Election Loss Hypocrisy

I've been thinking about something on and off for a little while now, and I just find it bemusing when talking with acquaintances who were(are?) Hillary supporters.

And this past weekend really set me in motion trying to find information that would make it more.. I don't know... Rational?

Not so long ago in our recent past we had Hillary and Trump pitted against each other in who would be our president. A lot of people were dead set that Hillary was going to win. The media and the polls practically pushed it as truth.

Then we had Hillary stating that Trump wouldn't accept the loss.

Then, boom! Hillary lost. People freaked out. Completely. And every day for almost four years now her and a bunch of other people have been constantly complaining about it.

Now, as we approach another presidential election, the same thing is happening. The media and polls are pushing a Trump loss as matter of fact, and lo-and-behold Hillary comes back out to say what of all things? Well, that Trump may not accept a loss of all things.

Did we get blasted by an asteroid back in 2015/16 and knocked into a Mandella timeline? (Remember those?)

Nearly four years later and the stage is practically set the same way.

We have a political party saying that Trump and his supporters won't accept a loss, along with a thinly veiled suggestion that it could lead to a civil war or just something "really bad."

This is really odd coming from a political party that for four years has acted like the electoral college is some newfangled thing designed to prevent them from being the side of the coin that's on top and that Trump isn't the real President, and trying their damndest to get rid of him.

Now, I couldn't give a rat's ass less about Trump, and I definitely won't miss either him or Hillary when nature decides to off them. Therefore, I would like to see people redirect their anger at the Democratic-Republican Party instead of each other.

There's a lot of talk about what Trump and his supporters will do if he loses, but what will the people who loathe Trump do if he wins?

We could continue fighting and arguing with each other, but why?

Why don't we focus all of our anger and energy towards the people at the top?

If I were still a Democrat I would be thoroughly pissed that after all the candidates there were they still went with Biden.

If I was a Republican I'd be thoroughly pissed that no other Republican candidate could outshine Trump.

It shouldn't even be a challenge! We have two out of-touch with reality geriatrics to choose from. We could all vote for someone else. It's not like it's not possible.

The government, so far, hasn't been putting guns to our heads making us pick one or the other.

We argue back and forth about half the country this, or half the country that, when in reality almost half of the country doesn't even vote. And the voting percentage of the population is basically a little more than 25% blue/25% red, and 10% "independent"(in name only.)

Whether you want to believe it or not the majority of us don't care about those of us who hold extreme views and would rather not work and protest all day every day. And if the two "halves" (25%/25%) do decide to try and start some crap the actual majority of us (and the large percentage that are ineligible to vote) are going to get pissed off about having our lives disrupted because the pissy groups of loudmouths couldn't figure out how to work together and do something about the government screwing us all over.

Then, the government will step in and royally screw us even more.

The way I'm seeing it is those on the left and those on the right are both pushing us toward a more overall authoritarian government in each other's attempts to be the controlling party. The results of which won't be in our favor. The only people that it will favor are the big wigs at the top of our government amd corporations.

a reply to: AutomateThis1

Hey, I get it.

I vote Republican for a few reasons but the primary reason is the insane authoritarian leftest who want to punish you if you don't do, think, speak, or conform to their immoral values. Kind of like the dark age church in Europe.


You cannot trust any of the polls this year. Half of the people like myself who will vote Republican (Trump currently) will not tell a pollster the truth. Most of us just want to be left alone and not targeted by crazy leftest zealots.

Phone rings "who will you vote for in 2020".... Oh, I vote Libertarian, please leave me alone.....

a reply to: AutomateThis1

While I agree with much of your rant, and a lot more of it makes me ashamed...

We can agree on a few things.
Hillary lost, people have been freaking out about it, fringe groups refused to accept it...

One thing to add, those are the people burning down buildings and murdering strangers.

The right is only pushing for authority because there's no other way to deal with unruly children.
Get your # together, make reasonable arguments.

If you want to be taken seriously you can't be throwing temper tantrums in your 30's.

I firmly believe we are witnessing the loud, boisterous death of the two party system. The fracture of the Democrat Party in particular started when Obama was elected and a lot of old-school moderate dems abandoned the party. After Obama the left split between the progressives who thought Obama wasn't left enough and the "establishment dems" who wanted to stick with the path the Dems were on... so to try and save their sorry excuse of a party they tried to unite everyone by becoming less of "The Left" and more of the anti-right. People seem to forget that Hillary was not exactly favorable among leftists; she got most of her votes on the principle of not being Trump. The Democrat Establishment already tried to force her on us in '08 when Obama came out of nowhere(I believe Obama started with good intentions but quickly "fell in line" after election and became the good little puppet they wanted him to be.)

Now, as for Trump, he was thoroughly trashed by the establishment right - who themselves had an identity crisis after Bush Junior's disastrous 8 year reign and the failures of McCain and Romney. Even still the right would rather have stuck with the status quo than risk being taken over by an outsider - hence why the other Republican candidates were critical of Trump throughout the 2016 election to the point that many Republican senators and reps refused to even vote for him. What surprised me is that instead of his election destroying the Republican establishment, Trump managed to unite the right around one simple thing - being anti-left.

