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Wanted: Honest intelligent productive thinking to resolve the issue God exists or not.

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posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 04:13 AM
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originally posted by: Itisnowagain

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance
Is God a release or a ball and chain?

Or none of the two?

God is peace of mind.
God is now ( presence).

Stay with what is actual......barking dog, chirping birds, the sound of cars, a flower.....and notice thoughts arising about other times but let them go because thought is known to be occuring and thought speaks about things which aren't.

Truth is now.


Wouldn't life feel lighter if you didn't have to carry time around?


i was good until he said nothing ever happened...

Everything experienced happened... it was just once upon a time lol


edit on 17-9-2020 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 04:23 AM
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a reply to: Akragon
No thing ever happened.

Now is not a thing......it is all there is.

No thing is everything.



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 04:27 AM
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a reply to: Akragon
There is no time.

Once upon a time is a fairy story!

If there is a belief in fairy stories peace will not be unveiled.

edit on 17-9-2020 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 04:44 AM
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a reply to: Itisnowagain

Now is nothing but time...




posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 06:27 AM
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So the USA never dropped an atomic bomb on Japan? Where did the lasting contamination and health effects originate from?



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 06:30 AM
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originally posted by: whereislogic

"The first Man according to the Egyptians was Atum (pronounced Adam). Atum had a child Set (Seth)."

Those are gods.


Just as the Hebrews mistakenly deified their ancestors via the Asherah Pole, so too did the Egyptians deify their late ancestors. It shouldn't come as a surprise that they would be prone to such idolatry because their ancestors lived nearly a thousand years and likely did many amazing things before the flood.



Atum ... is an important deity in Egyptian mythology.


according to the Egyptian Book of the Dead Atum was the father of all humankind, just like Adam. These are synchronistic accounts about the actual history of humankind. It reinforces the validity of Biblical history.




Set ... is a god of deserts, storms, disorder, violence, and foreigners in ancient Egyptian religion.

Source: wikipedia


Seth was seen as chaotic by the Egyptians because he was a nomadic wanderer opposing his brother's building of civilization. The Hebrews loved him because they supposed the nomadic wanderer was fulfilling the way of Moses and Abraham - nomadic wondering - was the ideal way to live and opposed his brother Cain's building of civilization. The Egyptians and Hebrews are describing the same event from different perspectives.



Even Archangels don't say such things about Satan.
The prefix “arch,” meaning “chief” or “principal,” implies that there is only one archangel, the chief angel; in the Scriptures, “archangel” is never found in the plural.

The idea of multiple archangels probably comes from the Roman Catholic Church, or the Eastern Orthodox Church, or both. The identity of this archangel is inconvenient to these Trinitarian religions, so they invented a whole bunch of 'm while keeping people in the dark regarding the inconvenient fact I mentioned above (which most of their Trinitarian bible translators and some theologians are well aware of, hence the expression: 'keeping people in the dark', while knowing better).

The Bible gives the name of the archangel, identifying him as Michael (Miʹcha·el) [Who Is Like God?].​—Da 12:1; Jude 9; Re 12:7.

“He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;” (Col 1:15). When on earth as a perfect man, he reflected his Father’s qualities and personality to the fullest extent possible within human limitations, so he could say that “he that has seen me has seen the Father also.” (Joh 14:9; 5:17, 19, 30, 36; 8:28, 38, 42) This likeness, however, was certainly heightened at the time of his resurrection to spirit life and his being granted “all authority . . . in heaven and on the earth” by his Father, Jehovah God. (1Pe 3:18; Mt 28:18) Since God then exalted him to “a superior position,” God’s Son now reflected his Father’s glory to an even greater degree than he had before leaving the heavens to come to earth. (Php 2:9; Heb 2:9) He is now “the exact representation of [God’s] very being.”​—Heb 1:2-4.

So, Who Is Like God? Who is Michael (Miʹcha·el)?*


I don't think chief implies there is only one. There were many chief priests, and it was often plural. We probably don't see Archangels in the plural because usually 1 is sufficient to do the job. Gabriel is mentioned 3 times in the bible and had the glorious duty of telling Mary she was giving birth to the One through whom Jehovah Saves. Also the book of Enoch mentions multiple Archangels. God Most High, "Lord of Hosts", has many Beings to serve Him and His creation. This is where many people mistakenly accuse Christianity as being polytheistic, but it is perhaps most accurately called a Kingdom in which there is a Most High God with subjects that came from Him and serve Him. The Monarchies throughout history attempted to emulate the heavenly Kingdom with an earthy kingdom because they wished to resemble the organization of the heavens.
edit on 17-9-2020 by cooperton because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 07:40 AM
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a reply to: Akragon

Time is nothing but now.
edit on 17-9-2020 by Out6of9Balance because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 07:43 AM
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originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Itisnowagain

Now is nothing but time...


