Not everybody has to have a soul

originally posted by: SourceTruth
a reply to: Osirisvset

Why does everyone disagree with me? And why is everyone ganging up on me?

That is exactly what you should be asking yourself.
No-one is ganging up on you, you just choose to see it that way because they don't agree with the premise of your philosophy.
You are so set in your beliefs that you refuse to listen to any opposing viewpoints, instead you choose to accuse them of attacking.
This is YOUR creation, you are manifesting this, again you should really ask yourself why?

originally posted by: SourceTruth
a reply to: sapien82

Animals do not have souls. Not even most humans have souls.

Again you will need to provide evidence

because as far back as recorded history goes humans have souls according to our first spiritual practice called shamanism


and currently there is more evidence to the existence of souls than the non existence of souls , multiple accounts from multiple ages and cultures

originally posted by: SourceTruth
a reply to: Osirisvset

Why does everyone disagree with me? And why is everyone ganging up on me?

Dont take it personally , I just dont agree with your position

its nothing against you , I just ask everyone the same who makes a claim, give us something to chew on
and think about that backs up your claim.

We can all be friends here and still have different view points on life.

That's what is great about consciousness even though we disagree we can still find a common interest in the discussion of the subject

a reply to: Osirisvset

I am willing to argue against everyone, but it seems like there is just nobody that has even acknowledged anything I say as having some value.

Just because I do not agree with their statements and I argue with them over it does not mean I am refusing to listen to them. It only means that I am not convinced by them.

a reply to: sapien82

You may be like that, but there are some on this forum that have a different attitude.

a reply to: sapien82

I'm happy just being the captain of my own little row boat.
But, ya, if I want my apple tree, I probably should go out and plant the seed, work alongside nature to help it grow, and learn to be patient...

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: sapien82

I'm happy just being the captain of my own little row boat.
But, ya, if I want my apple tree, I probably should go out and plant the seed, work alongside nature to help it grow, and learn to be patient...

Sounds like a nice way to be

originally posted by: SourceTruth
a reply to: sapien82

You may be like that, but there are some on this forum that have a different attitude.

Hey mate dont let them get to you , if they are just offering their opinion or are just mocking you then they treat them with the contempt they deserve and just dont reply to them.
There are plenty of trolls , and people with ego's exercising intellectual superiority in many subjects.
humans are weird , we could maybe agree those types of people arent very aware of their consciousness. I like to think the buddha was right

All that we are is the result of what we have thought: it is founded on our thoughts, it is made up of our thoughts. If a man speaks or acts with an evil thought, pain follows him, as the wheel follows the foot of the ox that draws the carriage... If a man speaks or acts with a pure thought, happiness follows him, like a shadow that never leaves him.

Let them think those thoughts , so be it !

I think that everyone seeks understanding , through conversation, its a really hard thing to achieve when so many think with negative/evil/impure thoughts.
They are just like rocks in a river , and we should be the river and flow past them on our journey.

Sometimes easier said than done right!

Anyway let me see what evidence we have for the existence of the soul

a reply to: SourceTruth

this is a psychology abstract but its pretty interesting

eviden ce for the existence of a soul

Basically the psychologist is looking at a famous artist De Kooning , he was found to have Alzheimers and some other conditions and he was still able to paint , despite the alzheimers completely affecting the degredation of his brain
he argues that they should investigate patients like this because his social self is gone , but something remains which allows him to paint. He would argue its the soul that remains
Anyway De kooning passed away in 1997. Still very interesting though.

You can download the PDF as its just an abstract, id like to read the paper on it if I could get it.

On the other hand , shamans of the world would argue that the soul and spirit realm is completely objective to them , just not to us because we havent become open to it.

originally posted by: SourceTruth
It seems like we all assume that everyone has a soul.
But if we are to really understand what the matrix is about then we cannot assume that everyone has a soul.

The idea that everyone has a soul is not rooted in any rigorous reasoning. Because of this, it should not be accepted as fact that everyone has a soul.

Their soul is somewhere else most likely by the devil himself.

a reply to: makemap

Maybe, but then maybe not. But that's alot of judgement coming from someone who really doesnt know squat for sure.
Maybe I am just thinking soulless is something different. To me, it's not being "evil", it's more like being vacant.
A comatose patient who got tired of sticking around in a useless body. An autistic child who for some reason is having trouble integrating into this world. Someone who is energetically weak because they've lent their energy to another version of themselves to assist them in getting through a difficult time.
I used to have dreams, about a child behind barbed wire with vacant eyes. I actually would write stories about this girl and the world she existed in. It wasn't till a few years ago that I found out that the descriptions in the stories matched those of one of the German concentration camps. I spent quite a bit of time exploring this girl this way.
Was she me in a past life? By paying attention to her was I giving her the strength and determination to make it through the ordeal? Was I sharing knowledge, advice, a different perspective that helped her? I dont know, but I do believe the experience changed me for the better, gave me understanding that I wouldn't have had otherwise.
But, I spent plenty of time exploring my imaginary ot maybe it wasn't so imaginary world and was often times vacant from this reality.

