TSA/FBI...loyalty, They Live and the god of this world...

originally posted by: TheElectricPriest

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: TheElectricPriest

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

People need to do what they have to do. I don’t see what god has to do with this. Other than you seem to find the need to virtue signal as much as you can. The gov certainly has a bad habit of withholding it’s loyalty to those in need. Veterans especially.

I think this shutdown is proving that our bloated government is full of un needed personel. 900,000 employees? The TSA is a perfect example. You say yourself, that they have a 95% failure rate. Is the cost for these services worth it? Your lack of surprise is really a good enough answer. TSA employees have been leaving their jobs since way before this shutdown ever happened. thehill.com...

It’s a #ty job, that’s not doing what it’s supposed to, because they hire people who have no security experience, and most of them get paid less than 15$. Which as most people know, isn’t really enough to run a household. These jobs were never meant to be taken seriously. 95% failure rate.

This was supposed to go here...whoops.

Come on man, I think everyone is making really good points and I'm hearing what everyone has to say...except you. You just needed to start off your post with accusing me of "virtue signalling", which I don't even know what the hell that means. Your hate and anger shine through, but I wanted to have a more pragmatic discussion, and yes, the "virtue" of duty does have pragmatic realities. Why don't you go take a nice warm bath...

You should look it up, and then answer this question. What does your belief in God have to do with the TSA? Why did you insert your belief in God and to your OP? Was it to signal some kind of virtue that you have?

Man, you are really having one of those mornings, aren't you sweetheart? I suppose I mentioned God to equate that level of faith with my belief in the importance of faith and service to the nation...they're equitable. Even those without a deistic faith would understand that by way of my comparison I'm setting a base-line for my belief in the importance of our duty to country, so the mentioning thereof was purposeful for this intent, not an attempt to persuade a complete stranger of my virtue. I suppose, however, you're one of those angry atheists who is "triggered" every time someone mentions something you don't believe in. Well I apologize buttercup, I'll try to be more mindful of your sensitivity next time...

it’s called virtue signaling. It’s the veil that religious people hide behind because they are not smart enough to have opinions that aren’t carefully laid out for them.

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: TheElectricPriest

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

When I read about the TSA calling in sick, the cases they were showing was they were picking up shifts at a part time job they had on the side so they could get paid.

In most instances in employee grievances with the shutdown, it seems that it is entry level employees (or slightly higher).

Now, this may come as a surprise to some, but some of these cats are living paycheck to paycheck. We could get into the debate of "well they should be more responsible", but I find this as a moot point. We all have contracts with our employers, and it boils down to something simple. Employee works X amount of hours, and every designated pay period (determined upon hiring) you settle up.

I get the whole "where's their sense of duty" line, but understand the federal government has been abusing it's power for some time, and their actions have consequences. These employees should have every right to not show up if they aren't being paid to put pressure on the decision makers. One of the few forms of leverage we have as employees is that our services are needed, so don't try and take that away from someone, because for many, that's all they have.

These are excellent points and the quality of response I was hoping to receive regarding the above. This is the type of post that forces me to question my presumptions...and so I thank you. Those that are simply making the argument of x pay for x hours are, in my opinion, failing to see the higher issue of service to a nation, a nation we all rely on for its functioning feeds us. I expected a certain level of healthy cynicism, but instead seem to be getting a double-dose of narcissism.

The point is that the gov is bloated with un needed personel. A point i made earlier that you ignored in favor of chastising me for calling out your need to virtue signal.

The TSA doesn’t work. Why would you be worried about them? You said it yourself with that 95% failure rate. Why would you want to pay for that?

Because, there is still a presumption of necessity (whether it's true or not) as well as a very real manifestation of their absence for national travel, just ask anyone who is flying today. The first response to my OP really made me step back and think a bit about what they were saying, which was that many of these lower level workers, living paycheck to paycheck, are calling in sick in order to work other temporary jobs in order to make ends meat. This makes sense to me and something I can completely understand. However, a lot of these people are simply saying "screw you" and laying up on the couch because their checks are delayed (and I'm not trying to minimize the impact, I'm personally against the idiocy of this wall, but the fact is that when the government opens they will be paid for their work, no one will have worked for free). Still, we've all been through these TSA lines, seen the quality of persons that are employed there (hence, no doubt, their stunning success rate), and this is all justified through their service to our nation. Now, when things go awry they just abandon that concept outright!? I stand by my assertion that this is disgusting behavior. It reveals who they are, and they are disgusting.

I'll tell you what, instead of focusing on this TSA thing, and in order for you and I to find a bit of peace with one another, why don't we address the point that I made regarding the FBI, which I find truly disturbing.

