Europe is a bigger enemy to Israel than Islam

originally posted by: justdust
a reply to: nwtrucker

I believe that Israel is the only country given a deed to the land by God himself.

Yeah but God took it away because of their sin
Broken covenant?

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: justdust
a reply to: nwtrucker

I believe that Israel is the only country given a deed to the land by God himself.

Yeah but God took it away because of their sin
Broken covenant?

Something like that.

originally posted by: justdust
a reply to: nwtrucker

I believe that Israel is the only country given a deed to the land by God himself.

And that should be your first indication that something is really f'd up.

It's totally outer limits that we support this insane country for prophecy, oil, & military bases. In that order.
Keep religion out of our politics. For the millionth time.

originally posted by: DieGloke
a reply to: nwtrucker

So what ? You want the USA to Bomb Europe?

The EU is the worlds biggest trading block. Country's like the UK have shed blood alongside your countrymen and supported the USA when in need.

You want to throw relations away for Israel (A pretty significant country by comparison) because these country's wont sycophancy support Israel like the USA?

What has cause this hate in the USA for EU country s and allies?

Sure another Dresden!!

All across the EU.

Let Russia help them.

a reply to: alldaylong

Having a balanced view on what is going on between The Palestinians and Israelis does not make the people of Europe an enemy of Israel.

They are "balanced" alright.

originally posted by: okrian

originally posted by: justdust
a reply to: nwtrucker

I believe that Israel is the only country given a deed to the land by God himself.

And that should be your first indication that something is really f'd up.

It's totally outer limits that we support this insane country for prophecy, oil, & military bases. In that order.
Keep religion out of our politics. For the millionth time.

None of your post applies to the creation of Israel, though. Granted, it ended up f'd up, but is that all Israel's fault? I think not. Europe picked a side. In general, Europe has empowered this situation both by ignoring the ongoing terrorist acts, right up to the day before yesterday with the mortar attack, with no 'resolutions' condemning Iran, Syria or Hamas but right on top of any response by Israel.

Personally, I don't buy into biblical motivations, whatsoever. Granted, Israel is no angel. Then again, if my survival was at stake, you can take it to the bank I wouldn't be any 'angel' either...

a reply to: MaxMech

To be fair, politically, the only difference between them is the democracy has the 'potential' of doing positive acts and is not particularly 'reliable' itself....

a reply to: nwtrucker

You do know The State of Israel was created by England and other European countries ?
what about the Akeshenazi Jews of Europe from Germany and France which make up about 2.8 million people in Israel alone ? even more in the states etc....
Israel is a European Creation

originally posted by: JokerThe1st
a reply to: nwtrucker

You do know The State of Israel was created by England and other European countries ?
what about the Akeshenazi Jews of Europe from Germany and France which make up about 2.8 million people in Israel alone ? even more in the states etc....
Israel is a European Creation

Yes. It wasn't a condemnation either. Merely an observation. It's just another point in the European history dealing with first Jews and then Israel and Jews.

Every single nation in that region is an artificial creation. Completely arbitrary. Sykes-Picot assured it. The whole mess of the ME is a European creation. To this very day.

P.S. The whole point of the thread is if one sees how it started and acknowledges the fact of it, it just may open the door to solutions rather than this continuous and unending crap!

originally posted by: nwtrucker

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
a reply to: rickymouse

Israel has no issue w Muslims in their country... They already have many working, living and owning businesses there w no problem.....

Their issue is w Hamas and extremists....

I've been to Israel, there is quite the Muslim population, contrary to what media or others would have you believe.

That being said..... I don't agree w the OP

he apparently doesn't know how the state was founded or the history, the borders made, or the fact that indeed it was originally a two state solution.... And the US DID recognize that resolution initialized by Europe

Soooo?

Sorry you need to check out the original territories given the State of Israel in '48. The U.S. abstained in the original U.N. vote. Go earlier, sir....

