As Sondland testified, a misleading Ukraine story spread among conservatives on social media

a reply to: Gryphon66

Oh I would never take that bet, I expect if Biden came out and admitted it he would not be held accountable. Half the country would scream half would cheer.

Not they they necessarily did something wrong but their actions are worthy of a thorough cavity search. Just to be sure.
It comes with the territory, as Mad Maxine says...if they did nothing wrong then they have nothing to fear.

I mean we are talking about the most corrupt country on the planet that for some ungodly reason we keep pouring billions of dollars into.

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: Gryphon66

Good thing I have never said what Biden did was wrong, so there is no quandry for me.

That is good. However, that is the presumption of Trump supporters who claim that the President's justification for requesting in investigation into the Bidens is because Biden 1 or Biden 2 did do something wrong.

a reply to: tanstaafl

Buckle Up Benjamin?

Is that not the name of a horse?

It will be "Buckle up Buttercup" thats about to become the colour of Trump's remaining days.

originally posted by: fringeofthefringe
Not they they necessarily did something wrong but their actions are worthy of a thorough cavity search. Just to be sure.
It comes with the territory, as Mad Maxine says...if they did nothing wrong then they have nothing to fear.

I mean we are talking about the most corrupt country on the planet that for some ungodly reason we keep pouring billions of dollars into.

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: Gryphon66

Good thing I have never said what Biden did was wrong, so there is no quandry for me.

That is good. However, that is the presumption of Trump supporters who claim that the President's justification for requesting in investigation into the Bidens is because Biden 1 or Biden 2 did do something wrong.

Are you going to conduct the cavity searches on all political psychopaths that have profited from this BS puppetshow?

Nope. Neither am I.

Biden is a goof. The younger one is what we call in the South a "hot ass mess." That's not complimentary.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Are you going to conduct the cavity searches on all political psychopaths that have profited from this BS puppetshow?

That's not a pretty picture

But your point is well taken! And it's critters on both the right and the left -- not all Dems and not all Pubs, just the ones at the top with the power. No one wants the ins and outs of their corruption investigated much less revealed to the public! But no doubt the Pubs have their own sweet deals et up and their own laundromat (Bain Capitol???) and are just as guilty as the Dems.

I think it speaks volumes that the overall GOP support for Trump has been half-hearted to say the least.

a reply to: Boadicea

Mr. Trump has done a lot of proactive things that will pay off in the future. Yes, I know that's an odd statement comign from me.

He has shaken the US Government and World Governments out of decades of complacency.

I've argued that he's a force of Chaos ... and that always brings great productivity though often after destruction.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Boadicea

Mr. Trump has done a lot of proactive things that will pay off in the future. Yes, I know that's an odd statement comign from me.

Perhaps not expected... but just shows your intellectual honesty and that's always appreciated!

He has shaken the US Government and World Governments out of decades of complacency.

That's the one thing I have appreciated about Trump since the campaign. He's definitely shaken up the status quo and challenged the sacred cows. And we desperately needed it.

I've argued that he's a force of Chaos ... and that always brings great productivity though often after destruction.

"Force of Chaos -- I like that! But, yeah, sometimes things have to get worse before they can get better. We don't have to like it, but it sure helps to understand it and work with the reality.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Boadicea

Mr. Trump has done a lot of proactive things that will pay off in the future. Yes, I know that's an odd statement comign from me.

He has shaken the US Government and World Governments out of decades of complacency.

I've argued that he's a force of Chaos ... and that always brings great productivity though often after destruction.

Okay, this is getting weird. That is twice I have had to star a post of yours in the last couple of days. So weird because you seem close minded on some things, but it also seems your eyes have been opened to some new ideas recently. I am also appreciating your unbiased reception of information.

a reply to: KnoxMSP

I may not agree with Gryph on a lot of his stances, but he has always been open minded and fair if presented with compelling evidence countering any of those stances.

As for the subject that the OP brings up, we will just have to wait and see if the indictment does indeed implicate Hunter and or his corporate structures.

a reply to: KnoxMSP

LOL ... It's almost like we're not all one side or the other eh?