In the meantime, let me tell you a bit about God...j/k

They should fire 1/2 (or all) of the TSA staff that don't have a real background insecurity and rehire 1/3 or 1/2 as many as before at 2-3x the rate (so $30-45/hr) and see if the statistics don't go up. I suspect that having 1/2-1/3 the employees but have them be actual EXPERTS in their field would have much better results than what we have currently.

This type of job would probably be great for police, military, etc who want to work a part time job and or those who are retiring but want to still work a little. Having less full time employees in TSA would also be a benefit b/c there would be less benefits paid, so it might work out to being able to hire more people than a straight 1/2 reduction and doubling the pay.

originally posted by: Nyiah

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: TheElectricPriest

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

When I read about the TSA calling in sick, the cases they were showing was they were picking up shifts at a part time job they had on the side so they could get paid.

In most instances in employee grievances with the shutdown, it seems that it is entry level employees (or slightly higher).

Now, this may come as a surprise to some, but some of these cats are living paycheck to paycheck. We could get into the debate of "well they should be more responsible", but I find this as a moot point. We all have contracts with our employers, and it boils down to something simple. Employee works X amount of hours, and every designated pay period (determined upon hiring) you settle up.

I get the whole "where's their sense of duty" line, but understand the federal government has been abusing it's power for some time, and their actions have consequences. These employees should have every right to not show up if they aren't being paid to put pressure on the decision makers. One of the few forms of leverage we have as employees is that our services are needed, so don't try and take that away from someone, because for many, that's all they have.

These are excellent points and the quality of response I was hoping to receive regarding the above. This is the type of post that forces me to question my presumptions...and so I thank you. Those that are simply making the argument of x pay for x hours are, in my opinion, failing to see the higher issue of service to a nation, a nation we all rely on for its functioning feeds us. I expected a certain level of healthy cynicism, but instead seem to be getting a double-dose of narcissism.

The point is that the gov is bloated with un needed personel. A point i made earlier that you ignored in favor of chastising me for calling out your need to virtue signal.

The TSA doesn’t work. Why would you be worried about them? You said it yourself with that 95% failure rate. Why would you want to pay for that?

Dude, nobody with a shred of common sense wants the TSA to stick around, but an abrupt stop such as this doesn't cut it for better management. Dial it down in controlled stages and dissolve it the right way with the least possible amount of income whiplash for employees as possible. We do owe those folks doing the work that much at least.

There has been no abrupt stop. All stations are still operational. Those positions should never have been created. Not in the context that they were anyways. Airport security is an important thing, but do you really think the TSA was worth the amount of money and the loss of privacy that it cost us? 95% failure rate. It’s time to break down all of these poorly built gov systems and rebuild one’s that work.

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Nyiah

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: TheElectricPriest

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

When I read about the TSA calling in sick, the cases they were showing was they were picking up shifts at a part time job they had on the side so they could get paid.

In most instances in employee grievances with the shutdown, it seems that it is entry level employees (or slightly higher).

Now, this may come as a surprise to some, but some of these cats are living paycheck to paycheck. We could get into the debate of "well they should be more responsible", but I find this as a moot point. We all have contracts with our employers, and it boils down to something simple. Employee works X amount of hours, and every designated pay period (determined upon hiring) you settle up.

I get the whole "where's their sense of duty" line, but understand the federal government has been abusing it's power for some time, and their actions have consequences. These employees should have every right to not show up if they aren't being paid to put pressure on the decision makers. One of the few forms of leverage we have as employees is that our services are needed, so don't try and take that away from someone, because for many, that's all they have.

These are excellent points and the quality of response I was hoping to receive regarding the above. This is the type of post that forces me to question my presumptions...and so I thank you. Those that are simply making the argument of x pay for x hours are, in my opinion, failing to see the higher issue of service to a nation, a nation we all rely on for its functioning feeds us. I expected a certain level of healthy cynicism, but instead seem to be getting a double-dose of narcissism.

The point is that the gov is bloated with un needed personel. A point i made earlier that you ignored in favor of chastising me for calling out your need to virtue signal.

The TSA doesn’t work. Why would you be worried about them? You said it yourself with that 95% failure rate. Why would you want to pay for that?

Dude, nobody with a shred of common sense wants the TSA to stick around, but an abrupt stop such as this doesn't cut it for better management. Dial it down in controlled stages and dissolve it the right way with the least possible amount of income whiplash for employees as possible. We do owe those folks doing the work that much at least.

There has been no abrupt stop. All stations are still operational. Those positions should never have been created. Not in the context that they were anyways. Airport security is an important thing, but do you really think the TSA was worth the amount of money and the loss of privacy that it cost us? 95% failure rate. It’s time to break down all of these poorly built gov systems and rebuild one’s that work.

The abrupt stop I'm referring to is pay, and that much should have been obvious, considering the thread topic.

