The Fear of God and so can you.

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: narrator

Child bettered by fearing a parent -Holding back affection to demonstrate a point This sounds like terrible parenting. Children should see their parents as a source of comfort, security, and knowledge, not fear.

Children that behave often do it because of fear of repercussions from loving parents. Otherwise you have footballs being thrown in areas where things can break or children doing dangerous things that may harm them or others. A healthy fear of parents is essential in bringing up well behaved children.

1955 called: they want their 'Father Know's Best'; children-should-be-seen-and-not-heard; that deserves a paddlin'; .."...well behaved children..."... , BS back.

IMHO: ..."...well behaved children..."... is a self-serving parenting interest, and the tactics used to achieve such (fear), have nothing to do with child development.

Whatever one's concept of god or fear: when it's used in a self-serving way, can't imagine how that is enlightened in any way, shape, or form.

Unenlightened self-interest. Was BS in 1955, and still is.

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: KansasGirl

No, no! Don't judge God by how the church presents him OR by the way the church acts! Today's church is broken, largely. And the Catholic Church, while I'm positive there are millions of good individual Christians within it, went off the cliff from the beginning. I've found that God is pretty unlike what the church/loud judgy "Christians" portray. 😕

Tsk tsk.. sounds like a loud judgemental Christian to me.🤷🏻‍♀️

I'm only judging the judgy ones! That makes it ok. 😂

originally posted by: Nothin

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: narrator

Child bettered by fearing a parent -Holding back affection to demonstrate a point This sounds like terrible parenting. Children should see their parents as a source of comfort, security, and knowledge, not fear.

Children that behave often do it because of fear of repercussions from loving parents. Otherwise you have footballs being thrown in areas where things can break or children doing dangerous things that may harm them or others. A healthy fear of parents is essential in bringing up well behaved children.

1955 called: they want their 'Father Know's Best'; children-should-be-seen-and-not-heard; that deserves a paddlin'; .."...well behaved children..."... , BS back.

IMHO: ..."...well behaved children..."... is a self-serving parenting interest, and the tactics used to achieve such (fear), have nothing to do with child development.

Whatever one's concept of god or fear: when it's used in a self-serving way, can't imagine how that is enlightened in any way, shape, or form.

Unenlightened self-interest. Was BS in 1955, and still is.

Are you a parent by any chance ?

I am, and one thing that my son complained about as he got older was that he was not disciplined and punished enough as he was growing up. He felt it would have been better if he was.

I was the parent who thought he was learning his lessons through loving conversation. He told me he wasn’t and he feels he could have turned into a better man had he been dealt with in a much tougher way.

So how do you deal with your children ? Do they throw footballs around in the living room where there are fancy ornamental things ? Just curious. If you take the football away that is disciplining them with fear of losing their toy.

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: KansasGirl

No, no! Don't judge God by how the church presents him OR by the way the church acts! Today's church is broken, largely. And the Catholic Church, while I'm positive there are millions of good individual Christians within it, went off the cliff from the beginning. I've found that God is pretty unlike what the church/loud judgy "Christians" portray. 😕

Tsk tsk.. sounds like a loud judgemental Christian to me.🤷🏻‍♀️

I'm only judging the judgy ones! That makes it ok. 😂

😆... hmmm .. who judges on who’s the judgy ones ?😏😉

originally posted by: Nothin

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: narrator

Child bettered by fearing a parent -Holding back affection to demonstrate a point This sounds like terrible parenting. Children should see their parents as a source of comfort, security, and knowledge, not fear.

Children that behave often do it because of fear of repercussions from loving parents. Otherwise you have footballs being thrown in areas where things can break or children doing dangerous things that may harm them or others. A healthy fear of parents is essential in bringing up well behaved children.

1955 called: they want their 'Father Know's Best'; children-should-be-seen-and-not-heard; that deserves a paddlin'; .."...well behaved children..."... , BS back.

IMHO: ..."...well behaved children..."... is a self-serving parenting interest, and the tactics used to achieve such (fear), have nothing to do with child development.

