The perfect Imperfections of God

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: TzarChasm
This god creature sounds like an oxymoron who is hilariously insecure to the point of crippling indecision.

Spoken like a true atheist
Surprisingly?

Wow, it's like you wanted to post a scathing reply but had no idea what to type. Bravo for trying, I guess?

Now let's return to the actual topic and why my comments were off the mark. Or better yet, why my comments were completely on point.

a reply to: St0rD

But I thought we would get into a genuine healthy debate here

Well you'll have to make up my mind amigo!

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: TzarChasm
This god creature sounds like an oxymoron who is hilariously insecure to the point of crippling indecision.

Spoken like a true atheist
Surprisingly?

Wow, it's like you wanted to post a scathing reply but had no idea what to type. Bravo for trying, I guess?

Now let's return to the actual topic and why my comments were off the mark. Or better yet, why my comments were completely on point.

Believe what you want TC
Not for me to argue your choice, just get all preachy at me and not really interested

I will say it again, you are like a fundamental atheist injecting your doctrine with a religious like fervour

originally posted by: St0rD
a reply to: Raggedyman

I never said I know why we were created what are you talking about? I talked about what I think is the place of evil in this universe.

I find it quite amusing you claim my arguments are nonsensical. From your post I can easily see you took what you wanted from my OP and let go of the rest.
Where did I state that God was evil?

My point is that since God holds all things together it means that evil is a part of him. The yin and the yang. Everything that exist is a part of God. So feel free to mock my OP but it doesn't change the fact that evil is a part of this universe, thus a part of God.

The difference between God and mankind is that he uses evil only for the greater good. There is no evil in Heaven but there is elsewhere. Sure, if you wanna go back to the source you have to let go of sins. God is sinless but he cannot pretend evil doesn't exist in him. Because if God is all, where does evil come from? It is only a mean to an end. Evil exist probably only to remind us of the importance of honoring our true nature.

originally posted by: St0rD
Nobody truly ask themselves what is the purpose of life anymore. Such a shame if you ask me.
...
Well, I've genuinely asked for the truth and like they say-
"Ask and you shall receive" so here is what I feel was delivered.

Maybe I did take what I wanted and read more into your op than you intended, then it was my mistake
It did seem to me you were inferring you knew the purpose of life

Anyway, my apologise

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: St0rD
a reply to: Raggedyman

I never said I know why we were created what are you talking about? I talked about what I think is the place of evil in this universe.

I find it quite amusing you claim my arguments are nonsensical. From your post I can easily see you took what you wanted from my OP and let go of the rest.
Where did I state that God was evil?

My point is that since God holds all things together it means that evil is a part of him. The yin and the yang. Everything that exist is a part of God. So feel free to mock my OP but it doesn't change the fact that evil is a part of this universe, thus a part of God.

The difference between God and mankind is that he uses evil only for the greater good. There is no evil in Heaven but there is elsewhere. Sure, if you wanna go back to the source you have to let go of sins. God is sinless but he cannot pretend evil doesn't exist in him. Because if God is all, where does evil come from? It is only a mean to an end. Evil exist probably only to remind us of the importance of honoring our true nature.

originally posted by: St0rD
Nobody truly ask themselves what is the purpose of life anymore. Such a shame if you ask me.
...
Well, I've genuinely asked for the truth and like they say-
"Ask and you shall receive" so here is what I feel was delivered.

Maybe I did take what I wanted and read more into your op than you intended, then it was my mistake
It did seem to me you were inferring you knew the purpose of life

Anyway, my apologise

I asked for the truth and God provided some powerful realizations to me but they are only a fragment of the whole tapistry. I don't claim to know the true purpose of life since nobody really knows for sure.

But no worries man it's all good.

a reply to: St0rD

The purpose of life, isn't it only found looking back?

Who is more evil? The personified evil that is the Devil? Or the one responsible for creating that evil and allowing it to prosper, even promoting its cause (giving it dominion over the Earth), and using it as a scapegoat and scare tactic? Also, spare me the free will argument because it's bologna too. God himself manipulates free will, and has plenty of times in the Bible. (Pharaoh vs Moses for example)

a reply to: St0rD

Thank you for sharing such beautiful truth.

