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Government bans release of secret UFO dossier for another 50 years leaving experts furious!

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posted on Oct, 11 2020 @ 03:05 PM
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So says the headline on the Sun newspaper’s website (the UK’s trashiest of all tabloids)

But is the UK Government refusing to release a secret dossier?

There are no quoted sources regarding this dossier being withheld and not one of the ‘furious experts’ are named.

It doesn’t mean this 30 year old case isn’t without a mystery though.

The original case files were released by the MoD around a decade ago.

DEFE 24/1940/1 - page 116

DEFE 31/179 on pages 157-8

DEFE 31/180 on pages 37-38 & 55-57

The story has come to be known as the Calvine/Pitlochry UFO. It remains one of Nick Pope’s staple anecdotes. For those who are unfamiliar with the background to it a short synopsis is provided below.

The UFO/Photograph Story



Artist rendition of the ‘lost’ Calvine UFO photo

On August 4th 1990, a 75 ft [nowadays inflated to 100ft] wide diamond object was tailed by an RAF Harrier some 20 miles north of Pitlochry in Scotland. It appeared to hover for 10 minutes above the A9 highway, near Calvine, in Scotland. It then rapidly accelerated up into the sky. A still unnamed photographer took a series of six photographs and sent them to the Daily Record newspaper.

The newspaper editors, in turn sent them to the UK Ministry of Defence [MoD], for comment, before running a report on the subject. The Daily Record, for whatever reasons, never ran the story.

The MoD, on the other hand, treated this fairly seriously. Even going as far as to circulate a memo to govt. ministers for the expected questions from the mainstream media. Which never came.

An official memo declared:


"Such stories are not normally drawn to the attention of ministers, and the MoD press office invariably responds to questions along well-established lines emphasising our limited interest in the UFO phenomenon and explaining that we therefore do not have the resources to undertake any in-depth investigations into particular sightings.”




The memo noted there was no record of RAF Harriers operating in the area at the time the photo was supposedly taken. It suggested the media should be told "no definite conclusions reached regarding large diamond-shaped object".



In 1991 the MoD also commissioned line drawings of the UFO. Their files contain blurry photocopies of two of the line drawings/pictures next to aviation journal reports about a secret triangular-shaped stealth aircraft said to have been developed by the USAF.


Line drawing taken from MoD files released

The original photographs appear to have gone missing and the identity of the photographer is also a mystery.

A question was posed in the British Parliament in 1996 about the incident.


Mr. Redmond: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence [Soames] what assessment his Department made of the photograph of an unidentified craft at Calvine on 4 August 1990; who removed it from an office in secretariat (air staff) 2a; for what reasons; and if he will make a statement. [39248]

Mr. Soames: A number of negatives associated with the sighting were examined by staff responsible for air defence matters. Since it was judged that they contained nothing of defence significance were not retained and we have no record of any photographs having been taken from them.

Source : Hansard 23rd July 1996


So back to the present....

Paul Sims of the Sun claimed a few days ago....



…. UFO experts hit out when it emerged a dossier into Britain’s most significant sighting is to be kept secret for another 50 years.
The file is said to contain astonishing colour photographs of a 100ft craft hovering over the village of Calvine in the Scottish Highlands in 1990.
A 30-year rule meant it was due to be declassified on January 1 — but the Ministry of Defence has now blocked release until 2072 without explanation.….

The Sun [UK] - 10th Oct 2020


But given that the MoD’s files had already been released on this case then where do these claims come from?

What dossier has been blocked from release?

Nick Pope, who is no stranger to speaking in exchange for money was also quoted;


…. My predecessor had undertaken the investigation and I was staggered to learn that it hadn’t proved possible to trace the aircraft…..
This was unprecedented and suggested that someone inside the MoD had sabotaged the investigation and blocked the UFO project from getting to the truth. Dark forces were at work…..

When the relevant files were released, the photos were missing.

