Rendlesham Forest 1980 Pt II - Will There Be An Answer?

originally posted by: Baablacksheep
Back to the book I mention . John claimed Nick lied re their book requiring clearance from both governments , it did not happen. Is that not fraud? Nick does highlight that fact about their book.

I suppose that would be something for the courts to decide, which means someone would first have to build a case. Do you reckon the US and UK governments could get away with spending tax payers money? Which leaves Burroughs and probably the best he could do is make a claim of false representation - I can't see that happening can you?

Given that ALL of them are misrepresenting the "facts" to the point of deception, I don't think that there is anyone, publishers especially, who want that can of worms opened. Perhaps Issac Koi can chip in, sound to me like there is a case to be had against several handfuls of "ufologists".

The borderline between criminal and civil liability

The borderline between criminal and civil liability is likely to be an issue in alleged Fraud Act offences particularly those under Section 1. Prosecutors should bear in mind that the principle of caveat emptor applies and should consider whether civil proceedings or the regulatory regime that applies to advertising and other commercial activities might be more appropriate. Not every advertising puff should lead to a criminal conviction but it is also the case that fraudsters prey on the vulnerable.

Prosecutors should guard against the criminal law being used as a debt collection agency or to protect the commercial interests of companies and organisations. However, prosecutors should also remain alert to the fact that such organisations can become the focus of serious and organised criminal offending.

The criminal law should not be used to protect private confidences.

Section 1 creates a general offence of fraud and introduces three ways of committing it set out in Sections 2, 3 and 4.

Fraud by false representation (Section 2);
Fraud by failure to disclose information when there is a legal duty to do so (Section 3); and
Fraud by abuse of position (Section 4).

In each case:

the defendant's conduct must be dishonest;
his/her intention must be to make a gain; or cause a loss or the risk of a loss to another.
No gain or loss needs actually to have been made.
The maximum sentence is 10 years' imprisonment.

www.cps.gov.uk...

a reply to: KilgoreTrout

I suppose that would be something for the courts to decide, which means someone would first have to build a case.

Perhaps one day, someone or someones will do exactly that?

Do you reckon the US and UK governments could get away with spending tax payers money?

Not right now.

Which leaves Burroughs and probably the best he could do is make a claim of false representation - I can't see that happening can you?

No, it would require resources , if of course his claims are true against Pope.

Given that ALL of them are misrepresenting the "facts" to the point of deception, I don't think that there is anyone, publishers especially, who want that can of worms opened.

Good heavens no, imagine opening that can of worms.

Perhaps Issac Koi can chip in, sound to me like there is a case to be had against several handfuls of "ufologists".

The perfect choice to make comment on the matter. His long term connection with the UFO community as well as close association with many high level players to include Nick Pope.

Thankyou for the links KT.

I suspect that what went on was Nick sent a final draft for his book to the public relations desks of the MoD and the DoD. Maybe he got a thank you, or maybe he got no comment at all. With his propensity for exaggeration that became 'clearance from two governments".

Is that fraud?

What is interesting is how Gerhard Weinberg and Konrad Kujau were jailed for their hoaxing of the HItler Diaries back in the 1980s. Creating fake history is therefore a real crime.

However when it comes to ufology no such rules apply. Ray Santili is said to have made millions from the Alien Autopsy Hoax in the 90s [and beyond]. There are people on record who've said they were part of the filming process. Yet no legal action has been taken against Santili. He remains both a wealthy and free man from his own fraud.

Why?

Because he created a hoax from something that has never been accepted history in the first place. One where he and multiple media companies profited from it. Who really lost out?

So it depends on who is committing the fraud and who is challenging it. It also depends on the value of winning any such case. I doubt there is anything to be gained from challenging Nick Pope in court over his claims.

a reply to: mirageman

I suspect that what went on was Nick sent a final draft for his book to the public relations desks of the MoD and the DoD. Maybe he got a thank you, or maybe he got no comment at all. With his propensity for exaggeration that became 'clearance from two governments".

Is that fraud?

Well of course that is speculation and is all we can do? Here is what Nick really tells us.

Now that our book has been published, I can finally reveal a few facts that could not have been disclosed previously. The first is that this is the only UFO book ever to have required security clearance from both the American and the British governments. This was because of my previous service with the Ministry of Defence, and the fact that John Burroughs and Jim Penniston both served with the United States Air Force. While all three of us have now left government/military service, our respective security oaths bind us for life. This, together with the extreme sensitivity of some of the information that we wanted to include, made this a very difficult book to write.