Time is a thought (concept/idea) that happens now.
No one has ever seen or heard time.

The seer is now and the seen is now.



edit on 17-9-2020 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 08:22 AM
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originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: Akragon
...
No thing is everything.

1 Timothy 6:20

Timothy, guard what has been entrusted to you, turning away from the empty speeches that violate what is holy and from the contradictions of the falsely called “knowledge.”* [Latin: scientia; KJV: “science”; Greek: gnoʹsis]

Colossians 2:8

Look out that no one takes you captive* [Or “carries you off as his prey.”] by means of the philosophy and empty deception according to human tradition, according to the elementary things of the world and not according to Christ;

1 Corinthians 3:19

For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God, for it is written: “He catches the wise in their own cunning.”

Knowledge (gnoʹsis) is put in a very favorable light in the Christian Greek Scriptures. However, not all that men may call “knowledge” is to be sought, because philosophies and views exist that are “falsely called ‘knowledge.’” (1Ti 6:20) The easiest way to recognize that sort of “knowledge”, is when you spot the earlier bolded “contradictions”. Usually they are a bit better hidden, unlike what you just said.

Antonyms for everything

nothing

Source: Everything Synonyms, Everything Antonyms | Thesaurus.com

When a word is the antonym of another, it means the opposite. So claiming that “no thing [nothing] is everything [every thing]”, is a contradiction.
edit on 17-9-2020 by whereislogic because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 09:55 AM
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a reply to: cooperton

Any mention anywhere in ancient Egyptian literature that Atum and Set were deified humans?

Gabriel is not the archangel and not referred to as such in the Bible. The Book of Enoch is a bad joke. The Book of Enoch is an apocryphal and pseudepigraphic text. It is falsely ascribed to Enoch (a sign of dishonesty and deception, being a product of the Father of the lie and the mastermind behind all religious or theological deception after all). Produced probably sometime during the second and first centuries B.C.E., it is a collection of extravagant and unhistorical Jewish myths, evidently the product of exegetical elaborations on the brief Genesis reference to Enoch. This alone is sufficient for lovers of God’s inspired Word to dismiss it.

Some researchers assert that Jude is quoting from the apocryphal Book of Enoch. However, R. C. H. Lenski notes: “We ask: ‘What is the source of this patchwork, the Book of Enoch?’ This book is an accretion, and nobody is sure of the dates of its various parts . . . ; nobody can be sure that some of its expressions were not, perhaps, taken from Jude himself.”
edit on 17-9-2020 by whereislogic because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 10:28 AM
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a reply to: Out6of9Balance

Here is always now too.



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 02:36 PM
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MONO




I am still waiting for Drucifer to do what he said he would do, namely:
    You want to tackle the biggest question in our existence and want people to keep it to under 50 words?
    I'll make a deal with ya, I'll write what I want to get my point across and you pick 50 words out of it to hold onto.



Perhaps someone else can take up where Drucifer left off, namely, tell me:


Pachomius posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 07:06 AM
- - - - - - - - - - - -


Dear Drucifer:


Please just choose one point that is relevant to the OP, for me to interact with you on, okay? And keep it to just not over 50 words.


For the rest, please be reminded that the thread is on God, as existing or not, and by way of reasoning, not on any revelation authority.


And no need to bring in Satan to increase your post volume with derails.





Annex


Pachomius posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 11:48 AM
- - - - - - - - - - - -


Dear Drucifer, you tell me:

You want to tackle the biggest question in our existence and want people to keep it to under 50 words?
I'll make a deal with ya, I'll write what I want to get my point across and you pick 50 words out of it to hold onto.



I am still waiting.


    originally posted by: Drucifer


    You want to tackle the biggest question in our existence and want people to keep it to under 50 words?
    I'll make a deal with ya, I'll write what I want to get my point across and you pick 50 words out of it to hold onto.

    And someone else brought up Satan, I just responded. There is no desire to drive up my post count, I've been here for practically 10 years and if that were a goal of mine, it'd be evident by my actual post count.


    [ . . . . ]






posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 04:42 PM
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MONO




Dear readers here and also my fellow honest intelligent productive posters here, you will notice that some posters here are into continual derails from the OP, because they just want to earn more volume of posts, even though they are into nugatory posting (nugatory, the word could sound like nut as in nuts), you know why:

Simple, BECAUSE they don't have the genuine whole full complete entire picture of reality i.e. of existence, what they have are bits and pieces of reality, by which they think they are smart, but really more into truncated nonsense shreds of distorted reality, for not factoring into their most rubbish-loaded brain, the concept of God, namely, in concept as the creator cause of man and the universe and everything with a beginning.

