Ethics, vegan life choices..unethical ?

I was stunned today. i love knitting and was asked what thread is suitable for knitting socks for vegan. Limitation is that it cannot be a thread from any animal.
..hmm unshearing makes animals life easier ( remember that overgrown sheep in Australia link )
Thinking of carbon footprint for cotton is worse than wool and it takes about 20 000 liters water to make one T-shirt
Mulesing is unethical but at least in my country that is not in action it is most used in Australia and New Zealand.
Wool and using natural coloring methods from plants is in my view more ethical than using cotton, bambu or synthetic threads...which carbon footprint is far worse than cotton

What is your choice if you are vegan.. seeing whole picture? Why ?

a reply to: dollukka

While "window shopping" on the web I frequently come across shoes, boots, clothes, bags, etc. that I like with the "Vegan, animal product free" label. Nearly every time when I look to see exactly what materials they are made of it ends up being synthetic, man made materials- and normally the kind that will take hundreds if not thousands of years or longer to biodegrade. Maybe good for some animals but definitely not good for the earth!

a reply to: dollukka

What in the world do these people think should be done with the wool?

Sheep have to be sheared once a year or they'll be suffering in the summer.

If I knew how to spin fibres, I'd even be using my Pyrenees cross's fur...

I wear whatever I want. I don't think I'd wear a fur though, unless it was necessary

a reply to: dollukka

The answer is every vegan product is worse for the earth, and horrible for the environment. But unfortunately, there are the individuals who think it better to be unnatural.

a reply to: dollukka

I believe all life in some way is sentient and self-aware. We have had articles posted here in the past linking to science articles showing plants communicate with each other -- some more than others. Some get along and like being next to each other and others die when in proximity even though there is no chemical reason for it.

I believe all fauna feels and loves their young. Animals are capable of most if not all emotions that we are as well.

Having said that, I eat meat and I eat plants. Those who make a distinction are hypocrites in my eyes, but whatever -- they can live their lives any way they choose to.

P.S. Can you knit me a beanie hat with a Davy Jones tentacle beard attached to it?! Purrty please!

a reply to: dollukka

I have vegan Family members. The thinking for them is animals should live in their natural environments in their natural state.
A sheep would not need to be sheered in its own natural habitat.
People who keep sheep for wool often also have the sheep killed and dispose of unwanted sheep. Sheep for wool can be as brutal as any other kind of factory farming: animals are kept in cramped, stressful, dirty conditions
When humans do not make use of animals they don't become like our cats and dogs being put to death by the millions every year.

originally posted by: dollukka


What is your choice if you are vegan.. seeing whole picture? Why ?

In a world not governed by the DEA the perfect choice would be hemp fibers.

I make my leather from grass fed free range vegans.

a reply to: SeaWorthy

Yes that is what mulesing is and it is unethical. But not in action in most countries. In nature before human harnessed these animals sheering happened due bushes and tree branches, but sheeps do not wander in forests anymore, we humans have cut off most of our forests and sheeps tend to live their lives in the open fields and enjoy sun. So if absolutely nothing from animals it means most of the resources comes from forests, chemical plants and water is polluted and used more than using simple wool from a lamb.. in my POV those choices are destroying our planet.

a reply to: kelbtalfenek

Hemp has a durable fiber as does manila. But they are not at the level of animal fibers.
The best fibers (for strength) are synthetic.

originally posted by: SeaWorthy
a reply to: dollukka

I have vegan Family members. The thinking for them is animals should live in their natural environments in their natural state.
A sheep would not need to be sheered in its own natural habitat.
People who keep sheep for wool often also have the sheep killed and dispose of unwanted sheep. Sheep for wool can be as brutal as any other kind of factory farming: animals are kept in cramped, stressful, dirty conditions
When humans do not make use of animals they don't become like our cats and dogs being put to death by the millions every year.

My neighbour has sheep on her farm. They get sheared sometime in June, they have so much wool they can barely move. Same with the alpacas. Maybe it's our cold northern winter, I don't know. They wouldn't survive the hot summer temperatures with that much wool.

This woman also treats her sheep almost like pets, she has around 50. That number fluctuates.
She does sell off the lambs though, occasionally.

Sometimes groups of sheep and goats also get used as lawn mowers....

a reply to: dollukka

Family friends I go see at least once a year has a hop farm. They take the hops off the vines, pay someone to make rope and then sell the rest to that person and they make paper and other linen type stuff with it. Pretty cool process. Plus you get beer from it, so it's all good.

a reply to: dollukka

You forget all the massive pounds of vegetables needed to feed animals. Most of the corn production is for animals for example.

To blame anything on the tiny population of vegans is absurd.

No idea where this hate for vegans comes from....

originally posted by: randomtangentsrme
a reply to: dollukka

The answer is every vegan product is worse for the earth, and horrible for the environment. But unfortunately, there are the individuals who think it better to be unnatural.

Nonsense.

If you eat your own boogers are you still vegan?

a reply to: blueman12

Prove me wrong?

Where very cold climates and baselayers are concerned, there is no substitute for real wool, period. Science has given us a couple of synthetics which retain their own heat storage capabilities when wet, same as wool does, BUT those storage capabilities aren't as high as wool to begin with. Plant based fibers do not retain their heat storage when wet... cotton kills.

If you start getting away from sheep wool and looking at musk ox qiviut (musk ox wool) the difference between it and even the finest synthetic is even more impressive. You can throw on a pair of qiviut lined mittens in 30 or 40 below zero and your hands will sweat.

originally posted by: blueman12
a reply to: dollukka

You forget all the massive pounds of vegetables needed to feed animals. Most of the corn production is for animals for example.

The sun is free, water is the same water the dinosaurs drank, now go produce some CO2.

Pretty sure hatred of Vegans comes from their know-it-all-yet-know-nothing-holier-than-thou-schtick.

Just a guess tho.



Be sure to drink your Ovaltine.

originally posted by: blueman12
a reply to: dollukka

You forget all the massive pounds of vegetables needed to feed animals. Most of the corn production is for animals for example.

Uh, sheep eat very little corn. Their diet is best kept to clover, grass, and hay with some wheat or barley grain (or a small amount of corn) supplemented to pregnant and lactating ewes. They neither require nor often eat vegetables. A sheep is literally nature's lawn mower and, last I checked, grasses grow quite readily with sunshine and some water.

The "hate for vegans" comes from humanity's natural distaste for self righteous pontificating loudmouths. "I don't know any vegans" is likely an accurate statement when someone makes it, as it seems to be impossible for any vegan to not remind anyone within earshot that they are a vegan every few minutes, regardless of the conversation topic.
"Hey, did you watch the Braves' game last night?
"I did, that was a towering homerun, in the 8th!"
"No kidding, maybe this year they'll actually win something...
"That would be swell. I'm a vegan and remember when they were annual contenders!"
"What? Why did you feel the need to bring your personal dietary choices into a baseball conversation?"
"Stop attacking me! You normies always demonize the vegans for no reason!!! This is why I don't eat meat, it makes people aggressive and violent! Murderer!!! MURDERER!!!!"