The Sun [UK]- 10th Oct 2020


Nick also verified this on his own website long ago…


… The MoD files that contain documents relating to this case have been released and are available at the National Archives, though MoD says that no trace has been found of the images, aside from one poor quality photocopy of a line drawing...
At some point in 1994 my Head of Division.. had somehow convinced himself that the craft was a secret, prototype aircraft or drone – probably American...when one day he took the photo away and locked it in his desk drawer. On the other hand, he was probably the one who drafted the Parliamentary assurances, so maybe he was just covering his back.

Nicholas Papal Website


The photos were already declared missing when the files were released with a batch of other UFO files. There’s no source for the story about any ‘secret dossier’ being withheld until Jan 2021. All roads seem to lead back to the same unreliable tabloid source. The Sun

>>> continued below >>>


edit on 11/10/2020 by mirageman because: tidy up



posted on Oct, 11 2020 @ 03:09 PM
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These recent headlines are possibly nothing more than whitespace filler and clickbait.

Where is the outrage by anonymous experts now?

What We Know


● We do have official documents that confirm there were photographs sent to the MoD from a newspaper.

● They also confirm govt. ministers were notified that there was likely to be a story published and guidelines issued for responding.

● A blow up of this photo was displayed on an MoD office wall in Whitehall between 1990 and 1994.

We don’t know


● Why the story then failed to appear in the Daily Record?

● Who originally snapped the photos or even if they were taken on the date and time claimed?

● What happened to the negatives and print[s] of the photo?

● Why a junior desk officer and then successor [Nick Pope] would be allowed to display a blown up photo on an office wall for 3 years or more until it was removed by a superior in 1994?

Conclusions


The incident occurred in the summer after the Belgian triangle sightings in 1990. But other than speculation there is no direct link there. However that’s assuming the date the photograph was taken is accurate.

So was it all a hoax?

It’s certainly possible. But the experts at the MoD treated it all seriously and seemed satisfied it was something real and unknown in the photo. The ‘photographer’ has never come forward to this day and the Daily Record has remained tight lipped too.

The presence of two Harrier jets in the photo also confuses the issue. If this was an adversary then they were some 50 miles or so inside UK airspace with Harriers in pursuit. Was that even possible in 1990 as the old Soviet Bloc began to break-up?

So could it have been a secret experimental British or Allied aircraft with the Harriers escorting it? Surely someone at the UK MoD would know if that was the case and silence all investigations. Nick Pope claimed the Pentagon was also asked if the US was testing anything over UK airspace. After an initial negative response the Americans were pushed again and gave a more terse and still negative response. But the fact the story never appeared in the Daily Record could point to a clandestine cover-up.

Despite all the hype of the past few days we are still none the wiser about the truth than we were when Nick Pope told the story in 1996.

A true mystery.



edit on 11/10/2020 by mirageman because: tidy up



posted on Oct, 11 2020 @ 03:55 PM
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It might have been this?

There were lots of rumours at the time....



See : Pop Mechanics - March 1993



posted on Oct, 11 2020 @ 05:18 PM
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a reply to: mirageman




You may want to watch the following videos.

Scotland's airspace was used extensively by black aircraft and development of systems to detect them.

There are still aircraft that haven't been been publicly revealed that were using the Machrihanish airfield. Most of what actually happened there is still deep classified.

Simon Holland (not a 'real' professor) was once a UK television science reporter for many years.
The following videos describe some of the activities associated with Machrihanish. A lot more was going on during the cold-war and the development of low detectability aircraft (I hesitate to use the word stealth as it suggests certain technologies, but the actual "stealth" science was part of a bigger picture, yet to be revealed). There was a lot of work being done to detect these black aircraft. There are hints at the detection technology successes in the last video.

Interesting stories, but no classified secrets are directly revealed in the videos, but there are many inferences that can be made.

I thrid to embed these videos, but it didnt seem to work.
Here are the URLs instead.

I have added 4 more videos. I hadn't realised that I had missed out several of UK Area51 videos.
All are posted on Simon Holland 's channel.



www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...



One thing I question in the last video is the alleged speed and flightpath of the aircraft flying around the UK coastline.
If it was a manned aircraft, then the turning circle at the claimed speed wouldn't seem to correspond.


