Never More Relevant Than Now

a reply to: bigsnowman

Absolutely. The fact this isn't just a Democrat/Republican thing should be eye opening to some.

We are all subject to this from the cradle to the grave regardless of skin color, sexual orientation or political leanings.

It transcends all that nonsense.

a reply to: SuicideKing33

It transcends all that nonsense.

Kind of like covid-19.

It's either killing people by the thousands or it's a hoax.
We must use strict measures to control it or it will just go away like magic.
The epidemiologists know what to do or they're in cahoots with Dems and the media in fabricating a hoax to make Trump look bad.

We sure could use a unified message right about now; before school starts.

The first major propaganda campaign that I remember was concerning littering. Early '60s before anti-littering laws, people would throw their trash out of car windows. The highway shoulders looked like dump sites. Concerted propaganda changed public opinion enough for laws to get passed and stiff penalties for littering. It worked.

To mask or not to mask. Hmmm

Oh wait!
"Stick with us. Don't believe the crap you see from these people, the fake news. ... What you're seeing and what you're reading is not what's happening." - DJ Trump

Trump can save us from propaganda. Let's go back to the good old days, when we were free. True freedom is throwing trash out your car window at 90 mph. Don't trample my freedom man!

a reply to: pthena

The past 4 months, to me, has proven everything bernays was saying. It's that simple.

Nobody is talking about trump except you.

Such weird reactions from some of you. Thank you headlock and snowman for having something constructive and relevant to add.

a reply to: Phage

He was. Very specific, and that is precisely the problem... people, perhaps yourself, have bought into the fantasy of "democracy" sold as the high road, the morally superior and egalitarian path, yet are being continually manipulated, most unknowingly. The contradiction is part of the control he wrote of. This info in the op is nothing new but it is a good reminder, especially in these times, of how we got here and how it was part of the plan all along. Other systems aren't great either and the end results are often the same, what differs is only the psychological path the population is offered to get there. Power is ultimately corrupted. Bernays knew that, got his 15 minutes of fame and the rest is history. He wrote the playbook no matter the system be it democracy, socialism, communism. He just happened to be a master of human psychology and proponent of democracy as seen from the controlling class.

a reply to: igloo

A quote comes to mind

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free."

Modern America in a nutshell.

a reply to: SuicideKing33

Bernays again... okay.

Here's the thing that always gets lost in the translation: No one is manipulated or "controlled" without their own consent and cooperation. It is only because people are already disposed to believing something and only because people are already predisposed to doing something that they can be "convinced" that their way is the "right" way or the "best" way or even the "only" way.

The proof is in the pudding... we've been bombarded with this crap for decades, many of us for our entire lifetimes, but we are not a collective. Far from it!!! Why? Because people are attracted to and drawn to that which serves our preconceived notions and perspectives. A White Supremacist already believes they are the most awesomest possumest, so when a silver tongued devil comes along and praises the merits of Whiteness, their own already existing prejudices and biases are confirmed, and they sing "Hallalujah!"

No one is manipulated or controlled without their consent and cooperation.

a reply to: Boadicea

No one is manipulated or controlled without their consent and cooperation.

Agreed.

originally posted by: SuicideKing33
a reply to: igloo

A quote comes to mind

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free."

Modern America in a nutshell.

www.cadc.uscourts.gov...

[

"No one is manipulated or controlled without their consent and cooperation."

Agreed.

The whole point of Bernay's teachings is that consent & cooperation can be manufactured, as he proceeds to describe a process to accomplish that. The "American Breakfast" - known internationally - is global acknowledgement of successful application of Bernay's principles.

Recognizing that this programming exists & learning how to mitigate it are the main lessons here for the masses.

ganjoa

a reply to: ganjoa

The whole point of Bernay's teachings is that consent & cooperation can be manufactured...

No. It is impossible to coerce anyone into anything that goes against their core values and principles. This is why hypnosis cannot be used to "suggest" someone commit murder. They will not do it if it violates their core values and principles.

...as he proceeds to describe a process to accomplish that.

What he describes is how our preconceived notions and prejudices can be exploited and taken advantage of.

For example, any and all good scams, hoaxes, etc., begin with known facts and truths, which the "mark" can easily recognize. Usually/often in a way that compliments and lauds the mark. The mark is now prepared to trust the scammer. The scammer then uses that established trust to slightly tweak and expand the facts and the truth, and the mark is eager to accept and believe anything that furthers his/her own beliefs.

The next step is encouraging the mark to believe that they are special... they're so much smarter and gooder than everyone else... they know and understand things that other people are too stoopid to get... critics and detractors are just jealous of how awesome possum the special people are... No need to listen to them... just laugh at them in the most condescending fashion.

It's all about playing the ego.

a reply to: SuicideKing33

Nobody is talking about trump except you.

Except you.

That Bernays sure must be a crazy trump supporter with his crackpot theories eh? (sarcasm)

So propaganda is a thing that works. That isn't news to me. PR (public relations), advertising; it works. That's why governments and businesses pay the big bucks for it.

a reply to: Boadicea

Not sure I can follow you there.

You can absolutely make people do dang near anything with trauma and misinformation. Even horrific stuff you never would do. You can absolutely manufacture consent. You can change core values. It's happening right now.

a reply to: pthena

Cool glad we agree.

originally posted by: SuicideKing33
a reply to: Boadicea

Not sure I can follow you there.