Here's to the Middle Majority.

a reply to: jadedANDcynical

Very kind Jaded. And the feeling is mutual for what it's worth.

Honestly, my logic would run along the lines of Hinder Biden is far too dopey to carry off any sort of real crime. We will see.

originally posted by: Gryphon66

The theory has zero evidence. Burisma paid Hunter Biden crazy money obviously because of his last name. Apparently, being associated with American politicians is a matter of great prestige in the Ukraine.

Sure, we're the United States of Investigation now ... what's one more.

An investigation would show either Hunter played off his day's name with nothing to do with dad, or there are more layers to that onion. This is why it is called an investigation.

To be honest, and the reason why people are pissed is Trump went off script as he seems to do a lot and just ab lib to what comes into his brain at the moment. In this case everyone wants Ukraine to demonstrate good faith in dealing with corruption to include anything 2016 related. Trump wants this, says he wanted this, but also to show that good faith to publicly announce it since they tend to say one thing behind close doors and do another. The pure Trump part is his suggesting something to announce that is what has been emotionally close to him in the form of 2016 elections, DNC server and even Burisma that he said if there is more to it then it would be "horrible".

This was not some 4D chess move, it was Trump randomly throwing out stuff that was on his mind with most likely zero thought in the process to whether it was good or bad. That is what Trump does with his tweets, what he does in meetings and what he does on phone calls...Trump being Trump

Since Trump spewed out a number of unrelated events there is no way to tie it all on Biden in an effort to only take him down. That is stretching it beyond any limits and though the House will most likely impeach at some point it will go no further.

As I have said a good number of times there will be repercussions in all this and much of that will not be favorable for the democrats. I think this is why Nancy wanted to not do the impeachment but keep it alive for election reasons. Now with such a crappy line up of candidates the left is getting desperate. This could lead to Trump gaining another 4 years AND the democrats losing the House. They are willing to roll the dice on this...

a reply to: Xtrozero

It’s also called an “investigation” because Mr. Trump has been “investigated” and the American right has degenerated to the level of the Democrats playing tit-for-tat.

So, don’t get snarky with me, bub. There is NO BASIS for the investigation aside from the fact that 1) The name BIden is involved and 2) Burisma paid Hunter Biden too much damned money in the opinions of many. None. There’s zero evidence.

Trump wanted an announcement of an investigation. That’s all he wanted/needed. You guys can pretend Trump is some sort of justice hound ... but that’s really just silly based on his record. For the record, Obama was no better in regard to Ukraine.

If we were serious about “defending” them and bringing them into the NATO fold, we’d build bases there, and let me say I find that idea personally unacceptable, but I also find unacceptable this constant waste of American dollars and resources on countries we get NOTHING back from. Perhaps that sounds mercenary.

You seem to be suggesting that the requirement for an investigation announcement was an impromptu gesture of Trumps, and none of the evidence we have so far bears that out.

Now, here’s my thing ... there is NOTHING wrong with what Trump did. IF he wanted to sponsor crime fighting in Ukraine, or throw # at Joe BIden or anything in between ... the President has the power to negotiate with foreign nations and there is just not a lot of limitation on that when it comes down to it.

And I believe sincerely that there should be. I am horrified that the Presidency has grown to become what Bill Barr envisions, but we’re well on the way to that. And yeah, I was concerned about Obama too, but that milksop really didn’t do anything out of the ordinary (and the fricking individual mandate was a Republican idea that they were dumb enough to bite on) at least in terms of actual accomplishments.

Obama and Trump are really two sides of the same coin ... thesis-antithesis, hero-antihero (works both ways), etc.

What’s really being pushed forward is the POWER of the PRESIDENCY. And that, I assure you, is not something ANY OF US want red hat or blue hat.

originally posted by: Gryphon66

So, don’t get snarky with me, bub. There is NO BASIS for the investigation aside from the fact that 1) The name BIden is involved and 2) Burisma paid Hunter Biden too much damned money in the opinions of many. None. There’s zero evidence.

