Any Advice for Helping an Alcoholic?

originally posted by: Oldtimer2
a reply to: Boadicea

Only way he can be helped is by wanting to quit,otherwise becomes a game,if someone has the desire they can quit,but some love the drama

Oh wow. I can see that happening. I'm tending not to think that's the case with him, since he's gone to such great lengths to hide his drinking. But never say never, right? I will keep that in mind.

Thank you!

a reply to: BotheLumberJack

I've heard Vitamin C stops the craving for nicotine. It's worth a try.

www.doctoryourself.com...

Thank you -- very good to know! I was actually going to look up Vitamin C, just because it's so amazing for so many things. We actually have some drip bars around the valley too, so we could go high dose IV if it helps. I'd even be happy to pay for a couple trips if it helps...

Wow... my list of things to check out is growing longer and longer... and it's wonderful!

a reply to: Iamonlyhuman

^^ This is the truest statement in this thread. If he does "sober up" be careful to help him identify and fix what actually is wrong with him. Remind him over and over who he "really is".

Yes -- that is a very profound statement, and one I'm taking to heart.

As his long-time "second mom," I'm hoping and praying the nature and foundation of our relationship will serve us well in that regard. I knew him before he knew himself, and I know who he was and is and always will be in his heart and soul. I know what great potential he has. I can love him and support him unconditionally as a "mom," while also being honest and firm and confident in his ability to do better for himself and his girls.

And I guess that includes making clear that the offer stands; if he's not ready now, okay... but when he is ready, I'll be ready too.

a reply to: one4all

Thank you again!

You make a very good point. Alcohol does have medicinal and healing properties -- I always keep brandy on hand for that very reason, and everyone knows it's medicine in our house!

One thing I read that struck me as important was to be clear alcohol in and of itself isn't the problem, and he himself is not the problem, it's the combination that is the problem. For whatever reason, his physiology and his use of alcohol just aren't compatible. And it's all compounded when emotional issues get tied up in it all too. A fire that feeds itself. But the main thing to remember is that he's not responsible for the chemical reactions so to speak, but he is responsible for understanding it is a problem for him and taking appropriate action.

originally posted by: one4all
Alcohol is an anti-parasitic and if you wish to break the alcohol grip simply use a stronger more well rounded anti-parasitic and you will crave it stronger than you crave alcohol....

I'm checking this out now. Is there a particular anti-parasitic you preferred?

I'm seeing papaya extracts are an anti-parasitic, and I know he's always had digestive issues, so it would help with that as well. And I have some on hand that I can give him. Also aloe vera -- which is great for so many things. Many things I would expect as well like onions, garlic, oregano oil and olive leaf extract.

a reply to: Boadicea



Once in AA just remember if they fall again to get back into the detox ASAP.
As others have said plenty of Vit C, build up of appetite again. Clearing of the mind/fog slowly and always be in touch with a sponsor

a reply to: Reverbs

It's crazy how sober you are if you're an alcoholic with a drink, after withdrawing

With all due respect - that is not sobriety. Alcohol is a progressive disease. For a while there everytime I fell off the wagon I returned where I left off.; more and more alochol.

You are not sober as the BAL is still there - the relief from anxiety caused by the withdrawal is what you're feeling.

a reply to: Reverbs

Thank you so much for sharing that -- very good to know!

And I can relate to that. After some bouts with sepsis, that brain fog was horrible. I know just what you mean about trying to get through the simplest tasks. Things that I could do in my sleep before, I found myself having to talk myself through it step-by-step -- and still losing my train of thought. Sometimes I just couldn't get from step 1 to step 2 and it was maddening. I knew enough to know I was stupid... but couldn't figure out how to fix it. Ugh!

One time I accidentally paid the electric bill to the gas bill. I didn't have to pay the gas bill again for almost a year! But I ended up having to find the money to pay the electric bill "again". I couldn't believe I had done that. But I did.

