UK, France and Germany warn China about South China Sea

www.express.co.uk...

What a welcome and surprising change! The UK, France and Germany grew a pair and warned China about its lawless claim of the South China Sea.

As the article notes, these three nations rank among the Top Seven GDPs in the world. They possess enormous potential clout over the highly export-dependent Chinese economy.

In 2017, China’s total exports were valued at $2.26 trillion. The United States and EU combined to buy 35 percent of China’s exports. China’s exports to Japan, South Korea, Taiwan, Australia, Singapore and Canada were 18 percent of its total. These eight economies alone buy 53 percent of all Chinese exports. As far as China’s concerned, there’s no substitute for the consumer markets of these nations and the EU (plus the UK).

And while China manufactures an enormous amount of the world’s goods, including a huge amount of pharmaceutical products, there’s no reason manufacturing can’t be moved elsewhere. India, the world’s largest democracy, would be delighted to provide cheap, smart, hard-working labor.

It’s time for the First World nations to lay down the law to China, which has ruined competitors by dumping products at below cost. It engages in wholesale theft of proprietary knowledge totaling hundreds of billions of dollars per year.

China violates human rights with an arrogance that’s simply breathtaking, as demonstrated by its interment of hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions, of Uighurs, and breaking its pledge to let Hong Kong remain a democracy. “One country, two systems.” What a sick joke!

China isn’t nearly as powerful as the free world thinks it is, but its authoritarian government allows it to act swiftly, decisively and ruthlessly. We need to realize we hold the whip hand over China, not the other way around. We can outsource production elsewhere, but they can never find another consumer market like the free world.

I wonder if the China virus was the last straw for the UK, France and Germany? The pandemic has devastated the world economy, not to mention fundamentally changed the way we live. If Trump is re-elected, the free world just might slow China’s thinly veiled ambition to dominate the world.

originally posted by: Scapegrace
www.express.co.uk...

What a welcome and surprising change! The UK, France and Germany grew a pair and warned China about its lawless claim of the South China Sea.

As the article notes, these three nations rank among the Top Seven GDPs in the world. They possess enormous potential clout over the highly export-dependent Chinese economy.

In 2017, China’s total exports were valued at $2.26 trillion. The United States and EU combined to buy 35 percent of China’s exports. China’s exports to Japan, South Korea, Taiwan, Australia, Singapore and Canada were 18 percent of its total. These eight economies alone buy 53 percent of all Chinese exports. As far as China’s concerned, there’s no substitute for the consumer markets of these nations and the EU (plus the UK).

And while China manufactures an enormous amount of the world’s goods, including a huge amount of pharmaceutical products, there’s no reason manufacturing can’t be moved elsewhere. India, the world’s largest democracy, would be delighted to provide cheap, smart, hard-working labor.

It’s time for the First World nations to lay down the law to China, which has ruined competitors by dumping products at below cost. It engages in wholesale theft of proprietary knowledge totaling hundreds of billions of dollars per year.

China violates human rights with an arrogance that’s simply breathtaking, as demonstrated by its interment of hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions, of Uighurs, and breaking its pledge to let Hong Kong remain a democracy. “One country, two systems.” What a sick joke!

China isn’t nearly as powerful as the free world thinks it is, but its authoritarian government allows it to act swiftly, decisively and ruthlessly. We need to realize we hold the whip hand over China, not the other way around. We can outsource production elsewhere, but they can never find another consumer market like the free world.

I wonder if the China virus was the last straw for the UK, France and Germany? The pandemic has devastated the world economy, not to mention fundamentally changed the way we live. If Trump is re-elected, the free world just might slow China’s thinly veiled ambition to dominate the world.

.


Wow that's a great post.
but these three countries and the United States is missing the true brutality of the Chinese government and I'm going to lay it to you very straight.
China made inroads to both Africa and South America.

As far as those four great superpowers, China is giving them the finger and telling them to buzz off and that is a fact.
they're already laughing at the stupidity of grieving greedy hands of their profit motive corporates that brought their industries to China.

Now China can confiscate those industries from Auto to electronics and so on.

The Chinese are laughing at the ignorance of these four countries they got suckered into it by a quick profit . the fact of this as I know you can't take money out of China.

and what these people don't understand that in China the foreign company can only own 42% of that business in their country that's it 42% That's the law that's Chinese law.

As we often say stupid is stupid.

a reply to: Scapegrace

S&F

Yes, surprising, indeed.

Thanks for posting....

The EU is slow to act on China because of Germany's unwillingness to antagonise an export opportunity.

The UK outside of the EU is likely to be less tied to the prevarication and indecision the EU often displays when faced with problematic foreign affairs.

No sure about France, but the UK is one of the countries who has made China all grumpy by sailing naval ships through international waters in the South China Sea.

Personally, I have viewed China as an affront from many years.

originally posted by: paraphi
... prevarication ...