Well-behaved children is absolutely not a "self-serving parenting interest." It is an I-want-my-child-to-be-a-functioning-member-of-society interest.

Your little statement is one of the most ignorant I've read on this site.

Have you ever been on an airplane, and there is a three or four year-old child in the seat behind yours, and they kept kicking the back of your seat? Over, and over, and over, and over again. Thump. Thump thump thump. Thump. Thump thump. Thump thump thump thumpthumpthumpthump! Thump thump thump thump thump thump......

And the parents say nothing to that child? Would you want that? Would you want those parents to let that kid continue to kick the ship out of your paid-for seat? Oh, you would want them to say something to the child, you say? You would want those parents to make that child stop, would you?

Even if the child didn't undetstand WHY he or she should stop and so therefore, won't want to stop? See, at that age they can't comprehemd the concept very well that when they kick that seat, that it's annoying and possibly even injuring that stranger in front of them. So they aren't going to want to stop, even if mommy and daddy ask them so sweetly AND explain why. Guess what? That kid ain't gonna care.

So...why do you want those parents to get their kid to stop?

What if the kid only stops when the parents sound mean? Then let him keep kicking your seat, right?

Do you have any children?

originally posted by: Sheye

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: KansasGirl

No, no! Don't judge God by how the church presents him OR by the way the church acts! Today's church is broken, largely. And the Catholic Church, while I'm positive there are millions of good individual Christians within it, went off the cliff from the beginning. I've found that God is pretty unlike what the church/loud judgy "Christians" portray. 😕

Tsk tsk.. sounds like a loud judgemental Christian to me.🤷🏻‍♀️

I'm only judging the judgy ones! That makes it ok. 😂

😆... hmmm .. who judges on who’s the judgy ones ?😏😉

You, apparently. Or at least, you judge who you think is being judging of the judgy.

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: Sheye

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: KansasGirl

No, no! Don't judge God by how the church presents him OR by the way the church acts! Today's church is broken, largely. And the Catholic Church, while I'm positive there are millions of good individual Christians within it, went off the cliff from the beginning. I've found that God is pretty unlike what the church/loud judgy "Christians" portray. 😕

Tsk tsk.. sounds like a loud judgemental Christian to me.🤷🏻‍♀️

I'm only judging the judgy ones! That makes it ok. 😂

😆... hmmm .. who judges on who’s the judgy ones ?😏😉

You, apparently. Or at least, you judge who you think is being judging of the judgy.

Now that’s a very judgemental thing to say.. tsk tsk 😏

But yes, I can be judgemental on occasion and anyone who says they aren’t ( on occasion) is not only judgemental but a liar as well. So lets just leave out judgemental attitudes out of this and continue on with the thread topic.

How do you feel about disciplinary action towards misbehaving children ?

Never mind , just read your previous post and you think as I do.

originally posted by: Sheye

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: Sheye

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: KansasGirl

No, no! Don't judge God by how the church presents him OR by the way the church acts! Today's church is broken, largely. And the Catholic Church, while I'm positive there are millions of good individual Christians within it, went off the cliff from the beginning. I've found that God is pretty unlike what the church/loud judgy "Christians" portray. 😕

Tsk tsk.. sounds like a loud judgemental Christian to me.🤷🏻‍♀️

I'm only judging the judgy ones! That makes it ok. 😂

😆... hmmm .. who judges on who’s the judgy ones ?😏😉

You, apparently. Or at least, you judge who you think is being judging of the judgy.

Now that’s a very judgemental thing to say.. tsk tsk 😏
So lets just leave out judgemental attitudes out of this and continue on with the thread topic.

I hesitate to point it out, but you are the one who made an issue of me judging the judgy Christians. So, we wouldn't even be having this dialogue had you not brought up my judgemental attitude.

So yes, let's leave judgemental attitudes out of it. Let's agree to judge each other equally judgementaly.

a reply to: KansasGirl

😏 Thanks for the chuckle.. I needed that. Trying to get to sleep but my judgemental attitude won’t let me. 😉 I may have a drink to calm my nerves , but I’ve already been judged a lousy Christian by many so maybe that’s not a good idea.😆

Take care Kansasgirl.. all in good fun. May the love that died on the cross for us always be close to your heart.