Let's hope we get that far that I need to remember and be patient and encouraging with him.

And the B1 -- also very good to know! I have some high quality B-complex supplements I can give him if he wants them. Tho I'm hoping we can get the bulk of his nutrition through better eating.

a reply to: raedar

Very helpful -- thank you for sharing that.

Your words remind me of the saying "faith it till you make it!" It doesn't always work out like you planned or hoped, but things do tend to work out if you keep trying -- sooner or later, one way or another.

One thing I'm being reminded of is that we are all individuals, and alcoholics are no different. We are all motivated by different things, and respond differently to various things, and the journey is different for everyone. I'm glad to understand this going in, so as not to expect this or that and not be prepared for his reality. He will have to figure out what motivates him, and what he will respond to and be able to build upon.

Well, we have the beginnings of a plan. My son is going to invite him to join us for Sunday dinner. That's actually a standing invitation, but he hasn't joined us for at least a couple years. But my son is going to extend the invitation. And tomorrow the four of us -- my hubby, son, his wife, and me -- will talk about how we'll address it. My son thinks -- and I hope -- that he'll bring up his troubles himself, and we can take our cue from him.

And on the plus side, my hubby spoke with his employers, and if/when our friend is ready to go back to work, he can go back to work with my husband. He's actually worked on my husband's crew before, so they know him, and they're happy to help him get back on his feet as well.

Thank you all for the words of wisdom, the personal knowledge and experiences, and -- of course! -- the prayers and positive thoughts. I can't tell you how valuable it all is to me, and I'm forever grateful and in awe of you all.

I'll let you know how it goes.

a reply to: Boadicea

There is no good or best time. They are alcoholic 24-7. Gotta get help w strength in numbers and try as best as you all can to band together to make your point. It will probably fall on deaf ears though.

Through no fault of yours...the brain chemistry has changed...and getting thru is the hardest part.They may listen...but thinking about the next drink while you are intervening.

Watch a few episodes of "Intervention"..I'm sure YouTube has them...and you'll see how these play out.

Never give up trying to get thru...never stop spreading the love. My mother-in-law has had so many brain cells damaged she barely remembers the last 60 yrs.

Fight the good fight, and don't stop trying. Keep up with us...I'm rooting for you.And God Bless you for caring!
MS

i dated an alcoholic. she went to detox 4 times in 2 years, but never went to therapy or meeting after. so she goes to detox, then 2 weeks later her friends 'convince' her to hit the bars again.

my friend from high school was making 120k a year, had a giant apartment, and a bmw.
now he lives on a couch freeloading.

alcohol sucks huge. i tell everyone just smoke MJMJ instead.

my friends who have cleaned up, explained the person has to realize it themselves.
while someone is an alcoholic, they are DELUSIONAL to the nth degree. that is one of the problems.

basically nothing you can do, at least i have failed all attempts.
you gotta wait for them to hit rock bottom.

30's? by 40's they will hit rock bottom.
then hopefully go to meetings and join a gym.

in fact, the only alcoholics who i know who quit, hit the gym almost everyday as a substitute.

originally posted by: mysterioustranger
a reply to: Boadicea

There is no good or best time. They are alcoholic 24-7. Gotta get help w strength in numbers and try as best as you all can to band together to make your point. It will probably fall on deaf ears though.

Okay... thank you. My son is going to invite him to Sunday dinner. We'll just have to see where it goes.

Never give up trying to get thru...never stop spreading the love. My mother-in-law has had so many brain cells damaged she barely remembers the last 60 yrs.

Fight the good fight, and don't stop trying. Keep up with us...I'm rooting for you.And God Bless you for caring!
MS

Thank you. We won't give up. We can't give up. But we may have to be patient and understanding. That may be the hardest part.

a reply to: dantanna

...the only alcoholics who i know who quit, hit the gym almost everyday as a substitute.