When there was three maybe more areas to investigate you can't just say only one was important, or it was the only concern. As I said Trump spews out whatever is on his brain and in this case where general corruption is a key issue Trump spewed out three that he personally sees as corruption. As I also said, Trump is not playing 4D chess here...

It is not just "Biden" it is "VP Biden" while he was officially VP and his son was made a multi-millionaire while his dad was VP by a corrupt company in a very corrupt country that his dad had numerous direct official dealings with. When you say zero evidence its like you put your head in the sand saying that, as this actually looks very scary to me, but as I said it could be nothing other than a flunky son riding his dad's name.

Trump wanted an announcement of an investigation. That’s all he wanted/needed. You guys can pretend Trump is some sort of justice hound ... but that’s really just silly based on his record. For the record, Obama was no better in regard to Ukraine.

A number of the witnesses said that Ukraine has a tendency to say one thing in private and do another. Trump is a show me kind of guy, as in show me you are sincere, and a public announcement would help and was not just Trump thinking that, but yes Trump did push for it as a condition of intent. To be honest, I'm not sure you can even call that quib pro quo to say you want what is agreed on to include a public announcement.

If we were serious about “defending” them and bringing them into the NATO fold, we’d build bases there, and let me say I find that idea personally unacceptable, but I also find unacceptable this constant waste of American dollars and resources on countries we get NOTHING back from. Perhaps that sounds mercenary.

Ya the country sucks, but Russia sucks worst and Russia WILL invade without our support.

You seem to be suggesting that the requirement for an investigation announcement was an impromptu gesture of Trumps, and none of the evidence we have so far bears that out.

I don't think Trump can think much pass impromptu, and the reason why I say that is EVERYONE was shocked that he went off the prepared path which tackling corruption was a part of. Trump could have just stayed on the path and with future conversations could have fine tuned what he wanted to investigate, but no... Trump started to ad-lib like crazy and that is what has pissed off all these bureaucrats that think, how dare he!

Now, here’s my thing ... there is NOTHING wrong with what Trump did. IF he wanted to sponsor crime fighting in Ukraine, or throw # at Joe BIden or anything in between ... the President has the power to negotiate with foreign nations and there is just not a lot of limitation on that when it comes down to it.

Don't get me wrong. I know Trump wants to take down Hillary, Obama, Biden, DNC and most likely 20 others that all played into the three years of hell for him, and Rudy was trying to do just that with whatever he could dig up. If Rudy did find dirt it is still dirt that attacked the President and the 2016 election, so it is not like "pissing on a prostitute" type of dirt, it is real political gangsta level dirt and something the American people should know.

And I believe sincerely that there should be. I am horrified that the Presidency has grown to become what Bill Barr envisions, but we’re well on the way to that. And yeah, I was concerned about Obama too, but that milksop really didn’t do anything out of the ordinary (and the fricking individual mandate was a Republican idea that they were dumb enough to bite on) at least in terms of actual accomplishments.

Obama and Trump are really two sides of the same coin ... thesis-antithesis, hero-antihero (works both ways), etc.

What’s really being pushed forward is the POWER of the PRESIDENCY. And that, I assure you, is not something ANY OF US want red hat or blue hat.

The left has weaponized "investigations" to an all new level while screaming foul play if the right even suggests it and even weaponized that with this impeachment hearing. Its like the same with this fake whistle-blower where they say no one can release his name as if he is the champion of the people and his life would be in danger. This is nothing but a circus act as there is zero legal standing to withhold his name, hell they would not even allow what agency he worked for be spoken. He that shall not be named!!

I'll say this again...the left is rolling the dice on all this and they could end up with Trump another 4 years and lose the House in the process.

a reply to: ErEhWoN

You make a thread about "Trump supporters jumping the gun on a story about Burisma" yet you use this as evidence that POTUS Trump must be locked up?...

ROFLMAO...

Whom is jumping the gun again? More so when leftists jumped every time a Schiff witness claimed "Trump committed this" and you all in the left stopped watching after that, or became temporarily blind and deaf, and then you all ignored when those same witnesses were questioned by Republicans, and we find out they all made supposition with no evidence backing their biased claims?... You even had a moron witness claim he could hear what President Zelensky was saying even though the call was not on speaker phone...

