New findings at the Gobekli Tepe site.

There was a cataclysmic event ~12,800 years ago. Enormous evidence points to a comet hitting Earth and a world wide flood. That’s the case here.

originally posted by: M4ngo
Hmmm... Extreme coordination of hundreds, probably thousands of people. The stone carvings are 3D. Do you even understand what that means? HG or not, this CIVILIZATION was advance.

except that without cities, agriculture and a systematic hierarchy. then it's not a civilization. It's merely a culture. and despite your claims, there was no worldwide flood. there would be ample evidence world wide for such an event. You provide no evidence, you simply demand that it is true.

originally posted by: M4ngo
There was a cataclysmic event ~12,800 years ago. Enormous evidence points to a comet hitting Earth and a world wide flood. That’s the case here.

First there was no world wide flood.

Secondly, there is no current evidence that the Hiawatha crater is the causative agent of the younger Dryas. Now the Dryas did occur but we don't know exactly what caused it. I would speculate it was mix of reasons and not just one.

“It's likely quite young, geologically speaking,” MacGregor says. “It's likely less than three million years old and possibly as young as 12,000 to 15,000 years old.” If the discovery holds, the Hiawatha Crater could therefore be a tantalizing new piece of evidence for a very controversial idea

We currently don't know the age of that crater. Many fringe sites and gurus have been pretending the date IS known while it is not. Now it could be but we don't know and it will be a few years until they can drill down and see.

www.sciencemag.org...

a reply to: M4ngo

The event is said to be the rapid warming of the mountainous glaciers, silt and mineral rich water ran heavily and almost suddenly down the Tigris and Euphrates rivers, where Ancient Ur sit's today, it was actually more coastal city right up against a lush marsh land.

originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: M4ngo

The event is said to be the rapid warming of the mountainous glaciers, silt and mineral rich water ran heavily and almost suddenly down the Tigris and Euphrates rivers, where Ancient Ur sit's today, it was actually more coastal city right up against a lush marsh land.

Might be said by people that don't really know what they're talking about.

Leonard Woolley, an accomplished Assyriologist, thought he'd found evidence of the "Great Flood" when he excavated Ur.
Had to eat his words when it was found to not be so extensive and other earlier large floods were found underneath it (and newer ones above it.)

What I'm saying is these sediments have been studied for almost a hundred years. They aren't in any way out of the ordinary for a large river flood, which happens on average every hundred years or so.
That's why they call them "hundred year floods" these days.

Woolley's flood doesn't hold a candle to the flood that would have occurred along the Mississippi River in 2011, if not for the levees that didn't break that year. There have been many floods in my lifetime along the Mississippi, every one of them accounted for by nothing but rainfall.

Harte

a reply to: Harte

The Dilmun is an area around where the Persian Gulf now sits.
The earliest known myths of the Sumerian people puts Enki impregnating the marshlands just north of the Dilmun, which is apparently for some reason off limits.

This is a rather good indication that the Dilum territory was once a much larger land mass and was said to be very fertile as well. The way the silt has developed in the deltas of the two rivers is a good indication of flash flooding. Plus, you know the whole flood myth.

originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: Harte

The Dilmun is an area around where the Persian Gulf now sits.
The earliest known myths of the Sumerian people puts Enki impregnating the marshlands just north of the Dilmun, which is apparently for some reason off limits.

This is a rather good indication that the Dilum territory was once a much larger land mass and was said to be very fertile as well. The way the silt has developed in the deltas of the two rivers is a good indication of flash flooding. Plus, you know the whole flood myth.

The Dilmun were a culture in the area of Qatar, Bahrain, the eastern province of Saudi and perhaps parts of the UAE.

The information is fragmented but it seems to have came into existence about the time Sumerian moved into the Ubaidian territories and reached it peak about 2000 BCE.

What are these indications you mentioned about a larger land mass? I've been to most of the Dilmun sites and once lived next to one of their tombs on Bahrain. I've seen ideas that people inhabited the dry land that later became the Persian Gulf but that was thousands of years before the establishment of the Dilmun and Sumer. Investigations have not found any extensive human presence under the waters of the Gulf.

Flooding of the Persian Gulf/land

people.rses.anu.edu.au...

www.sciencedirect.com...

a reply to: Hanslune

What are these indications you mentioned about a larger land mass? I've been to most of the Dilmun sites and once lived next to one of their tombs on Bahrain. I've seen ideas that people inhabited the dry land that later became the Persian Gulf but that was thousands of years before the establishment of the Dilmun and Sumer. Investigations have not found any extensive human presence under the waters of the Gulf.

