Trump has exposed Democratic hypocrisy on prison reform

BTW the count I live in has 179 thousand people in it and 45,000 outstanding warrents .
This should show you just how corrupt it really is EVEN sin city its self VEGES which has over 3 million people only has 68,000 .

a reply to: rickymouse

Heres the thing, rickymouse.

The most left wing politicians of any note that you have in your country, are corporatist, capitalist appeasers with NOTHING, not a damned thing, in common with anyone who could accurately be called "far left". Even Bernie Sanders is not FAR left, he is just good old fashioned left, and even HE is not as left as is required to correct the horrific injustices and imbalances in the system in America.

He is nearly there, but not quite. I would go as far as to say that you have never met a member of the far left, because there simply are not more than a few handfuls of them in all the states of America, and those that do exist, are not in positions of power, prestige, or in command of any kind of a platform to operate from.

The DNC and the Democrat Party more broadly, are penetrated by corporate entities and interests, from top to bottom and side to side, with so few exceptions as to be irrelevant, making them precisely the same as the RNC and Republican Party, save for the identities of the companies who have purchased their favour being somewhat different. It really does not matter, because ANY corporate involvement with a political party or voting bloc, removes its legitimacy as a far left outfit. If there is any corporate money in it, then there is no far left near it, because the far left is allergic to the existence of a power over and above that of the people, whether that power is military, political, or financial.

With that in mind, what we are really looking at here, is a situation where one group of dodgy, corporate sponsored, traitorous hacks, is calling out another dodgy, corporate sponsored, traitorous group of hacks, for being dodgy, corporate sponsored, traitorous hacks. Its the kettle calling another kettle black, not a kettle and a pot. Its like identical twins sitting there calling one another ugly across a table.

Until your country has a strong leftist tradition, you will not be in a position to identify its agents very well. You see, this is where the UK and European nations have the edge, because we have actually had a NUANCED and VARIED history of political discourse, ranging from the left to the right and back again. That is why, when someone from the UK or Europe says "This person or that person is a member of the far right/left" we are correct to say as much, because our cultural history has prepared us correctly to make such discernment. No one in the United States, other than those whose origins are from without the nation, will EVER be able to say that, not currently at any rate. The states has NO experience of dealing with the far left, it has no history of containing significant numbers of people who could be considered far left, and too damned few who have even the benefit of being accurately described as genuinely left leaning.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha

originally posted by: nwtrucker

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: nwtrucker


Schools don't put kids in jail. Judges do. That's where the sentencing guidelines and requirements come in.

Your the one who cited a "School to prison pipeline", not me.

Yeah, and I don't see it being addressed in this bill, among other things that have to do with HOW people get to prison in the first place, sentencing.

Sentencing has EVERYTHING to do with prison reform.

Nope. Not at all. Sentencing has to do with Judicial reform, not prison reform. The latter is to reduce repeat offenders returning to prison 'no matter the length' of their sentence.

a reply to: Grambler

Thats pretty damned noble of you...

Kudos.

So, have you looked over the proposals as they stand? If so, do you believe they go far enough in attempting to solve the problems with the prison system, to make arguing for improvements less worthwhile than simply allowing the proposal to pass?

The Dems have been introducing bills to allow felons to vote. Just as in Europe. What happens in Europe happens in the states. They know this is all about a new voting demographic.

originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: underwerks
a reply to: Grambler
Thanks for posting the actual Democrat response. It seems in reality the Democrats wanted better prison reform than Trump was willing to offer, but somehow you’ve spun that into Trump exposing Democrat hypocrisy.

I think you’d make a great republican politician.

Yes they wanted more, so they are against things they want.

It is hypocrisy.

If trump says "I want Obamacare rolled back and I want abortion made illegal!"

And the democrats say "Ok we will roll back Obamacare"

It would be hypocritical nonsense for Trump to say "I refuse to accept your rollback of Obamacrae, because it doesnt give me everything I want!"

It would be clear at that point that Trump wanted to play politics more than he cared about helping people from rolling back Obama care.

I guess if you’re thirsty and somebody pees in a glass and hands it to you and you don’t drink it, you’re a hypocrite.

Hypocrite!

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: Grambler

Trump should come out as "Pro Oxygen" so leftists would stop breathing.

glad to see the lexicon changing from liberals to leftist

As soon as I read that Meek Mills was not attending the prison reform summit because Jay Z called him and told him the optics would be bad if he went. I knew that certain factions on the left were gonna go into overdrive and double down on more nonsense.

Prison reform is needed. Who cares whose name is behind the effort. Or if there is a little D or R next to their name. All that matter is that the reform starts to happen. But you know the optics are bad so lets shoot ourselves in the foot.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: nwtrucker


Schools don't put kids in jail. Judges do. That's where the sentencing guidelines and requirements come in.

Judges don’t put people in jail...people that commit crimes put themselves in jail.

Also, if you want to stop prison overpopulation then don’t criminalize victimless crimes. Unless there is a victim of person or property there shouldn’t be a crime.

Trump will have his private corporate prisons and I will be able to make a great living ratting out traitors for cash.

I know who the smarty pants traitors are by the way they comb their hair and those ugly brown shoes!!

And don't think the supposedly internet privacy and anonymity will protect you...it won't!!!!....believe me.

