Instead of wall, why not make it a crime to hire, harbor and support illegal immigrants?

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: TheRedneck
They're not going to stop coming just because we passed a law last week that said they couldn't get hired.

Nope, just like people arent going to stop murdering becasue it's illegal.

It's our personal dirty little secret, illegals are tolerated because they do many jobs no one wants for the wages offered. There is no one solution, the issue invovles many aspects of our society and economy and each one of them needs to be addressed in turn if you really want to seriously curtail the paradigm.

Correct but with illegals we lower the murder rate to by demagnetizing the jobs.

originally posted by: olaru12
Think about it....

Who has the power to influence the way laws are enforced in America? Apparently the voters don't as the corporations with their money, lobbiest, and lapdog politicians have much more influence on government.

Bottom line is profit, and cheap labor is a means to that end.

deal with it....

It's not a democratic republic, it's a Corpratrcracy. Even with a stupid wall the illegal workers will always be with us; in the meat packing industry, construction, hotel maids, fruit pickers, landscapers, dish washers, etc, and other menial low wage, dead end, jobs.

While we do vote and have some democratic processes,The USA was NEVER a democratic Republic. We have always been a "Constitutional Republic". Constitutional instead of Democratic to prevent 50.1% of the people from dictating to 49.1 % of the people.

A Constitutional Republic gives individual ideas put forth from anyone a chance to grow. People can panicked into things in a Democracy. Some things are always controversial like "we think the science is SETTLED" and needs much more study than a handful of liars can give us.

Every issue of the day cannot be solved easily and to try to solve thing fast often causes mistakes greater than the problem being 'fixed' for us was initially. We need a "Republic" to have a greater influence over our own defense and we can't depend on NY or LA to know what is right when they have voted in leaders who are revealing their utter stupidity and narcissistic hubris.

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: bob77
that is the price for being world policeman...

Interpol are the world policemen.

The US is just a terrorist group.

Only the terrorist allowed to fight for freedom in your Dimension chrOnaut?
Tell the Yazidi sex slave girls in the Middle East and the sex slave girls in Africa that the Jihadi's owned that we liberate my good man that the US is the one that raped and murdered their families. I suspect you don't know the definition of terrorist?

originally posted by: Justoneman
My suggestion is ENFORCE the existing laws, problem solved by demagnetizing the job to allow under the table pay. If they think they will easily get away with it, the cheaters will cheat.

You're never going to have the manpower to completely eliminate the day laborer aspect, it's not possible.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus
if offered a $1000- 10,000 for information about anyone hiring day laborers..with crime tip hotline..might raise a fortune if someone really wanted to make some cash and do their part reporting violators...

Especially if homeowners who hire them are facing asset forfeiture and one might can get a good deal on a used set of wheels and a house to flip with all the cash they make on turning in illegal labor supporters.

Think in many cases, would see people report offenders for no reward...Million or so sign up to be on the task force, is my guess...no pay.

originally posted by: dojozen
a reply to: AugustusMasonicus
if offered a $1000- 10,000 for information about anyone hiring day laborers..with crime tip hotline..might raise a fortune if someone really wanted to make some cash and do their part reporting violators...

Especially if homeowners who hire them are facing asset forfeiture and one might can get a good deal on a used set of wheels and a house to flip with all the cash they make on turning in illegal labor supporters.

Think in many cases, would see people report offenders for no reward...Million or so sign up to be on the task force, is my guess...no pay.

Where's the reward money going to come from? More taxes...gofundme pages,

Crops are rotting in the field now because farmers can't get enough labor to harvest.

fortune.com...

pragmatist...my ass

a reply to: olaru12

comes from the funds generated from fines, asset forfeiture auctions ...the fine just needs to be greater than the reward and then some.

Work visas for migrant farm workers should be allowed, in those situations, though robotic pickers are here now, just like the cotton gin, not going to need pickers much longer anyways..

understand your point and really like to see more agriculture jobs south of the border and US and other countries import them and pay same price and cost of production should be lower or same.

originally posted by: Justoneman

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: bob77
that is the price for being world policeman...

Interpol are the world policemen.

The US is just a terrorist group.

Only the terrorist allowed to fight for freedom in your Dimension chrOnaut?

Terrorists don't fight for freedom, but they all justify themselves by saying that they do.

They generally oppress.

They all use terror tactics to impose their will upon a resistant populace. The usual terror tactics are threats and use of extreme violence.

Take a look at the US forces throughout the world. Automatic rifles, drones, bombs and armor in the hands of foreigners. That doesn't say peace, that says terror.

Also, America has the highest rate and numbers of incarceration of its own citizens of any country in the world. It was one of the last countries in the world to ban slavery. The opposite to freedom is incarceration and slavery. Look up the definitions if you don't believe me. I doubt that the average American would know what freedom was like if they tripped over it. Double ditto for their militant.

