What's the big deal with Israel?

originally posted by: stormson
a reply to: Vector99
So it seems you're stuck on the name we give the people that lived in the region before '48.

Why is Israel so special?

Israel isn't special. Jews were nearly eradicated during WW2 thanks to Germany. They couldn't assimilate back into Germany after the holocaust (gee, I wonder why) therefore they were given land, land they later proclaimed to be holy land. They took that land and made a civilization with. The local tribal Arabs (Palestinians) didn't like it and constantly fought the Jews, primarily for religious reasons. The land was undeveloped and only suitable for tribal population when the Jews were given the land, it wasn't recognized by any nation in the world.

a reply to: stormson

Part of the issue is that the Hebrew people had been told by God that they would be given the land as their eternal domain, their 'promised land'. The history of that land and those people is that it has been contended for since day 1.

I do believe that they have a historic ethnic claim to the land and even though there were other peoples in the land for thousands of years, the Jewish people had remained in the locale for thousands of years, too.

When the Balfour declaration was proposed, it wasn't that Jews weren't there, and some other people were. The truth of the situation is that everyone was migrating around and through the area and no-one claimed they were the indigenous people, except the Jews.

There's a Wikipedia pagewhich shows that the truth of the matter is that hardly anyone was there at all and so the British giving what was seen as mostly uninhabited land to the Jews, for a homeland, did not seem so onerous.

a reply to: IAMALLYETALLIAM

i wouldnt call it racist, more theologist, if i may coin a phrase.

its not so much the Jews and Israel, as what they represent, the Second Coming.

a reply to: stormson

I believe to claim that your race of people and only your race are God's chosen people is racial supremacy.

a reply to: Vector99

The 1948 Palestinian exodus, also known as the Nakba (Arabic: النكبة‎, al-Nakbah, literally "disaster", "catastrophe", or "cataclysm"),[1] occurred when more than 700,000 Palestinian Arabs — about half of prewar Palestine's Arab population — fled or were expelled from their homes, during the 1948 Palestine war.[

wiki, so take with a grain of salt.

seems like a lot of people that didn't move very far would hold a grudge.

a reply to: chr0naut

the jews ruled that land for less than a thousand years, were off it for 2 thousand years, an now its theirs agains, based on ancestral claim?

seriously, the native americans, who owned this land for several thousand years, and only been removed for a hundred plus, have more claim to ownership.

a reply to: IAMALLYETALLIAM
seems fair, i will grant you that.

a reply to: dashen
i think "resettlement" is the key word in your post.

the land was settled, and the newbies took more, kicking the already settled folk off and out of the lands they had for generations.

i do not dispute small enclaves of jews in israel. just as there are small enclaves of native americans, we call them reservations, does no entitle them to kick us out of our homes or take our lands just because of ancestral right.

a reply to: stormson

There was actually almost nobody living on the land. And all of the land in its entirety belonged to the Ottomans and a few Nobles. There was also landless fellaheen that were kind of just nomadic Wanderers.
On The Late eighteen hundreds when's the Jewish settlers started draining the swamps irrigating the deserts and buying up humongous tracts of land Arab started flooding in from Egypt and Jordan for the new opportunities.
Even the so-called hero of the Palestinians Yasser Arafat was born in Cairo. Everything you're saying is just entirely BS. I said the conversation was over but your overwhelming ignorance pulled me out of retirement. Okay time to bed

originally posted by: stormson
a reply to: IAMALLYETALLIAM

i wouldnt call it racist, more theologist, if i may coin a phrase.

its not so much the Jews and Israel, as what they represent, the Second Coming.

Only the Jewish people have no knowledge of a "Second Coming" .
That is purely a Christian ideology.
Please research BEFORE you post.

a reply to: stormson

Britain occupied the area known as Palestine from the end of WW1 up to the end of WW2.

The land was supposed to be divided between the Jews and local Arabs. The Arabs refused and fought the Jews, and lost.

There was no territory/country/homeland prior to that.

The supposed land of Palestine was land that was made up of tribal savage Arabs, boundaries were not set, and populations were low.

It's very similar to the birth of the USA. There weren't any specific lands and/or borders set by the Native Americans, yet the land was settled and taken over.

I'm not saying I agree with it, but that's the true history. there has never been a true claim to a Palestinian state, the same as there's never been a claim to a Native American state in the USA.

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Gothmog
Well, to cut down your entire thread
There was never a Palestinian land .
So , all stated is not historically accurate.
As far as Israel ceding land to the Palestinians ?
They were given the boot from the Muslim countries , including Egypt
The UN decided to give part of Israeli land to the Palestinians
Land that used to be held by the Philistines (Philistines are not Palestinian)

As an aside, the Philistines, it appears, were European.

Very interesting .
Thanks

originally posted by: stormson
a reply to: IAMALLYETALLIAM
Ah.
However, I hold to my idea as I know both evangelicals and Jews, and the evangelicals hold Israel in higher regard because it heralds the "second coming".

In my opinion the evangelical hold Israel in special or higher regard is due to the promise

Gen 12:3
I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you."

originally posted by: PhilbertDezineck

originally posted by: stormson
a reply to: IAMALLYETALLIAM
Ah.
However, I hold to my idea as I know both evangelicals and Jews, and the evangelicals hold Israel in higher regard because it heralds the "second coming".

In my opinion the evangelical hold Israel in special or higher regard is due to the promise

Gen 12:3
I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you."

Yes, and the US Politicians who hold dual citizenship influence foreign policy.

originally posted by: stormson
a reply to: chr0naut

the jews ruled that land for less than a thousand years, were off it for 2 thousand years, an now its theirs agains, based on ancestral claim?

seriously, the native americans, who owned this land for several thousand years, and only been removed for a hundred plus, have more claim to ownership.

More than a thousand years.
Why do you think they left ?
And , not all left for Egypt.
It is theirs again as chartered by the UN and the world .
Don't agree ?
Take it up with the UN and the UK

What does the history of Israel have to do with the history of Native Americans ?
The 2 have very different histories.

a reply to: new_here

Every politician regardless of dual citizenship has influence over foreign policy.

originally posted by: PhilbertDezineck
a reply to: new_here

Every politician regardless of dual citizenship has influence over foreign policy.

Yes of course. The point is that politicians who hold DUAL citizenship have DUAL allegiance. You see that, right?

a reply to: new_here

I see politicians as whores who will do anything to stay in power.

There are currently 89 politicians who have dual citizenship with Israel and they are all Democrats.

originally posted by: new_here

originally posted by: PhilbertDezineck
a reply to: new_here

Every politician regardless of dual citizenship has influence over foreign policy.

Yes of course. The point is that politicians who hold DUAL citizenship have DUAL allegiance. You see that, right?

What makes you say that ?
You state as a matter of fact , yet I see nothing but personal opinion .(or , YouTube videos)

Well it doesn't matter who has rights the to land. The people in the Middle East are all belligerent a holes. There will never be peace in the Middle East because people will not stop killing each other over stupid words coming out people's mouths.

I think the Middle East is a huge waste of money that would be better spent fixing infrastructure here where it counts.