And so, we are left today with two parties who are shells of their former glory, based solely around "hey, at least we aren't the other guys". To the establishment's credit, it's working. Every time I try to debate policy with a fellow leftist, all they want tot talk about is Trump this or Trump that. Many leftists can name hundreds of Trump's alleged transgressions but are blissfully ignorant of the corruption on the left. Same goes for the countless Trump supporters I've talked to that are incredibly well-versed in the left's corruption but are relatively clueless as to what's happening on the right. We don't have a left & right so much these days as we have "The Anti-Left" and "The Anti-Right". The only question I have is how long can they keep this polarization act up...you'd think eventually people would wake up to the fact they'd rather keep us pitted against each other so we don't turn on them.

a reply to: infolurker

Hey I'd like to vote for Jo, I like a lot of what she has said, but she talks a big game for not having alot of history to back it up.

I mean she says she's going to get rid of the NSA, ATF, and other agencies? Man, like the current system is going to let that happen!

She's talked about streamlining immigration, and some other stuff, but she's also said some things that don't quite resonate with me, but overall she can't possibly be any worse than the two fools we have hogging the spotlight.

I really do think we need to fix Congress and Supreme Court. We need people that actually represent us and will actually work together to make things better for all of us instead of attempting to compartmentalize all of us into boxes that fit their agendas.

I'm telling you I can feel it happening in the near future. Especially when the young people today become adults. With the way tlwe share information we could easily garner support for a viable third party candidate. The only issue is that even in the other parties their candidates tend to be not so great.

Libertarians as a whole want to redefine the Kibertarian platform to fit their personal agendas and a good chunk of them treat the party as a joke. We have people who "used to be" trying to pass themselves off as Libertarians attempting to swing Libs into voting for Biden or Trump.

The Constitution Party is only somewhat "constitutional." I have a suspicion they really just wish to amend the Constitution in their favor.

The Transhumanist party is a joke.

I'm not even going to get into the Green Party.

People have to start giving a damn about their neighbors and their communities, and new people who move into existing communities have to blend in and be a benefit as well.

We have to ignore the extremists and realize that the majority of what they want is fantasy, and in reality we live in a pre-existing system in which we vote for people to represent us and should do that. We elect community representatives and other officials, and in turn they can work their way up continuing to do good, and representing not just their local community, but their counties, and even their state. Then, if we all continue working together and making sure we vote for good candidates, and remove bad ones we may finally start getting candidates that are worth their salt.


What extremists want(without naming or blaming certain groups) is to throw everything, even the good, in a fire and make life miserable for everyone.

But what we should be doing is working together and making sure we're good neighbors, and when we see something wrong to speak up.

a reply to: bigsnowman

Yep, it's a rise of reactionism. Which is the result of growing hate and fear. We all know what reactionary extremism leads to, and it's not pretty.

Hell, I used to be able to have decent political conversations with people all across the spectrum.

Now I can hardly talk to anyone without it devolving into a one sided anger mismanagement shutdown. Doesn't matter what political affiliation they have.

Online, I've been caught off guard by it. The conversation could be going well, and the next I know the person has written a small article on how I'm a traitor or just flat out wrong. I've been called a commie, a Neo/Nazi, pig, bootlicker, Trumpster, Never-Trumoer, fascist, leftie, alt-right you name it.

A lot of people are overly sensitzed to the point they'd feel the need to write an article over a small misunderstanding instead of just asking for a rephrasing or clarification.

In person I can actually see it in affect. Another person and I could be talking about something, and we could broach a subject and I can see the eyes dart, the gaze lower, the brow furrow, the skin blush, the sweat bead, and either the shouting starts or the stammering and incoherent babble begins.

We need a whole lot less over reaction and a whole lot more understanding.

Hillary didn't accept her obvious defeat that night. The next morning when she appeared, it was like a funeral.

The MSM will keep the polls artificially inflated, in Biden's favor. They will portray him as the next president... they will declare his inevitable coronation...

Then, when the President does get re-elected... they will use those polls as "evidence" of a stolen election.

They will decry the process as being invalid... they will riot. They will burn entire cities.

That's my take.

I'm wondering how many Hollywood creeps will actually leave the country this time if Trump wins again.

a reply to: AutomateThis1

I'm telling you I can feel it happening in the near future. Especially when the young people today become adults.

At present, there's a very good chance that "young people today becoming adults" will never happen.
Perpetual adolescence or mutually assured destruction or 'plandemic' inspired genocidal vaccines - are all potentially in our immediate future.

I've advocated dumping the two party system for a more diverse set of candidates (preferably without ANY party affiliation) so that elected representatives MUST stand on their own without the safety of a 'party line' to tell them how to act - for years. Political power systems will not let that happen. Ever.


ganjoa

a reply to: AutomateThis1

and lo-and-behold Hillary comes back out to say what of all things? Well, that Trump may not accept a loss of all things.

He's already laid the ground for that so she's probably right , the difference this time is that it'll be the sitting President not accepting defeat not just a candidate as they both were last time.

