a reply to: Arbitrageur

WTF?

I DIDN'T WRITE OR POST THIS as follows:

originally posted by: Waterglass "Martin had actually seen a “balloon-shaped” UFO, but used the saucer term to describe the size of the object from his perspective. "

Really WTF ATS

You quoted it. I put quotes around it, to show you quoted it. I didn't say you said it yourself, which if you did, I wouldn't have put quotes around it, I would have used the normal bbcode tags.

If I had just left it inside the EX tags, it wouldn't show up, like it doesn't show up above. In an earlier version of ATS, it would have showed up, but ATS changed that, so the text inside EX tags only shows up now if it's not inside any other EX or Quote tags.

a reply to: Arbitrageur

No way. It was manipulated by someone. Not just a keyboard typo. OK so what. So here's another UFO slap. He was the #2 Nazi Rocket Scientist. Look him up and what his opinions were on ET. He Trumps you, he Trumps me and he also trumps Trump. Vril?

Hermann Oberth

Many decades ago, the mentor of Wernher Von Braun, Hermann Oberth (both seen in the picture above), the founding father of rocketry and astronautics, also known as the ‘father of Spaceflight’ stated his belief that “flying saucers are real” and that “they are space ships from another solar system.” He went on to say that “I think that they possibly are manned by intelligent observers who are members of a race that may have been investigating our Earth for centuries.” He wrote these words in “Flying Saucers Come From A Distant World”, The American Weekly, Oct 24, 1954. At the time, academics like Oberth were well aware of the reality of UFO phenomenon. Carl Jung, for example, accused the air force of covering up the UFO phenomenon at the

originally posted by: Waterglass
a reply to: Arbitrageur

No way. It was manipulated by someone. Not just a keyboard typo.

You're talking about this post?

As far as I can tell, whether you edit your own post, or whether the mods edit it, there will be a notation at the bottom that the post has been edited. There are no notations of any edits on the post so it sure looks like it hasn't been manipulated by anybody.

I find other people's beliefs interesting, but I'm not particularly swayed by them unless they have some objective evidence to back those beliefs up. Lots of prominent people believe lots of things which don't appear to be any kind of objective truth. So if you want to believe something because someone else believes it, be my guest, it's your choice, but it doesn't work for me because many people have many beliefs which do not appear to be true, a phenomenon studied by psychologists. Prominent people are no exception.

Take religion for example, lots of people have religious beliefs, but they aren't all the same. They are difficult to prove false ("can't prove a negative"), or true, so we can't say which if any are objectively true, but, they can't all be true because they are to some extent conflicting with each other. So the only truths we can count on are objective truths, the kind that people agree on, because they are based on solid evidence which is objectively verifiable. That doesn't mean you can't have personal beliefs on top of that, but not everyone is going to agree with your personal beliefs if they aren't objectively verifiable.

a reply to: Arbitrageur

Well were done. I mean so whats the point as many here are here simply to push disinformation. ATS needs to smarten up but then again it also may be "old" technology with Twitter, Facebook and others coming on stream.

What I was told is that certain guys are here to extract what others have. Nothing less and nothing more. So I look at the givers and takers of information.

Actually for my $6 a month on another UFO site I have learned more in one year than 3 years here. So one gets what he pays for.

You have anything on Vril as in Maria Orsic? How about Dr. Karla Turner?

Stay tuned

a reply to: Waterglass

Yea I thought so.

I forgot to ask him whether he likes to eat his Sushi; shaken or stirred.