GrumpyPants
edit on 11-10-2020 by GrumpyPants because: embedding youtube videos wouldn't work

edit on 11-10-2020 by GrumpyPants because: added more links to videos

edit on 11-10-2020 by GrumpyPants because: (no reason given)

edit on 11-10-2020 by GrumpyPants because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 11 2020 @ 06:46 PM
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Excellent story!! Long time lurker here, approx 9 years

It’s going to be interesting to see how this develops given everyone’s attention is on elections and COVID dramas

It does make me wonder why the story was never published and the photographer hasn’t tried again?

Certainly has the distinct subtle smell of something more that’s being covered up



posted on Oct, 11 2020 @ 08:40 PM
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Don’t know how to take this sentence from the poster on a different forum....

“Needless to say, I found the photo, viewed above”

Does he mean an “actual” photo? Is it one of the six photos mentioned in the post?

If anything fake or not..it’s at least an additional rendition zoomed in..

The knobby thing on the tail end? (right side) ... possibly propulsion end? Then it may be of earth design since that would mean some sort of diffused exhaust such as ramjet designs or variation thereof...imo.

Give this a whirl on pumpkin seed discussion... some pretty interesting links throughout the thread. In fact the entire website is interesting..

www.secretprojects.co.uk...






edit on 11-10-2020 by Ophiuchus1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 12:35 AM
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Whoops deleted pic from previous post by mistake.....

Don’t know how to take this sentence from the poster on a different forum....

“Needless to say, I found the photo, viewed above”

Does he mean an “actual” photo? Is it one of the six photos mentioned in the post?

If anything fake or not..it’s at least an additional rendition zoomed in..

The knobby thing on the tail end? (right side) ... possibly propulsion end? Then it may be of earth design since that would mean some sort of diffused exhaust such as ramjet designs or variation thereof...imo.



edit on 12-10-2020 by Ophiuchus1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 03:37 AM
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originally posted by: GrumpyPants
a reply to: mirageman


Scotland's airspace was used extensively by black aircraft and development of systems to detect them.

There are still aircraft that haven't been been publicly revealed that were using the Machrihanish airfield. Most of what actually happened there is still deep classified.

Simon Holland (not a 'real' professor) was once a UK television science reporter for many years.



How do you know something is deeply classified unless you are read in on it?

The problem with the Machrihanish story is the people who worked fire control at said Airfield during the stated period have no recollection of any special training, procedures or NDA's relating to secret aircraft.

Cant find the link but if you have a look around the British Army rumour website they discuss it in context of "Aurora" with all parties (including fire control) agreeing there was never any evidence of anything "classified" flying out of that site.

(Fake) Professor Holland needs to vet his sources more carefully.
His recent vids alluding to the Mach 7 circuits of the UK and the Fylingdales radar operator sound like they were made up by one of ATS's visiting phantom SME's.

edit on 12-10-2020 by Jukiodone because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 06:31 AM
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a reply to: Ophiuchus1



This 'photo' is a reconstruction based on the photocopied line drawings from the MoD files. It is not one of the original pictures. The Daily Express used it in 2015 strangely with a credit to a UFO Hunter and Youtube. It's actually lifted from ATS in 2013.

The only person who has ever claimed to have seen the photo is Nick Pope. A ufotainer. Who's career revolves around endless speculation about UFOs.

Given that he still speaks about the solved 1993 Cosford story to this day as if it was still a mystery then I do wonder whether he just hypes this one as well.

Maybe the photos were actually a clever hoax and that's why the MoD could not identify the harriers on the day claimed, the alleged photographers remain unknown and the story never ran in the Daily Record?


edit on 12/10/2020 by mirageman because: pic



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 07:18 AM
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a reply to: mirageman

Nice thread.

Tricky Nicky says a lot of things

Cough.









posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 07:28 AM
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Growing up, the UK was the second best place on UFOs. Why not? the UK is another first world nation. So of course they’ll be sightings.

This particular case is relatively unknown to me, however, it would seem existing designs for technology matches the sightings.
I also never knew that Scotland was home to test beds of black technologies, is that true? Is that completely a domestic thing, or a partnership with US defense companies or some other entities?