The way I see it, the beast being cast out for a thousand years would be akin to One removing a mask.

How confusing a place if close to none knew even the costumes they themselves were wearing.


^_^

originally posted by: WakeUpBeer
Who is more evil? The personified evil that is the Devil? Or the one responsible for creating that evil and allowing it to prosper, even promoting its cause (giving it dominion over the Earth), and using it as a scapegoat and scare tactic? Also, spare me the free will argument because it's bologna too. God himself manipulates free will, and has plenty of times in the Bible. (Pharaoh vs Moses for example)

I would tend to argue God didn't create evil per se. It has always been there lurking somewhere. God cannot deny evil because it would mean denying creation itselfs. It seems he tried to contain it instead which definitely backfired.

Yeah, It's a mystery why God let terrible things happen on Earth. I guess the most plausible explanation would be that God honor justice and stick by his own laws. He gave us the choice to refuse evil temptations and the sinful nature that comes with it. Now that we chose a path he must respect it and be true to his words. Letting us live like we (think) we want.

To go deeper, I had an insight once about God having himself battled against doubts. When creation was One and in perfect balance God gave rise to a disturbing question-
Where do I come from?
Just imagine that this is a truly frightening question and mystery even for us humans. Now think about the implications and shock it would be for a supreme being to start to question his own existence. Ofc it is just my own theory but I personnaly feel like it was delivered by God so I could know him better. I don't know if there is truth in it but it surely changed my perspective on what God might be.

That maybe he made mistakes too at one point and had to face all the doubts we humans also face. Maybe it was dormant in himself and when it revealed itself evil was unleashed in some ways.

a reply to: St0rD

This vision was a gift bestowed upon you.

To share this burden of knowledge is One's task, but only to those willing to Know.

Can you imagine how One would undertake such an endeavor? Alone? In our world?

a reply to: St0rD

That was a refreshing post to read, thank you. Too often I think people attribute perfection to God. But clearly that can't be the case. In the old Testament it portrays this imo. Feelings of jealousy, regret, anger. Emotions that humans have, and as it says in Genesis, he created us in his own image. Like you said,

Just imagine that this is a truly frightening question and mystery even for us humans. Now think about the implications and shock it would be for a supreme being to start to question his own existence.

In my opinion, the OT is for the most part, pretty nasty. But with the NT and the new covenant through Jesus, you can see a change towards the positive (more or less imo). God, growing and maturing, so to speak. Anyway, I don't have much to theorize on there. I just like the thought and approach you're taking there. Personally, I am an atheist, and regard the Bible as more symbolic than anything else (perhaps other than a tool for certain powers throughout the ages). My atheism aside, if this God, or any God, does indeed exist, I find it more probable, and believable, that while we as mere humans would call them divine, that doesn't mean they have to be "perfect".

Idk if you're a fan of Futurama but your post reminded me of the episode where Bender gets lost in space. Life forms on his shiny metal a$$ and he becomes their deity. Despite how much he tries to help form a perfect society for them, something always goes wrong, despite his best intentions.

a reply to: St0rD

Another thing, however..

As far as the Christian narrative goes, the personified evil I spoke of, God did create. I am referring to Lucifer, Satan, the Devil. God giving him dominion over the Earth. God's strong delusions to solidify his detractors feelings towards him. What sense does that make?

God told Moses to go to Pharaoh to convince him to let his chosen people go, but yet God hardens Pharaoh's heart against doing that exact thing? Resulting in various plagues and innocent lives being taken?

a reply to: WakeUpBeer

I appreciate your insight m8!

And yeah I think it is a mistake to portray God as a perfect being without flaws because it makes it seem like he is so much better than us. A lot of people will have a hard time relating to him because of that.

It would be more plausible to think God is perfect only because he had to face the evil that resided within him and overcome it. And how can you be a perfect being without doing mistakes first in order to learn. Life teaches us that failing is part of the process of evolving. I can see God having to face the fact that there was still room in him to learn about new knowledge.

I

originally posted by: WakeUpBeer
a reply to: St0rD

Another thing, however..

As far as the Christian narrative goes, the personified evil I spoke of, God did create. I am referring to Lucifer, Satan, the Devil. God giving him dominion over the Earth. God's strong delusions to solidify his detractors feelings towards him. What sense does that make?

