Eternal damnation how bad can it be

I once had an argument with a born again Christian on the nature of God. I really got this guy upset and he started talking about eternal damnation and where my soul was going to go when I die. I said, "How bad can it be? It can't be worse than living in New Jersey." He did not crack a smile.

I had to work with this guy so I tried to smooth things over by talking about the metaphysics of Hell. I told him the suffering Hell cannot be repetitive because you would get use to it. I said the suffering in Hell had to be like an irrational number, that is, never ending and never repeating otherwise you would get used to it. With a glean in his eye and the smile on his face like an angry wolf about to devour fresh meat he said, "Yeah, that's it." He was actually very please with the idea I would suffer for all eternity in the worse possible way imaginable. At the time, I genuinely felt sorry for him for having so much hate for his fellow man.

I think a God of unconditional love would be a little more forgiving. I imagine God would use His omnipotent powers of forgiveness to forgive even Hitler. So for me, it doesn't matter who gets into Heaven to experience eternally Heavenly bliss. As long as everyone experiences Heavenly bliss it's all good. Life is too short and frustrating to take so much joy in other people's suffering. I think God loves each us with no conditions. It doesn't matter what happens in our lives. God forgives everything equally.

This is what makes God so great! God is capable of levels of love unimaginable by spiteful, hateful, revengeful human beings. I think my way of thinking is true because based on human experiments there is no amount of evil God will not tolerate in order to preserve our free-will. I don't think God is indifferent or doesn't care. I think God is just very quick to forgive and is always giving people second and third chances to be the best they can be.

I would suggest that god is the most spiteful, hateful and revengeful out of everyone. An absolute hypocrite. And I would tell him so

a reply to: dfnj2015
The only thing we really know, biblically, is that the choice is between "being in the presence of God" and "not being in the presence of God". In the New Testament, it is taken for granted that the first is preferable. That is probably as much as we can comprehend.

Eternal damnation doesn’t make sense. The punishment doesn’t fit the crime. A few years of sin could never be equal to an eternity in hell.

originally posted by: dfnj2015
I said the suffering in Hell had to be like an irrational number, that is, never ending and never repeating otherwise you would get used to it.

I can tell you first hand that there is suffering and pain to which one never adapts, having experienced it here and while a dozen physicians couldn't figure it out. I strongly disagree with the idea that one "get(s) used to" all suffering.

originally posted by: drussell41

originally posted by: dfnj2015
I said the suffering in Hell had to be like an irrational number, that is, never ending and never repeating otherwise you would get used to it.

I can tell you first hand that there is suffering and pain to which one never adapts, having experienced it here and while a dozen physicians couldn't figure it out. I strongly disagree with the idea that one "get(s) used to" all suffering.

But you haven’t spent 1000 years or 10,000 years with that suffering so that’s not a good example.

All I can say is that none of you are even close to understanding the reasoning for being in hell, or the "characteristics" of being in hell. You are trying to compare it to what you have experienced and with that, you will never comprehend it. Also, I don't think it is that God Chooses this person and not another, that is a mistake people make. I can't say that I fully understand what it is or how it would/will be, but others who don't think of it in a "childish" way, blaming "god" for putting them there, have a totally different understanding of it as well, and we have agreed that it is near impossible to explain, but blaming God for it isn't the answer or way to avoid it. Maybe God has no choice in if hell exists or not, only who ends up there, and how he chooses is not for us to say, or even understand.

People have tried their best to conceptualize it by writing books (dante's inferno) but those fall short of what it woudl be like. Until you have an "awakening" and really get the picture, you are going to be like a child trying to design a self replicating rocketship/biodome/space colony - while trying to understand/explain hell.

originally posted by: Secretrooster
Eternal damnation doesn’t make sense. The punishment doesn’t fit the crime. A few years of sin could never be equal to an eternity in hell.

Exactly! In the Law God gave to Moses, the punishment always fit the crime, death being the worst. Further punishment after death is never specified or even hinted at.

Hell is justice, in the minds of revenge-minded people. God's justice was to send His Own Son to suffer and die for our benefit. Such a God would send none to an eternal conscious torment in Hell. Anyway, Hell, both the word and the idea, come from pagan sources.

Think about it - you must be dead to go to Hell, but you must be alive to suffer in it...but you're dead, and on and on...

originally posted by: Secretrooster

originally posted by: drussell41

originally posted by: dfnj2015
I said the suffering in Hell had to be like an irrational number, that is, never ending and never repeating otherwise you would get used to it.

I can tell you first hand that there is suffering and pain to which one never adapts, having experienced it here and while a dozen physicians couldn't figure it out. I strongly disagree with the idea that one "get(s) used to" all suffering.

But you haven’t spent 1000 years or 10,000 years with that suffering so that’s not a good example.

It wouldn't matter whether it was 10 years or 10,000 years. There is some pain to which one never adjusts. Be glad you don't know.