Somewhere along the lines the sumer people must have settled further south in the gulf and eventually settled around where Ur is today for agricultural reasons.

Not all of where the Dilmun sits now is under water. But sediment in the gulf indicates that heavy flows of water did come from the mountains to the north east.

originally posted by: Hanslune

originally posted by: M4ngo
There was a cataclysmic event ~12,800 years ago. Enormous evidence points to a comet hitting Earth and a world wide flood. That’s the case here.

First there was no world wide flood.

Secondly, there is no current evidence that the Hiawatha crater is the causative agent of the younger Dryas. Now the Dryas did occur but we don't know exactly what caused it. I would speculate it was mix of reasons and not just one.

“It's likely quite young, geologically speaking,” MacGregor says. “It's likely less than three million years old and possibly as young as 12,000 to 15,000 years old.” If the discovery holds, the Hiawatha Crater could therefore be a tantalizing new piece of evidence for a very controversial idea

We currently don't know the age of that crater. Many fringe sites and gurus have been pretending the date IS known while it is not. Now it could be but we don't know and it will be a few years until they can drill down and see.

www.sciencemag.org...

An abundance of evidence points to a cataclysmic event 12,800 years ago and a world-wide flood. Just because you claim it wasn’t so doesn’t mean it didn’t happen. It’s highly plausible multiple impacts occurred, not just a single one. Have to follow the evidence.

Major cosmic impact 12,800 years ago Geologic and paleontological evidence unearthed in southern Chile supports the theory that a major cosmic impact event occurred approximately 12,800 years ago


THE FLOODING OF THE MEDITERRANEAN BASIN AT THE YOUNGER-DRYAS BOUNDARY


Massive crater under Greenland’s ice points to climate-altering impact in the time of humans

originally posted by: M4ngo

originally posted by: Hanslune

originally posted by: M4ngo
There was a cataclysmic event ~12,800 years ago. Enormous evidence points to a comet hitting Earth and a world wide flood. That’s the case here.

First there was no world wide flood.

Secondly, there is no current evidence that the Hiawatha crater is the causative agent of the younger Dryas. Now the Dryas did occur but we don't know exactly what caused it. I would speculate it was mix of reasons and not just one.

“It's likely quite young, geologically speaking,” MacGregor says. “It's likely less than three million years old and possibly as young as 12,000 to 15,000 years old.” If the discovery holds, the Hiawatha Crater could therefore be a tantalizing new piece of evidence for a very controversial idea

We currently don't know the age of that crater. Many fringe sites and gurus have been pretending the date IS known while it is not. Now it could be but we don't know and it will be a few years until they can drill down and see.

www.sciencemag.org...

An abundance of evidence points to a cataclysmic event 12,800 years ago and a world-wide flood. Just because you claim it wasn’t so doesn’t mean it didn’t happen. It’s highly plausible multiple impacts occurred, not just a single one. Have to follow the evidence.

Major cosmic impact 12,800 years ago Geologic and paleontological evidence unearthed in southern Chile supports the theory that a major cosmic impact event occurred approximately 12,800 years ago

As Hans quoted for you, the age of the Hiawatha crater has been nailed down to "probably" less than 3 million years. If that sounds like evidence that it dates to the YD boundary, then you probably don't understand the word "evidence."

originally posted by: M4ngo
THE FLOODING OF THE MEDITERRANEAN BASIN AT THE YOUNGER-DRYAS BOUNDARY

This is a link to a treatise published by an open access journal (the author paid to have it published) written by a guy with a 66 page pamphlet for sale on Amazon (for 40 bucks) about the world wide flood who advertises himself as a former associate professor at the US Naval Academy. He was an associate professor - in Defense Analysis. He has credentials in Mathematics. He has no academic credentials regarding geology or any field related to any meteoric impact hypothesis.
This guy asserts that Mankind evolved in Lemuria and Atlantis for God's sake.
Again, not evidence in any way.

Massive crater under Greenland’s ice points to climate-altering impact in the time of humans

This is a headline and the story neglects to inform of the very large time span involved in what is currently known about the age of this crater. It is technically correct because it uses the phrase "The timing is still up for debate" in the story, which shows the headline is clickbait.
A headline isn't evidence either.

Do you need a link to a dictionary?

Harte

a reply to: Harte

I checked the usual suspects for when such a expedition would set forth. One is in the planning but is on hold due to Covid and an initial lack of funding. It would seem the NSF is taking precautions too:

icecores.org...

