The Plastic Bag Scandal

a reply to: EvillerBob

However Sainsbury's already over charge for most daily products, so technically or rather blatantly they are still charging everyone the same if not more.

originally posted by: skalla
a reply to: BlackProject

Why would you need someone to provide you with a bag and then claim you have no other choice in what you do?

That is utterly stupid.

Think for yourself, take a frikkin bag that will last years.

Is it so difficult?

Not talking about myself, however it is the shops requirement to provide adequte means to move products you buy from the shop to your car. Hence the reason they give you a shopping trolly or basket. So yes, if this is all they provide that is their problem pushed on us.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: BrianFlanders
Nonsense?
It is a fact that plastic bags and plastic generally is slowly harming ocean life.
For that reason I support a reduction in use. But keep your blinkers on and call it nonsense.

It is nonsense. As you are claiming reducing plastic is therefore our problem. If all gas stations was to only provide diesel, you can only buy diesel. Then you would have to drive a diesel car, however there is a choice. Most shops do not offer this choice at a reasonable cost. Therefore it is the shop and the government allowing plastic bag manufactures the ability to keep producing. As I say, paper bags would suffice.

a reply to: BlackProject

Which bit are you saying is nonsense? Plastic is massively damaging marine life, that is a fact.
Or do just like using words like 'nonsense' even when you have no case to argue against an assertion?

originally posted by: BlackProject

originally posted by: skalla
a reply to: BlackProject

Why would you need someone to provide you with a bag and then claim you have no other choice in what you do?

That is utterly stupid.

Think for yourself, take a frikkin bag that will last years.

Is it so difficult?

Not talking about myself, however it is the shops requirement to provide adequte means to move products you buy from the shop to your car. Hence the reason they give you a shopping trolly or basket. So yes, if this is all they provide that is their problem pushed on us.

Bahaha, now that is nonsense!!
It is not a requirement of the store, they offer it because they think customers want it. Don't blame the supermarket for your own failings to be environmentally aware and taking your own means of carrying whatever you buy from the shop to the car.
LMAO 'It's the stores fault I use the throwaway plastic bags!' Never read anything so ridiculous.

Carlin on plastic...

Nuff said...

Ocean.si.edu

EDIT

originally posted by: badw0lf
a reply to: CthulhuMythos

Have you heard about the islands of plastic in the oceans gyres? thousands of miles wide, and even larger deep. And the problem with plastic, is that as it sinks lower, it breaks down into small particulate that becomes microscopic, becoming a toxic sludge like soft plasticine.

So the small sea creatures ingest the toxins. The big sea creatures ingest the small sea creatures. The bigger sea creatures ingest the big sea creatures. The large fish eat the bigger sea creatures. And we catch and eat the large fish, which have accumulated the toxins from all the way down the food chain.

Of course I know of the large island the size of Manhattan made up of plastic bottles etc - not just poly bags. I would like to know how all that got in the sea in the first place. Is it being dumped there by cruise ships? By ships who are supposed to be taking it to China for 'recycling' and who don't want to use all their fuel doing so after being paid to haul it so they just dump it out in the middle of nowhere?

Yes I know about bio-accumulation, you think it is only plastic that is accumulating in fish? You don't think mercury has been accumulating in fish for decades? Yes I know the creatures of the sea are suffering from this, but plastic is just one problem, and is less in size compared to the other toxins that are being put in the sea deliberately by industry. What about all the corexit that was dumped after the gulf oil spill? Did that soak up all the oil and make it go away? No, it dispersed it from the surface where it could be seen to the bottom of the sea where it sits as a toxic sludge which due to the toxicity of corexit was worse than the crude oil in the first place.... but it made the water look safe again, out of sight out of mind, eh?

What I am saying is 5p bag tax is NOT GOING TO FIX THINGS. All it does is make people think they are 'doing their bit' to help save the planet, when in reality it is not making a dent in the toxic problems that are being created by big industry who can lobby/pay off regulators to look the other way. Look at the fracking industry, how they are allowed to use fresh water to make their toxic and very corrosive mix that is pumped into the earth and can get into the water table. They don't use saline because it corrodes their pipes. FRESH WATER!!! And they are getting away with all that contamination, not to mention the health problems it causes those who live around where they have a fracking plant.

If our governments were really that bothered, they would make all supermarkets/shops use bio-degradable bags, would make all beer/canned drinks manufacturers use an edible material for linking their cans together instead of the plastic 'ring' mesh that is used now. There would be trawlers going out to the huge floating plastic island sifting it out of the water and bringing it back to feed 'garbage to fuel' plants which can turn it back into gas, oil and water. They would demand manufacturers reduce their packaging, especially plastic packaging or face large fines.

But no, let's not invest in any of that, let's not put the cuffs on big industry or the military to get them to clean up their act..... let's just put a 5p bag tax out there so that it looks like they are being pro-active whilst letting their industrial sponsors get away with it all.



Edible wrapping

edible seaweed cups

originally posted by: BrianFlanders

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy

originally posted by: BrianFlanders

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: BrianFlanders
Nonsense?
It is a fact that plastic bags and plastic generally is slowly harming ocean life.
For that reason I support a reduction in use. But keep your blinkers on and call it nonsense.

Well, we could talk about giving out free condoms to reduce the number of people (and therefore the need for more resources). Good luck with that.

Completely different topic and a sidetrack on your half, but for the record Britain actually does give out free condoms and other forms of contraception to anyone who wants it...so good luck with that dude lol

Not a completely different topic. More people = more everything that people produce. Including more pollution and more waste.

The condom suggestion was actually kind of a joke but you could make a policy out of it by making sure everyone knows how and where to get free birth control and free abortions 24/7/365 and then set a limit on how many babies are allowed to be born in the world on any given day/week/month/year. Now, if you want to tax people for damaging the planet, tax them for reproducing and nip it in the bud.

And I mean a heavy tax that will suck like 1 million per child. And also raise the taxes on all the baby supplies like bottles, diapers and so forth. Let's say a 90% tax on diapers, which are definitely going to end up in the trash. And that's before those little monsters grow up and start generating adult-sized portions of waste, pollution and so forth. And everyone will sit around and wonder why taxing plastic grocery bags didn't do anything.

Sorry I missed this at the bottom of the page.
I can't say I agree with you though, sounds like pseudo eugenics to me. I support the UK National Health Service providing 'free at the point of transaction' contraception, from condoms to the coil, and everything in between.
Perhaps your country should offer free contraception, then the overpopulation you fear could be addressed?

EDIT
You are personally responsible for being a plastic consumer, same as me, so I buy as little plastic wrapped/contained products as I can.
That is the issue, and the topic of this thread, start another one about overpopulation if you like, It's an interesting subject.
This thread is about the plastic bag/corporate/government scam.