The hypocrisy is that if Trump wins it will be a fair election but if Biden wins it will be because of fraud , the stage is set.

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: AutomateThis1

and lo-and-behold Hillary comes back out to say what of all things? Well, that Trump may not accept a loss of all things.

He's already laid the ground for that so she's probably right , the difference this time is that it'll be the sitting President not accepting defeat not just a candidate as they both were last time.

The hypocrisy is that if Trump wins it will be a fair election but if Biden wins it will be because of fraud , the stage is set.

There is ZERO indication that Trump is remotely close to losing this next election. None. Zip.

So, what's more likely?

What sucks, is we have to fight our own enemy, right here at home. We'll continue to fight for four more years.

The Democrats will never see another Presidency. They did it to themselves.

originally posted by: madmac5150
The MSM will keep the polls artificially inflated, in Biden's favor. They will portray him as the next president... they will declare his inevitable coronation...

Then, when the President does get re-elected... they will use those polls as "evidence" of a stolen election.

They will decry the process as being invalid... they will riot. They will burn entire cities.

That's my take.

Well if you're so sure than bet everything on Trump (you can almost triple your stake if he gets re-elected.)

You can argue that polls might be fake, but do you think bookies will get it wrong again (2016) by having Biden as favorite? I doubt it.

Btw. Even Trump doesn't believe he will get re elected. That's the reason why he's talking about voter fraud and whatnot.
We have a guy who wants to postpone the elections and talks about voter fraud and you guys are talking about democrats not willing to accept election loss?
Only on ATS lol

a reply to: SourGrapes

There is ZERO indication that Trump is remotely close to losing this next election. None. Zip.

There are indications but as they are only indications his fan base ignore them because anything that is negative is "fake news" , his poll numbers are falling and only a fool ignores that , polls are not a prediction they're an indication.

What sucks, is we have to fight our own enemy, right here at home.

They're your enemy by design , divide and conquer has been the theme of the last 4 years and now it plays out to the finale.

a reply to: bigsnowman

I don't know man, I'm a Trump supporter because I like his platform, most of which he's been able to push out. He's done some things I don't like, but it's not bad enough to outweigh the good he's done. Most of what he does that people don't like, are the things he says or tweets. They're words, not actions. I'm not so much anti-left as I am pro-country. I just don't like the way current democrats have been forcing everything they want on us, that's authoritarian and I don't like it. Things were so much better when the country was "You do you and I'll do me". The thing I dislike the most is how left wing groups are able to go out and destroy anything they don't like and the left wing mayors sit back and let it happen. That's more of a "I'll do me and I'll do you" thing and it doesn't sit well. Like Trump or hate him, at least he's done or tried to do what he was elected to do. I didn't like the message of Obama, McCain, or Romney and didn't vote for any of them. I liked Trump's message and as it stands, I'm getting what I asked for, for the most part. I'm pro any pres that offers a platform I like and tries to adhere to that platform.

a reply to: ganjoa

Yeah it would be nice if there was no party affiliation and you had to choose by platform.

originally posted by: XCrycek

originally posted by: madmac5150
The MSM will keep the polls artificially inflated, in Biden's favor. They will portray him as the next president... they will declare his inevitable coronation...

Then, when the President does get re-elected... they will use those polls as "evidence" of a stolen election.

They will decry the process as being invalid... they will riot. They will burn entire cities.

That's my take.

Well if you're so sure than bet everything on Trump (you can almost triple your stake if he gets re-elected.)

You can argue that polls might be fake, but do you think bookies will get it wrong again (2016) by having Biden as favorite? I doubt it.

Yes. They'll get it wrong again if they put their money on Biden. Bookies are no strangers to losing, they go by polls and the media likes to poll blue cities for results.

originally posted by: AutomateThis1
We have two out of-touch with reality geriatrics to choose from.

Yeah, you were doing pretty good there, until you had to let your TDS loose.

The fact is, Trump is anything but 'an out of touch with reality geriatric'...

He is one of the most sane. rational Presidents we've had in a long time... far from perfect, and no, I don't worship him or agree with everything he does, and his Queens style of communication is annoying at times, but those are miniscule complaints when compared to the positive America First policies that he has promoted and engaged.

originally posted by: tanstaafl

originally posted by: AutomateThis1
We have two out of-touch with reality geriatrics to choose from.

Yeah, you were doing pretty good there, until you had to let your TDS loose.

The fact is, Trump is anything but 'an out of touch with reality geriatric'...

He is one of the most sane. rational Presidents we've had in a long time... far from perfect, and no, I don't worship him or agree with everything he does, and his Queens style of communication is annoying at times, but those are miniscule complaints when compared to the positive America First policies that he has promoted and engaged.

That's exactly how I see Trump as well... I don't see a "lesser of two evils", I see a guy who promised things and has actually come through on those promises. I don't really get how people say he's terrible, just not as terrible as the other guy. He's done more than Bush I, Clinton, Bush II, and Obama put together. Reagan was the last real guy we had before Trump.