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: KansasGirl

😏 Thanks for the chuckle.. I needed that. Trying to get to sleep but my judgemental attitude won’t let me. 😉 I may have a drink to calm my nerves , but I’ve already been judged a lousy Christian by many so maybe that’s not a good idea.😆

Take care Kansasgirl.. all in good fun. May the love that died on the cross for us always be close to your heart.

Oh! That's one thing I WONT judge you for- having a drink! Or twenty! Big giant drunky (now sober) alcoholic here, so you just said the magic words to make me stop judging you for judging me for judging everyone but myself! 😂😂

I pray you will sleep easy and well tonight, with or without a drink, dear sister. 💞💞💞💞💞

a reply to: cooperton


I'm afraid that I can't properly enjoy a song without also reading the lyrics.

Just A Matter Of Time
John Cafferty & The Beaver Brown Band

There was a time
You had no need for rhythm
or rhyme
And the world seemed so wild
and so free
You just wrapped yourself up
in a dream
all you had to do was believe
and nothin' was out of your reach
so sure how it all falls in line
it's just a matter of time
it's just a matter of time

Then you wake up one day
all your dreams somehow
faded away
the road that you followed
It turned
You can't find where the
fire once burned
can't look yourself straight
in the eyes
in your heart of hearts'
you've compromised
baby one day we'll all cross
that line
it's just a matter of time
it's just a matter of time

All alone in the still of the night
you come face to face with
your pride
and how much you wanted
it all
you can't believe now you're
taking the fall

Then you reach out one day
to the light of a new
dawning day
and you take just one small
grain of sand
right into the palm of your hand
and maybe you find in the end
you're able to dream'.
Once again
and baby you fall back in line
it's just a matter of time
it's just a matter of time

====================

I was a trumpet and so was she,
but we never played together.

She was second chair,
trying for first.
I was a 3rd who never tried higher.

never watched her play,
never heard her music.

never joined a band
after expulsion from
my last.

We never played together,
and I fear,
no, I am certain,
that we never will.

So the gods will depart from mankind – a grievous thing! – and only evil angels will remain, who will mingle with men, and drive the poor wretches by main force into all manner of reckless crime, into wars, and robberies, and frauds, and all things hostile to the nature of the soul…Darkness will be preferred to light, and death will be thought more profitable than life…the pious will be deemed insane, and the impious wise, the madman will be thought a brave man, and the wicked will be esteemed as good" --Hermes Trismegistus, AD 150-270

originally posted by: SeaWorthy

originally posted by: narrator

originally posted by: SeaWorthy

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: cooperton

Gods aren’t real. People’s imaginations are though. I think your rant goes a long way to back that up.

tHERE IS A LOT AT STAKE SO i HOPE YOU HAVE HEAVILY RESEARCHED YOUR POSITION.
dO YOU EVER WONDER WHY SO MANY INTELLIGENT PEOPLE OVER (SORRY) the centuries have felt the opposite of you?

There's a lot at stake? Is there proof of that claim? I haven't seen any.

I can't speak for Woodcarver, but I have heavily researched my position. I've read the bible in it's entirety. I grew up in the Catholic faith. Catholic school, catechism every Sunday, followed by church (where I was an alter boy), etc etc etc. Everything I learned throughout that showed me that I have zero desire to follow a god that acts as described in the bible/by the church.

I can easily flip your statement: There are many very intelligent people that aren't religious in any way, shape, or form. Do you ever wonder why?

The Catholic church has little to do with what is in the bible. Your eternal life is at stake and no one can prove that to anyone else. The majority of the world does believe in creation and science is leading to that conclusion.

Less and less people will believe in the last days as is happening.
The old testament had its purpose which was fulfilled and no longer needed, the new testament tells us again how much our creator loves us. Fear is not the kind you speak of, my children who turned out wonderfully did fear disobeying me and that is a good thing. They also knew they were loved as all who have faith in Jesus feel strongly.

If you've read my post, you'll notice that I've read the bible, in it's entirety.

