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2-10 Acres with existing house and utilities

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posted on Jul, 5 2018 @ 09:23 PM
a reply to: visitedbythem

In your dreams pal,property anywhere in Calif is expensive,most growers have been growing since the 60's,there is no "price war" here I love it when someone chimes in with a ill thought foible

posted on Jul, 6 2018 @ 09:00 AM
Looking again at the op, I would say it's critical to start now, before you even have land, and get involved in your own food production. If that means gardening, then go ahead where you are and plant some food producers, even if it's in pots on your fire escape. You can compost in a 1 gallon bucket-- enough for 3tomato plants next year. At any rate, experience and skill will be your most important assets, whatever happens.

In much of the south and southwest US, you will actually get more food from a winter garden, anyway. If you start growing your own herbs for home use now, you will definitely use what you learn later when doing larger scale garden/small farm. If you grow garlic (autumn planting time), basil (on your window sill), parsley (in a pot on the porch), and some Roma tomatoes, you've got the basic seasonings for Italian food like making your own sauce and pizza.

Same with chickens. A lot of suburbs will let you keep 2 hens as "pets." The biggest thing I've had with chickens is predators; you can learn about that right now in the suburbs!

I definitely recommend getting one or two projects off the ground, and adding more as you go. Don't start by buying equipment! Your projects will dictate your needs. It will probably turn out that what you need most is a low-boy trailer and a circular saw. Then a post-holer, a chainsaw, and a come-along.

Basically, when you start to build something, you'll start making repeat trips to the hardware store. Each project will dictate the tools.

I am heavily prejudiced against ATVs. Where I live, people only bring them out when they hunt. If you were a deer, and heard "RING-ding-ding-ding-ding" right before the shooting starts, you'd learn pretty quick to clear out at the sound...

A used pickup, even an old ford ranger or Chevy s10 will do more work than an SUVs, pull a low-boy trailer, and cost less. Unless it's and el Camino, which you should be saving from farm work anyway.

posted on Jul, 6 2018 @ 09:36 AM
a reply to: amazing

Foe semi-self-sufficiency, all the things you listed are critical. I would look at how long it will take them to come to fruition.

The longest return will be fruit/nut trees. Get those planted first. Do a little research and have your soil tested to know what trees to plant and where. Soil can vary drastically within 50 feet.

Next would be fruit bushes... those will bear sooner than trees, but can still take a couple years to mature.

Next would be fencing... not just to keep things in, but to keep things out. Otherwise, you might have sticks instead of trees when the deer get through.

Then you'll need some sort of storage, so you're looking at sheds.

It is too late for a garden this year (I'm assuming Northern hemisphere), so concentrate on other things first. If you get the tractor (see below) you might want to bushhog and till your garden plot a few months before planting.

The tractor, rain collection (I agree with the others; a well is better if your property has enough water), etc. are all purchases. You can take care of them in a day or two if you take your time. For the tractor, I love John Deere, but Kubota is a pretty good deal as well. Look for something with enough horses to do what you need. You will not need a $100,000 machine; those are for commercial farms. You want one of the smallest tractors they make, maybe 20-30 hp, but not a lawn tractor. Get one with the hydraulics already in place for a blade and maybe a hoe. Make sure it has a PTO (most do, but a few do not) as you'll need that for any powered accessories like a bushhog or tiller.

I recommend both of those: the bushhog is needed for clearing out brush, and the tiller makes preparing a garden soooo much easier. Remember that you don't just need a tractor: you need the right equipment for it to pull. The tractor is just a power source for the equipment.

Don't worry about an ATV, unless you want one for fun. The tractor does much more, faster, easier, and better.

What you might want to do is to get a small pad of paper and carry it in your pocket for a month. Every time you use something, write it down (you will be amazed how fast that list grows). Every time you pay for something, write it down. At the end of the month, look back over it and ask yourself what things you wrote down you are willing to do without... what's left is what you need to have. Then look at how long it will take to get each one and start with the longer times first.


posted on Jul, 6 2018 @ 10:36 AM
Tractor loader rototiller other stuff depending on location and how far off the road you are. I ay go with about 20 HP maybe a little bigger. !0 acres isn't that big to need a bigger tractor. Get a larger tractor type lawnmower big enough to haul a 6x10 trailer to move stuff.

4 Wheelers are toys that come later unless you have the $$$

I have a 20hp Ford with loader and 5' tiller, post hole digger and rear blade.