Here in Texas, there are plenty of sightings of Triangle type craft.
edit on 12-10-2020 by Arnie123 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 07:45 AM
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Harriers seem an odd choice as our interceptors in 1990 were Tornado F-3.

I might be corrected but RAF Harriers were GR (Ground Recon) with Aim-9 capability but it didn’t have a radar so not much use and I think only the Royal Navy Sea had a real A2A role as a fleet defender but it was also a Fighter Bomber or Strike Fighter, doesn’t even have an internal gun so a strange choice of aircraft.

So unless a pair happened to be in the area training or ferrying and were sent to have a look maybe, but the F-3 were on QRA for the Russians and sending an unarmed aircraft ,for a look’ doesn’t sound like a risk we would take with a ‘$30 million dollar aircraft captain’.

That said, the RAF do train in the area so it’s not beyond the realms of possible for them to be there.
edit on 12 10 2020 by Forensick because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 08:28 AM
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a reply to: Forensick

F4 phantoms were also still heavily used in these areas for training.



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 09:39 AM
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This article sheds some light on the case.

According to Nick Pope, the actual Calvine color photographs were set to be released in the new year. However, this release has now been blocked for another 50 years …

The MOD conclusion in 1990, according to Nick Pope, was one of two possibilities:
1. Extraterrestrial
2. A secret US aircraft

An inquiry at the US authorities was met with firm denials.
A second inquiry `incensed’ the Secretary of the Air Force, Donald Rice.
As a result of this diplomatic bust-up, Nick’s Head of Division removed the Calvine incident photo from Nick’s office wall.

Apparently, a fierce `skeptic vs believer’ dogfight was raging within the MOD during this period.

So … what could possibly be a reason to keep these photos secret for another 50 years, after 30 years already have passed since the incident? If this really was a secret aircraft, the parts aren’t even available anymore by now. I mean… 1990 was the year Windows 3.0 was launched.



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 10:50 AM
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a reply to: Guest101

Watch the video's I posted above.

There was a big campaign of disinformation about 'stealth' aircraft.

There was also a psyop type op to get people to look into the sky for unidentified objects. Something similar came out of the US military recently.

The problem was that the military were not sure if they were actually detecting stealth aircraft, or whether it was radar noise, birds etc.

A huge effert was put into collecting UFO sightings. Public were asked to report exact times, dates, locations and descriptions of what they observed. This info was secretly passed to the military, and radar records were backtracked to see if there were corresponding anomalies in radar and other sensor data. If there seemed to be a correlation with observational data and sightings, the data was then sent to the scientists and engineers to see if the anomalies were actual low visibility aircraft. A huge effort was put into improving radar filtering to detect potential unobserved stealth aircraft.

Much publicity was given to ECM techniques, what was no emphasised is there was an equal and opposite ammount of effort put into defeating the ECM.

The US was NOT the only country to have low observational visibility aircraft.

Read my post above again, watch the videos and note how Fylingdales was alleged to detect an unexpected US stealth, lit it up with targeting radar, and seemingly, the aircraft responded and got-out-of-dodge.

The videos on S Hollands web page are nothing to do with me, but I can confirm that much of what the videos report are correct and accurate.

There is a lot more behind the 'ufo' sightings and activities at Machrihanish. There are national security reasons why these reports are still classified.

GP.



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 11:29 AM
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originally posted by: Guest101

......As a result of this diplomatic bust-up, Nick’s Head of Division removed the Calvine incident photo from Nick’s office wall.


In the standard verbiage and tone of the AA crew, “you have to wonder” if you or anybody was Nick, and that you would have taken pictures of the pictures on the wall.... for personal posterity at least as souvenirs or backups. I certainly would have taken pictures of the pictures if not overtly, then covertly if I was Nick.......(but I’m not). Nick has to know, his employment wasn’t forever... and if he knew he would be getting deeper into UFO’s post his employment then, having pictures of those pictures on the wall would have helped his new UFO career building, after his clearance ended and not liable to government to maintain secrecy.