That's excellent advice! I've always found hard work to be an excellent disciplinary tool, especially for boys/men. Something about it seems to help them work off whatever they need to work off and then somehow focus their mind and energy... Exercise -- any physical exertion -- probably has similar effects. His city's Parks & Rec department offers a big selection of organized sports and activities for very reasonable fees. We can check that out.

Thank you!

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: KansasGirl

Thank you, KS -- and congratulations on your sobriety! I am appreciating more what a challenge and achievement that is. Good for you and brightest blessings!

I'm glad you shared your thought's on intervention. I've been hesitant to go that route, mostly because I'm afraid he'll feel ambushed or ganged up on and withdraw even further into his shell.

I did find a place that does detox. I seriously doubt he has insurance right now though. He lost his job a while ago apparently, and he's too old for his parents' insurance plan. I know of a couple resources that may be able to help pay for it though. I'm going to check those out today.

The insurance thing is one of the reasons I suggest going to a place run by your county. The one I went to was county run, so they charge you on a sliding scale, based on what you make, if you don't have insurance. I didn't have insurance. I was there for ten days, and my bill was very payable. Had I not been able to pay it all at once, they also offered payment plans.

The private rehabs and private detoxes are going to charge thousands a day and only accept people with insurance.

Definitely go the county route!

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: rickymouse

Thank you! I'm so glad you joined the discussion!!! You always have good info.

At least one of the alcohol clinics I checked out does prescribe anti-alcohol medications. I'm a little concerned about the Suboxone treatment, as it seems to have some serious possible adverse effects. Especially if he continues drinking while taking it. But the antabuse may be of value.

Thanks for the food tips. I will look for more benzo/healing foods for him as well.

Just wanted to chime in on some of the replies I have personal experience with. Anabuse: nah. He will just stop taking it if he wants to drink. I've been sobER twice. The first time for 7 years. Then I relapsed for a year, and then had the detox experience I shared in this thread over five years ago and have been sober (again) since. Before that first 7 years of sobriety, I tried so many times to get sober. In-patient treatment for 30 days. Out-patient treatment for 30 days. There was something else in there too that I'm forgetting. But after one of the treatments I took Anabuse. When I was craving booze too much I just stopped taking it and drank again. But I could tell people "oh don't worry I'm taking Anabuse" and they would feel better. So the Anabuse only works if he has already made up his mind that he is DONE. And in that case, he won't need the Anabuse because if he gets too tempted he will reach out for help before he takes a drink.

AA: it is a good program. A poster here mentioned how powerful it is for a newly sober, shaking, anxiety-ridden alcoholic to look around a room and see people who are healthy, smiling, happy, and calm, and know that they once felt and looked like him. It gives hope, which the alcoholic lost long ago.

Those first meetings affect everyone a little differently. Some plug in immediately. Others are turned off by the God talk. I was. But if the person is repelled by the God talk, they can just focus on the people there who are not drinking and used to be like the alcoholic is now. The most invaluable thing in AA is for the alcoholic to not have to explain why he drinks, and that he's in a room full of people just like him. He can tell them stuff he's done and they will just say "oh yeah, I did that too." That's the magic of AA.

There are open meetings and closed meetings. Open meetings can be attended by anyone (you could go with him) but closed meetings are just for members of AA. There will be a listing of local meetings, places and times, on the Internet. It will also state whether the meetings are open or closed.

The Suboxone treatment is usually used with people who are addicted to drugs. Is your son's friend into drugs as well? Either way, I would be very wary of Suboxone. Like with benzos, people will just end up trading the addiction of drugs or alcohol for an addiction Suboxone. I can't tell you the number of people I've sat next to in meetings who are just zoned out, and if they share, they sound drugged, and then you find out they are on Suboxone and have been on it for months and months and months. Hopefully you can find a detox who will give him a benzo to get him free of alcohol and through the worst withdrawls, and send him to wherever he is going next withOUT a prescription for benzos, but with a prescription for Trazadone so he can sleep at night.