While I do know someone working for them, I'm not in favor of keeping the agency -- it needs to go bye-bye a decade ago. Doing so will save a ton, as does simply not paying out on pay days. But the latter is the WRONG way to save money, and the wrong way to run any place of employment. You know this much, everyone does. We don't need the TSA, absolutely, but scowling at the people between a rock & a hard place because they're in the middle of a shutdown in a government agency you don't like solves nothing.

originally posted by: TheElectricPriest

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: TheElectricPriest

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

When I read about the TSA calling in sick, the cases they were showing was they were picking up shifts at a part time job they had on the side so they could get paid.

In most instances in employee grievances with the shutdown, it seems that it is entry level employees (or slightly higher).

Now, this may come as a surprise to some, but some of these cats are living paycheck to paycheck. We could get into the debate of "well they should be more responsible", but I find this as a moot point. We all have contracts with our employers, and it boils down to something simple. Employee works X amount of hours, and every designated pay period (determined upon hiring) you settle up.

I get the whole "where's their sense of duty" line, but understand the federal government has been abusing it's power for some time, and their actions have consequences. These employees should have every right to not show up if they aren't being paid to put pressure on the decision makers. One of the few forms of leverage we have as employees is that our services are needed, so don't try and take that away from someone, because for many, that's all they have.

These are excellent points and the quality of response I was hoping to receive regarding the above. This is the type of post that forces me to question my presumptions...and so I thank you. Those that are simply making the argument of x pay for x hours are, in my opinion, failing to see the higher issue of service to a nation, a nation we all rely on for its functioning feeds us. I expected a certain level of healthy cynicism, but instead seem to be getting a double-dose of narcissism.

The point is that the gov is bloated with un needed personel. A point i made earlier that you ignored in favor of chastising me for calling out your need to virtue signal.

The TSA doesn’t work. Why would you be worried about them? You said it yourself with that 95% failure rate. Why would you want to pay for that?

Because, there is still a presumption of necessity (whether it's true or not) as well as a very real manifestation of their absence for national travel, just ask anyone who is flying today. The first response to my OP really made me step back and think a bit about what they were saying, which was that many of these lower level workers, living paycheck to paycheck, are calling in sick in order to work other temporary jobs in order to make ends meat. This makes sense to me and something I can completely understand. However, a lot of these people are simply saying "screw you" and laying up on the couch because their checks are delayed (and I'm not trying to minimize the impact, I'm personally against the idiocy of this wall, but the fact is that when the government opens they will be paid for their work, no one will have worked for free). Still, we've all been through these TSA lines, seen the quality of persons that are employed there (hence, no doubt, their stunning success rate), and this is all justified through their service to our nation. Now, when things go awry they just abandon that concept outright!? I stand by my assertion that this is disgusting behavior. It reveals who they are, and they are disgusting.

I'll tell you what, instead of focusing on this TSA thing, and in order for you and I to find a bit of peace with one another, why don't we address the point that I made regarding the FBI, which I find truly disturbing.

In the meantime, let me tell you a bit about God...j/k

Before you read that reply, what did you think they were calling in sick for? Serious question, because i can’t imagine that wasn’t obvious. These folks don’t have the cash to sit around on their couches.

The TSA is still there. There are just fewer people standing around doing nothing than there were. Did you see the link i posted earlier? thehill.com...

People were already leaving and calling in sick before the gov shutdown. It offers low pay because they hire entry level with low starting pay and most of them never get over $15 an hour. That is how serious a position it is. Other essential personel are still being paid. This shutdown is going to force the gov to trim the fat, which is only going to expose the non essential gov positions.

originally posted by: DigginFoTroof
They should fire 1/2 (or all) of the TSA staff that don't have a real background insecurity and rehire 1/3 or 1/2 as many as before at 2-3x the rate (so $30-45/hr) and see if the statistics don't go up. I suspect that having 1/2-1/3 the employees but have them be actual EXPERTS in their field would have much better results than what we have currently.

This type of job would probably be great for police, military, etc who want to work a part time job and or those who are retiring but want to still work a little. Having less full time employees in TSA would also be a benefit b/c there would be less benefits paid, so it might work out to being able to hire more people than a straight 1/2 reduction and doubling the pay.

What this guy said.

originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: CriticalStinker

If I wasn't getting paid, I would stop showing up and find somewhere they did pay actual money.

I would do the opposite.... If I were a TSA cog in the wheel, I would find an office or other private room in the facility to live in and shower up ...meals are as difficult as getting a $50 microwave and getting food stuffs in the off duty hours one or so a week (if no cafeteria's are operating there in the facility for a lunch or dinner option)

in such a Spartan mode, I may be able to outlast a no-paycheck issue for 2 months of temporary discomfort on a pauper's pocket change of perhaps $40 per week

Allegiance to such things is pure stupidity. Believing god and country are the same is even worse. This is not only stupid, but dangerous thinking.