Reaper Kills a T-72 in Syria

15 more Russian's among SAA killed in (Deir ez-Zor) from a weapons cache explosion.

a reply to: all2human

don't forget about the artillery that was destroyed as well and the crews firing them

a reply to: wileel

This was a new incident, an apparent booby trapped weapons cache
Rumours are that the SDF have left the area to bolster forces in Afrin and handed over control to regional forces.
The SAA and allies have amassed more troops in Deir ez-Zor, one would assume they have manpad's, though I believe they should hold the line and concentrate on Damascus instead of trying to take territory in the adjacent oil fields, for obvious reasons.
I'm baffled why the Russian's/Syrian's have not activated their S-3/400 anti-air systems in response, unless there is a disconnect between Syria and Russia or unknown counter measures are being employed.

a reply to: all2human

The artillery was taken out the same time frame as the tanks, they were actively firing on our guys....the weapons cache I wont comment on.

I think bringing online anti-air defense systems would be a really bad call for them and implicate the Russians more. Right now there isn't any air defense worth mentioning...not sure who has control of it but any system brought online would quickly be dispatched if it showed any hostile intent.

a reply to: wileel

I don't see how it would implicate Russia as they are there on legal grounds and have just cause to defend their countrymen, where within the borders of Syria the USA doesn't.
Though I agree it would exacerbate the situation, given Syria intends to retake their country, it is well within their right to do so and without impediment confront and eliminate ISIS.
US forces, in contrast, have been placed in an uncomfortable position where by holding ground and engaging Syrian forces they are violating there oath to the constitution and international law.

a reply to: all2human

Wouldn't you say the same for US countrymen in Syria? The way I see it US and Russia are in the same boat...maybe implicate was the wrong term.

Serious question...how do you feel Russia has the right to be there fighting and the US is violating international law or the constitution?

You nailed it, the US forces there are in a crappy spot to operate in. We agree that this whole thing is a s#it show, and its a hard one to sort out (for me anyways). I can appreciate all sides but we really need to keep ISIS from gaining ground so I feel THAT should be the primary concern...unfortunately I don't rule the world. If they (whom ever they are) need a hand taking on ISIL I'm personally ok with the US, NATO, or anyone for that matter supporting the effort.

a reply to: wileel

To be terse,They Russian’s were invited
The constitution requires congressional approval.
US forces holding territory and engaging Syrian army cannot be legally defended.
I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States

Drone Kills.Not a new thang...

a reply to: all2human

But I think you left out the most important part;

...against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me...

Those guys with boots on the ground are just doing their job as they are directed to. We aren't committing war crimes, atrocities, or anything cruel/unusual unlike others have in that area. We are in country (in very small numbers) pushing back against terrorist groups who has been identified as the enemy, same as what we are doing from the air everyday in several countries.

In this instance those attacks were response to units actively firing on our people which is just, no matter who is pulling the trigger IMO

Again I agree that those guys on the ground are stuck in a total s#it show ...there are way too many pieces of this puzzle that make this operation complex as hell when it comes to who is against who

a reply to: wileel

Just doing their job and breaking domestic and international law
They have a duty to refuse any unconstitutional order.
The term and concept of ‘war crime’ are all acts constituting a violation of the laws or customs of war, irrespective of whether the conduct is criminal.
The active participation of overthrowing a sovereign government without authority, Giving Aid and Comfort to an enemy without congressional approval is (starts with a T and rhymes with reason)
Syrian troops are not terrorists, the PYD/Pkk is however and are recognized as so by the very gov supporting them.
www.dailysabah.com...
aa.com.tr...

a reply to: all2human

I don't know about your military service, but it doesn't work like that in the real world that I have experienced. We aren't talking about a bunch of supply troops here who need "time out" cards, these are mostly SOCOM folks who get to see the picture of what's happening WAY clearer than the general public. These orders are coming down from the top so holding anyone on the ground libel for treason is a stretch, this is an operation that has been approved, much like many others across the globe

There are two parts to this discussion, the boots on the ground and the stuff happening in the air above.

As for the ground, I personally don't have much more insight on what's happening than most do. Its convoluted at best but I do believe the bulk of people are in training rolls....teaching exactly who, to fight who...well I'm not sure, but I will say they are cleared to defend themselves.

