November jobs report more winning

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: Fallingdown

Contrast with Canada's November numbers:

71,200 Jobs LOST

Unemployment rate jumps to 5.9%

Source: theconservativetreehouse.com...

The conservative tree house eh, well a quick flick through that crap and surprise surprise it's all sensationalist clickbait . C'mon you don't really take any of that crap seriously do you.

More sensationalist clickbait from Statistics Canada;

After holding steady in October, employment fell by 71,000 (-0.4%) in November. The unemployment rate rose by 0.4 percentage points to 5.9%.


www150.statcan.gc.ca...

Statistics Canada is the national statistical office. The agency ensures Canadians have the key information on Canada's economy, society and environment that they require to function effectively as citizens and decision makers.

The Democrats said it couldn’t happen, they said it wouldn’t happen. Guess what it did happen.

D's are the ones that should be unemployed.



I say it's 50% Trump policies + 50% do nothing congress.

Yeah. I recall 07 well. Everyone was cheering vapidly about how well the economy was doing then as well. And just as I did then, I suggest everyone should be prepared. All the signs are there, again, and everyone is ignoring them blissfully, again.

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
Walmart customer:” Trump created 5 million jobs!”
Walmart cashier:” I have 3 of them and I still can’t pay my rent.”

I see you consume CNN and AOC news. I found your problem.

Most of the wage growth has been for the bottom 40% of wage earners. The average work week is 35 hours. I know you haters would love America to fail just to blast #OrangeManBad.

Why do you hate the bottom 40% making HUGE wage increases not seen in over 20 years?

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: Fallingdown

Contrast with Canada's November numbers:

71,200 Jobs LOST

Unemployment rate jumps to 5.9%

Source: theconservativetreehouse.com...

The conservative tree house eh, well a quick flick through that crap and surprise surprise it's all sensationalist clickbait . C'mon you don't really take any of that crap seriously do you.

What numbers that he posted do you dispute? Attacking a source is simply using logical fallacies when actual numbers are provided. If it's simply opinion and spin, that's a different story, but we have actual numbers here to verify.

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Lumenari

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Lumenari
a reply to: strongfp

What's your point? Notice the difference between how Obama handled the downfall and how Trump is? I bet you can't with your dissonance towards the subject.

Obama was handed an economy that Democratic policies caused and managed to take a 18-21 month recession and make it last 8 years while telling everyone that America was in a permanent decline and he was just there to manage the decline.

Trump took the same and here we are.

So yes, there is a HUGE difference between how Obama and Trump handled the economy.

The US is in longest period of continued growth recorded, the majority of which was under Obama.

Not sure how that is making a recession last 8 years.

Trump so far has kept the economy going well but it is very much built on trends that started long before he became president.

Did you type that with a straight face?

Just.... LOL

So what policies did Democrats enact that started this amazing growth?

Or do you just mean that enough people fell off of unemployment and started getting food stamps that the unemployment numbers went down under Obama?

Because Obama added 13 million people to the food stamps roster.

The number of people in poverty rose 6 million under Obama.

But yea... this is Obama's economy we are seeing now.

/facepalm

Obama inherited the worst economic downturn since the great depression.

He passed on an economy with ( at the time) the second longest period of economic growth recorded.

I dont think Obama did a great job on the economy But the idea that there has been a major economic turnaround under Trump is simply false.

There is always a big recovery after recessions. Obama's recovery is the worst in US history. Dead last worst.

The right measure and comparison for Obama’s record is not to compare the recovery to the recession, but to compare Obama’s recovery with other recoveries from other recessions since the Great Depression. By that measure, what is clear is that Obamanomics has produced the worst recovery from a recession since the Great Depression, worse than what every other President who has faced a recession has achieved since the Great Depression.

www.forbes.com...

First of all its an article from 2013 so hardly representative of the economy Trump inherited .

Secondly it's defining it as the worst post-war recovery since took longer to recover to pre recession levels. Since it was the worst recession since the war that is an almost completely meaningless way of judging the recovery.

The article is an opinion piece by a right wing think tank so is trying to make a political point, not an economic one.

Again Obama's handling of the economy was far from perfect, but the economy that was handed over to Trump was doing well under every major economic metric. So far those trends have continued or even improved, but the idea of a miraculous economic turnaround is a myth.

All you did is cover your ears. Tell me what recession recoveries did worse than Obama's. I got more wage growth in 2 years under Trump than I did in 8 years under Obama. We have quarterly meetings where we discuss things such as future raises, so it was not something in the works which just happened to take place once Trump was elected. As soon as Trump was elected the increases started coming faster and bigger.