Ya, I could be just a little nutty, but then again maybe not.

a reply to: sapien82

Yeah that is an interesting paper...

It does seem like many on this form have such an ego that they will dismiss anything that doesn't fit with their viewpoint.

a reply to: makemap

No, they are like a vacant body.

originally posted by: sapien82
On the other hand , shamans of the world would argue that the soul and spirit realm is completely objective to them , just not to us because we havent become open to it.

I would agree with that.

Many people say that you cant prove anything of a supernatural nature. But the thing is that once you access that realm than you would have seen it objectively and it would be "proven" to you. It can be proven by seeing it or yourself and that will prove it to the individual

a reply to: SourceTruth

Sounds like something an NPC would say, yet another fetch quest.

Dont worry brah, pretty sure NPCs have souls, probably an NPC soul, created by the neural network of NPCs united, likley from the branch of the matrix located in the data banks somewhere in andromeda galaxy. Or maybe created by the god of NPC's, Npcinitos the great, I like to dub such a god who creates NPCs.

But I really got to stop reading this, the more I read what you say. The more I am becoming convinced that there really are people out there without souls.

Yes, I am saying that you may have no soul. You should check your left coat pocket, maybe you misplaced it, or who knows what or were. Can you prove to me that you have a soul?

And no, I am not trying to make you look bad. Get off your high horse, the opinions of people do not matter, nor does the world revolve around you, or even me. You know what the world revolves around....The sun, duh.

But anyways, still waiting for this prof of a soul you so do like to go on about. So far what you said, has not convinced me at all that not only do you know what a soul is, but that even you may be one of these soulless dudes, and are somehow confused on the matter.

Lets just say that I am starting to believe you when you say that there are people out there without souls.

a reply to: galadofwarthethird

I will reword my initial claim.
I will say: Not every human being can be considered to have a consciousness.
I can replace my use of the word soul with a more proper word which is consciousness. That may help to clear misunderstandings of the use of the word soul and it's connotations.
You see how I reworded it but it still has the same meaning.

Would you now ask me to prove that such a thing as having consciousness exists?
It should be obvious to both of us that there exists something we call consciousness.
There should be an underlying understanding of what the words mean in their context.

a reply to: galadofwarthethird

For me to prove that a soul exists than we have to be clear about our definition of a soul. If we simply equate having a soul with having consciousness, than it should be obvious what consciousness is and how it exists. But if we don't agree on this definition than my own statement would better be worded without using the word soul and instead using the word consciousness.

a reply to: SourceTruth

So we go from souls to consciousness. What next from apples to bananas? It would be much more easier for you to prove that bananas exist, then either souls or consciousness exist. As you see a banana or an apple is not prone to as many opinions and translations.

But! Why not just admit that you have no clue what your talking about? T'would be more efficient.

So then there guy. What is a consciousnesses?

Yes, yes I know, I sometimes like to annoy people, but if you cant even answer that then even this is getting old.

a reply to: galadofwarthethird

But! Why not just admit that you have no clue what your talking about? T'would be more efficient.

Why not just admit that you don't agree with me? Because you are so assertive of this.

So we go from souls to consciousness. What next from apples to bananas? It would be much more easier for you to prove that bananas exist, then either souls or consciousness exist. As you see a banana or an apple is not prone to as many opinions and translations.

I went from souls to consciousness for a reason, but you do not want to acknowledge that I have a reason for doing so.

So then there guy. What is a consciousnesses? Yes, yes I know, I sometimes like to annoy people, but if you cant even answer that then even this is getting old.

The only thing that is getting old is people like you not acknowledging what I say.

I will explain to you what a consciousness is. I can't say that this is a perfect explanation, but it will help us to understand what consciousness is better.

Consciousness is an experience that is taking place somewhere. The somewhere that it is occurring is a point on a timeline.
There is information that makes up the experience of consciousness, but this is separated from consciousness itself. Consciousness is the receiver of the information that is an experience. Where does this information go to? It goes to a unique point in time for the information to exist as experience at that point in time.
The experience of consciousness exists at a point in time, but there is also a continuum of time with a collection of all the points of consciousness on a timeline. This forms a timeline. The different timelines are different consciousness experiences being experienced within time.

In a soulless person than you have all of the information for consciousness to receive existing, but you do not have the information being experienced at a point in time. There is no point in time where the information is existing as experience. So the information is there but it is not going to be received by any consciousness.

The way I have described this may not make sense to you if you don't understand the underlying concept I am trying to describe. It makes sense when you already have a grasp on what consciousness is.