I was absolutely sure you miss-typed a word. But I looked it up and kudos to you, my friend, for bringing a new word to ATS readers!

Now if I can just remember how to pronounce it.

Don't do business with China....

Not hard. Right?

If they are so evil, why exactly are other countries at their economic mercy? Why does the US owe China so much in debt?

When it was good, it was great. Now China is growing at a very quick pace...They're evil now.

How and why did China become such a juggernaut in manufacturing..everything?

When US and European and south east Asia were happy to use cheap labor in order to get rich quick, i.e. The capitalist framework, Why were there no outcry in the potential dangers of using cheap labor until our own economic fortitude did a quick 180 turn?


The companies in the US getting rich from china's cheap labor are somehow saints now?

We went to China, China never came to us. Let's firmly remember this.

originally posted by: paraphi
The EU is slow to act on China because of Germany's unwillingness to antagonise an export opportunity.

The UK outside of the EU is likely to be less tied to the prevarication and indecision the EU often displays when faced with problematic foreign affairs.

No sure about France, but the UK is one of the countries who has made China all grumpy by sailing naval ships through international waters in the South China Sea.

Personally, I have viewed China as an affront from many years.

Im not sure exactly what the EUs game is. I get the greed and power aspect, but I think they would have been much better off had they played things differently in so many areas.

I meam what was the rationale behind allowing mass imigration of ppl who had zero intention of integrating into a very different culture? Anyone with am IQ above 80, should have seen that as problematic in many different aspects.

What is their fascination with appeasing Iran? Have then not learned anything from their own history?

originally posted by: odzeandennz
Don't do business with China....

Not hard. Right?

If they are so evil, why exactly are other countries at their economic mercy? Why does the US owe China so much in debt?

When it was good, it was great. Now China is growing at a very quick pace...They're evil now.

How and why did China become such a juggernaut in manufacturing..everything?

When US and European and south east Asia were happy to use cheap labor in order to get rich quick, i.e. The capitalist framework, Why were there no outcry in the potential dangers of using cheap labor until our own economic fortitude did a quick 180 turn?


The companies in the US getting rich from china's cheap labor are somehow saints now?

We went to China, China never came to us. Let's firmly remember this.

Much to my surprise, I totally agree with you. No one to blame but ourselves. And there’s plenty of blame to go around. Democrat and Republican politicians and business people. And consumers, like me, although I’m trying (often unsuccessfully) to buy products made anywhere but China. We created this monster. It was so unbelievably foolish and short-sighted, and we were given ample warnings along the way as we grew ever more dependent.

The pandemic and China’s unbelievable arrogance on so many issues has finally opened some eyes. This is the perfect time, thanks to the depression caused by the virus, to start a graduated disengagement from China. It’ll hurt a lot less now than in a year or three, or however long it takes the world economy to recover.

a reply to: odzeandennz

I think you're right on this one.

Multinationals gave consumers a taste of cheaper goods, and we allowed over time the moving of industries.

It's cheaper at the time of purchase, but over time it's the same price IMO when you see the economic effects.

I think the economic argument alone is enough to justify a restructuring of relations with China... But then if you look at their human rights, that's when the situation becomes truly alarming.

And we're all throwing gas on the fire, and crossing a point of no return.

I don't know if we can even walk this back now.

Outsourcing for the sake of cheap labor hit the tech markets too. I'm talking about software development when big companies realized it was cheaper to go off-shore. When that trend started, I was a well paid developer (in the USA) and outsourcing was an obvious threat to my livelihood.

25 years later, there are many IT companies in India with very good and competitive IT systems. I know of a few "failed" redevelopment of very complex, but old, systems that later were being offered as competing solutions from Indian start-ups.

I also remember the management argument in the 90's was that "we have the intellectual property, the development is just a factory. Don't worry!"

a reply to: Scapegrace

This is the first time in history that these 3 have joined forces to issue a NOTE which is a public 2 page voicing of concerns over chinese wolfwar diplomacy.

According to Steve Tsang director of SOAS the 3 have spoken before on the issue but only called for peace and stability.

The fact that the 3 now publicly are warning and criticizing china is a sign of things to come.....wouldn't be surprised if real conflict initiates before Christmas folks.

originally posted by: CthruU
a reply to: Scapegrace

This is the first time in history that these 3 have joined forces to issue a NOTE which is a public 2 page voicing of concerns over chinese wolfwar diplomacy.

According to Steve Tsang director of SOAS the 3 have spoken before on the issue but only called for peace and stability.

The fact that the 3 now publicly are warning and criticizing china is a sign of things to come.....wouldn't be surprised if real conflict initiates before Christmas folks.

Both the United States and China are assiduously preparing to fight each other. I don’t think either wants a war, but China’s been getting away with just about every gambit it’s tried in the last decade, and no one has stood up to them until recently. Who would have thought they could simply take all those islets and atolls in the South China Sea, or steadily encroach on the border with India with no repercussions other than political protests and a few casualties against the Indians?