Obama inherited a terrible economy (which Democrats created by ignoring the housing crisis), and he did a terrible job at turning it around. Obama prevented the economic recovery we should have had, slowed it down, and created the biggest racial divide in this country in my lifetime. Basically everything the left has accused Trump of doing, Obama actually did (you know, like threaten and punish whistleblowers, abusing his powers to go after journalists who were critical of him).

The fact is everyone should be happy at what Trump is doing for the economy, but TDS won't let them.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Still waiting for my wage increase. Oh and get this, apparently I'm grandfathered in, new employees don't even get paid vacation like I do, ever. When I started vacation time increased with years worked. Mine won't increase but at least I'm grandathered in the one week I earned.

How messed is that? Not that I had a good opportunity to use it this year. Also apparently there are efforts in government to make it so minimum wage doesn't apply to home health care workers. Not that I'm making minimum wage here getting better than that. Few jobs pay minimum wage. Then again looked into various states for movement options, apparently some love paying minimum wage. Avoiding those states.

Overall home health care being screwed over, as ussual. Love how little being the people who will take care of everyone when older or are taking care of your grandparents or parents now matters to the country. Would rather send that money to football players and movie stars, and politicians, and killing people. No wonder we're one of the most understaffed professions in existence.

That's the problem with capitalism, the money more often than not goes to stupid # and rarely towards the jobs that keep society afloat.

a reply to: Puppylove

Sorry you did not get any, most Americans did. Most wage growth has gone to the bottom 40% wage earners, and workers are getting bigger wage increases than managers.

I had been waiting to save money to go back to school for 4 years, so I could afford to not work full time and just work part time. As soon as Trump won and the money started rolling in for us I quit and now go to school and don't work at all and we live on just my wife's salary. We also upgraded our house to a much bigger one. My wife did not get any special raises, no new job title, everyone got the same raise as her, she's an RN, we worked at the same hospital (which is where I now go to school as well).

Wish I would’ve found this earlier .

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
Walmart customer:” Trump created 5 million jobs!”
Walmart cashier:” I have 3 of them and I still can’t pay my rent.”

I see you consume CNN and AOC news. I found your problem.

Most of the wage growth has been for the bottom 40% of wage earners. The average work week is 35 hours. I know you haters would love America to fail just to blast #OrangeManBad.

Why do you hate the bottom 40% making HUGE wage increases not seen in over 20 years?

So what exactly are these “huge” wage gains you speak of? If it’s the targets, Walmart’s, and amazon, we can thank sanders and the push for $15 for all of that, exclusively. But I would love to see what these huge wage gains you speak of are, and how they are due to trumps policies.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Inspired by this decided to look into things. Apparently there is a lot of focus on the industry I'm in being in trouble and trying to find ways to reform it. Some of it looks promissing, some of it does not.

Apparently there's fear of the immigration situation reducing our already understaffed profession. Didn't realize how many of my coworkers I never see are immigrants many apparently illegal. I'm not sure I'm happy with their focus on immigrants rather than increasing incentives. I mean they are talking increasing incentives and training to allow us to legally do what many of us do anyway to allow us to be paid more and actually have benefits like health care.

How messed up is that? I'm in a job providing health care for others but don't even get real health care myself if I need it. I mean sure they offer catastrophic insurance but that's crap and it's not like I can afford it.

So apparently my industry is part of the open borders brigade. No wonder I felt it easier to get my job than expected. Though not sure how they get past the mandatory background checks...

Buuuuuuuut, there is some positives down the road, potentially, hopefully...

a reply to: Puppylove

Oh yeah, industries love immigrants. They have to settle for less pay, can be abused and exploited without any recourse or defense, can’t work to improve their lot or advance. Have no protections or representation, and can’t get benefits. All things that make them perfect, subservient, obedient servants. Oh, and they lower the wage bar for the rest of the workforce too.

a reply to: pexx421

Me and my wife both work in healthcare. Everyone in the hospital got huge increases. Everyone. Do you think an RN is an elitist 1%?

Why would I thank people that had nothing to do with it? They can push for it all they like it will never happen until the economic climate is ready for it, which is what Trump did.

Are you disputing the wage growth is happening or are you saying it is all going to the 1% and none to anyone else?

Workers at the lower end of the pay scale finally are getting the most benefit from rising wages

Average hourly earnings rose 3.4 percent in February, the best increase since April 2009.

For the first time during the recovery, lower-end earners are getting more of the benefit, according to a Goldman Sachs report.

The trend could mean that the economy has more strength to it than some economists think.

www.cnbc.com...