18 HP Economy for hauling a trailer around the property or the wood splitter and trailer.

16 HP economy with a 48" deck for mowing and pulling.

4 chainsaws and a wood splitter

2 Generators 1000 watt and a 5000 watt if spit hits the fan they get sold or traded will need to learn to live without power anyway.

Have a 26 foot motorhome with generator and solar that is our backup. For $4000 it was a great investment. Keep it full of gas and propane. Will go about 600 miles if needed.

Have a couple of nuke plants nearby and Chitcago an hour away so anything is possible.

edit on 6-7-2018 by mikell because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 6 2018 @ 12:33 PM

originally posted by: amazing
Thanks guys!

I guess the goal would be to semi self sufficient, growing some crops, possible horses etc. Country living, better for the family. Look into revenue streams possibly in the future. SHTF location but I realize that I've got some limitations with that being semi close to a city. Got to get out of the Big City though and always wanted some land. We'll both be working so income won't be a problem.

How hard is pouring your own concrete for shop foundation or homemade basketball court?

In that case it can even pay for itself, providing you buy good productive land. Having ample resources to get going is a huge advantage.

I'm not big on the bug out locations, since it's pretty unlikely they will be used. I think having a way to go off grid if needed and produce your own needs is more important than a cave in the hills. You can do that near a city.

posted on Jul, 6 2018 @ 12:54 PM
a reply to: amazing

How hard is pouring your own concrete for shop foundation or homemade basketball court?

Pretty hard, to be honest. Not much in construction that is harder work than concrete.

First of all, forget mixing it yourself. You can do that with a small footing, by working along a line, but a pad... nope. You'll need a concrete truck. To get that, you'll need a way for them to get there... access. Those things are heavy, so we're talking a thick gravel drive at least.

Forget Quikcrete. That's for little spots, like post holes. You would need a truckload of Quikcrete bags to pour a little foundation, and you'd spend so much time opening bags, you would probably not be able to keep up with the curing time.

The procedure is simple: you dig out the area you want to pour, then either use dirt forms (careful digging) or wooden forms made out of cheap sheet wood held in place with 2x2 stakes. You have to be meticulous setting the forms, because you do not want any incorrect slope. You also want to pour in sections, most people use 4'x4' squares with 1/2" expansion joints between them so the seasonal heating and cooling doesn't crack the slab.

You'll need reinforcing set in the forms. There are two basic types: concrete reinforcing wire, or rebar criss-crossed and held up by short pieces driven into the ground. If using rebar, you'll need to wire each joint together with baling wire and space it about 6"-8" apart. (I use both.)

When the truck gets there, they will not spread it; they dump it for you. If you're nice to the driver, he might dump it in a few different spots. It's your responsibility to spread it out before it cures. You'll need shovels for moving and hoes for pulling, waders unless you want your lower parts to look like a statue, and plenty of help with strong backs. If you stop before it cures, you will have just paid for a big rock you now have to pay to have removed.

Finishing concrete is an art in itself. If you've never finished any, hire it done. You essentially have to work the surface with a float, back and forth, over and over, adding sprinkles of water as needed to smooth it. The motion pushes the rock deeper and draws the finer material to the surface. How much water, when, and how long do you float it? No way to tell you that here... it's an acquired art, on the job learning, if you will.

Concrete finishers are worth their weight in gold for this, and often they will handle the pouring as well... that's probably your best bet.


posted on Jul, 6 2018 @ 02:04 PM

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: amazing

I'm not sure by the way you worded it, but do you have a specific lot in mind or just a general area?

If you know the lot and the layout start drawing up plans. I would suggest a tractor as the first piece of equipment. If you have deer in your area a fence needs to be at least 8ft high, or they can easily jump it and eat all fruit tree you plan. If water won't be an issue i'd do the rainwater last. I would plant trees and get things going before you decide on how big of a greenhouse you need. Have you done this before, there are greenhouses that range from tiny to factory size. It all depends on your intended purpose, same for shop/outbuilding.

That's the problem and why I worded it so vaguely. I know the general area but won't know what's really available and in my price range until next year.

posted on Jul, 6 2018 @ 02:13 PM
Thanks again for all the replies.

Thoughts on Tractors for small land. Favorite make/model. Good price for a small used tractor?

posted on Jul, 6 2018 @ 02:27 PM
a reply to: amazing

These are the threads I love on ATS. Good questions followed by great advice.

