Am I being paranoid? Is this right?

a reply to: TheRedneck

The drug itself is not particularly worrisome.

It's the same concept as doner plasma antibodies. The only difference is that these have been tricked out of lab mice. It's also in Phase 4 trials. Now, Teikiatsu is familiar with how all this works as it's his career.

Phase 1 is proof of concept. Phase 2 is animal trial. Phase 3 is human trial. Phase 4 is the fine tuning process.

By the time a drug has passed Phase 3, they know what safe dosages are for age, weight, race, health, etc. They have to show all that in order to just pass Phase 3. Phase 4 is the final process. It involves what's called LoQ or List of Questions. Regulatory bodies send these back to the manufacturers who then have to answer those questions, sometimes with further studies or trials of the data they already have won't cover to the Regulatory's satisfaction. That's the phase this drug is in.

So overall, they know how to use it and that it's safe or it never would have passed Stage 3.

It should work like getting an infusion of antibodies from doner plasma.

So what it comes to are whether or not you trust the people giving it to the president to have given him what they say it is.

a reply to: Freeborn

Do you think this could be a deliberate ploy by Trump?
It detracts and distracts away from many of the questions Trump was having to face. I assume - something I hate doing but.... - it will at least delay the scheduled debates and to be honest with you, given the fickle nature of some people I suspect it may even hand Trump the sympathetic vote.

I've not ignored this possibility... but then again, talking about a leopard changing its spots... Trump going after a sympathy vote? I just can't see that. It's not in the man's personality.

The next debates are on the 15th... it makes no sense to get the virus this early if the idea is to delay the debates. That's 13 days between symptom onset and the next debate, which is a hair more than would be expected to be needed to beat the virus. CDC says it is expected to last 10 days from symptom onset. Would it not be better to wait a week and then get the virus if the idea is to delay the debates?

TheRedneck

a reply to: VariableConstant

Interesting thread. A person is struck in the face with the fact that they have been fed bullsh*t.

OK, at least some things haven't changed...

TheRedneck

a reply to: Vector99

Maybe you should do some more digging, start with fauci's financial investments.

Could you be more specific? It is completely permissible to add solid information to the OP, you know. I only have so many hours in the day.

I know Fauci has been in bed with China, but specifics would help. Maybe together we can nail down what's really happening.

TheRedneck

So we know Trump has taken REGN-COV2, remdesivir, zinc, vitamin D, famotidine, melatonin, aspirin, and some other immune system boosting drugs. I'd also be very interested to know if Trump was still taking hydroxychloroquine, from what I gather he no longer takes it because the FDA said it was an unproven or ineffective treatment. However there are several recent studies which show it definitely does help if taken early and in conjunction with things like zinc. So if he did stop taking it and suffers severe symptoms, which he appears to be, they deserve some of the blame imo.

a reply to: Astyanax

The facts don't fit the picture you've drawn, or have had drawn for you by the Trumpist fantasy media.

What facts am I missing? Just saying a fact exists tells no one anything... except that you didn't really say anything.

TheRedneck

a reply to: oloufo

what was it like in the past when a president had a flu? did he have to go to hospital?

Depends on how bad it is. The President gets the best treatment available in the world, period. Walter Reed is probably the best hospital in the world, and it is the preferred hospital of choice for all government officials. A President going to Walter Reed in itself is nothing unusual.

What I am finding unusual is a combination of many things... the use of an experimental drug so quickly in the process, the movement to Walter Reed based on using that drug, Melania dropping out of the news and left behind, the sudden shift in the campaign rhetoric, the lack of tweets, and the shift in news reporting.

Any one of these things is easily dismissed, but all of them together?

Where is Melania?

TheRedneck

a reply to: underwerks

You’ve been wearing Fox News brand glasses that make you think everything around you has spots on it. Wake up.

Actually, I used to watch CNN almost exclusively. CNN convinced me to switch to Fox. At least with Fox I don't usually have these uncontrollable urges to throw heavy objects through my TV screen.

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

4D Chess.

Only an absolute ass would kick a guy that was down by wishing death/gleeful excitement about serious illness. The media, his opposition, no one can talk trash about Trump until he recovers.

Trump could have hid the fact he has Covid but didn’t. His departure from the White House was perfectly timed for the end of local news for the switch to national news. Taking a hit like Covid and getting a positive out of it. That is Trump’s 4D Chess in action.

a reply to: Kenzo

I would be concerned now that Trump is in the " treatment loop "....because it is literally easy peacy thing to murder anyone with wrong treatments...or by accident also. I say this because i know the medical cartel is very dangerous group...and well we know what happen to JFK .

You know, I was thinking last night as I fell asleep about the early days of the Trump Presidency. He was spending a lot of his time at MaraLago instead of the White House and actually moved a lot of his office to his hotel. I always assumed Trump did that because he didn't feel safe in the White House. As he became more familiar with the people around him and made adjustments, he came to be comfortable in the White House and started staying there more.

Walter Reed is one place where he will be far from protected in that sense. It may be the best hospital on the planet, but it can also house people with malicious intent and as you say, it definitely provides plenty of opportunity to do the unspeakable. Trump is at the mercy of the medical staff there.

Could that be why Melania is not there?

TheRedneck

a reply to: Kenzo

Yes, I agree, something is very weird about using these drugs so early in the onset of symptoms. It usually takes about a week to go from mild to severe.