When all the witnesses were asked if they had any evidence, beside assumptions/presumptions and biased opinions, or had seen or heard any evidence of corruption, bribery, wrongdoing, or if they suddenly saw a Russian spy come out of the POTUS' hair.... They ALL said NO EVIDENCE...

These witnesses LIED from the start, and based their lies on their own assumptions and without any evidence corroboroting their assumptions and biased opinions...

The POTUS DARED not follow the same policies of Obama's appointed government officials, such as Vindman and the former U.S. ambassador to Ukraine among others, and you all are acting as if that is "abuse of the POTUS powers?..." It is the right of the POTUS to change the policy towards another nation... It's part of his job, and he doesn't have to follow the advice of ANYONE...

Advisers, whom were not elected by the public, are there to give the POTUS advice, but he doesn't have to follow that advise... Obama did it... Bush junior did it... Bush senior did it... Clinton did it... Reagan did it...etc, etc, etc...

originally posted by: Gryphon66

It’s also called an “investigation” because Mr. Trump has been “investigated” and the American right has degenerated to the level of the Democrats playing tit-for-tat.
...

Correction... Trump was spied on by the Obama administration which used the left-wing media to leak false claims, and Obama used the FBI, and CIA among other agencies to spy on the political opposition of Obama/Hillary/Biden... These people used RUSSIAN LIES to spy on a political candidate and those same lies were used for 3 years to try to depose the duly elected POTUS...

originally posted by: Gryphon66
So, don’t get snarky with me, bub. There is NO BASIS for the investigation aside from the fact that 1) The name BIden is involved and 2) Burisma paid Hunter Biden too much damned money in the opinions of many. None. There’s zero evidence.

Yes there is... Biden ADMITTED to bribing/using quid pro quo on the former Ukrainian administration,telling them he would not give them over $1 billion in aid if they did not fire the prosecutor whom was investigating Biden's son, and his link to the corrupt Burisma Holdings...

You should learn to differentiate facts from lies... It is a FACT that Biden did bribe/use quid pro quo on the former Ukrainian administration...

It is a LIE that POTUS Trump did the same thing...

For over three years now the left have been using LIES to spy not because the left had any factual evidence of a crime that Presidential candidate Trump/POTUS Trump committed, but because the left under Obama wanted to spy on him and everyone linked to him to use that and change the results of the 2016 election.

POTUS Trump asked the Ukrainians, without quid pro quo he asked for a favor, to investigate the corruption the Ukrainians themselves pointed out had occurred between the Obama administration and the former Ukrainian authorities, and this corruption involved Joe Biden and his son among others.

In one case there was no crime committed, on the second case we have an administration (Obama's) using our Federal agencies to spy on a political candidate, and everyone and everything linked to him, which hadn't committed ANY crime the left made up about "Russia collusion, bribery, ect...

The only things people have been sentence for are "process crimes..." Such as not remembering exactly a conversation that happened years ago... Or a crime committed in 2005, as in the case of Manafort, in which the prosecution back in 2005 stated they were not going to go after Manafort for those crimes, and you have democrat allies being given immunity for committing the same crimes anyone linked to Trump has been found "guilty of..."

You have had Schiff lie to you all in the left , and none of you seem to care you were lied to by him, Pelosi et al... You continue falling for Schiff's lies and instead want to claim the POTUS is the one whom committed an imaginary crime which he never committed...

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Boadicea

Mr. Trump has done a lot of proactive things that will pay off in the future. Yes, I know that's an odd statement comign from me.

He has shaken the US Government and World Governments out of decades of complacency.

I've argued that he's a force of Chaos ... and that always brings great productivity though often after destruction.

I knew we could eventually get at lest one ”Atta Boy Trump” out of you. Lots of work though!
Good analogy with a lot of truth in it.

a reply to: mtnshredder

I too thought Trump might rattle some sense into Republicans. Good sense.

Alas. Turns out it was a silver lining which wasn't.