Hell....depending on the room type this wall was in and access to the room (cipher, etc..) ... if it was basic locking devices...the janitor would have been able to see those 🤓
edit on 12-10-2020 by Ophiuchus1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 01:39 PM
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a reply to: Guest101



According to Nick Pope, the actual Calvine color photographs were set to be released in the new year. However, this release has now been blocked for another 50 years …


I linked to a copy of that interview in the original post. All Nick Pope says is....


...I’ll be delighted if the Calvine photos are released in the New Year, but I’m not getting my hopes up. I’ll believe it when I see it.


I don't see any official comment from the UK MoD that these photos were due for release in January 2021 and have since been locked away until 2076. No links or quotes back to anything other than the Sun's own story.

And with all due respect to Nick he's been out of the loop since 1994 and left the MoD in 2006.

His own website says the photos were missing.,


.... MoD says that no trace has been found of the images, aside from one poor quality photocopy of a line drawing...


The line drawing was released with the other files a decade ago.

I suspect someone is just filling whitespace and that maybe this story was a hoax.

If the photos were on a junior desk officers wall for three years or more. Then I suspect the MoD were no longer investigating the issue. The fact that Nick never thought of sneaking out a copy in some form also makes me doubt his version of the story.

There are of course other reasons to doubt Nick Pope's sincerity.



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 01:51 PM
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originally posted by: mirageman

The only person who has ever claimed to have seen the photo is Nick Pope. A ufotainer. Who's career revolves around endless speculation about UFOs.



He also used to describe how countless people who approached his 'UFO Desk' would inevitably gawp in amazement at the blown-up photograph on his office wall.


“You’d have this surreal moment when they’d stop mid-sentence, stare at it, point and say ‘what the hell’s that?’ — this wasn’t the archetypal distant, blurred UFO photo. This was up close and personal, reach out and you can touch it stuff. ‘I don’t know what it is, but it’s not one of ours,’ was our stock answer to the inevitable question.”


www.rdrnews.com...

Is it unusual that nobody except Pope himself has ever come forward to confirm the 'poster on the wall' story? Or is it just Mulder-flavoured hogwash?

Furthermore, Pope's claim that he was nick-named "Spooky" whilst at the 'UFO Desk' does not allow much of a window of opportunity since 'The X-Files' first aired in the UK during September 1994 - the same year Pope left the desk. Do we know his exact date of departure?

Hmmm.


edit on 12-10-2020 by ConfusedBrit because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 02:00 PM
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a reply to: GrumpyPants

Yeah....B2's routinely fly unannounced sorties over NATO Airspace.
Fylingdales doesnt have US agencies/contractors in perpetual attendance.
Causing a B2 to divert from its normal course doesn't cost multiple thousands of dollars and wouldnt cost you your job.

Any other whimsical tales with absolutely no foundation in fact?



posted on Oct, 12 2020 @ 03:00 PM
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a reply to: Jukiodone

Ha ha.

And so speaks someone who has never worked in Fylingdales.

And before you ask, Yes. No further commentary needed.

And why do you think that the golf-balls were upgraded in 1990 ?? Absolutely nothing at all to do with low observability airborne 'things'.

p.s.

Re read my earlier commentary.

The info stated was sourced from a video from Prof Simon Holland (not a real professor, but an ex BBC TV science reporter). Videos are posted above.

As for the role of Fylingdales and the SR71, that info I

- stole it
- copied it
- plagiarized it
- repeated it for your pleasure.

All of this under "fair-use license" of course.

Take your pick.

I just added a to the commentary.


As for the SR71, was it, was it not, was it a variant, was it a flock of birds, was it radar-noise? Or was it something else?


I can verify that pretty much, if not most, of the stories from the videos are correct, not the whole story, but correct.

Are all the parts correct, hell no.

I am not identifying which parts are correct, and which are not. I am neither stating as to how 'correct' the info is. But in general terms, the info is good.

Anyhow, true or false, it does make an amusing tale, don't you think?

Find the truth, do your own research.


...




edit on 12-10-2020 by GrumpyPants because: Somewhere, a blast of hot air caused a leaf to flutter briefly.



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