Tell the Yazidi sex slave girls in the Middle East and the sex slave girls in Africa that the Jihadi's owned that we liberate

Really, and do you have any actual numbers for that. Every instance I have heard has a similar complaint, "We had been abandoned by everyone. There is no support from the international community or the government. Even though we repeatedly ask, nobody helps us". They usually escape (or are discarded by their captors) by themselves and end up in refugee camps.

my good man that the US is the one that raped and murdered their families. I suspect you don't know the definition of terrorist?

The US forces have also raped, abused and killed.



United States war crimes From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

originally posted by: dojozen

if offered a $1000- 10,000 for information about anyone hiring day laborers..

The country would be even more broke than it is now and there still wouldnt be enough people to process the calls.

a reply to: dojozen

Not about putting any Hispanics or anyone out of work who are in the USA legally and have right to work.

It's not about what you want to happen... it's about what your policies would cause to happen.

Some time back, the US decided to levy a luxury tax on things like yachts. It sounded like a good idea, because only wealthy people who can afford the taxes buy yachts, right? The result was that less wealthy people bought yachts, and there was a huge layoff in the shipbuilding industry. Workers lost their jobs right and left... not wealthy workers, but rather middle class folks who were simply working to make a living for their family. No one who passed the bill wanted these middle class workers to lose their jobs, but it happened anyway (as many, including me predicted). It was an unintended consequence of the new taxes.

Your proposal would put millions of Hispanics out of work, whether it is intended to do so or not.

Sure 3 strikes rule would be nice, unless flagrant where there is someone housing dozens and obviously knows what they are doing...maybe send in a mole and investigate employers and for those suspected of housing and giving shelter, give them a 30 day notice to comply or else...

It sounded like you wanted extreme prosecution before, and now it sounds like you want gentler enforcement. You can't have both. Laws must be exactly spelled out to prevent abuse from those enforcing it. Otherwise you run the risk of someone's buddy getting off scot-free, while their competitors could be forced out of business by an iron-fisted enforcement.

If treated them like terrorist, and used drones to attack them in their homeland before they even left and might be a solution also, though look at syria and other places where there has been war and dronem bombings and all the refugees created by the crisis's and reason so many are seeking safe haven and food and shelter...

No! I absolutely do not agree we should attack anyone in their homeland with drones! That is war-mongering and the primary reason we have international crises as it is. The United States has a long and colorful history of interfering in other countries' business, and it never works out well.

I absolutely oppose this, in any way, shape, or form!

TheRedneck

It’s already illegal.
Why don’t we make murder illegal to stop all these shootings?
Same logic

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Justoneman

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: bob77
that is the price for being world policeman...

Interpol are the world policemen.

The US is just a terrorist group.

Only the terrorist allowed to fight for freedom in your Dimension chrOnaut?

Terrorists don't fight for freedom, but they all justify themselves by saying that they do.

They generally oppress.

They all use terror tactics to impose their will upon a resistant populace. The usual terror tactics are threats and use of extreme violence.

Take a look at the US forces throughout the world. Automatic rifles, drones, bombs and armor in the hands of foreigners. That doesn't say peace, that says terror.

Also, America has the highest rate and numbers of incarceration of its own citizens of any country in the world. It was one of the last countries in the world to ban slavery. The opposite to freedom is incarceration and slavery. Look up the definitions if you don't believe me. I doubt that the average American would know what freedom was like if they tripped over it. Double ditto for their militant.

Tell the Yazidi sex slave girls in the Middle East and the sex slave girls in Africa that the Jihadi's owned that we liberate

Really, and do you have any actual numbers for that. Every instance I have heard has a similar complaint, "We had been abandoned by everyone. There is no support from the international community or the government. Even though we repeatedly ask, nobody helps us". They usually escape (or are discarded by their captors) by themselves and end up in refugee camps.

my good man that the US is the one that raped and murdered their families. I suspect you don't know the definition of terrorist?

The US forces have also raped, abused and killed.

United States war crimes From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Is this all you have a stale 60 year old picture of war is hell?

Why do you hate America?

originally posted by: Justoneman

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Justoneman

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: bob77
that is the price for being world policeman...

Interpol are the world policemen.

The US is just a terrorist group.

Only the terrorist allowed to fight for freedom in your Dimension chrOnaut?

Terrorists don't fight for freedom, but they all justify themselves by saying that they do.

They generally oppress.

They all use terror tactics to impose their will upon a resistant populace. The usual terror tactics are threats and use of extreme violence.

Take a look at the US forces throughout the world. Automatic rifles, drones, bombs and armor in the hands of foreigners. That doesn't say peace, that says terror.

Also, America has the highest rate and numbers of incarceration of its own citizens of any country in the world. It was one of the last countries in the world to ban slavery. The opposite to freedom is incarceration and slavery. Look up the definitions if you don't believe me. I doubt that the average American would know what freedom was like if they tripped over it. Double ditto for their militant.

