The stages of Empire collapse and why.

Human society seems to have problem that wont go away, it might be some thing to do with the essential psychological makeup of the human species, when it tries to organize itself into bigger and bigger societies with a central control. First their is the energy phase, which establishes the society as something apart from a lose group of farming families, then it grows and can get to the size of the Roman, Turkish Ottoman , Soviet, Or us the American Western Empire. But the result is always the same, the Democratic Republic, turns into Military dictatorship, then their is "overreach" which leads to economic collapse, for the Romans it was plating the copper Denarius with silver, with us its printing more money. The Military dictatorship which has taken over the Republic, the same as Caesars when he crossed the Rubicon, is well established since the Second world war and is now calling the shots, where the Senate just in the days of long past talks democracy and freedom, but practices the opposite.
How long has the new Western Empire got left before the inevitable collapse. Who knows? but judging from the past historical models , which we should have learnt from, it seems to appear to be in its last stages., of the economical collapse stage, it never ends quietly, and even now Generals are calling for a change in the Constitution to allow troops to police the populous.
The eight thousand military bases in the US, and the eight hundred overseas, will have the same problems, as did the collapse of the Western Roman Empire did in 400ad.why should it be any different.
This vid by an eminent professor, made in 2007 lays out the stages of collapse which is handy for any prepper who might realize it instinctually, but would like a more historical handle on the present situation which is unfolding.

a reply to: anonentity

This American Empire you speak about, how many countries outside of The U.S. do you have political control of ?

How many countries outside of The U.S. fly the Stars and Stripes over their Government buildings?

Until those things happen. The U.S. does not have an " Empire ". It's all in your imagination.

a reply to: alldaylong


The reality is that when America says jump, you ask how high. I that's not an Empire by any other name what is? If you don't jump you get whacked, one way or another.

The English used to have an empire of which the U.S. was a part, however, the U.S. itself has no empire nor have they ever so this doesn’t apply.

originally posted by: anonentity
a reply to: alldaylong


The reality is that when America says jump, you ask how high. I that's not an Empire by any other name what is? If you don't jump you get whacked, one way or another.

Where do you live where this is somehow your reality? Even California doesn’t pay attention to the U.S. Government and they are supposedly a member state.

a reply to: anonentity

Let me explain what an " Empire " is.

The 13 British Colonies on North America where controlled politically and economically from London.

So which countries does The U.S. control outside of The U.S.? Answer none.

What The U.S. has is political and economic " influence " That is not an Empire.

As a footnote, which countries has The U.S. actually bought into their very existence ? Answer None.

The British Empire bought New Zealand, Australia, Canada and to a greater extent The U.S. onto this planet.

What we are experiencing the last five years or so convinces me that the USA is about to collapse. We have way too much nuclear power to be collapsing, who gets those bombs and what will they do with them when they get them. I am sure that some will be sold to the highest bidder.

Nice post, don't mind the grammar police, it's hard to illuminate the effects of overreach in America today. Before globalism an entity was tied to geography (nationalism). Now it's not, so to say America will follow the path of historical downfall is somewhat flawed due to the ease of relocation by the money. Not saying there is not commonality ( German immigrants into western Rome, inflation caused by over printing money etc) America will perhaps follow the fall of the ussr, California becoming its own separatist nation state like Ukraine. I know that I don't know.To the question of what country does America own? How about Puerto Rico. Just my thoughts.

a reply to: anonentity

Good post OP . I haven't watched the vid yet or don't think I have but wanted to make a comment and post a vid . How Empires rise and fall is a interesting subject for me as of late . I think it might be important to keep in mind the modern day State differs from ones in the past . What we call today Native populations are a mix while in the past they were either Native based on their mother tongue . Those distinctions are blurred it would seem . So for instance we see African American as well as Irish American and the list goes on . Immigrants making the main body of the population .

It has been noticed that Original Native peoples demographic has a healthy growth rate as well as groups with a strong family orientation . Any how this vid is a important one to keep in mind when looking at the big picture

a reply to: rickymouse

I'm gonna somewhat disagree with you on your speculation. You have the right pieces with the wrong outcome -- no collapse in sight. Look back to 1929 through 1944. We realized that the war triggered the largest expansion of the middle class in US history. Expect another bloody war before any sort of collapse.