Why take a risk an unknown drug when it's not needed?

a reply to: TheRedneck


Yes, why move him when it's not needed. They could bring ventilators and oxygen to the Whitehouse.

Even though Walter Reed probably has strict security, it's probably not as secured as the Whitehouse. For just the sole reason is you have many more unsecured people in the same building.

Unless of course, Trump is not at that hospital but in another secured location.

This allows for a convenient narrative if he doesn't win.
Either is voter fraud, or the Chinese.
I suppose a grand conspiracy either way.
I hope he both recovers and wins, so that the 'would have, could have' doesn't raise it's ugly head.

originally posted by: Daughter2
a reply to: Kenzo

Yes, I agree, something is very weird about using these drugs so early in the onset of symptoms. It usually takes about a week to go from mild to severe.

Why take a risk an unknown drug when it's not needed?

You're talking about an antibody infusion which is what the drug is. If the object is to get ahead of the disease process, then using an infusion of antibodies is an attempt to get ahead of the disease process and let the body's own immune system catch up.

Again, the effects of the drug are far from unknown. It's basically the same as giving doner plasma antibodies except these come from mice. The big difference there is that using mouse antibodies removes some of the ethical considerations that you have with humans.

Such a thing would be more useful to use early rather than waiting until the disease gets severe. At that point, you are working uphill. This is the same reasoning behind HCQ therapies too -- use them early rather then late because their main usefulness is to head off viral replication inside the cell.

In the case of the president, we are talking about an older man with an older immune system. Giving him an infusion of antibodies is an attempt to give his older immune system the chance to ramp itself up without having to fight a severe disease process at the same time.

a reply to: TheRedneck

Maybe the docs didn't think he needed to go to the hospital but he made them take him.

In that scenario I can see why she would stay behind.

I wonder if they gave trump any hdc?

a reply to: TheRedneck

I dont know the Walter Reed hospital at all, it must be good hospital as you say, i just have bad feeling , why the rush with all the drug coctails.

And there is also few non-virus things that can cause same flu-like symptoms...shortness of breath and fatigue. Inhaled toxins, specifig EMF radiatiation , thought i know the EMF is controversial...but im sure that the CIA dont think it so controversial. So i mean that the symptoms Trump started to get might be also caused by something else than virus.

Well this is a conspiracy site , i think it is in the possibilitys that there could be a conspiracy against Trumps life.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder

You seem to be hitting on some of the same things I was seeing.

REGN-COV2 and Remdesivir do completely different things, but yes, both are experimental. Remdesivir is one of those almost failed drugs as well... it was developed in 2009 for use against hepatitis, but failed to do anything to hepatitis. Then it was tried against ebola and proved to have some antiviral properties. Gilead Pharmaceutical sunk a lot of money into developing Remdesivir, and right now they're just trying to find some way to break close(r) to even.

I have seen an awful lot of connections between the hydroxychloroquine naysayers and Gilead payrolls.

The general "official" thinking at present seems to favor Remdesivir over hydroxychloroquine, so I was not really surprised to hear about Remdesivir being given at the hospital. I was very surprised when the first drug used was REGN-COV2! I had heard not the first peep about it, other than Trump had mentioned the use of antibodies before.

I suppose it's possible that the use of REGN-COV2 was specifically requested by Trump himself, and then consultation with other doctors indicated that since he took it, he needed closer observation than what was available at the White House. Donald J. Trump has this very intense personality and typically gets what he wants. If so, I will go so far as to say that was a bonehead maneuver. While I am well known for not trusting doctors, I also certainly don't trust myself when it comes to medical situations. If there is anyone worse to listen to in times of medical distress than a bad doctor, it is certainly the patient.

As I type this, the thought is occurring to me that if Donald Trump convinced his doctor at the White House to give him REGN-COV2 so quickly, then found out that because he did that he was having to be sent to Walter Reed, that would answer a few things as well. it would explain his disinterest in the media leaving for the hospital, because he was probably embarrassed he did so much stoopid. It would also explain his lack of tweets since.

And of course, most people are horrified to learn about experimental therapies being used... and somewhat rightfully so because that can take very bad turns. So that could explain the 180 degree change in Biden and Twitter, as they might believe he is heading for some very rough times.

At least it's an alternate theory. But dammit, where is Melania?

TheRedneck

a reply to: camain

OK, dammit, man, I need to think about that one! You make some awesome points.

So in other words, Pence is holding off on taking control until after his debate with Kamala... then Pence can take the reins temporarily and go on to debate Biden! In effect, throwing the Democrats off their game at least temporarily, until Trump can resume power for the final sprint to the finish line. And the sympathy vote rolls in as well.

Damn, that might just work...

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

It's strange enough that we notice there is something going on, more than we know.

a reply to: TheRedneck

Here's a report on REGN-Cov2

It's dated Sept. 29.

Regeneron Pharmaceuticals, Inc. (NASDAQ: REGN) today announced the first data from a descriptive analysis of a seamless Phase 1/2/3 trial of its investigational antibody cocktail REGN-COV2 showing it reduced viral load and the time to alleviate symptoms in non-hospitalized patients with COVID-19. REGN-COV2 also showed positive trends in reducing medical visits. The ongoing, randomized, double-blind trial measures the effect of adding REGN-COV2 to usual standard-of-care, compared to adding placebo to standard-of-care.

From reading this, they had two bodies of patients: those who had measurable immune response and those who had some. The question would be which category Trump fits into. It's possible he had no measurable antibody response and this is why they gave him this drug and why he's at Walter Reed right now.