I am still waiting for anyone to engage with me in exchange of ideas in this thread, on a sustained basis, but they are all fearful, starting with one Neutron and now Drucifer, scared to death, owing to their - and they are unwitting about it, their deficiency of a full, whole, complete, entire picture of reality, at the apex of which reality is God, in concept as the creator cause of man and the universe and everything with a beginning.

.

Okay, I am still waiting.
.



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 06:39 PM
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originally posted by: Pachomius
MONO

Dear readers here and also my fellow honest intelligent productive posters here, you will notice that some posters here are into continual derails from the OP, because they just want to earn more volume of posts, even though they are into nugatory posting (nugatory, the word could sound like nut as in nuts), you know why:

Simple, BECAUSE they don't have the genuine whole full complete entire picture of reality i.e. of existence, what they have are bits and pieces of reality, by which they think they are smart, but really more into truncated nonsense shreds of distorted reality, for not factoring into their most rubbish-loaded brain, the concept of God, namely, in concept as the creator cause of man and the universe and everything with a beginning.

I am still waiting for anyone to engage with me in exchange of ideas in this thread, on a sustained basis, but they are all fearful, starting with one Neutron and now Drucifer, scared to death, owing to their - and they are unwitting about it, their deficiency of a full, whole, complete, entire picture of reality, at the apex of which reality is God, in concept as the creator cause of man and the universe and everything with a beginning.

.

Okay, I am still waiting.
.


I think we concluded many pages ago that God must exist due to the necessity of design in this very complex and mathematically perpetual world we live in. We our selves are intelligent, meaning we must derive from some sort of intelligence, which by its very definition would be the Source popularly referred to as God. Evolution fails to put forth a viable mechanism for how random chance could ever create intelligible beings with over 100 billion neurons and 1 trillion supporting glial cells to create a self-aware, rational, emotional, and homeostatic brain that each and every one of us are gifted with. If someone facing these facts cannot see the necessity of design then there is nothing that would convince them...

They even had God incarnate come and raise Himself from the grave as a sign for everyone - still the endless imagination of humankind allows the possibility for doubt even among such immense evidence that God is the Cause of All. God is insistent upon the Good Will of humans, but He would never force Himself on anyone. Neither can you force the understanding of the necessity of God upon anyone, the onus is on them to come to the realization in due time. Many just need more time to develop rationally, emotionally, and spiritually to be able to discover how God works in our lives every day. It is an ever-expanding lotus that even the most Theologically and philosophically aware people are still developing each and every day.
edit on 17-9-2020 by cooperton because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 09:17 PM
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MONO



I could not have said it better, thanks cooperton!






a reply to: cooperton



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 09:59 PM
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Did God create monkeys ?

Did monkeys create God ?

Whom amongst us really remembers, and whom just guesses ?



Here : have some monkey-juice ! ! LoL !!



posted on Sep, 17 2020 @ 11:11 PM
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a reply to: Nothin



Whom amongst us really remembers, and whom just guesses ?

I'll put it like this: I remember what I remember.
I don't remember the first human or the last.

I'm in the process of writing up a rather lengthy memoir,
things I remember over a lengthy period of time.

The NOW is freking overrated. Every act, every thought, in the past has consequences for today and tomorrow and the future. And we're killing ourselves as an ongoing process that could have been prevented 50 years ago, 40 years ago, maybe even 30 years ago, but we freaking didn't. Now we're F***ed.

When I'm done with the Bee Sting story, it will probably get posted in the Conspiracies in Religion forum. In the meantime, here's something that probably won't be in that story:

Where the hell did the concept of creator come from? Well the Greco-Roman idea came from a little word, Ktistēs.

Who was a ktistis ? An ancient founder of a small shabby colony. Then when the founder died, he was buried, and there were shrines. Founder/Creator. Then the small shabby colonies grew to be cities, and the cities became parts of empires, then Theology invented the gods.

Eventually, someone decided that the humble word ktistes, should be transmogrified from shabby colony founder to the freakin one and only self existing Creator of the Universe out of nothing.
See Oxford Classical Dictionary

And as further material for the video you posted, see: Great chain of being




edit on 17-9-2020 by pthena because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 18 2020 @ 03:40 AM
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a reply to: Pachomius

You


starting with one Neutron and now Drucifer, scared to death, owing to their - and they are unwitting about it, their deficiency of a full, whole, complete, entire picture of reality, at the apex of which reality is God, in concept as the creator cause of man and the universe and everything with a beginning.



WTF?

Your delusional.

At least I posted accounts and testimony by people proclaiming physical evidence of God.

Is that false.

I’ll take that over your pride and hollow definition of your god.

Do you believe that your spirit will some day stand before the spirit that created the universe.

I see you creating a convenient god in your imagine on your terms. Paying lip service to god with no actual testimony or account concerning god. That you have no personal relationship with God.