Sorry, but I'm still confused. What original UN vote? Are you still referring to UN Resolution 181?

a reply to: AngryCymraeg

Sorry but I don't recall the number or the exact date. Perhaps as an earlier poster stated it was the '47 vote.

a reply to: AngryCymraeg

I suspect you are aware of some aspect that I am not. If that is the case, I'd appreciate a direct correction sans any 'confusion' comments.

a reply to: nwtrucker

This subject is of huge complexity there is so many factors to take into consideration here.
some of the major factors in this are Zionism,Freemasonry,the 1st and 2nd world wars,Akeshenazi jews from the middle ages(European Jews),Palestine which i might add has a big christian population(many just think Islam and Arabs) also that in truth when we refer to biblical times and Jews these people were more than likely black and not what we see in these areas today in fact you can still find some black Palestinians who are slowly(quickly) being wiped out.

A large portion of the hate directed at Jews over the centuries can be linked to Zionist propaganda and the very clever but stupid position of being The Lords chosen people although i must point out here that the old testament over and over again states that the lord is the god of Israel/it's people not everyone else but for them only!
what i find so interesting is why have so many jumped on the band wagon claiming this Lord as there's also when they are not from the Jewish race.

Every group/religion that has been and yet to come with the position that they are better than others not of there faith/belief will suffer from the same tarnished brush(people do like to be excluded)

The solution is the truth and the acceptance of but trying to find that truth in this boiling pot of lies,death and murder is a monumental task and will be met by huge opposition from very wealthy,greedy,heartless human beings who like nothing better than watch the little men fight and shed blood while filling there own self appointed pockets.

And dare i say it if we want a true representation of biblical Israel then these lands belong to neither European Jews or Arabs, both are trespassers.

Also a little food for thought the word Holocaust is a Jewish word meaning - Sacrifice to God - the word was used in the old testament translations of old before it got messed with some more. this sits very uncomfortably with me personally, the many that died where a sacrifice to god! seriously what kind of garbage is that ? was this a sacrifice for the acquisition of the lands of Israel after the war ended ?
this would sit very neatly for the heavy occult influences of the day in Germany,England,France etc... not to mention Baal
this rabbit hole sucks i am coming up for air before i go to far!

a reply to: JokerThe1st

My first reaction to your post is it seems to that you've looked for reasons to align against the state of Israel and perhaps Jews, in general.

In all honesty. I've taken the opposite tack. Living in North America, I do not require an 'education' on first nation's religious beliefs to acknowledge that they 'got the shaft'. I couldn't care less about biblical arguments. I do believe that Jews-albeit as a fait accompli- deserve to keep the homeland that was given to them.

Simply put, the erasure of an Israel would create even more and worse problems than applying the 'Law of possession' does.

As virtually every country in the region is an artificial creation, again thanks to Europeans, i see serious hypocrisy in moral judgement and diatribe regarding Israel and not the rest.

Next, every religion has a built in smugness...I include the 'religion' of secular humanism... and in my experiences, Jews have never been a faith that's 'in your face' with that smugness and certainly nowhere near the levels of Christianity and Islam have often reached.

Zionism. Here's how I view it. I am convinced there never would have been a Zionist movement if the Jews living in Europe had been treated in a 'Christian fashion' from the onset. They would have been satisfied with where they lived and eventually would have flourished and prospered. That was not the case, was it? My understanding is the money traders, as they were forced into becoming, that formed that group were known as 'the group with no name'. (My understanding is limited, to say the least.) The goal was to form an Jewish state. If one has a problem with calling that goal a noble one, it is equally a stretch to call it an evil one. Fairly reasonable, methinks.

Fast forward, whether that goal has significantly altered or not is beyond my knowledge. Preserving the state of Israel is an obvious one. Now the meme is anything that is even remotely questionable is dumped into the 'trash bin' labelled 'Zionist'. It looks to me that attacking 'Jews' is not P.C. largely due to WWII and attacking 'Zionism' or Israel, itself, has replaced it.