Okay. Apparently it doesn't confirm your pre-conceived notions...

You can absolutely make people do dang near anything with trauma and misinformation.

Interesting that you bring up trauma, because that is an extreme means of exploiting one's existing fears. In fact, there are those who will induce such trauma (read: torture) in order to exploit that fearful state.

Even horrific stuff you never would do. You can absolutely manufacture consent. You can change core values. It's happening right now.

Nope. Let's take the state of trauma you cited. If a principled person is in a state of fear for their life, that existing fear can be exploited to confirm the traumatized person needs to take a life to protect their life... but this is a confirmation of their existing survival instinct and their principles of self-defense.

On the other hand, you could not convince that same principled person to kill in order to steal their possessions, no matter how traumatized, because it is not a confirmation of their existing core values and principles.

a reply to: Boadicea

Maybe I'm not understanding...

You're telling me you couldn't torture/brainwash/lie to someone enough to get them to kill someone they normally wouldnt?

You understand how silly that sounds?

originally posted by: SuicideKing33
a reply to: Boadicea

Maybe I'm not understanding...

You're telling me you couldn't torture/brainwash/lie to someone enough to get them to kill someone they normally wouldnt?

Yes, that is what I am saying. Which word(s) did you not understand?

Specifically, it is possible to exploit a person's pre-existing values and principles to believe that killing someone is justified and in accordance with their pre-existing values and principles... but you cannot override that person's existing core values and principles.

You understand how silly that sounds?

Silly? LOL! No, it's not silly at all. It is actually an informed opinion.

What's silly is thinking that people are being mind-controlled when people obviously think all kinds of different things and have all kinds of different ideas and aspirations and confirmation biases. If people were that easily controlled, there would be no dissension or disagreement about anything at all, because we'd all be force fed our thoughts and opinions. Heaven knows lots of folks are trying their damnedest to make that happen, but it hasn't been successful so there is obviously something stopping that. I am clearly and unequivocally attributing it to our individual will and conscience.

Perhaps you need to read up on more than just Bernays. Try Neuro Linguistic Programming (NLP) and Large Group Awareness Training (LGAT) tactics and techniques. There are legitimate purposes and uses for both, as well as non-legitimate purposes and uses.

a reply to: Boadicea

Ever heard of Manchurian Canidates? Mk-ultra? Trauma causing personalities to split and be completely unaware of each other?

You don't think prolonged torture for years can make a good man snap?

What world do you live in?

You might think it's silly "that people are being mind controlled" but prominent psychologists like Freud and Bernays sure dont.

a reply to: SuicideKing33

Wow. I'm really not even disagreeing with you... simply expanding on the concepts and processes involved.

I know more about this crap than I ever wanted to know. I have seen this crap up close and personal. I educated myself. In depth.

If you want to hang onto your confirmation biases and preconceived notions (not to mention your self-forsaken free will and autonomy), okay. Go for it. Embrace ignorance!!!

But I know better. And guess what? Your nonsense isn't going "brainwash" me or "control" my mind.

See how that works???

a reply to: Boadicea

I'm going by experience in real life bud. You must think yourself immune to propaganda then?

You didn't even address the last post.

You actually said someone can't be coerced to kill if they normally wouldnt. Aside from a billion examples i guess you're right. They teach you to kill in the army by shooting silhouettes so it's easier on a real person. Because not everyone who joins the army is a murderous psycho. You can traumatize someone and split their personality, completely unaware of each other.

You're unaware of this??? In depth studied??? What nonsense??? And I'm trying to brainwash you by pointing out the myriad of ways people will kill each other when coerced? Sharp as a cue ball some of you I swear...

originally posted by: SuicideKing33
a reply to: Boadicea

You actually said someone can't be coerced to kill if they normally wouldnt.

No, that's not exactly what I said. I said that people will not and cannot be manipulated to kill in violation of their core values and principles. Already established survival and self-defense instincts can be exploited (for example by inducing life-threatening trauma) to kill in what they perceive as self-defense, kill or be killed, scenario. Because it is in accord with their existing values and principles.

That same person would not and could not be manipulated to kill someone in order to steal someone else's property or possessions when it is not in accord with their core values and principles.

Aside from a billion examples i guess you're right. They teach you to kill in the army by shooting silhouettes so it's easier on a real person.

But the person in the army has joined the army because defending their nation and its people is in accord with their core values and principles. In war, it is already accepted that it is kill or be killed. So the training does not introduce or coerce anyone to do anything. It is perfecting and honing skills to accomplish already accepted core values and principles.

Because not everyone who joins the army is a murderous psycho.

Obviously. They are there BECAUSE they have core values and principles, including defending their nation and its people.

You can traumatize someone and split their personality, completely unaware of each other.

And yet, still intricately related and associated, even if on a subconscious level, because the split levels are still part of a whole.

You're unaware of this??? In depth studied??? What nonsense???

I am obviously aware. I'm just not limiting my understanding of it with confirmation bias and preconceived notions.

Why are you so determined to convince me (and everyone) that we are just puppets? Ripe for the picking? Defenseless? Helpless? Hopeless?