I don’t know what your looking for, but you will not get to truth through falsehoods. Specially false accounts of individuals by you. I think you have doubt and are afraid there is no god. And at the same time are afraid of people of spiritual faith that don’t have to define god into a corner. That don’t have to trap and box in god in fifty words or lest.

And it is very obvious you use blatant falsehoods.

That you derailed this thread with falsehoods. and personal attacks fabricated out of blatant falsehoods.

Again...


originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: Pachomius

I await with “bated” breath for you to answer question asked of you.

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: Pachomius

You


Okay, dear Neutron, define faith - he will run away.


Look at you, more falsehoods by you

I have posted the definition of faith several times with working examples. Is that a false statement.

Why would you harm your credibility with such a easily proven wrong statement.

I bet your one of those people that ignore what is actually posted in the thread. You have selective memory. Or pride Where you ignore everyone else’s posts, and beliefs.

You didn’t answer what was actually posted. You should stay away from statements like “ he will run away” when your the one “running” away. So not only is there your documented falsehood, there is your documented hypocrisy.

Again... stop changing the subject.

It’s not proof. It circular logic.

It’s no different than saying:

The universe is in a state of flux with matter always existing. After a cycle of collapse and expansion, the universe was reborn with mostly hydrogen. The hydrogen collected and formed the stars. The stars through fusion converted the hydrogen into heavier and heavier elements that compose the human body.

The elements were full of chemical potential energy. The chemicals combined until the primordial soup that gave rise to life was formed. Giving rise to chemical machines.

See logic is not proof.


edit on 18-9-2020 by neutronflux because: Added and fixed



posted on Sep, 18 2020 @ 11:16 AM
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MONO




Thanks Neutron for a very long post, but you forgot to repeat in your long post what is your definition of faith.

Do it now when if ever you remember what you repeated many times already in the past.

Then we can have a sustained exchange of ideas on how faith brought you to the existence of God, the God that your faith brought to your cognitive faculty i.e. the knowledge of the existence of God, your God, okay?



Annex


Neutron posted on Sep, 18 2020 @ 05:40 PM a reply to: Pachomius
- - - - - - - - - -

You



    starting with one Neutron and now Drucifer, scared to death, owing to their - and they are unwitting about it, their deficiency of a full, whole, complete, entire picture of reality, at the apex of which reality is God, in concept as the creator cause of man and the universe and everything with a beginning.




WTF?

Your delusional.

At least I posted accounts and testimony by people proclaiming physical evidence of God.

Is that false.

I’ll take that over your pride and hollow definition of your god.

Do you believe that your spirit will some day stand before the spirit that created the universe.

I see you creating a convenient god in your imagine on your terms. Paying lip service to god with no actual testimony or account concerning god. That you have no personal relationship with God.

I don’t know what your looking for, but you will not get to truth through falsehoods. Specially false accounts of individuals by you. I think you have doubt and are afraid there is no god. And at the same time are afraid of people of spiritual faith that don’t have to define god into a corner. That don’t have to trap and box in god in fifty words or lest.

And it is very obvious you use blatant falsehoods.

That you derailed this thread with falsehoods. and personal attacks fabricated out of blatant falsehoods.

Again...


    originally posted by: neutronflux a reply to: Pachomius

    I await with “bated” breath for you to answer question asked of you.

    originally posted by: neutronflux a reply to: Pachomius

    You



    "Okay, dear Neutron, define faith - he will run away."




Look at you, more falsehoods by you

I have posted the definition of faith several times with working examples. Is that a false statement.

Why would you harm your credibility with such a easily proven wrong statement.

I bet your one of those people that ignore what is actually posted in the thread. You have selective memory. Or pride Where you ignore everyone else’s posts, and beliefs.

You didn’t answer what was actually posted. You should stay away from statements like “ he will run away” when your the one “running” away. So not only is there your documented falsehood, there is your documented hypocrisy.

Again... stop changing the subject.

It’s not proof. It circular logic.

It’s no different than saying:

The universe is in a state of flux with matter always existing. After a cycle of collapse and expansion, the universe was reborn with mostly hydrogen. The hydrogen collected and formed the stars. The stars through fusion converted the hydrogen into heavier and heavier elements that compose the human body.

The elements were full of chemical potential energy. The chemicals combined until the primordial soup that gave rise to life was formed. Giving rise to chemical machines.

See logic is not proof.

====================
edit on 18-9-2020 by neutronflux because: Added and fixed




posted on Sep, 18 2020 @ 11:23 AM
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a reply to: Pachomius

You


Thanks Neutron for a very long post, but you forgot to repeat in your long post what is your definition of faith.


Again...

I have posted the definition of faith several times with working examples. Is that a false statement.




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