Tell the Yazidi sex slave girls in the Middle East and the sex slave girls in Africa that the Jihadi's owned that we liberate

Really, and do you have any actual numbers for that. Every instance I have heard has a similar complaint, "We had been abandoned by everyone. There is no support from the international community or the government. Even though we repeatedly ask, nobody helps us". They usually escape (or are discarded by their captors) by themselves and end up in refugee camps.

my good man that the US is the one that raped and murdered their families. I suspect you don't know the definition of terrorist?

The US forces have also raped, abused and killed.

United States war crimes From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Is this all you have a stale 60 year old picture of war is hell?

Why do you hate America?

Same county but now with more bases abroad and still involving itself in conflicts everywhere, uninvited. It's modus operandi, we've figured it out now.

I don't hate America. I actually applaud its experiment in government that was behind the Constitution and some of its amendments. But the Constitution and the political experiment has turned out to be flawed and didn't create the better fairer country that was so hoped for.

I do dislike the complacent who chant irrelevant and untrue slogans which prevent them from allowing changes that are necessary to get somewhere better from here. The true regressives who want to go back and make things great 'again', like repeating the mistakes of the past are going to give different results. Take a look at the way Trump keeps writing out EO's that get canned because they are unconstitutional. His style of government is exactly what the writers of the constitution were trying to avoid. But the Trump style regressives aren't the true America, anyway, and history, technology and the power of the public will obliterate even their memory.

a reply to: chr0naut

Read it, the Constitution is not flawed. It has always been HUMANS that are flawed and the COTUS grasps that fact exactly. THIS is about morals. The leaders have no morals to perform their duties and they have sold us out to Big Business and the UN. We were charged with not electing fools.

So instead, the fools have found a way to get the funding from the Old Oligarchy from the 17th Century or like the DNC did for HRC, literally alter votes in fact by cheating. Easy to believe with 'by any means necessary" being the chant of the leftist looking to overturn the COTUS. Their plan for we the people living by it, is to be fleeced and berated as pawns of the Old Oligarchy who have used greed of our own currently free Politicians against the formerly free "we the people".

They won’t do anything that affects the elite who want to hire slave waged workers.

if the agencies target the businesses which hire 'Illeagles' we are culling the honest immigrants who want honest wages for honest work performed

... We should be Targeting the crooks/cons/pushers/gangs/gangsters … With a formidable 'Wall' or an Impregnable Fence -> Because the real Refugees/immigrants will opt to take the legal but long immigration process & not crash-the-gates---> If & When the Democrats/Socialist Libs/Globalists/D33p State stop inticeing these individuals with Free Stuff to become Democrat Voters in return (a blatant act of Sedition on the part of the DNC/ELITES)

That, in short, is the single best way to keep everyone that is not 'screened' or 'profiled' out of the Law Abiding Land of Gringos & peaceful Immigrants in the USA.


minimum bla-bla-bla

originally posted by: St Udio


if the agencies target the businesses which hire 'Illeagles' we are culling the honest immigrants who want honest wages for honest work performed

... We should be Targeting the crooks/cons/pushers/gangs/gangsters … With a formidable 'Wall' or an Impregnable Fence -> Because the real Refugees/immigrants will opt to take the legal but long immigration process & not crash-the-gates---> If & When the Democrats/Socialist Libs/Globalists/D33p State stop inticeing these individuals with Free Stuff to become Democrat Voters in return (a blatant act of Sedition on the part of the DNC/ELITES)

That, in short, is the single best way to keep everyone that is not 'screened' or 'profiled' out of the Law Abiding Land of Gringos & peaceful Immigrants in the USA.

minimum bla-bla-bla

You need to be a citizen to register to vote at a national level.

I doubt that the Democrats/Elites would get many extra votes.

Even if every undocumented person could vote, 11 million, in 320 million, is not that significant.

a reply to: chr0naut

You need to be a citizen to register to vote at a national level.

Yes, but the same party that supports open borders also opposes any effort to ensure that voters are legal citizens.

Coinkidink?

TheRedneck

originally posted by: TheRedneck
Some time back, the US decided to levy a luxury tax on things like yachts. It sounded like a good idea, because only wealthy people who can afford the taxes buy yachts, right? The result was that less wealthy people bought yachts, and there was a huge layoff in the shipbuilding industry. Workers lost their jobs right and left...

The law of unintended consequences. Same thing happened in Nevada when they taxed tobacco to raise revenue for the school budgets, too many people quit smoking and they didn't have enough cash.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

That law seems to raise its ugly head whenever the tax code is used to try and change people's actions. You'd think people would get the idea that is a bad thing after 236 years but...

Taxes are there to fund the government, not to let the government choose winners and losers in the economy.

TheRedneck