God told Moses to go to Pharaoh to convince him to let his chosen people go, but yet God hardens Pharaoh's heart against doing that exact thing? Resulting in various plagues and innocent lives being taken?

Well as far as we know God created Satan as a perfect marvelous angel of light. He gave him all he could ever dream of. I guess he was naïve by thinking all of this power would not mess with Satan's mind. Like they say, power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. It seems only God can truly manage such amount of power... and even that we don't know for sure.

From the scripture, Satan let pride arises in his heart and had the arrogance (and overwhelming stupidity) to think he could rise above God. So what to do with such treason? He banished him and then Satan tempted us in the Garden of Eden resulting in sin and evil being unleashed in our dimension. Like I said, God tried to contain it and hide it from us but it still got released in the end.

Now to go further, I feel like Satan has only one way to win a battle against God by dividing mankind and cutting them completely from his presence. Since we are his childrens just imagine the pain that would be inflicted if such a plan was to succeed. I feel like virtual reality, AI and robots are all part of this deception.

Time will tell.

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: TzarChasm
This god creature sounds like an oxymoron who is hilariously insecure to the point of crippling indecision.

Spoken like a true atheist
Surprisingly?

Wow, it's like you wanted to post a scathing reply but had no idea what to type. Bravo for trying, I guess?

Now let's return to the actual topic and why my comments were off the mark. Or better yet, why my comments were completely on point.

Believe what you want TC
Not for me to argue your choice, just get all preachy at me and not really interested

I will say it again, you are like a fundamental atheist injecting your doctrine with a religious like fervour

So you agree that the topic here is taoism and not traditional christian theology? Naturalist philosophy from China?

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: Specimen88
The mundane question if God could make a rock so heavy, could he move it? And if he couldnt, would it still make a him a God comes to mind.

Shadows do need light to be shadows.

God did make a rock so big He couldn’t move it, after He moved it, He made a greater rock....and again

And thats why he made Satan, so he can have intelligent an interesting conversations at least during their usual chess match.

Would explain why he made such a "god awful mistake" that only desire is said to see him defeated with much larger army later. Best 2/3?

Tbh, the N.T does sound like Dr. Jekyl an Mr. Hyde. "Satan hate puny Jesus" sounds right.

originally posted by: 19Bones79
a reply to: St0rD

Epicurius asked a very important question(s) :


"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”



When you understand the mental gymnastics required to brush this honest inquiry aside, you will know and understand the current leftist political rationale.


By any means necessary.

I don't brush it aside. I simple ask back: "Should I keep my child sealed in a box so that he can never be physically harmed, never learn hard lessons, never know love and betrayal? I would always feed and clean him. He would never be without food or water to keep him alive. Would that be benevolence? Is protection from the world what is best for my child?"

I also wonder if Epicurius ever thought about levels of spiritual evil that we mortals may be exposed to if not for the protecting hand of a benevolent God. Once we leave the mortal coil, it is said that we could be exposed to an entirely new order of malevolence, pain, and suffering.

a reply to: Specimen88

Satan hate puny Jesus but satan attacks puny human and avoids Jesus like a virus

How could we learn true forgiveness if we have never experienced the greatest of losses. Thus God in his wisdom created the realm of dualities. So we can see light in the darkness.

When we have experienced all that can be experienced we will awaken from the dream. Realising truth through all our senses.

Thus is the power of God.

a reply to: Teikiatsu


"Should I keep my child sealed in a box?“

Of course not. However if you are present when your child is in danger you will do anything to prevent it, am I right? Let's say for arguments sake your god exists and is omnipresent. Now try to imagine the most brutal things ever visited upon millions of children in this world, every single day.

He likes to watch.


"I also wonder if Epicurius ever thought about levels of spiritual evil that we mortals may be exposed to if not for the protecting hand of a benevolent God."


If your God is the almighty creator of everything, then without him "spiritual evil" would not exist.

If your god is benevolent and offers his protecting hand, he is selective on a whim which child receives protection and which one endures so much trauma that his/her mind is irreparably split from the trauma where death would be a welcome release.


I contend that you, who would give your life to save your children would not choose to watch one die a terrible death the one day while saving the other on another day.

I contend that you are more benevolent than your god.