I think they may be suffering from what some Japanese called “victory disease” during the year following Pearl Harbor. China hasn’t won any great battles, but they’ve been winning a kind of slow motion war that suits them well. Hopefully, they won’t miscalculate and do something really stupid, like invade Taiwan.

Great Post 👍🏼
But try not to use the express if you can in future, their constant hyperbole makes me sick lol.

Glad you posted along side it snf

a reply to: odzeandennz

OH yes the debt. That debt can be wrote off because of china attacking us with the Virus,because essentially that was a act of war. You do not pay people who attack you back.

While I condemn the Communist party of China for the above mentioned and to add the authoritarian death grip it holds over its own people. What is sad about it all is Populace will begin to lose confidence in the ruling party and the ruling party will feel threatened to provide the masses with distractions and recourses needed to survive. As time goes by less international trade will result in a need to fill that void and may expedite China's desired global expansion or cause civil war within.

While the latter is likely many millions of innocent folks will die at the transfer of power or China's expansion. Its unavoidable and China is ever racing to that point of no return.

The communist party is not the sole guilty party of this connundrem, but those who allowed China to behave this way unchecked for the last 3 decades or so.

I place some of this blame on the authors of trade agreements and subsequent presidents and policy makers for allowing it to continue

October 2000
Normalized Trade Relations
U.S. President Bill Clinton signs the U.S.-China Relations Act of 2000 in October, granting Beijing permanent normal trade relations with the United States and paving the way for China to join the World Trade Organization in 2001. Between 1980 and 2004, U.S.-China trade rises from $5 billion to $231 billion. In 2006, China surpasses Mexico as the United States’ second-biggest trade partner, after Canada

In 2008 the point of ruin and further evidence of major imbalancements were becoming more and more apparent

September 2008
China Becomes Largest U.S. Foreign Creditor
In September 2008, China surpasses Japan to become the largest holder of U.S. debt—or treasuries—at around $600 billion. The growing interdependence between the U.S. and Chinese economies becomes evident as a financial crisis threatens the global economy, fueling concerns over U.S.-China economic imbalances.

Ten years (probably less) from now if the issues were not addressed by Trump a fiscally independent United States would arguably not be feasible as we become more and more beholdent to a communist government.

This is no more than a 'controlled demolition' of the global economy.......and as much as I used to think it was a 'cabal' of all the financial 'cabal' that control everything behind the scenes, I am now beginning to think this was all a two pronged attack by China......send out a virus....watch the West close down their economies....thus protecting China's own.

Rainbows
Jane

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: odzeandennz

I think you're right on this one.

Multinationals gave consumers a taste of cheaper goods, and we allowed over time the moving of industries.

It's cheaper at the time of purchase, but over time it's the same price IMO when you see the economic effects.

I think the economic argument alone is enough to justify a restructuring of relations with China... But then if you look at their human rights, that's when the situation becomes truly alarming.

And we're all throwing gas on the fire, and crossing a point of no return.

I don't know if we can even walk this back now.

Which is better for consumers: cheaper goods or better-paying jobs? Outsourcing production to China has given us the former at the expense of the latter. I’d rather have millions of good jobs. Much of our opiates epidemic can be attributed to U.S. firms outsourcing jobs, often just to increase profits.

Don’t get me wrong; companies have to be profitable, but if they can survive with reduced profits and remain in the USA, that’s the right thing to do.

If they can’t possibly stay alive operating in America, I’d rather they go just about anywhere other than China, the worst existential threat to this country since the Soviet Union in the 1980s.

a reply to: CriticalStinker
What we are witnessing today IS the restructuring of relations with China.

originally posted by: angelchemuel
This is no more than a 'controlled demolition' of the global economy.......and as much as I used to think it was a 'cabal' of all the financial 'cabal' that control everything behind the scenes, I am now beginning to think this was all a two pronged attack by China......send out a virus....watch the West close down their economies....thus protecting China's own.

Rainbows
Jane

Of course it was. Trumps trade tariffs and sanctions were bleeding them big-time. The Democrats and a lot of Rhino Republicans are beholden to China and that's the only reason why the US has not declared war on them.

Back in March China said they see no cure for the deadly virus. They quietly bought every foreign controlled companies assets that were in China for pennies on the dollar as companies fled in droves.

The day they had bought every last one of them, they claimed they now did not have a virus problem and they were instantly the only country on earth that was not in the red.

The news out of China was nothing more than a movie script on top of China getting rid of its own popular uprising and in Hong Kong with one drop of a bug, during the Chinese holiday festival.

China just also bought up enough Crude to fight a long war, while it was so cheap companies just wanted it out of their tankers.

The entire world should jump on China militarily right now and remove this Communist pest once and for all.

a reply to: RudeMarine
Thank you for replying and adding facts to what was just a gut feeling on my part.

Rainbows
Jane