The marketing and publicity plan for the book had to be kept secret too, and the big news is that in the UK, the book was serialized by the Daily Mail. The Daily Mail is the UK’s second best-selling national daily newspaper, and needless to say, it’s extremely rare for the mainstream media to highlight a UFO book in this way, so that the story reaches literally millions of people. The deal – skillfully negotiated by the Andrew Lownie Literary Agency – propelled the book to number 35 in Amazon’s UK book chart. Most UFO books never break out of the paranormal niche and onto the main bestseller list in this way.

www.ufodigest.com...



But now we have John Burroughs telling us Nick lied and the others are after Nick with sticks and stones. Does not look a healthy situation.

Now that UFOlogy is taking a different turn as we now see out there, perhaps things might well change ?

and he has the audacity to call other people fraudsters, you couldn't make this up. a reply to: Baablacksheep

a reply to: wobbs62

Scandelous...... Watch the theatrics now. Some are already unfolding .

Popcorn time.

The Popester obviously thinks "government clearance" is a selling point. Even for his fictional works.

Operation Thunderchild.....The tagline for this controversial book was “The truth can only be told in fiction”, and this led to much speculation in the UFO and conspiracy theory community, especially when it emerged that the manuscript of Operation Thunder Child had gone through the government’s security clearance procedure. Film/TV rights are available....

web.archive.org...

I'm not sure if it is a good selling point given the levels of distrust.

Of course Burroughs could raise FOIA requests if he wants to prove no clearances for their book was given. Maybe he has already? But who really cares?

Rendlesham became a circus as soon as various characters began to fictionalize their stories.

What happened to that guy Smithy, who claimed he'd got the formula for anti-gravity?

a reply to: mirageman

The Popester obviously thinks "government clearance" is a selling point. Even for his fictional works.

Clearly Jim and John also liked the sales pitch for the Rendlesham book they all wrote too, despite Johns recent accusations. FOIA requests others can do too. Philip seems to care as he is using it in his Nick Pope drive that he is on, hes spreading it all thick and fast, he is even getting Lori involved. No clue re Smithy but seems like Lori wants Pope gone and others to investigate , guess she probably knows the low down re Smithy.


www.facebook.com...

RENDALSHAM the case that keeps on giving, sad it's turned into a cash cow with so many new testimonials from folk not even born when the event went off. still this (ATS Threads) has to be the best resource for information on the case, mirage man your a class act ! plus many other contributors, i recently bsent UK's Philip mantle this way if he wanted some great information about the case, we were having a bit of a lighthouse meltdown and i wasn't backing down that if people think the lighthouse was the source of the activities those nights then we may as well give up. like the guys on the base would not be familiar with it as they would see it every night ! that just doesn't hold water imo i think we can say nope this was no lighthouse.

a reply to: stealthyaroura

Philip may be re-publishing Brenda's book.

m.facebook.com...

There has been some interesting research conducted here from Miragemans first thread to this 2nd thread. Am sure Philip is well aware of it all already or should be.

It's all kicking off, Harry potter, formally of the mod is throwing his toys out the pram and calling others fraudsters...😆a reply to: Baablacksheep

a reply to: wobbs62

Wobb am just coming to terms with learning Brenda assisted building the pyramid's. The thought of Harry Potter accusing other fraudsters is just too much. I need medication!

Harry potter and the goblet of BS. reply to: Baablacksheep

originally posted by: wobbs62
I believe there are earth lights or whatever you want to call them in the Woodbridge area, theres a report from 1946 of red Amber lights being seen outside Woodbridge that Dr David Clarke found in mod files so the lights were around before the fancy microwave radars were being tested in the area.
The lights could also be paranormal activity with the amount of witchcraft that's gone on there over the years, who knows, but definitely something weird about that particular area. a reply to: penroc3

First of all, ALL RADAR is microwaves and microwaves were in that area during the early art of WWII years before 1946


that being said I believe in earthlights, and I think there may be some unique geology in the area that would allow such things but earth lights are usually more of the electrical discharge type of color deep reds are usually as far as my experience, something else.

a reply to: wobbs62

Am pretty sure a few goblets will be overflowing in the not so distant future.

www.ancientaliencruise.com...

originally posted by: Baablacksheep
a reply to: wobbs62

Wobb am just coming to terms with learning Brenda assisted building the pyramid's.....

When someone claimed she was away with the Pharaohs I thought I'd misheard them.

a reply to: [post=25754133]mirageman[/post

a reply to: mirageman

By the way MM. Seeing as Philip is now involved in a possible re-print of all this craziness, perhaps it will be told why John Burroughs threatened Gary Osborn with legal action if he worked on the binary of Brenda's. I mean she was supposed to have received hers in 1979. Anyway he was quite the bully I believe.