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: anonentity

Let me explain what an " Empire " is.....
...
The British Empire bought New Zealand, Australia, Canada and to a greater extent The U.S. onto this planet.

If you believe The Crown still collects taxes from the treasury then I suppose by your definition the empire is run by the de Rothschild family.

originally posted by: drewlander
a reply to: rickymouse

I'm gonna somewhat disagree with you on your speculation. You have the right pieces with the wrong outcome -- no collapse in sight. Look back to 1929 through 1944. We realized that the war triggered the largest expansion of the middle class in US history. Expect another bloody war before any sort of collapse.

That is how some of the Democrats think we should fix this, start a war with Russia. The Vietnam war was started to stimulate the economy, that did not work so well. I think the internet will bust attempts to use war to fix the economy, we die in wars, not the leaders who get us into the wars. Sacrificing people to boost the economy sounds so primitive. But the ones who make the weapons love that, and they are too important to get drafted to fight and die too.

I suppose I am on some list now.

a reply to: Commoner123


The salient points of an Empire in decline , is in all probability on who has the power and how they use it. Power is a two edged sword, because if you have it loosing it is not an option, so you only have a few things that you can do. All Empires at a certain stage use the same tools and end up running out of options. The American Empire is no different as far as the psychological makeup of the ruling class , and the tools they use to retain power is the same from antiquity. Because the basic human psychology hasn't or is never likely to change. Sure communications are faster than the past, which will only speed things up.
The signs are all around, the distractions with the "Bread and circuses" the modern day sportsmen getting paid the same rate as the charioteers in the old hippodrome. The currency degradation. etc. Theirs a point where purchasing loyalty , turns into demanding it .Simply because the resources run low. When this happens, the worst is felt in the provinces, in this case Mexico Venezuela Brazil Ecuador, the easy fiefdoms. The homelessness and decay in major industrial cities, the growing unease with government, which makes it illegal to produce your own power and collect your own rainwater, or use your own garden to produce food. So that you are tied into a system which makes you indebted .They wont give up power easily they never have and they never will. That's why in the end it collapses, the most interesting point I got from the vid, was where a female soldier in Iraq was asked why she was here, she said something to the effect." I couldn't even get a job in Wallmart back in America, here I have a job" . If AI has to go it will, because if people cant have skilled and live meaningful productive lives , you haven't got a society anyway, the present system cant supply that. The Bankers know it and so does the military but their is nothing they can do about it, because they would have done so by now.

Currently under the new digital era, money pops out of nowhere. Cashless society is coming, but not fast.
No country will collapse any soon anymore unless famine hits hard which no one wants. The is a call for weather/chemical/biological warfare. The reason US is losing is because it is doing those type of warfare especially on other countries. As soon as more US planes/US secret planes dropping chem trails are blocked from all around the world, the better. God forbids US to win under false freedom in fake democratic capitalism. The world is re-aligning itself to the East for protection. Even aliens sees US as a major threat to the planet.

What you implying about US military in a dictatorship is exactly true. No US citizens have access to any lands or information of freedom/free press in US military bases since the Cold War started. Area51 is a prime example. Even WW2 vets calling US a fascist state now. If we had a lot of WW2 vets alive in their 30's, they'll be putting up arms and doing a revolution right now in the US.

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: anonentity

This American Empire you speak about, how many countries outside of The U.S. do you have political control of ?

How many countries outside of The U.S. fly the Stars and Stripes over their Government buildings?

Until those things happen. The U.S. does not have an " Empire ". It's all in your imagination.

US had been caught red handed to control through Regime change/puppet regime in which they keep losing control because it is very difficult to control them when it comes to religion or different race.
As for Europe it is under NATO command. Go check who controls most of NATO. Even European civilians don't like it and see it as puppet army being used against Russia rather than neutral.