I'm fortunate that my friend who asked me if I wanted to go to detox didn't give up on me. Everyone else had. Everyone else went to "Only she can help herself." Yes, but I needed help getting started on helping myself. The one who hadn't given up on me was another sober alcoholic. PLease don't listen to the fatalistic replies. Just one person who won't give up on the drunk can help change their life.

a reply to: Boadicea

Sorry to hear that Boadicea, my son in law went through the same thing with drugs and alcohol and took him almost 3 years to get himself where he is now

We did what we could, short of further enabling the drug & alcohol abuse to continue. Eventually paid for treatment and in-patient care which helped with the immediate cessation/withdraws since alcohol withdrawal can be fatal if not medically supervised

Seems like a lot of good people get roped into abusing various drugs, and it is unfortunate to see the effect they have on themselves and those around them. Usually the result of a handful of bad choices, sometimes years in the past. Hard to figure out what drives people, but my son in law had to eliminate things from his life that he associated with drug and alcohol abuse, went to his treatment and got into a program after he cleaned himself up

Best of luck, he is still young enough to make a change that will impact the rest of his life

a reply to: JBurns

Thank you, JB -- I so appreciate these success stories. He needs to know it can be done and has been done.

And I really appreciate your excellent point about him still being young enough to recover and make a good life for himself and his daughters. That needs to be part of my overall attitude as well. This can be a blip in the road of his young life -- not the final destination.

At this point, he was a kid longer than he's been an adult.

Thanks for being that person for your son-in-law. As a parent, I know you were doing it for your daughter (and grandchildren?) as much as for him, but it's just awesome either way.

a reply to: KansasGirl

All of this is so valuable to me -- thank you!

I've been wondering about the faith aspect of this. He was raised in a Mennonite church, and attended Christian private schools until high school. I'm really not sure where his faith is at right now. That's something I'll have to take my cue from him I guess. It won't help to push it on him, may just make matters worse.

The drugs are worrying me. I know they could be helpful, but they could go the other way just as easily. And he may not even want to go that route. As far as I know, there are no drugs involved. I am seeing that cannabis oil and high CBD oil are effective in treating the withdrawal symptoms also.

I guess the best I can do is learn what I can about his options, and then help him understand his options.

Finally, thank you for the encouragement. I won't give up. I may have to be patient and wait until he's ready. But I can do that. And when he is ready, I'll be ready too.

originally posted by: TheConstruKctionofLight
a reply to: Reverbs
For a while there everytime I fell off the wagon I returned where I left off.; more and more alochol.

You are not sober as the BAL is still there - the relief from anxiety caused by the withdrawal is what you're feeling.

Absolutely agree, the 'need' for the next drink is caused by the early symptoms of withdrawal.
Not wishing to go off topic but did you give up by cutting down or did you stop cold turkey and go through full withdrawal?
I ignored my doctor's advice not to do so due to risk of death by seizures, I just wanted to stop drinking and face whatever it was going to be like so locked myself away at home and stopped. Anxiety, sweats, intense shakes (Body and limbs), then horrific hallucinations for the last 3 days.
It took just over a week and was the wildest experience of my life, and also almost spiritual.
My body no longer wanted a drink, not just my own conscious mind, but my body and subconscious brain. It just needed to go through the full process.

Now, I wouldn't suggest anyone else do it as my doctor's told me I was stupid for ignoring them, but if you do go through the whole horrific process of withdrawal cold turkey and come out alive it massively changes you. I walk through alcohol aisle's in supermarkets as neutral as if they are the cleaning products aisle...but I can never have a drink again or i'll remind my brain what it's like and I'm never going through that experience again, I actually fear alcohol now as I do heroin, something I've never tried.

(Sorry to go slightly off-topic Boadicea but it may help you understand the dangers of just stopping if you didn't know)