You see complexities. I see a few simplicities. I tend to the 'keep it simple,stupid' mentality or, if you prefer, Occam's Razor.

Simply put, I see Europe as the source of the ME ills and, to a large extent, the continuance of those ills. I'm not suggesting some guilt trip, here. Merely that if my view is accurate, that might open the door to a balanced, even handed solution somewhere down the road.

I'm not holding my breath, though.

a reply to: nwtrucker

and there it is the anti-Semitic banner being thrown my way albeit in a underhanded way and for what ? for stating some uncomfortable truths you seem to want to ignore, also how on earth can you say your not interested in biblical arguments when the whole situation out there is based on them, not to mention both Islam and Christianity are based on Judaism,freemasonry is Judaism for the gentiles/Goyim (you know this word?)

And my point concerning the Akeshenazi Jews of Europe is that they are European imposters claiming a genesis that is not there's
as far as Zionism goes there is plenty of self proclaimed Zionists out there with very questionable goals and comments made over the years, why not look into it ? oh that's right Zionism is just a cover for anti-Semitic sentiment (really!)

and also my post quite clearly states i believe neither European jew or Arab belong there, is that one sided ?
Also who put Hamas in power ??? was it per chance Israel ?

Just want to address a couple of other points here also

''They would have been satisfied with where they lived and eventually would have flourished and prospered. That was not the case, was it? My understanding is the money traders, as they were forced into becoming, that formed that group were known as 'the group with no name'. (My understanding is limited, to say the least.) The goal was to form an Jewish state.''

please show me where and when they where forced into money lending (loan sharking) ? also if they where treated badly from the outset which i am not even sure is the case maybe we should ask why? and at what point do you believe in history these people were first persecuted or treated unfairly purely based on there race?

also the formation of the state of Israel in itself i do not view as evil but the lengths and actions taken to achieve it could very easily be seen as so especially as the evidence of a grand play paid out in blood and suffering is so heavy, which i might add is often discounted as anti-Semitic propaganda.
people are petrified to speak about this subject without a bias nowadays due to the heavy witch hunting that happens.
when my research began in this subject many years ago i was heavily sympathetic, the evidence of what i have found speaks against such sympathy in many ways.

originally posted by: JokerThe1st
a reply to: nwtrucker

and there it is the anti-Semitic banner being thrown my way albeit in a underhanded way and for what ? for stating some uncomfortable truths you seem to want to ignore, also how on earth can you say your not interested in biblical arguments when the whole situation out there is based on them, not to mention both Islam and Christianity are based on Judaism,freemasonry is Judaism for the gentiles/Goyim (you know this word?)

And my point concerning the Akeshenazi Jews of Europe is that they are European imposters claiming a genesis that is not there's
as far as Zionism goes there is plenty of self proclaimed Zionists out there with very questionable goals and comments made over the years, why not look into it ? oh that's right Zionism is just a cover for anti-Semitic sentiment (really!)

and also my post quite clearly states i believe neither European jew or Arab belong there, is that one sided ?
Also who put Hamas in power ??? was it per chance Israel ?

I can only go by your post, sir. I saw nothing that suggests, hints at or acknowledges the fact that the Jewish origins are Judea.

No, it doesn't matter to me one whit what the Bible states. It doesn't require a bible to know where the Jewish people come from. It is a historical fact which you seem to marginalize. One doesn't need a bible to confirm that fact. Does one?

Those that use the bible as some sort of source is their business. I am not among them. Nor will I succumb to your efforts to turn into a biblical debate.

While the thread is opinion based, it is empirical, not biblical.

You have your views, I have mine. There's more diverse peoples/tribes than land. The Kurds number 25 milliom and have no homeland. With help, the Jews have carved out their homeland. It's done. I would have it remain so.

a reply to: nwtrucker

Israel just has to blink an eye, and Germany (gov) gets on its knees - they still feel the weight of history.
In France, the elites are totally pro-Israel (maybe not as much as US). Or maybe I should re-phrase, they are leaning towards Israel.
Example:
When some shops got broken during a demonstration in Paris, FR gov called it ultra violence.
At the same time, 52 people got shot in Gaza by the Israeli army, FR gov called it clashes.

