An honest unusual discussion about firearms

a reply to: enlightenedservant

Study Al Capone and the alcohol driven mafias of the Prohibition Era. They were plenty bloody. One of the tourist features of Union Station in Kansas City is the site of the Kansas City massacre which saw the violent gunning down of four law enforcement officers by criminals seeking to free a buddy of theirs being transported to Leavenworth.

The 1930s were a very violent era between rum rummers, the Mob, and the bank robbers in the Midwest.

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: Edumakated

If a concerted effort was put in place to eliminate firearms, then even in urban areas, the death rate would surely decrease.

There would still be multiple issues regarding inner cites, but deaths by firearms would be reduced.

If that were true, then you wouldn't have the UK talking about banning knives which have now become the weapon of choice for violent crime.

I think it does come back to violent people will be violent.

There was a highly publicized road rage incident coming out of my neck of the woods where in older man who had served time for murder stabbed a 23-year-old to death and fled the scene. No guns, but he was still murderously violent.

People still get murdered without guns just a lot less often.

The talk about tighter rules on knifes (not a ban) comes from an increase in stabbings in London. However overall homicide rate for London still remains way behind that of the US.

a reply to: ScepticScot

Is it less often because people just would never pick up the knife and stab someone? Or is it that people choose the tool that gives them the least risk, and the gun typically fits that bill?

Then again, there could be untold thousands of poisonings that go completely undetected. To a skilled hand that is pretty low risk.

Still, you ever heard the expression "don't bring a knife to a gunfight"? Thats why more murders are committed with guns than knives. Most people are stupid, but they aren't idiots.

a reply to: Kryties

Good lord you can't help yourself, can you? So many dramatic declarations about being done, but you keep coming back.

Still does not mean that it's right nor does it contribute anything to intelligent conversation.

It's the Mud-Pit. If you're going to insist on decorum, go to another forum. Mocking a loaded question is perfectly acceptable in this forum, whether it offends you or not. If you can't come up with an intelligent response to a comment that wasn't directed at you, perhaps you should simply ignore it.

The fact you're defending it so hard is proof positive that it is your only intention on this website - to silence and mock. Your desire to mock people says everything I need to know about you.

The fact that you're continuing to make things up about me so that you can attack me for them is proof that you're consistent about employing fallacies in an effort to be right about something. The fact that in one comment you manage to both acknowledge that I mocked a question but then go on to claim I attacked a member is proof that you're utterly incapable of creating a rational, factual argument and would instead rather continue to focus your white-knight efforts on attacking me over things you're making up.

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: ScepticScot

Is it less often because people just would never pick up the knife and stab someone? Or is it that people choose the tool that gives them the least risk, and the gun typically fits that bill?

Then again, there could be untold thousands of poisonings that go completely undetected. To a skilled hand that is pretty low risk.

Still, you ever heard the expression "don't bring a knife to a gunfight"? Thats why more murders are committed with guns than knives. Most people are stupid, but they aren't idiots.

I think it's that guns make it easier both psychologically to attack someone and also increase the lethality of the attack.

I completely agree with the point that guns don't by themselves kill people. What they do is escalate situations that otherwise may just have been an argument or an assault.

originally posted by: Shamrock6

It's the Mud-Pit. If you're going to insist on decorum, go to another forum.

You, and a handful of others, are simply using the Mud Pit as an excuse to mock, abuse and insult.

It's pathetic. Get a life.

a reply to: ScepticScot

People still get murdered without guns just a lot less often.

In Australia, knives have outpaced guns used in homicide for decades, including for years before the gun laws were changed. While the gun laws have, arguably, lowered the number of homicide by firearms the number of homicide by knife hasn't really changed much other than year to year fluctuation.

a reply to: Kryties

You, and a handful of others, are simply using the Mud Pit as an excuse to mock, abuse and insult.

Mock a silly question? Yes, that I did. Abuse and insult? No, sure didn't.

It's pathetic. Get a life.

You're the one that keeps coming back to it after you say you're done with it. Is this the part of your "tactic" where you keep things going by endlessly giving us your personal opinion about me in the hopes that eventually I'll wander off, at which point you can interpret the lack of response as a victory for yourself?

And overall homicide rate of Australia is a fraction of that of the US.

Reducing gun homicides doesn't decrease killing by other types, It could even increase it. What it does do is decrease the overall homicide rate.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: enlightenedservant

Study Al Capone and the alcohol driven mafias of the Prohibition Era. They were plenty bloody.