I really don't know what you are disputing.

originally posted by: pexx421
a reply to: Puppylove

Oh yeah, industries love immigrants. They have to settle for less pay, can be abused and exploited without any recourse or defense, can’t work to improve their lot or advance. Have no protections or representation, and can’t get benefits. All things that make them perfect, subservient, obedient servants. Oh, and they lower the wage bar for the rest of the workforce too.

Democrats love it too. All those reasons are exactly why anyone who actually cares should support Republican efforts to fix immigration.

a reply to: Puppylove

Illegal immigration depressing wage growth is a huge problem. Construction used to be a great paying job, now the wages stagnate and I basically only see hispanics taking the jobs. The entire sector was destroyed by illegal immigration.

I am sorry you happen to be in one of the sectors not seeing the gain, I truly am.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: pexx421

Me and my wife both work in healthcare. Everyone in the hospital got huge increases. Everyone. Do you think an RN is an elitist 1%?

Why would I thank people that had nothing to do with it? They can push for it all they like it will never happen until the economic climate is ready for it, which is what Trump did.

Are you disputing the wage growth is happening or are you saying it is all going to the 1% and none to anyone else?

Workers at the lower end of the pay scale finally are getting the most benefit from rising wages

Average hourly earnings rose 3.4 percent in February, the best increase since April 2009.

For the first time during the recovery, lower-end earners are getting more of the benefit, according to a Goldman Sachs report.

The trend could mean that the economy has more strength to it than some economists think.

www.cnbc.com...

I really don't know what you are disputing.

Ah! So 3.4% is this “huge!!!” Wage growth you’re crowing about. Sorry to bust your bubble, but that’s 1.6% lower than my standard raises prior to 08 and far from “HUGE!!”. Now, don’t get me wrong, I got about 15% increase this year, and THATS “huge!!!”, especially at my salary, but I know that’s far from what others are experiencing, and I’m in healthcare as well, which didn’t take a hit from the 08 crisis and has just been making record profits every year, though they used 08 as an excuse to forego raises for 5 years because they are opportunists and liars. “Sorry, we can’t afford to give you guys raises or staff fully due to the economic crisis the nation is in. But there’s great news! We’ve made more profit than ever before!!” Is how that went.

At any rate, 3.4% doesn’t even keep up with real increase in costs, you know, actual inflation. Especially the inflation in medical costs from the very industry that we both apparently work in.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: pexx421
a reply to: Puppylove

Oh yeah, industries love immigrants. They have to settle for less pay, can be abused and exploited without any recourse or defense, can’t work to improve their lot or advance. Have no protections or representation, and can’t get benefits. All things that make them perfect, subservient, obedient servants. Oh, and they lower the wage bar for the rest of the workforce too.

Democrats love it too. All those reasons are exactly why anyone who actually cares should support Republican efforts to fix immigration.

I said “industry loves immigrants” which naturally means both republicans and democrats, as they both get their marching orders from industry. Don’t know why you would assume I think otherwise. You’re shortfall is where you suggest I should support Republican efforts to fix immigration. Those are just as shallow, farcical, and dishonest as democratic attempts to “support the working class”. It’s all bs and that you think one party is any less culpable in the decline of American society than the other merely indicates to which side you’re partisanship delusions lie.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Problem is, the republicans have been steadfast against anything to provide right, protections, or pretty much anything for home health care workers. In fact, in many places we apparently are not consider real jobs and are not even beholden to mimimum wage. This apparently goes way back to ancient policies. Only a few states have actually instituted these protections.

WTH I just found out if desired and people were willing to work for so little, my state could pay me less than minimum wage. Screw that I'd work in McDonald's first and I swore to never work fast food again. Apparently republicans are against my job even deserving minimum wage rights.

#ed from both sides...

Both parties can suck a big one.

At least there has been some progress with the democrats apparently to pass things to improve the lot of home health care workers, while the republicans have apparently fought it at every step.

I'm feeling very conflicted about what to do now come election time...

a reply to: pexx421

The only party that has any interest in fixing immigration are Republicans. The fact you think I am partisan is hilarious, I have never voted for a Republican in my life and despise them, they are simply the lesser evil currently. If people got behind Republican efforts to fix immigration they could influence how it was fixed. Too many people do not want it fixed, they like loose immigration that allows illegals to flood our borders.

Remove birthright citizenship for illegals. Find the jobs that actually do benefit from immigrants (rather than use immigrants to depress wages), and get some programs for legal immigrants to work (without citizenship or birthright citizenship for their kids). Give them actual protections and go after employers who abuse them. That's a start.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Problem is apparently republicans would never do that because they seem to never care about worker's rights.

Ugh we seriously need to kick both parties in the head.