The only reason why Asia remains divided is because of US unwillingly to end wars. North to South Korea. PRC to ROC. US bases in Japan, Thailand, Malaysia and Philippines is actually occupation from old colonial war eras.
US did try the South to North Vietnam but failed horribly as they could not get majority of the Viets to align. We have Duterte threaten to kick them out.

Did you know US supported Pakistan against India? So, you can't blame China for Modern Pakistan. If Pakistan doesn't exist, then maybe China would've backed off except the Tibet issue. Tibet will always remain yellow, and never brown. Sorry Indians, but that is the truth. India is by far the most untrustworthy ally during that time. It couldn't choose who to align with properly. Only survived for having a big population. The whole reason India lost to the British first place from the British Raj.

In all, US is still an empire of expansion through puppeteer.

originally posted by: drewlander
a reply to: rickymouse

I'm gonna somewhat disagree with you on your speculation. You have the right pieces with the wrong outcome -- no collapse in sight. Look back to 1929 through 1944. We realized that the war triggered the largest expansion of the middle class in US history. Expect another bloody war before any sort of collapse.

All brainwashing. The US back then isn't the US today. There were less corporate control over everyone. The Gov had major power over companies or corporations. The war forced all the rich to start hiring for the war effort for protection. That is the reason middle class rose. Today its direct opposite. The rich > Government. Therefore not of the people. A WW3 will mean total collapse of US from its true form. All conscript will be like mercs and waste their lives away. We already saw this in Vietnam War, but this will be even worst. Go and conquer for your corporate landlords men.

Very interesting

If America doesn’t have an empire then what is it doing trying to invade Cuba, invading Grenada, and Panama and messing around in the ME with wars and interventions.
Sure they have an empire, just not by the traditional overt means of the past like the British or Roman Empire


Russia had an empire under the Soviet Union which has been taken down.


In fact the so far short-lived American empire may be the greatest one in history and the shortest one in history.

a reply to: anonentity

The West doesn't have long. It has indeed become tyrannical, but tyranny first starts in the hearts of the people before it reaches they heights of governmental authority. As horrible as it may be, collapse is a necessary fail-safe to protect the world against total consolidation of global powers. This is why I stopped buying into the Illuminati/NWO conspiracy theories. It's just the human nature of individuals to become socially entrained into a living field of evil, which is ultimately projected upward, to create an equally evil system of government. Like you said, it's a flaw existing deep within our psychological structure.

originally posted by: rickymouse

originally posted by: drewlander
a reply to: rickymouse

I'm gonna somewhat disagree with you on your speculation. You have the right pieces with the wrong outcome -- no collapse in sight. Look back to 1929 through 1944. We realized that the war triggered the largest expansion of the middle class in US history. Expect another bloody war before any sort of collapse.

That is how some of the Democrats think we should fix this, start a war with Russia. The Vietnam war was started to stimulate the economy, that did not work so well. I think the internet will bust attempts to use war to fix the economy, we die in wars, not the leaders who get us into the wars. Sacrificing people to boost the economy sounds so primitive. But the ones who make the weapons love that, and they are too important to get drafted to fight and die too.

I suppose I am on some list now.

"This is how some Democrats think we should fix this, start a war with Russia."

Wrong.

Thank you for not referring to us as "leftists," though - the latest iteration in the ongoing attempt to make us "less American" than our conservative betters.

No, no democrat thinks that we should be starting a war with Russia to build the middle class. No democrat thinks we should be starting a war with Russia over anything. Just bc we would like to see the investigation play out and find out just exactly what Russia has (if anything) over Trump, doesn't mean we want war. We do want to see Russia's obvious expansionist plans checked. We do prefer France, the UK, Germany and such to Putin and his ilk.

No, to build the middle class we advocate the same things that built the middle class in the post WWII era, and it wasn't "cutting taxes and getting government off people's backs" - it was actually, relatively high taxation, huge public investment in education and infrastructure, a strong commitment to unions, higher wages (the minimum wage was 25% higher in the 60s) and an end to legalized corporate money in politics. So long as Citizen's United remains the law of the land, no one should be surprised when both parties act with corporate good as their overriding interests.