I'm not basing my conclusions on my experiences on the Catholic church, I just mentioned those to demonstrate that I'm not some random atheist, I'm very well versed on Christianity/the bible/etc. In the bible, god sounds like a terrible person, unless you commit to loving him unconditionally forever. That seems a bit sociopathic to me.

Not to mention the countless contradictions and scientific impossibilities written within.

My eternal life is at stake? Again, show me some shred of scientific evidence to back that up. If you want to believe that, that is perfectly fine. But that has zero scientific basis.

The majority of the world believes in Creationism? As in, the exact same creation that you believe in? Care to cite that? I've never heard that. Only 33% of the world is Christian, and that's definitely not the majority.

Even if the majority of the world does believe in it, that doesn't sway me in any way. The majority of the world once believed that the earth was flat, and was also the center of the universe. They were wrong on both counts. Just because a ton of people believe something doesn't make it true.

Science is leading to the conclusion that creationism is real? Again, cite that please. From everything I've read, it's the exact opposite.

To reiterate, I'm in no way trying to deny your right to believe in your religion/god of choice. Go nuts. But, you can't bring logic and science into a decidedly illogical/unscientific topic. It just doesn't fly.

originally posted by: KansasGirl
a reply to: narrator

No, no! Don't judge God by how the church presents him OR by the way the church acts! Today's church is broken, largely. And the Catholic Church, while I'm positive there are millions of good individual Christians within it, went off the cliff from the beginning.

I've found that God is pretty unlike what the church/loud judgy "Christians" portray. 😕

Well, as I said in my other post, I've read the bible in it's entirety. The god in there sounds like a pretty terrible person in my opinion. I only pointed out my upbringing to show that I'm not a random atheist, I have a very deep background in religious teachings.

So, we're to believe that god:
-Creates everything, including humans.
-Says he loves us
-Also creates all sorts of things that will kill us in terrible ways (disease, etc)
-Doesn't tell us how to solve those problems, even though he knows how because he's omnipotent.
-Tells us we have to love him or we go to hell, even though he's given us zero proof he actually exists.
-Created us in his image, but condemns people to hell for acting the way they were created.
-Gave us free will, but if we use it to decide to follow another religion (or none) then condemns us to hell.
-Told a guy to kill his son (Abraham and Isaac) as a sacrifice to prove his devotion. When he gets everything set up to do just that, god sends a messenger to tell him not to kill him after all. The first written instance of the "gotcha!" moment. God over family is the message in that story. The opposite of how it should be.

God seems eerily similar to how parents (specifically fathers) were looked at during the time the bible was written. Fear me, do whatever I say without question, I am the highest authority, etc. Almost like the authors patterned him after themselves (or their own fathers).

Bottom line, to me, the Christian god seems sociopathic. I have no desire to believe in and worship someone who has supposedly done so many outright terrible things. Even if it were scientifically proven that the Christian god exists, I would not worship him.

You're more than welcome to, and if that makes you a better person, then more power to you. I have no personal need for the Christian god.

originally posted by: Sheye

originally posted by: Nothin

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: narrator

Child bettered by fearing a parent -Holding back affection to demonstrate a point This sounds like terrible parenting. Children should see their parents as a source of comfort, security, and knowledge, not fear.

Children that behave often do it because of fear of repercussions from loving parents. Otherwise you have footballs being thrown in areas where things can break or children doing dangerous things that may harm them or others. A healthy fear of parents is essential in bringing up well behaved children.

1955 called: they want their 'Father Know's Best'; children-should-be-seen-and-not-heard; that deserves a paddlin'; .."...well behaved children..."... , BS back.

IMHO: ..."...well behaved children..."... is a self-serving parenting interest, and the tactics used to achieve such (fear), have nothing to do with child development.

Whatever one's concept of god or fear: when it's used in a self-serving way, can't imagine how that is enlightened in any way, shape, or form.

Unenlightened self-interest. Was BS in 1955, and still is.

Are you a parent by any chance ?

I am, and one thing that my son complained about as he got older was that he was not disciplined and punished enough as he was growing up. He felt it would have been better if he was.

