Manned Space Exploration...Why?

a reply to: rickymouse

Bravo!!

Someone who truly understands!!

Bravo!!

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

This thread isn't about dreams and hopes, it's not about fantasy...it's about reality.

The reality, like it or not, is that we are going to Mars. Period. The only thing that can stop us is if humanity doesn't survive long enough, in which case we wasted nothing by trying.

When Robert Fitzgerald Kennedy announced we were going to the moon, there were a lot of people who poo-pooed that too. It's too far, we're too needy a species, the tech isn't there, it's too dangerous, we don't know what we'll find... well, we went anyway. And because we went, we now have cell phones and the Internet.

No one knows what nice little toys we'll develop along the way this time.

So we'll go to Mars, and we'll come back, and we'll decide from there what to do next based on what we learn. Then we'll fight over where else to go, and when we finally get another visionary for a leader, we'll go there too. And people will say it's impossible, it's too far, we're too needy a species, the tech isn't there, it's to dangerous, we don't know what we'll find...

There's your reality.

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

Heh...okay...rewind all the way back to the start...because it's cool

"needy" is very correct though, and I don't doubt your prediction.

ETA...how many humans do you suppose will (ever) set foot on Mars? 1/ten billionth of a percent of mankind? And, will they represent you, your family and your heritage?

originally posted by: Flyingclaydisk
a reply to: rickymouse

Bravo!!

Someone who truly understands!!

Bravo!!

I think he shot completely off the mark.

Space exploration, including manned, is all about advancing pure knowledge, and developing technologies that would allow us to do so. Space exploration started with great minds like Tsiolkovsky and Korolyev, and has nothing to do with "making a good living".

NASA currently has a small fraction of the Federal budget, but uses it to bring us knowledge about space and planet Earth, and many useful technologies that we use down here.

a reply to: wildespace

Once again, for the umpteenth time, this thread was never about "space exploration". No, this thread was all about "manned space exploration"! (please refer to the very title of the OP!)

Manned Space Exploration...Why?

How many times do I have to make this clarification before people get it???????? Sheesh!!!

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

I do not know. Maybe no one who ever knew anyone who was ever related to my family will go, maybe my grandson will be one of the first settlers and have a statue erected to him in the center of the first Mars colony. My crystal ball isn't working right now and I'm having trouble finding a repairman.

I do know one thing, though... assuming humanity lasts long enough and we decide to settle on Mars...

The settlers will represent my species.

TheRedneck

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Oh, one more prediction... a couple generations from now, someone will start a thread on ATS claiming that the Mars colony is not real, and that what we see on the news is actually filmed on a movie set in Beijing.

Just adding that in for posterity.

TheRedneck

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

I've long held to the idea that we don't really have the choice not to. We think we're being intrepid whereas it's more likely we're being driven by genetics. Seeking out and occupying new environments is what life does at a very basic level.

We might have all the free will of a dandelion seeds even though we love to believe otherwise.

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

This thread isn't about dreams and hopes, it's not about fantasy...it's about reality.

The reality, like it or not, is that we are going to Mars. Period. The only thing that can stop us is if humanity doesn't survive long enough, in which case we wasted nothing by trying.

When Robert Fitzgerald Kennedy announced we were going to the moon, there were a lot of people who poo-pooed that too. It's too far, we're too needy a species, the tech isn't there, it's too dangerous, we don't know what we'll find... well, we went anyway. And because we went, we now have cell phones and the Internet.

No one knows what nice little toys we'll develop along the way this time.

So we'll go to Mars, and we'll come back, and we'll decide from there what to do next based on what we learn. Then we'll fight over where else to go, and when we finally get another visionary for a leader, we'll go there too. And people will say it's impossible, it's too far, we're too needy a species, the tech isn't there, it's to dangerous, we don't know what we'll find...

There's your reality.

TheRedneck

Mars is an immediate neighbour. Is that the limit? Immediate neighbours.

What about "to infinity and beyond"?

Lets look at that.

4.3 light years away. That's more like space exploration.

earthsky.org...

Unfortunately it's only around January 2014 light that we're seeing coming from there. For all we know. It might not even be there anymore. And, the further we look. The further back in the past we're seeing. These far away planets we want to conquer might no longer exist. Or, not be where we think now.

So. Manned space exploration would only be possible with our immediate neighbouring planets. IMO.

a reply to: blackcrowe

At present it is only possible within our solar system. Our furthest drone, Voyager, is still not clear of the solar gravitational field.

The future will bring what it always brings: new ideas, new techniques, new technologies, and new understanding. Then we can talk about 4.3 light years away... or maybe 4.3 million light years away. Who knows?



TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

It's less likely the more you look at it.

It's a little like Schrodinger's cat. You don't know if the cat is alive or dead. Same with the stars. You have no idea if they're even there anymore.

Sending probes/drones would still have challenges. 1 being. Signals only travel at light speed. It would take nearly 9 years to send/receive data from just 4.3 light years away.

It's good sci fi.

a reply to: blackcrowe

Problem is, you're only looking at it from one perspective: the present state of the art. Yeah, in that perspective, we don't even know if it is still there.