Consider our human lives on Earth - some of us have good, pleasant, comfortable lives because of the choices we make, while others have negative, horrible lives because of our choices. For example, perhaps a person chooses to use drugs, knowing that people using the same drugs become addicts and end up living on the streets and getting diseases and suffering. Perhaps another person chooses to give in to feelings of hatred and fantasies of revenge, despite knowing that love and forgiveness are preferable. The point here is that to some extent, we choose our conditions - and I think that the afterlife functions in a similar way. I think "where" we go after we die here is somewhat up to us, in that we go wherever we want, or, more accurately, wherever is most spiritually appropriate for us to be. I don't think there's a single "heaven" or "hell", but rather that there are infinite variations of those and everything in between. Swedish theologian Emanuel Swedenborg wrote that everything in this earthly life has a spiritual equivalence. So, if you live a life of addiction, you might choose to go to a place in the afterlife where you can partake in whatever the spiritual equivalent of your previous addiction was. If you live a life of hatred, you go to a place in the afterlife where you are surrounded by the hatred you choose to dwell in. So, one might wonder, if we can go wherever we choose to go, why might someone choose to go to (a) hell? Well, that's the same as asking why someone might choose to feel hatred, or greed, or to use harmful drugs. Just because we might know we can go to the highest peaks of heaven doesn't mean we will choose to do so, in the same way that knowing we don't have to use drugs or live with hatred doesn't mean that we won't still choose to do those things.

tl:dr (based on everything I've come to understand);
1. There isn't a single "heaven" or "hell", there are infinite variations of afterlife conditions one could exist in.
2. You're not stuck in any one place for eternity, you're always free to ascend or descend spiritually according to what you're comfortable with.
3. Some of us choose negative states of existence in the afterlife just the same as we do here in this life.
4. Don't worry about where you'll go when you die, you'll be exactly where you want to be, whether that's a good or bad place.

originally posted by: trollz
Consider our human lives on Earth - some of us have good, pleasant, comfortable lives because of the choices we make, while others have negative, horrible lives because of our choices. For example, perhaps a person chooses to use drugs, knowing that people using the same drugs become addicts and end up living on the streets and getting diseases and suffering. Perhaps another person chooses to give in to feelings of hatred and fantasies of revenge, despite knowing that love and forgiveness are preferable. The point here is that to some extent, we choose our conditions - and I think that the afterlife functions in a similar way. I think "where" we go after we die here is somewhat up to us, in that we go wherever we want, or, more accurately, wherever is most spiritually appropriate for us to be. I don't think there's a single "heaven" or "hell", but rather that there are infinite variations of those and everything in between. Swedish theologian Emanuel Swedenborg wrote that everything in this earthly life has a spiritual equivalence. So, if you live a life of addiction, you might choose to go to a place in the afterlife where you can partake in whatever the spiritual equivalent of your previous addiction was. If you live a life of hatred, you go to a place in the afterlife where you are surrounded by the hatred you choose to dwell in. So, one might wonder, if we can go wherever we choose to go, why might someone choose to go to (a) hell? Well, that's the same as asking why someone might choose to feel hatred, or greed, or to use harmful drugs. Just because we might know we can go to the highest peaks of heaven doesn't mean we will choose to do so, in the same way that knowing we don't have to use drugs or live with hatred doesn't mean that we won't still choose to do those things.

tl:dr (based on everything I've come to understand);
1. There isn't a single "heaven" or "hell", there are infinite variations of afterlife conditions one could exist in.
2. You're not stuck in any one place for eternity, you're always free to ascend or descend spiritually according to what you're comfortable with.
3. Some of us choose negative states of existence in the afterlife just the same as we do here in this life.
4. Don't worry about where you'll go when you die, you'll be exactly where you want to be, whether that's a good or bad place.

You are assuming that your puny will overrides God's sovereign Will. I believe God is both willing and able to save us from death, suffering and our own sinful nature.

originally posted by: Briles1207
And I would tell him so

If God exists, he can hear you, right? Go ahead, tell him. What's stopping you?

originally posted by: Lazarus Short
You are assuming that your puny will overrides God's sovereign Will. I believe God is both willing and able to save us from death, suffering and our own sinful nature.

Are you saying that there is no suffering whatsoever in the afterlife, despite our spiritual condition upon death? If not, what do you mean?

a reply to: DigginFoTroof

I'm glad to hear another person from New Jersey chiming into the conversation.

a reply to: dfnj2015

It’s called eternal destruction in the bible
Meaning eternally destroyed, away from God
Probably means just complete and utter nothing, like before you were born

I have never read eternal punishment for humans, outside of Jesus humanity is not eternal
How could I be happy in heaven knowing people are suffering eternal pain in hell, makes no sense a loving God would or could do that

Catholic doctrine based on Greek religion

Think you got it wrong

As for everyone in heaven, unless you request a desire to spend eternity with Jesus, He can’t force it, choice

a reply to: Lazarus Short

No longer having anxiety over dying is at least a sliver of heaven.

originally posted by: Raggedyman
As for everyone in heaven, unless you request a desire to spend eternity with Jesus, He can’t force it, choice

If I am going to spend eternity in the arms of my creator I would prefer She be a woman.

a reply to: trollz

Yeah but he doesn't, so I cant

a reply to: dfnj2015

Not how it works. Yes God would even forgive Hitler, but he has to all for forgiveness and accept Jesus to do so. Once you accept Christs perfection in place of your own sin, out should fundamentally change you as a person putting you on a path of turning from sin.

Jaden

originally posted by: dfnj2015

originally posted by: Raggedyman
As for everyone in heaven, unless you request a desire to spend eternity with Jesus, He can’t force it, choice

If I am going to spend eternity in the arms of my creator I would prefer She be a woman.

Yeah, me too
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