Does Middle East Peace Require a Two-State Solution or a Palestinian Defeat?

I have long been an advocate for the defeat of Hamas leading to a long term peace in the region. Many on ATS don't seem willing to even consider the benefits of a total and final defeat of Hamas and an integration of the remaining Palestinian territories and peoples into Israel. We need to at least have a debate about the potential for peace through a Israeli victory.

"To resolve the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, Israel must first achieve defeat of the Palestinian movement." That was the topic of a debated hosted by the Soho Forum on March 18, 2019.

It was an Oxford-style debate, in which the audience votes on the resolution at the beginning and end of the event, and the side that gains the most ground is victorious.

It is a very interesting debate and one I believe will eventually pave the way to peace.

For the affirmative, Elan Journo, a fellow and director of policy research at the Ayn Rand Institute, argued that the Palestinian movement is irreedemably corrupt and must be defeated as a necessary condition to achieve peace. The P.L.O. and Hamas have a long history of inciting terrorism and suicide attacks, and they aremore concerned with destroying Israel than with winning justice and prosperity for the Palestinian people, he argued. The defeat of the movement will require a coalition of governments to wage a sustained campaign of economic, diplomatic, and military efforts.

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Even the Palestinian people are sick of Hamas. I think it is time to free the Palestinian people from these terrorist thugs.

ATS Link

I think there is a good chance that even if it were nuked into glass...the entierity of the region...people would move back from abroad just to fight each other.

Has there ever been peace in the middle east?

originally posted by: Bluntone22
Has there ever been peace in the middle east?

Yeah, that is a good question. When has there ever been any kind of stability in the region?

originally posted by: Bluntone22
Has there ever been peace in the middle east?

Yeah, that is a good question. When has there ever been any kind of stability in the region?

Hamas abuses them and so does Israeli soldiers. Shooting unarmed protesters all the time. Taking people homes ect..

Will Israeli make amends after defeating hamas? Or will Israeli kill and abuse Palestinians on their quest to eradicate hamas? Then, when it's over will Palestinians become equal citizens or will the rampant racism in israel throw them aside as trash?

Israeli hasn't showed that they care about Palestinians one bit.

a reply to: Edumakated

not sure exactly when it was most peacefull but here is its entire history in a 12 minute youtube video www.youtube.com... but if i had to guess during the lulls between the crusades in ye old times?

currently as the board sits its not looking good for the Palestinians,Egypt is in an alliance with Saudi and Israeli government . syria is in shambles,uae and jorden are some what friendly to the idf now and no major power but iran still kind of stands with the Palestinians

a reply to: Metallicus

If the Palestinian people have their own land/country, they should be left alone to live life as they choose.

Israel should be left alone to do the same.

It's simple logic.

It requires a 50 megaton warhead.

a reply to: MetallicusNeither going to do it for peace................................... The answer lies in something supernatural call it the Messiah or Second Coming if you will that is the deal maker

The Two-state solution is the only one that will work in the long-run. Just difficult getting the hate-filled cretins who don't want peace around a table.

a reply to: Metallicus

I'm no expert in the Middle East and of Israel, but from what little I do know is that a 2-state solution is a bad idea.

2 shekels.

originally posted by: Bluntone22
Has there ever been peace in the middle east?

No.

The only way there will ever be peace in a middle east is nirbu strikes it.

The 'nation' of Islam will never allow peace.

a reply to: carewemust

If the Palestinian people have their own land/country, they should be left alone to live life as they choose.

Palestine has never been it's own country.

Before the Ottoman empire fall that lasted over 600 years. They always been someone else's snip.

a reply to: Metallicus

I think it is time to free the Palestinian people from these terrorist thugs.

Let them free themselves.

If one thing is certain, there is no Islamic nation in the Middle East that wants freedom. Most definitely not American freedom. They don't think like Westerners. They don't prioritize personal freedom. They don't believe in the concept of God-given rights. Everything is submission to the will of Allah.

Whatever they fight for, freedom won't be it. Ever. For this reason, alone we should support Israel, the only nation in that whole region with people who understand the concept of citizenship and individual rights.

a reply to: Metallicus

integration of the remaining Palestinian territories and peoples into Israel.

Including right of return for all Palestinian refugees and their descendants and stop calling Israel a Jewish State. Yaaa equal rights for all ethnicities, religions, genders, etc.

Sounds okay to me; but that's my American idealism speaking.

The reality is that the U.S. doesn't give a rap about ideals. They'll back Israel all the way while Israel continues to take territory and force Palestinians out. All in the name of something other than human rights and freedoms.

The U.S. is the current big bully brother to Israel atrocity. U.S. trumps justice and the 137 of the 193 United Nations (UN) member states that recognize Palestine State as of 3 August 2018.

It requires all parties involved to want peace. I'm not sure those in charge in the Middle East want peace with Israel.

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: Metallicus

If the Palestinian people have their own land/country, they should be left alone to live life as they choose.

Israel should be left alone to do the same.

It's simple logic.

Ahem. They had a home once but the PLO and arafatt tried to overthrow it. The whole thing is a KGB and PLO op cooked up to screw with the US and allies in the cold war.

originally posted by: RickyD
I think there is a good chance that even if it were nuked into glass...the entierity of the region...people would move back from abroad just to fight each other.

They'd section off the parking lot along the borders of the nations. Or if no one showed up to claim Syria and Lebanon, Israel would rope that off too and call it Greater Israel based on the territory that tribes held in a chapter of a religious book chronicling events in the favor of the original audience 2,500 years ago. Then they'd build the third temple, Jesus returns in time to fight the Antichrist, a really cool arch nemesis villain bent on enslaving and destroying the world.

Both are high level avatars or characters in the MMORPG called Earth being played by God or YHWH and Satan, an angel character he created that rebelled and is attempting a takeover of Earth with its population of intelligent self aware primate beings that YHWH created to look like him.

He's doing it through making people want to do bad things to each other. He can't log in as Antichrist until XX/XX/2XXX because it's coded into the game by YHWH. YHWH also created reality and time. He's lead and only developer. He programmed the entire game as well as designed the graphics and gameplay. The game servers are ran by YHWH inc.

After the armageddon event, everyone who played on YHWH's team get to be in paradise forever and Satan's team get banned and have their characters deleted with no back ups. Characters with a high Buddhism skill, which you can't train with Satanism, avoid permadeath and can roll new characters but they start at level 1.

originally posted by: paraphi
The Two-state solution is the only one that will work in the long-run. Just difficult getting the hate-filled cretins who don't want peace around a table.