If you hit YT there are scores of videos by people who've done what you want to do. Downside is they all cost a lot of money whether they're British or American. An upside is I've watched videos where the local community come out and help too even when 'local' covers many square miles of separation. You can't depend on the kindness of neighbours so it's a gamble. Best to get your budget planned out and allow for serious hidden costs.

posted on Jul, 6 2018 @ 03:25 PM
a reply to: amazing

John Deere or Kubota. International Harvester is a good tractor, but they're overpriced here. I like the fluid drive that Kubota has... takes some getting used to if you're used to a mechanical drive, but it seems to work good.

I did some tire-kicking for a small tractor here a year or so ago. A brand new Kubota or Deere, 20-25 hp, with hydraulics, plus a 5' bushhog and a 4' tiller, was about $20k new. Used, you might can pick up an older one for a lot less, and maybe get some extra equipment. Someone mentioned a hole digger... those are awesome if you're going to do some fencing!

Tractors don't have as much lot value as cars... you lose some value when you drive it off the lot, but not as much. They also tend to last a lot longer and retain more value. I would estimate (just a guess!) that $8k or so should get you a nice setup used. Might be a little tough to find the exact thing you want, like one with hydraulics, but yo0u can probably do it.

If used, check the tires out! They don't usually wear out before they rot out, but those things are EXPENSIVE! Especially the big ones.

Also, don't pay as much attention to the year model as you do the hours. Tractors don't usually have odometers; they have hour meters.

On another note, you will likely need a good chainsaw. I swear by my little 16" Stihl. Buy an extra chain, and keep one being sharpened at all times (or invest in a sharpener). Most places that sell them also sharpen the chains.


posted on Jul, 7 2018 @ 02:44 AM
I like Belarus tractors on principle. No formed metal; all flat so you can weld on it. Filters that can be washed and re-used. No a/c to eff with.

I also like old (80s) John Deere. Idk if it's still true, but back when I had no gray hair, JD made parts for every product they'd ever produced. A reverse threaded gudgeon for the pitman arm on a 1958 John Deere 95 combine. Rivets for an 1889 land plane mouldboard horse-plow. Chain drives for a 1932 row planter. The Solon, OH plant would shut down for 6 weeks every summer and they would make old collector parts for your poppin' Johnny.

I know a guy who converted a 1946 farm-all to run on moonshine. He says Case sent him the specs for the plugs and carburetor. He grows the corn that fires the tractor....

Thing is, don't focus on machinery. It won't feed you, but it will present itself at the right time. Focus on the egg layers, the beeves, the sows and seeds and canes that will feed you and the little ones. And don't forget hunting.

As a matter of fact, butchering is a cottage industry. If you can split a beef with your neighbors, hamburger goes down to a dollar a pound. My neighbors pay me to dress their chickens and deer meat...
edit on 7-7-2018 by tovenar because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 7 2018 @ 07:49 AM
Make detailed plans on what you want to accomplish. Look into how to outline a business plan and start with that. Include all laws you'll need to account for, local laws, tax laws, licenses, etc. Once you feel certain you have your ducks in a row, then look for a property that has most of what you'll need and that will fit your budget.

If you can get through all that, then the real work begins. You will need to dedicate your entire life to your goals and be ready to make mistakes and be willing to find solutions to any problems you may encounter. You must make this your number one priority and don't allow anything to stop you from reaching your goals. Have your plans on a schedule and stick to it. The to do list will never end, so be prepared to accept that.

There are plenty of resources online for information you'll need. Do plenty of research and make copies on your computer and on backup drives, maybe hard copies too. I suggest you look into the Survival Blog, it has lots of people that have done what you propose to do who have great advice. It has a huge data base to look through. All this will be time well spent before you commit to such a huge project.

Good luck. I hope you will prevail, it's a worthy effort IMO.

posted on Jul, 7 2018 @ 08:13 AM
a reply to: amazing

My sis and her hubby poured their own foundation for their hot tub pad. She told me the other day it's easy, just dig 4 inches down shape it put wood on sides then (the hardest part) carry/drag over the bags of concrete and empty them in. She also said if she did it again she would buy a handheld concrete mixing tool or an attachment to her battery operated drill so she could hand mix the water into the concrete. Easy peasy, so she says.

My suggestion for when you are looking at properties, get the water directly from the well tested, not from the tap. Also check the soil, make sure it is not too rocky, if not then you won't need a heavy duty tractor to do the clearing. Also, go into the forest and identify the trees for sources of food, maple or birch syrup, and wood as well as wildflowers and shrubs for food and medicine.

edit on 17CDT08America/Chicago02680831 by InTheLight because: (no reason given)

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