I was the parent who thought he was learning his lessons through loving conversation. He told me he wasn’t and he feels he could have turned into a better man had he been dealt with in a much tougher way.

So how do you deal with your children ? Do they throw footballs around in the living room where there are fancy ornamental things ? Just curious. If you take the football away that is disciplining them with fear of losing their toy.

Perhaps some chance was involved, but mostly did it intentionally...

Sorry that your son thought it could have been better. Must have been hard to digest.
Thanks for sharing, and it helps us to understand the views you have expressed herein.

But just because one person thinks, that maybe he would be ..."...a better man..."..., if he had been raised in a slightly more strict manner, doesn't mean that that is a universal application for all children.
It remains one persons opinion for now, with surely more elsewhere.
You did your best, and who could ask for more?

Have you never heard of the many children raised strictly, that wish that they were raised in a softer way?
Why even suggest that there is only one way to raise a child?
Instilling fear in a dependent child, is a control mechanism, and reflects the opinion of the parent, rather than the need of the child, no?


Wasn't raised in a museum, and didn't create one in our family space neither. No established religions.
Just loving, caring, and Nerf footballs, Nerf basketballs, and mini-hockey sticks for the indoors shenanigans.

My parents never withheld anything from me, and thus never needed to contemplate taking anything away anyone else.

This cup runneth over, and realizing that: brings sadness seeing those poor little ones being subjected to the dogma that appeases the parent, rather that what meets the need.

So yeah: instilling fear into a vulnerable child, to get them to do what the parent wants: is unenlightened, self-serving, egotistical BS.
Gonna stick with that one, for now.
Please don't take it harshly, because it is clear that you are a good person, just trying their best.

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: Nothin

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: narrator

Child bettered by fearing a parent -Holding back affection to demonstrate a point This sounds like terrible parenting. Children should see their parents as a source of comfort, security, and knowledge, not fear.

Children that behave often do it because of fear of repercussions from loving parents. Otherwise you have footballs being thrown in areas where things can break or children doing dangerous things that may harm them or others. A healthy fear of parents is essential in bringing up well behaved children.

1955 called: they want their 'Father Know's Best'; children-should-be-seen-and-not-heard; that deserves a paddlin'; .."...well behaved children..."... , BS back.

IMHO: ..."...well behaved children..."... is a self-serving parenting interest, and the tactics used to achieve such (fear), have nothing to do with child development.

..."...Your little statement is one of the most ignorant I've read on this site..."...

Sorry that you see it that way.
Perhaps you'll understand, that am not interested in responding to your questions.

a reply to: narrator

If you've read my post, you'll notice that I've read the bible, in it's entirety.

Reading through the bible you don't learn much, ancient texts can be confusing.

originally posted by: SeaWorthy
a reply to: narrator

If you've read my post, you'll notice that I've read the bible, in it's entirety.

Reading through the bible you don't learn much, ancient texts can be confusing.

Then how would you suggest I learn?

I've been told in this thread that my Catholic upbringing shouldn't affect my thoughts on religion, and now I'm being told that the bible shouldn't hold weight either.

What else is there? Just blindly believe in it?

originally posted by: narrator
In my opinion, debating whether or not god exists is pointless.

Why are you here then? I would go through and answer all the questions you raised but you're only asking them to try to trap people, you don't actually care to learn other perspective. So again, why are you even here?

originally posted by: narrator

originally posted by: SeaWorthy
a reply to: narrator

If you've read my post, you'll notice that I've read the bible, in it's entirety.

Reading through the bible you don't learn much, ancient texts can be confusing.

Then how would you suggest I learn?

I've been told in this thread that my Catholic upbringing shouldn't affect my thoughts on religion, and now I'm being told that the bible shouldn't hold weight either.

What else is there? Just blindly believe in it?

I hope you are not being serious. I am to old for games I don't get. Did you not understand what was said or just joking?
My statement is that it takes a lot more than reading through the bible once. Ask and you shall receive, if you want to know ask God in Jesus name and he will help you in .
I cannot count the times I have read through the bible, yet every time I learn more.