EU gov are on thin ice for internal politics.
EU has a large muslim minority, which is of course supporting Palestine. Therefore when it comes to internal affairs, EU govs are more careful.
Several ministers in FR gov are / have been Jewish.

Their reaction is also giving away their position when someone gets attacked in the street:
. a Jewish person being attacked, within 5 minutes they all tweet against this "antisemitic attack".
. a black or arab person gets attacked, this is racism, takes a bit longer to get reaction from gov
. a Chinese gets attacked... well media don't even speak about it (happened recently in France, it got in the media because the Chinese community demonstrated in Paris).
. a white guy gets attacked, all you her is "you were at the wrong place at the wrong time" - happened to me several times.

Note: I don't want to start a race war. Attacking someone in the street (or anywhere else) is bad, whatever the race, gender, culture, skin colour, religion, etc. of this person is.

Regarding the elites, many (at least in France) are Jewish.
E.g. Marcel Dassault, the founder of Dassault, the FR airplanes - who by the way just passed away - was Jewish.

I guess you are thinking that EU govs and elites are anti-Israel because of the vote against the embassy move to Jerusalem?
As mentioned earlier, EU govs (except maybe Poland and some other easter EU) are leaning towards Israel, but not 100% behind every Israel move.

I find it objectively difficult to claim that EU is a bigger enemy of Israel than islam.
In EU, extreme right groups have shifted most of their hatred from Jewish to dark skinned people/muslims.


peace

a reply to: JokerThe1st

P.S. You claim the Zionists have questionable goals? Please prove that. Individuals? Please. That's comparable to...say..Hitler being a vegetarian and using that point to condemn all vegetarians.

Jews aren't monolithic any more than any religious group is.

Lastly, your comment that Zionist created Hamas exposes you. You tried the religious approach and when that received no traction you waxed indignant and threw that laughable effort regarding Hamas.

The fact is Israel could walk over Syria, Lebanon and Jordon any time they choose to. They could take the land, or any amount of it they chose and none could stop it. They don't need a Hamas when it clearly causes casualties amongst their own peoples and nation.

Ludicrous.

a reply to: nwtrucker


Europe has always been an enemy to the Jews, 89 expulsions, 109 occasions. No wonder the Jews want to destroy Europe via mass immigration .
They won't get their way without destroying themselves.
I call that fair justice, it will happen anyway eventually, never mind.
Bye Bye Israhell.

a reply to: nwtrucker

exposes me lol
oh and nice chuck in of the good old Hitler mention there buzz words to hit peoples soft spots,oh quick mention Hitler that always gets them.

your point regarding how Israel could walk over other nations and none could stop them is a real exposure of your views unlike the one you accuse me of by misquoting me as well (sloppy)

oh here is one
"The thesis that the danger of genocide was hanging over us in June 1967 and that Israel was fighting for its physical existence is only bluff, which was born and developed after the war." Israeli General Matityahu Peled, Ha'aretz, 19 March 1972.

another
"We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population." Israel Koenig, "The Koenig Memorandum."

also found this pretty quickly just for you

By 1986 the Brotherhood controlled 40 percent of all the mosques and the 7,000-student Islamic University in Gaza. At the time, Israeli authorities saw the Brotherhood as a counterbalance to the secular PLO and contributed to the Brotherhood’s cause through favors and donations to mosques and schools.3 Israeli donations to the Brotherhood were reported to be in the millions of dollars.4

When Hamas emerged from the Brotherhood, however, it turned out that Israel had helped create an enemy motived not only by the nationalism of the PLO but by the religious fervor of Islam.

and please feel free to actually answer some of my questions as well