Wanted: Honest intelligent productive thinking to resolve the issue God exists or not.

You're saying people wonder why God doesn't exist.

a reply to: Out6of9Balance

To whom are you speaking?

originally posted by: Phage

So easy.

Easy pleasy, makes so much sense now...lol

originally posted by: Phage

Pi, and kangaroos, and platypuses. Australia. Australia is proof that God is nuts.

No...proof that Gods has a sense of humor...

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance
You're saying people wonder why God doesn't exist.

I'm not saying God exist or not... Both arguments are beyond what we can comprehend... I'm just asking why do you need God in the first place?

a reply to: Xtrozero

A deadly sense of humor, I guess.
Cuz...Australia.

a reply to: Xtrozero

Both arguments are exactly what we comprehend.

We need God simply because He's there.

originally posted by: Phage

A deadly sense of humor, I guess.
Cuz...Australia.

Well we can say he likes snakes.... and beetles since there are like 360,000 species of them...he most definitely likes beetles more than humans.

a reply to: Out6of9Balance

My dog used to chase his tail. It was amusing.
But even he realized the futility after a short while.

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance

We need God simply because He's there.

Where?

We get into the Chicken or the egg scenario when you throw God into the mix. Why do we need intelligent design at all.

Its an argument that can not be solved. BTW God would be incomprehensible...as in maybe not even life or intelligence as we know it and not something that cares about our morals...

a reply to: Xtrozero

You're trying to find Him in your understanding. Try to live a little.

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance

You're trying to find Him in your understanding. Try to live a little.

Actually I don't care, so I guess I'll live....

This concept of God would be something just to say whatever is outside of our universe... I can roll with that...In the end it means nothing as its a term for explaining what can not be explain...

You can call it "here be dragons" and I'll accept that term just the same.
Now what I would find interesting is how do you think God interacts with you and me?

a reply to: Pachomius

Please be specific, what precisely don't you accept in my step No. 12:

"12. (a) If you cannot or will not accept that God exists, (b) are you not then either irrational (c) or dishonestly stubborn against the existence of God?"


There are three clauses, pinpoint first just one clause you don't accept and why.

There is only the one condition and then two possible conclusions.

(b) implies irrationality to not believing, whereas belief is irrational in my opinion.
(c) "dishonestly stubborn" implies that there is some well established, or even imposed by authority, reality being rejected. There really isn't anything obviously real about your conceptual god. And if there is some authority imposing this concept upon people, that authority itself has not been authoritatively recognized universally.

Now the Pythagoreans established the existence of irrational numbers and thought that they should keep the knowledge of irrationality their own secret, like they alone should be afforded irrationality in belief and practice. But good people didn't need their secrets, because in real life people can and do experience the irrational every day.

Edit to add:

I just realized that my response to (b) may be mistaken as bigotry. Just to be clear: believers and unbelievers alike can enjoy the benefits of irrationality, for Manuela is no respecter of persons.

That last sentence I wrote!!! I feel ... I feel ... not special for knowing Manuela.
Oh well, you know what they say:
Via con Dios.

a reply to: Xtrozero

You're destroying something so beautiful for yourself if you believe your own reasoning.

originally posted by: Pachomius
Dear everyone, there is no way man can get everyone to work out an issue, unless they first concur on what is the issue to resolve.

My thread here has to do with the issue God exists or not, and already there are posters here who don't want to at all concur everyone together on the concept of God, that is God with the G in upper case.

You see, my experiences with trying to talk with atheists, is that they are scared to death when they already feel that they cannot anymore oppose me on the issue God exists or not, because I point out to them that facts, truths, evidence, logic, goodness of mankind, and the history of ideas definitely prove that God exists, God in concept as the creator cause of man and the universe and everything with a beginning.

So they flee from me, and the powers that be in forums they close down my threads which have to do with the issue God exists or not, because these powers fear also to have to come to agreement with me that God exists, on evidence from facts, truths, goodness, evidence, logic, and the history of ideas.

Fear of raw reality is what keeps people from facing the existence of God, God in concept as the creator cause of man and the universe and everything with a beginning. .

Oh my !
We are very sorry, for your perceptions, which are mostly yours, but, maybe : we ?

Also : it feels kinda awkward to say this now... but... uhmmmm....
We kinda resolved the whole : ..."...resolve the issue God exists or not..."... , thing, uhhhm, earlier in the thread ...

Yeah : really ...

We figured it all out, came to agreements, shook hands, and now :we're just out in the parking-lot for the après-match.
Hangin around our cars, havin a few brewskis, you know...
Chattin about the thread.
You know...
Reading the stat sheet, given to us from Yohan Oinysheet*...
Teasing Whip Trigen about his bobble...
Listening to Ewen Oiwy brag about his great play...

Regular after-game stuff.
Uhhhmmm : did you miss that ?
Did he miss that ?

Just here for the entertainment.
You know ?


*Yohan Oinysheet = You and I and he she it

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance

You're destroying something so beautiful for yourself if you believe your own reasoning.

Believe or believe not, real or real not...the ending is the same...

a reply to: Xtrozero

Lying about the truth you will change your way.

originally posted by: Pachomius
...
Please be specific, what precisely don't you accept in my step No. 12:

"12. (a) If you cannot or will not accept that God exists, (b) are you not then either irrational (c) or dishonestly stubborn against the existence of God?" ...

Thank-you for writing that !

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance
a reply to: Xtrozero

Lying about the truth you will change your way.

Lying about what. Care to cite a truth that is being lied about?

And how is your trolling glorify the truth?

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance

What else is outside of the universe? Do you understand?

It is not something we can understand since it is....outside of our universe. When I say universe I'm saying outside of our space time. As I said what is no time where infinite and nothing can be the same thing, where there is no beginning no end...no time...

We have a beginning and a end, time flows within our universe and the only infinite we have is basically the universe dimensions and math that is a form of abstract language to explain what we can. We run into some rather big concepts we can not comprehend, so we call it God. Just like the days of old...can't understand it so we put a God in place to explain it.

Where is time now?
Time is an idea that happens presently.

Change happens now.

Can you separate yourself from now?

Are you sure that you had a beginning?

Did now ever begin? Will now ever end?