Fascism...you're gonna love it!!

originally posted by: underwerks

originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: underwerks
a reply to: Grambler
Thanks for posting the actual Democrat response. It seems in reality the Democrats wanted better prison reform than Trump was willing to offer, but somehow you’ve spun that into Trump exposing Democrat hypocrisy.

I think you’d make a great republican politician.

Yes they wanted more, so they are against things they want.

It is hypocrisy.

If trump says "I want Obamacare rolled back and I want abortion made illegal!"

And the democrats say "Ok we will roll back Obamacare"

It would be hypocritical nonsense for Trump to say "I refuse to accept your rollback of Obamacrae, because it doesnt give me everything I want!"

It would be clear at that point that Trump wanted to play politics more than he cared about helping people from rolling back Obama care.

I guess if you’re thirsty and somebody pees in a glass and hands it to you and you don’t drink it, you’re a hypocrite.

Hypocrite!

M
And there we have it.

The measures suggested to have programs to teach inmates job and life skills to help them succeed when they get out is just “pee in a glass “

Disgusting

a reply to: nwtrucker

Nope. Not at all. Sentencing has to do with Judicial reform, not prison reform.

The Judicial Branch of the government runs prisons.

Federal prisons are ran by Bureau of Prisons which is under the Department of Justice
answers.yahoo.com...

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: Grambler

Thats pretty damned noble of you...

Kudos.

So, have you looked over the proposals as they stand? If so, do you believe they go far enough in attempting to solve the problems with the prison system, to make arguing for improvements less worthwhile than simply allowing the proposal to pass?

Doesn't go far enough? Really? When the Dems had control, the was no 'prison reform proposed by the left. Now it doesn't go far enough. Nothing but blocking initial improvements.

You know it. You still support that view. Disappointing.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: nwtrucker

Nope. Not at all. Sentencing has to do with Judicial reform, not prison reform.

The Judicial Branch of the government runs prisons.

Federal prisons are ran by Bureau of Prisons which is under the Department of Justice
answers.yahoo.com...

Fair enough. Then what you desire is Judicial reform. What thi bill addresses is specifically what is done for the prisoners. For their rehabilitation.

Your against that...interesting.

originally posted by: Metallicus

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: nwtrucker


Schools don't put kids in jail. Judges do. That's where the sentencing guidelines and requirements come in.

Judges don’t put people in jail...people that commit crimes put themselves in jail.

Also, if you want to stop prison overpopulation then don’t criminalize victimless crimes. Unless there is a victim of person or property there shouldn’t be a crime.

The Judicial Dept and Judges put people in jail. There are tons of white collar criminals who judges choose not to imprison. So, your mantra, people put themselves in jail, doesn't work.

Prison reform will be corporate prisons.

Guess who has a bigly stock investments in private prisons? Pence perhaps?

thinkprogress.org...


www.usatoday.com...

It's just a matter of time until FEMA will be sold to a private investment group like Gobal tel link...

www.motherjones.com...

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: Grambler

Thats pretty damned noble of you...

Kudos.

So, have you looked over the proposals as they stand? If so, do you believe they go far enough in attempting to solve the problems with the prison system, to make arguing for improvements less worthwhile than simply allowing the proposal to pass?

No it doesn’t go far enough at all in my mind

I would start by ending the war on drugs

Then I would place heavy emphasis on seeking to help rehabilitate non violent offenders as opposed to forcing them into a life of crime in violent prisons

I would focus on rehab programs, job training programs, in these prisons

I would end for profit prisons

I would push for the most humane treatment possible for people incarcerated, although understanding gather criminals would require harsher plans to ensure safety

I would work to ending the stigma of it being hard to hire criminals, with opportunities for programs to be committed moneyed outside of prison to clean up records

Now this plan does not do anywhere near enough

But it does offer training programs, and is a step toward reforming our prison system from just being a brutal place designed only for punishment, to a place designed to keep people incarcerated and safe by to encourage and help them to become successful members of society

What the program suggested does not do is offer anything COUNTER to what I want

In other words, it’s not enough, but I would still support this plan as a first step

These dem politicians are just against it because they want to be against trump, and they are refusing a good first step for cooperation to help solve this problem

As reported by CNBC, the bill would “require the federal prison system to evaluate inmates after sentencing and provide services to help them avoid becoming repeat offenders, including drug treatment, job training and mental health counseling.”

I can see why the democrats, or anyone else that is concerned about prison reform, would not take this seriously.

Literally, all of the things listed are already integral parts of the prison systems. Hell, this is basic stuff that was pushed back in the 80's.

The problem is not that the prisoners are not getting what they need while incarcerated. The problem is the system that leads to them being incarcerated to begin with.

This is common tactic when it comes to bills and such. They name a bill something with an emotional tie or a feel good purpose but when it is found that the bill does not do as advertised, or misses the point in what really needs to be addressed, they bash people who disagree or do not support it over the head with it.

The Patriot Act is a great example.

This is normal, slickster politics from the Right.

Person: "2+2 = 4"

Leftist: "I can agree with that."

Trump Supporter: "2+2 = 4"

Leftist: "GOD I HATE YOU, YOU IDIOT! JUST DIE ALREADY! LIAR!