Previous organizations for that type of research

en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...

This is just me---but I always had a issue with the idea of GT being reburied twice.

Maybe I missed the exact evidence that points to this being done?

So in my thinking---with the idea that the YD event was not one strike---is that it took several strikes.
In the first one debris covers the structures. GT seems to be a place of ritual gatherings---maybe among several "tribes" in the region. After a destructive event survivors flock to GT to see who might be left. They uncover the structures in a attempt to re-start their life up. Either the first strike caused eventual demise in the collapsing of the food chain or a second strike finished the area off and it was not uncovered until current ages.

We have reports of debris filled skys and "black rain" following reports of "events" in antiquity so if enough debris are in the atmosphere down they come to fill up and in whatever holds

originally posted by: atlantiswatusi
This is just me---but I always had a issue with the idea of GT being reburied twice.

Maybe I missed the exact evidence that points to this being done?

It was buried way more than twice. It was about every 15 or 20 years, on average.
You can tell by stuff being underneath other stuff.

Harte

originally posted by: Harte

originally posted by: atlantiswatusi
This is just me---but I always had a issue with the idea of GT being reburied twice.

Maybe I missed the exact evidence that points to this being done?

It was buried way more than twice. It was about every 15 or 20 years, on average.
You can tell by stuff being underneath other stuff.

Harte

Yes that magic thing we learned in archaeology - and geology

en.wikipedia.org...(archaeology)

www.crowcanyon.org...

archaeologymuseum.ca...

www.brown.edu...

a reply to: Harte

I hadn't come across that piece of information about it being reburied multiple times. I get how the process works but my understanding of GT is cursory at best. I can't recall exactly where I read the buried twice thing---maybe it was just from someone else posting on this site?

I haven't had time yet to jump on the info site for GT that either you or Hanslune posted earlier in the thread.

So thanks for pointing that out. Do you have a source for me to read up on that more?

a reply to: Harte
Have you read the work on the Greenland crater?
The older threshhold for dating is due to old organics being excavated by the impact, the ice profiles constrain the actual impact to younger than 30ish k years as there are known, dated incomformities that the crater disrupts.

originally posted by: atlantiswatusi
a reply to: Harte

I hadn't come across that piece of information about it being reburied multiple times. I get how the process works but my understanding of GT is cursory at best. I can't recall exactly where I read the buried twice thing---maybe it was just from someone else posting on this site?

I haven't had time yet to jump on the info site for GT that either you or Hanslune posted earlier in the thread.

So thanks for pointing that out. Do you have a source for me to read up on that more?

It comes from Klaus Schmidt. He led excavations there for 18 years until he died. You'd have to look it up.

Schmidt's name is permanently associated with the site because he (or his team, anyway,) is the one that made all the discoveries there. Anything that's known about the site is known because of Schmidt.

The multiple burials was reported in NatGeo in 2011. However, the article is only available now to subscribers. You can probably find the info elsewhere, maybe Google Scholar, searching under Klaus Schmidt. He wrote skads of stuff about what he found until he died in 2014.

Harte

a reply to: strongfp




" Is Gobekli Tepe the middle stage between hunter gatherer humans and agrarian humans? Was there a dark age between such events 11,000 years ago? "


No , Gobekli Tepe is a Testament to the REMEMBERANCE of the Advanced Civilization that Existed Before it was Destroyed during the Younger Dryas Event 11,600 Years Ago . A Regression of Man's Social Evolution at the time .

originally posted by: punkinworks10
a reply to: Harte
Have you read the work on the Greenland crater?
The older threshhold for dating is due to old organics being excavated by the impact, the ice profiles constrain the actual impact to younger than 30ish k years as there are known, dated incomformities that the crater disrupts.

Maybe, but there's enough papers out there that "the work" isn't specific enough. That is, I've read probably 30 or 40 articles and/or papers on it going back two years when it was discovered. Do you have anything newer than May 2020? Is it in this thread? Post a link.

Harte

originally posted by: Zanti Misfit



No , Gobekli Tepe is a Testament to the REMEMBERANCE of the Advanced Civilization that Existed Before it was Destroyed during the Younger Dryas Event 11,600 Years Ago . A Regression of Man's Social Evolution at the time .

Could you explain how the folks at Gobekli Tepe would know about 'an advanced civilization' located in North America?, That was then destroyed and why or how they would remember this thousands of years later while being 6-8000 kilometers away?