Now let's replace Capone's and the alcohol driven mafias of the Prohibition Era's guns with "knives, bats, chains, etc." as the other poster said. Would more or fewer people have been killed by them?

originally posted by: Shamrock6

You're the one that keeps coming back to it after you say you're done with it.

Says the guy that keeps replying back to me.

Do something with yourself other than sit in a basement mocking and abusing people for your own sick enjoyment.

a reply to: Kryties

I'm not the one that keeps saying I'm leaving and not coming back. Nor am I the one that keeps trying to picture what the other person is doing, or is like in certain social settings.

That's pretty weird.

originally posted by: Shamrock6
a reply to: Kryties

I'm not the one that keeps saying I'm leaving and not coming back.

Never said anything of the sort. Now who is making stuff up?

Nor am I the one that keeps trying to picture what the other person is doing, or is like in certain social settings.

That's pretty weird.

I never said I was picturing you, I just made an assumption. Your lack of denial certainly goes toward it being a true assumption.

originally posted by: enlightenedservant


But if you went back in time and gave each of their members modern guns, would they kill more or fewer people?

They would have killed period. I always wonder why we do not set a max speed of 35 across the country...it would save lives, would it not.

In the big picture we are talking about forcing safety scissors on the population because they can not walk/run with real scissors without hurting themselves or others, or at least that is what many/Government think.

We can bubble boy everyone up all nicely, and still people are going to kill each other. I have always said that a truck is much more dangerous than a gun if a person wanted to mass kill.

a reply to: Kryties

Never said anything of the sort.

Sure you did.

Keep up the insults and abuse and you'll get nothing from me.

After which you repeatedly claim I'm insulting and abusing people. That was followed, many comments later, by

I shall not be continuing further with you

Now who is making stuff up?

You, when you said you didn't say things you said. No worries, you've still got a lock on making things up.

I never said I was picturing you, I just made an assumption.

Sure

Your lack of denial certainly goes toward it being a true assumption.

Because a denial of things you're making up is going to work, right? You'll change your stance thanks to a denial of your current platform of continuing to attack me? Riiiight.

a reply to: ScepticScot

It takes committment to kill someone up close and personal, or at least i'd imagine. I loathe conflict, and certainly have no desire to ever experience the gruesome. I'd assume that most people who are normal feel the same way.

Any projectile makes that a bit easier, psychologically. Gun, arrow, sling with a ball bearing. Maybe even an ignition button. You do it over here, they die over there...much easier psychologically. No doubt.

a reply to: Shamrock6

See now you've gone and proven you cannot read correctly. I CLEARLY said "you" not "the thread" when I said "I shall not be continuing further with YOU"

Got any more nonsense to have a whinge about? Or are you going to go off and mock some more people?

a reply to: Kryties

See now you've gone and proven you cannot read correctly. I CLEARLY said "you" not "the thread" when I said "I shall not be continuing further with YOU"

Heeeey, great! You finally caught up! Yes, you said you were done engaging with me, multiple times. If I was unclear when I said "you said you were done" it was because I presumed you would recall saying you were done engaging with me more than once, so I didn't need to specify exactly what you were done with. Not once did I say you had claimed to be done with the thread, because that's not what you said. I'm glad you got yourself caught up with that.

Got any more nonsense to have a whinge about?

I think you're confusing yourself on who said what again. One of us has consistently whined about the words of the other, making things up that weren't even said in the process. One of us has consistently pointed out the fallacies employed by the other. (Here's a hint since you seem to have already confused yourself again: I'm the second guy. That should narrow down which of us is the first guy)

Or are you going to go off and mock some more people?

Are you going to keep saying you're not going to engage with me but then continue to do so? Are you going to keep making things up, to the extent that you contradict yourself within the same comments?

We may never know

a reply to: Shamrock6

Move on mate. You're acting a little obsessed. Might be time to step away from the computer and look out a window. That big round thing in the sky? It's called "The Sun".

Honestly, the amount of time you've spent crafting those replies to me is worrying, given that it's nothing but a big long whinge. Get some fresh air.

a reply to: Kryties

Move on mate. You're acting a little obsessed.

Coming from the guy who's said he won't talk to me anymore, that's a wee bit ironic.

That big round thing in the sky? It's called "The Sun".

Indeed. Your display of knowledge is masterful.

Honestly, the amount of time you've spent crafting those replies to me is worrying, given that it's nothing but a big long whinge.

You shouldn't think so little of yourself. You're worth seconds of somebody's time.