Science, Enlightenment, and going Nuts

a reply to: DaRAGE

When scientists say things like, "nothing really exists until its observed", what they really mean is, "we haven't got a clue as to how things really came to exist, and that scares us, so we're gonna pretend to know everything and make up some non-deterministic BS to fill in the cracks."

It's nothing to go nuts over.

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

But when they show that those observations create the past then it is different. Did you even read the science part of it? It is not just that scientific experiment. Other scientific experiments have found the same thing....

It is the "release of information" to the observer that changes the history of an atom... or the things that make up what we percieve as reality. Future events change their past... based on the release of information..

But even the information given to me or anyone else... based on these facts... is also in question. Because all i know is my own aweareness... any information i know is created by my own awareness. Everything doesnt exist... not really. Am i the source or just part of the source or just connected to the source... the reality i experience is just a vastness of nothing. A boundless void. Filled with nothing but my own awareness. Not even "my" awareness... just awareness in general.

a reply to: DaRAGE

The article you linked was poorly written. It's not easy to visualize the described experiment. Nevertheless, atoms are made of components that are essentially waves, so it should not be shocking that a single atom behaves like a wave (destructive and constructive interference patterns). I think the "particle" label we use is just a way to describe a wave under confinement in a turbulent field of interfering waves.

In order to say the release of info changes the past, we would have to know all of the factors involved. It would have to be an experiment without any kind of variables. We are not advanced enough to conduct Quantum Mechanical experiments without variables.

I'd like to see more (better written) articles corroborating that astounding claim.

reality doesnt exista reply to: BELIEVERpriest

reality doesnt exist


Search google and you will find them

reality doesnt exist

a reply to: DaRAGE

So they basically saw waves acting like waves. Everything is a symphony of waves colliding and harmonizing. The notion of a particle is the illusion. That's why the experiment seems like a paradox.

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Just because I think you would enjoy it if you don't already know it:

Sweden 2008 Electron

a reply to: Peeple

I did enjoy that. Thank you.

originally posted by: DaRAGE
a reply to: badw0lf

No it wasnt. It was created after the fact. Thats what the science says...

No, it was in a state of being unknown. That is not not the same as not existing.

And we use that state now, in quantum computers. Which do exist whether or not, there is an observer.

You can even use one for free, online, right now.

IBM Q Experience

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: DaRAGE

When scientists say things like, "nothing really exists until its observed", what they really mean is, "we haven't got a clue as to how things really came to exist, and that scares us, so we're gonna pretend to know everything and make up some non-deterministic BS to fill in the cracks."

It's nothing to go nuts over.

No one has said they know everything. You using "why are there apes now, then?" logic.

I think, if you take the blinkers off, you'll find that science involves not knowing things, and trying to figure them out. If the conclusion is not all conclusive, keep looking.

Unlike the "god" aspect of things, which is case closed by belief.

originally posted by: Incandescent
There is no experience without an observer.

Imagine if every single person, animal, insect, bug and every other type of creature (all life forms) disappeared. Would a forest still exist? Arguably, no it would not.

But more arguably, yes it would.

a reply to: DaRAGE

the caveat is in your OP source :

reality doesn't actually exist until we measure it - at least, not on the very small scale.

its NOT talking about macro objects - but quantum phenonemon

a reply to: skunkape23

since the tree is alive why would it require observation ?...inanimate objects on the other hand maybe

a reply to: DaRAGE

I am sticking to the theory stating our universe is a simulation of some sort. I like the thought of "world building" and this could be key in "hacking" the universe.

OP, do we construct the perceived reality, or is it constructed simultaneously at the time of our observation? I ask because there is evidence suggesting that the decisions we make are made a wee bit in advance, our bodies just seem to follow along.

It is also nothing new, ironically, I was watching a video list, and this came up.



relevant to everything you asked about observing reality making it reality.

a reply to: DaRAGE

There is no scientific theory thats states that things don’t exist until an observer is present. This is simply a bad translation of the double slit experiment. This claim only exists in the scale of electrons, not in the scale of trees and such.

Your link stinks of solipsism. If that is the best that "science" can come up with then it is a very sad thing to behold.

I think the funny part of this is that this is where the Einstein world of science led it to be. Basically is this, "we don't understand the universe so we will abstract it all to magical thinking".

It's a shame that the ether theory was not allowed to run in tandem with the current atomic theory. Ether and electric magnetism make far more sense than the current nothingness(gravity, black holes, black matter, etc) and nukes.

a reply to: DaRAGE

You might find this video interesting:

originally posted by: DaRAGE
a reply to: badw0lf

Yeah i probably messed up there in the heading a bit. The "measurement" part is the observation. We are measuring.... aka ... getting information about something... getting information about something... and whatever we are getting information about.... doesnt matter until we attempt to get that information. Until we get that information.... reality hasnt already chosen what state its in and doesnt exist in a sense. It is essentially like saying a piece of paper to us can appear vertical or horizontal but until we look at it that paper doesnt exist. until we need to understand where that paper is and attempt to figure out if its vertical or horizontal is then that that papers past is created and therefore the paper now is determined to be either vertical or horizontal.

Rather than write a book about this in this thread, I'll refer you to one:
"The Quantum Moment: How Planck, Bohr, Einstein, and Heisenberg Taught Us to Love Uncertainty"
by Crease, Robert P.

originally posted by: DaRAGE
Science says...

Science, just another weapon in the PTB's arsenal.

I don't believe a WORD "science" says any more...

"...the Illuminati eventually controlled the science departments in all colleges and institutions of higher learning. The plan was to stifle scientific knowledge and then twist what was left to fit the science they wanted the people to believe. They accomplished this by adopting new rules in regards to scientific research.

Science - The Illuminati Religion and Mind Control Tool for the Masses

a reply to: Murgatroid

I don't believe a WORD "science" says any more...

the pure dripping irony of typing ^ on a computer and uploading it to the internet

science says : " do no drink concentrated sulphuric acid "

what are you going to do ??????????????????