But ten years form now we'll have a different perspective. In 100 years we'll have a different perspective from that. Ever heard of quantum entanglement? That's faster-than-light travel. We don't understand it... yet. One day we might, and be able to move faster than the cosmic speed limit normally allows.

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

That sill doesn't alter the fact that we don't know the position of or if a target planet still exists because the light we see is years ago.

Quantum anything won't change that.

But. The future will offer new possibilities.

Mining space will be a good idea. But, even then. We can use machines. In our immediate neighbourhood of course.

originally posted by: Flyingclaydisk
a reply to: wildespace

Once again, for the umpteenth time, this thread was never about "space exploration". No, this thread was all about "manned space exploration"! (please refer to the very title of the OP!)

Manned Space Exploration...Why?

How many times do I have to make this clarification before people get it???????? Sheesh!!!

Unmanned space exploration outside of our solar system becomes almost useless. The distances makes communications near impossible. Lets say you tried to use radio signals the power needed to maintain communications would easily exceed our world wide energy usage. And think you would need to do this on both ends. So ok let's try to get off cheaper with focused lasers. Problem becomes the further the craft goes the bigger we would have to make the receiver. Lets say you tried to pick up lasers from Bernards star. Choosing this because it's diffrent you would need a collector the size of Jupiter. Obviously that would be very expensive and only work for one way communication.

Any probe outside the solar system would have to return to be useful. And even in best case scenario humans would be needed to collect supplies and return. But the biggest problem is with current technology the best we could do is a couple of hundred years and require the entire GDP of the planet for decades.

Now people want to always bring up warp drives. Yes in theory they could reach other solar systems in a couple of years. Bernards star for example about 4 not bad for interstellar travel. But there is a huge problem with warp drive technology that we done see on star trek. When the ship reaches its destination it has to stop. And that’s when all hell breaks loose. Physics tells us that the warp drive would create a huge problem. Interstellar space isn't empty and as our warp bubble moves along its going to collect this interstellar particles.

When the ship slows down out of warp acxording to Researchers from the University of Sydney when our ship decelerates from superluminal speed, the particles its bubble has gathered are released in energetic outbursts. It creates huge gamma ray bursts,large enough to destroy a planet. So we would travel to another solar system to meet aliens and kill there entire civilization. Anuthing in front of the craft would be gamma ray and high energy particle blasted into oblivion due to the extreme blueshifts. Even worse there doesn't seem to be a limit on the devastation the longer the flight the more energy it collects to the point of destroying the solar system instead of just the planet.

So let's hope some aliens don't visit with warp drive technology or we are in trouble.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Robots to the rescue !!
www.dailystar.co.uk...

Space mining set to produce world’s first TRILLIONAIRE in galactic gold rush

SPACE mining priceless asteroids is set to produce the world’s first trillionaire, it has been predicted.



A galactic gold rush has been predicted for some time, with experts saying teams will race against each other to collect precious metals from space rocks.

Earlier this year, physicist Michio Kaku described asteroids as “flying gold mine[s] in outer space” that could replenish any metal shortage on Earth.

Examples of valuable asteroids include one rock measuring 3,000ft across that contains $5.4 trillion worth of platinum.

And now it is predicted the first trillionaire will make their fortune in outer space.

There is so much useful stuff if we could just find the motivation/desire/money to get off this rock..

originally posted by: dragonridr
Any probe outside the solar system would have to return to be useful. And even in best case scenario humans would be needed to collect supplies and return.

Not really. In the 1970s the Soviet Union sent probes to the Moon that returned samples, today we have much better technology to do the same thing in a completely autonomous way. In the near future we will have even better conditions for doing it.

Send the homeless.

Give them a whole planet.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

the main reason is so that our species arent wiped out instantly by one ELE

we currently have all of our eggs in one basket and if humanity is to survive earth , and space we need to think BIG !

and that means having more than one human colony!

and that is the be all end of all space exploration, that and EGO

originally posted by: sapien82
a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

the main reason is so that our species arent wiped out instantly by one ELE

we currently have all of our eggs in one basket and if humanity is to survive earth , and space we need to think BIG !

and that means having more than one human colony!

and that is the be all end of all space exploration, that and EGO

4.5 billion years old. Life is thriving on planet earth.

Despite many ELE's.

We're better protected here than most places in our solar system. Let alone outer space.

We have a large moon which we can see has protected us.

A nice atmosphere to break large debris down into smaller very precious rocks.

We have the ionosphere and troposphere protecting us from harmful solar rays.

It's not bad here.

Maybe we could build some tech to help prevent an ELE.

And this.

originally posted by: blackcrowe
a reply to: schuyler


Good Lord. The IDEA that we could GO EXTINCT is NOT rocket science. Hello? The probability that an extinction level event will happen in Earth's future is 100%. If we are not off the planet and out of the solar system by then, we go extinct. Period.

So. We find a suitable planet. How do the odds differ that an extinction event won't happen there? Or, along the way?

Seriously people?!

You think we will not send or be in want of volunteers to go to space?!


An ELE? Meh. # happens.


We are hard wired to drive our ships to new lands. Maybe we meet our match or not.

Better than cowering in a corner, right?