Catalans march on Barcelona after 2 nights of violence

BARCELONA, Spain (AP) — Thousands of people on Wednesday joined five large protest marches across Catalonia that were set to converge on Barcelona, as the restive region reeled from two straight days of violent clashes between police and protesters.

Protests in Catalonia

The priorities of the EU concerning crises of democracy are curious at best. Poland's government gets harassed for wanting to reform a communist-era judicial structure, but Spain's government gets a free pass on violent suppression of regions seeking greater autonomy. Madrid has handled this crisis with a remarkable lack of wisdom. The latest protests are a result of heavy-handed sentences given to Catalan politicians by the Spanish supreme court.

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a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

Eventually the EU will have to become glocal(global + local) the problem is the federations cling to their power. But gouvernement makes only sense on a local level and trade only global, that's what the EU should be for: trade. And all the burocratic/technocratic monstrosities which we now call "nations" need to be overcome and destroyed.
I'm Bavarian and European, not German, so I can feel where the Catalans are coming from.

a reply to: Peeple

I'm Bavarian and European

Peeple, nice region you're from. I've been there; particularly enjoyed Bad Tölz.

I liked the EU a lot more when it was focused on trade. The political direction of the Union lately has IMO not been encouraging.

I agree with you, Europe is very regional. The nation-states are prominent in textbooks, but Picardie is as different from Provence as Bayern is from Brandenburg.

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a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

Exactly, cultural Identity if you take a closer look is regional and not national except a few superficial or religious holidays.
Every true European would subscribe that and let's face it in its current Form the EU doesn't make much sense, we got our national gov already costing money and being detached from the problems our communities really have, we don't need two of those political balloons, do we?

a reply to: Peeple

Peeple, this is an interesting topic, and one little-discussed in Anglophone forums (as far as I am aware, I may be very wrong).

Yes, multiple levels of costly governmental structures are worth questioning. But the current EU leadership apparently takes a dim view of national identity; I wonder if they actually have contempt for regional identity. The idea of "more Europe" seems mostly about doing away with local sense of identity. The Union tells people they need to become Europeans when they have already been Europeans -- since forever, almost.

But even in less contentious areas, the functioning of the Union is odd. A large, open trade area. But from what I've seen, the products of one EU country don't seem to get advertised or sold very much in other EU countries, with the exception of some products like automobiles. At that level of the economy, one could be excused for assuming there is no free trade area. Apparently, banks and large corporations like the Euro and free trade area ... but has it impacted the lives of individual Europeans so much (other than to make things more expensive when the Euro replaced their national currency)? Perhaps even more to the point: Do individual Europeans even WANT to see products from other EU countries? Not to mention that much of the low-cost items sold in the EU these days are not made by EU countries, but rather, by China.

So we have a super-bureaucracy that gives an appearance of not really caring what Europeans want, and a trade union that seemingly benefits but a few.

Is that an accurate view, or?

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a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

I look at the EU more as a "learning by doing" experiment and politics is in general following the "trends" of their population. What I'm basically saying is this you and me discussing is exactly what needs to be done to reform the political "biosphere". Try new ideas, share our observations etc.
Politicians are just parrots and because they lack the input of some novelty they're ideologically stuck 100 years ago.


A problem with inner EU trade is for the most parts that our goods are too expensive for most of our nations, England can (will be have been?) able to import from the Netherlands, Italy etc for others it's mostly cheaper and for obvious reasons better to use the own regional basic goods like veggies etc.
But I remember here with the Greek tragedy some more Greek products showed up on the supermarket shelfs, might be my perception is unreliable, might mean something.


Another problem the EU has is it grew to fast. It should have been BeNeLux, France, Spain, Austria, Italy, Greece, Germany, Portugal, and who ever of the Scandinavians wants to, then an adjustment of living standards for everybody involved and then we could discuss who else might be a candidate to join. Those #ers were dreaming of a hegemony ie power and perverted the funding basics of what the EU was meant to be.
So yeah no, haha, as it is it's definitely #.
But I have hopes people will organise once someone presents a better plan and we destroy the old and build new like it happened so many times before.

The Catalans are just right now the little snowball that starts rolling I have no doubt it will become an avalanche.

a reply to: Peeple

Politicians are just parrots and because they lack the input of some novelty they're ideologically stuck 100 years ago.

That's a great comment. I pretty much agree with your sentiments. I just hope the "avalanche" remains manageable.

Haha, I just noticed what your avatar has strapped to its leg

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a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

Control freak. you want to manage an avalanche? Good luck
Maybe they do that with controlled detonation? Why not it happened before after the French revolution most nobles of other European countries gave up their power without being forced...

Spain’s Supreme Court found nine politicians and activists guilty of sedition on Monday and sentenced them to up to 13 years in jail.

Thousands barricaded the airport on Monday, leading to canceled flights and stranded tourists. On Wednesday, nearly 100 people were injured across the region in unrest while cars and garbage bins were torched overnight.

Rioting in Barcelona

Catalans are very unhappy with Madrid's harsh punishment of their politicians. Footage I saw last night showed a lot of physical confrontation between protesters and the police.

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