For the air operation, I can say that we are targeting and engaging ISIL we are not actively striking Syrian forces. The tank/artillery strike was in defense and justified.

If Syrian troops used chemical weapons on non military targets is that not a breach of the customs of war and cause to be considered a terrorist act? I don't know...but should be considered unacceptable IMO. This whole thing is a mess but its nice to be able to actually discuss/debate it here.

a reply to: wileel

Treason as defined is ANYONE giving aid and comfort to the enemy
HIMARS is not a defensive weapon, there is no debate, nothing you can bring up can be defended if the operation is illegal.

I'll tell you what's on the ground, Currently The USA is occupying and "defending" HALF of Syria's land mass against the Syrian government, they are supporting the SDF/YPG , amongst it's ranks are the PYG,PKK, not to mention the elephant, ISIS , There is wide support (by reputable sources) that it's a US Proxy, You say the Operation in Syria has been approved, please tell, by who's authority?
Excuse me while I don't hold my breath for your "aha" moment.

I congratulate you for admitting a Lack of education about the Syrian war, but if you can't accept facts , you've officially graduated to belief.
with that I bid you adieu

a reply to: all2human

If this is going to be a pissing match, I'll gladly bow out and let you believe what you want...no skin off my back in the slightest but it wont all be facts.

I'll try and help out since it appears you have been misinformed...no debate here, these are facts

HIMARS was not used to strike the tanks or artillery that were targeted in defense of our folks, that was from the air.
HIMARS can be a defensive...as can ANY weapon
You have no idea of the ROE for that operating area, so you are not in a position to comment on how people are defended

Do I need to give a specific name of who approved this operation, because I cant (way above my pay grade) and don't need to...but I would assume SECDEF would be in the loop and I can guarantee SOCOM is. We have operations happing ALL OVER THE WORLD that the general public has no knowledge of

Just because you don't know the details don't assume people are traitors. You (or the general public) may not be privy to the details for good reasons...maybe not... Much like any job, in any company, the higher you get the more you come to realize why things are done at the lower levels. Something as simple as sweeping a work area. As a new troop its a waste of time because it will just get dirty again....at the top level you see that the sweeping saves millions of dollars a year by preventing FOD damages, equipment wear and injuries. Do we second guess additives in gasoline, or why components in cars are made of certain materials...no...we take faith in the system knowing someone way smarter and better informed is making decisions based on what they know.

It seems you mind is already made on holding everyone involved guilty of treason so I shouldn't waste any more of your time discussing it...time will tell, if you are correct there will be thousands of people on trial, I wouldn't suggest you hold your breath for that either.

Its not like we (Military and Contractors) just decide to pack-up, leave our families and head off to some unfriendly corner of the world and start blasting. I would have thought that this would be obvious even to some one who has no military experience. This is funded...to get money you need approval...the logistics alone is not a trivial thing. How did the people and assets get there is not...did we buy our own tickets and ship our own of equipment?

Absolutely I am not an expert on the Syrian situation when it comes to any ulterior motives or , but I don't know of many who are...we agree this is vey complex. I'm glad you have "reputable sources" but I can assure you we are not "occupying" half of Syria's land.
Keep an open mind, what you see on the news and internet might not be the same as others do. Please don't assume everyone in the forum is sitting in their comfy home playing armchair quarterback and aren't close to or seeing what's actually happening day after day.

I don't think that EU-NATO plan in Syria for this weekend will go anywhere.

Also the upcoming ceasefire is not going to work due to EU-backed terrorists being still present in Syria.

a reply to: Flanker86

What has happened was several hundred people were killed via airstrikes, therefore a temporary ceasefire was proposed and voted on in the UN for humanitarian reasons. All you're saying is that you're opposed to a ceasefire for humanitarian reasons because you would rather they keep bombing the city to destroy the enemy, though that enemy are to my knowledge may include extremists.

Or do believe this will simply help them regroup?

I am still learning here but iirc, the west tends to support two main groups: SDF/YPG. And Opposition/Anti-Government forces. iirc, some of the latter group are extremists, some are moderates. Who exactly are in eastern Damascus?

Also how's the weather this time of year in Vladivostok?