I don't know about any legal issues. When you take a step back and look at the whole rotten saga here it ends up as a total mess with a nonsensical narrative.

The story as told by the witnesses and their various partners down the years paints one of a bungling and incompetent US military when it comes to dealing with UFO cases (as does a lot of mythology from Roswell to the Nimitz incident). With a bunch of witnesses with conflicting and even absurd stories at times.

This is basically the story....



● On Dec 26th 1980, it might have been just after midnight or it probably was closer to 3am, three USAF personnel Jim, John and Ed left Woodbridge Airbase in Suffolk to investigate a possible air crash in Rendlesham Forest.

● Ed stayed back at the jeep as a radio relay. Although he doesn't remember that, so maybe he didn't. As they approached the lights they all ducked down, and it sped off and up into the night skies. Or it didn't and Ed doesn't remember much at all, John was unconscious and Jim left him on the ground. Choosing instead to perform a long slow 45 minute reconnaissance of a craft the others don't recall seeing.

● Jim noted glyphs on the side of a smooth shaped triangular craft, about the size of a car sitting on the forest floor. He drew them in his notebook in a dark forest. [This would remain unknown to anyone until the early 90s]. British police arrived at around 4:30am and found nothing of consequence.

● Col. Halt arrives at his office some hours later and ask for details to be recorded in the official logs. He also takes witness statements on Jan 2nd 1981 but ignores the events of the 3rd night. Although only those of officers Chandler and Buran are on official USAF stationery. They do confirm the correct date.

● Despite these records which should have been easily accessible he ignored them to write a totally inaccurate record of events in his memo to the UK MoD.. He claims it was written purely from memory some three weeks after the incident. On that memo he incorrectly records the date of events as the 27th Dec 1980 too and describes a metallic craft that no one else saw according to their statememnts.

● In daylight British Police arrive again to inspect the suspected landing site of the craft. They dismiss the markings as animal scratchings. Senior Air Force officers at the Twin Bases also inspect the site. At no time did anyone think to take radiation readings until two nights later under darkness.

● In the evening of the 26th Dec 1980 another event involving Lt. Bonnie Tamplin causes her to freak out. Details of which remain sketchy to this day.

● On Dec 27th 1980 more lights are seen in the forest and a number of Air Force troops are stationed in the forest with lighting equipment. Col. Halt is at an awards dinner and is interrupted. This time he thinks he needs a Geiger counter and asks Nevels to go get one.

● Halt's group begin stomping around the forest. At first taking radiation readings from a suspected landing site, then following a light around the forest. They see a flashing light in the general area of the Orfordness Lighthouse at pretty much the same rate it blinks. Halt's tape has him on record stating a huge beam of light falling at his feet. None of the group with him appear to have described anything as dramatic as Halt did. The light also supposedly buzzed the weapons storage areas. But at no time was any alert called on the base. Nor did British forces take any action.

● Halt's tape has no mention of Burroughs and Bustinza's testimony of them being sent forwards towards the strange light in the field. Eventually Halt just gives up and goes home after calling in for a radar check fails to produce anything of substance.

● 30 years later Jim claims he recorded a stream of binary code which came to him in his head the morning after the incident. He recorded this, coincidentally, in the same notebook he drew the glyphs in the dark. However, he also removed these pages until he was due to be on TV. John claimed he never saw Jim making any notes a number of years before.

The binary codes 'allegedly' contain co-ordinates of supposedly mystical places around the globe and an important message about the future. The co-ordinates also match those used by Google Earth in 2009 (but no longer).

So there you have it.

The warnings about our future were hidden in a binary code and delivered by machine to brain transfer in 1980 to an American Air Force Sergeant. A man who said they "didn't mean nothing to him". Until he was due to be on a TV show in 2010.

What a ridiculous way to transmit a message and choose someone who didn't even understand what it was.

And don't forget we have the constant revolving and changing allegiances of the Rendle Sham Circus.

For years they were kept apart but Jim and John tied the knot in 2009.

Larry was the long term husband to Peter. But then Gary came along and split them up. After a lie detector test.

Gary was originally with Chuck, but their plans ended because Chuck kept bad-mouthing new partner Larry.

Chuck is now with John (another one).

Jim left John for a different Gary that's not Larry's Gary.

John is now with James after flirting with Linda. But not until after he and Jim were in a messy menage a trois with Harry Potter.

Larry and Gary's Holywood style wedding in Chapel Green has been promoted for years but still no date for the big day.

Meanwhile, Harry Potter is currently being attacked because although he's been to Hogwarts he was not really Head of the HufflePuff as he has claimed. Even though he talks a lot of it.