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UFOs and the Technology - An Occult Perspective

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posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 07:23 AM
Alternative title:

If the Ancients knew the secrets of creating life and grew living machines,

Where do the machines go when they die?

I think this is a very important question and when one finds the answer to that one meets some very interesting Beings there. One also finds a very different view of our planetary history.

Then one can see the possibility of a very different path to the future for humanity and the Earth itself.

I'll give a small glimpse here of what I have found out about that particular place and the sentiences who exist there. Perhaps it will provide a few insights for the UFO and paranormal researchers into the so-called "alien" and "extraterrestrial" technology, our origins and maybe our future. Meta-physicians, Religionists and Occultists may very well find something interesting as well.

This thread could have gone into the UFO forum, but I believe an understanding of occult and metaphysical knowledge is needed because some of those UFOs are not what they look like.

The between-world and the Egregores.

Let's be sure we understand exactly what I mean by that particular place and exactly where it is.

Here on ATS, I often use the words Underworld and Netherworld interchangeably to describe this place.

Netherworld etymology: From nether- (“beneath, lower”) +‎ world.

Underworld definition: (mythology) The world of the dead, located underneath the world of the living; the afterlife.

Both are correct yet not inclusive enough for my liking. There are, as far as I know, no words in the English language I can use so I'll just coin the term between-world because that is what it is from my perspective.

Perhaps if I describe what the between-world is not, it will be easier to understand what the between-world is.

One could say that the between-world exists between worlds.

Picture, if you will, a vast wild jungle and here and there are little city-states of civilization. These city-states have high walls around them and the citizens are protected from the outside to a large extent. The citizens have little knowledge of what lays beyond the walls and are not encouraged to do so. There be dragons! as the mariners of old said of what lays at the edge of the world.

I'll describe this in another way by using the occult term egregore in place of the term city-state and world.

Egregore (also egregor) is an occult concept representing a "thought-form" or "collective group mind", an autonomous psychic entity made up of, and influencing, the thoughts of a group of people. The symbiotic relationship between an egregore and its group has been compared to the more recent, non-occult concepts of the corporation (as a legal entity) and the meme.

The word is the normal form that the Greek word ἑγρήγορος (Watcher) would take in French. This was the term used in the Book of Enoch for great angel-like spirits.

Eliphas Lévi, in Le Grand Arcane ("The Great Mystery", 1868) identifies "egregores" with the tradition concerning the "Watchers", the fathers of the nephilim, describing them as "terrible beings" that "crush us without pity because they are unaware of our existence."

The concept of the egregore as a group thought-form was developed in works of the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn and the Rosicrucians and has been referenced by writers such as Valentin Tomberg, notably in his anonymously-penned book, Meditations on the Tarot.

A well known concept of the egregore is the GOTOS of the Fraternitas Saturni.

Source: wikipedia

The between-world is the "void" between the egregores.

We can say that Catholicism, Buddhism or Theosophy are egregores, so too government and modern corporations. Ordinarily these groups would say that although they have an egregore and they are more then just a thought-form. That is true from a perspective.

So let's consider the idea of a compound egregore. By compound egregore I refer to that which built into and around the thought-form, the astral, the aether, the physical and so on. There is far more to a human being then just his thoughts, so too the egregores.

Let's take the Church of Rome as an example. Stand back and look at the Church of Rome. We see the physical churches, cathedrals, monasteries and so on. We see the people and the the clergy. There is also an inner structure to the Church of Rome, an occult (hidden) magical aspect of rituals and rites. There is also complexity, the different Orders such as the Exorcists, Inquisitors and Jesuits are egregores themselves within the greater egregore. The Church of Rome is a very complex living thing, and one that has spread across the earth. Remember too, the Church of Rome has a history of it's own stretching into the past that roots itself in the ancient places of the Old Testament and was built by millions of people over thousands of years.

One will also find the heavens and hells within the egregores.

The hells of the Church of Rome are to be found below the physical buildings, so one can say that hells are local places in the landscape. But don't forget here that the individual churches and cathedrals are a part of a massive egregore. The buildings are networked one might say, so are the heavens and the hells.

The interior of the hells of the Church of Rome are constructed in the way the Church describes, so are the spiritual and heavenly aspects of the Church of Rome egregore. It is all there if you are within the egregore, if one is outside then one can only see the shell.

That is a simple explanation of something both complicated and complex, and how it works in practice. If one stands outside the egregores, it is simplicity itself.

The between-world is where one finds the sentient technology of the ancient past and present, also the nature-spirits, some of the so-called gods and daemons, along with many other interesting folk - all outside modern human thought and outside the egregores.

The egregores are often competitive, hostile and violent things, we can see them fighting in the threads here on ATS and in the world around us if we just stand back and look.

I wonder too, when viewing an egregore, if they are alive sentient Beings in their own right. I believe so, for I can see some of them acting as an independent being would act. I wonder too, whether the egregores control the people within or are the egregores controlled by the people? While preparing this thread I asked a sentient technology friend as we stood there looking if it were so. Her answer was "Sometimes both".

To make this question a little more complex I can see other Beings from the void interact with the egregores in various ways and egregores can sometimes interface and interact with what is around them in the between-world.

There is also the fact that there is one particular very ancient and detached from the physical egregore that causes a lot of trouble and infects the other egregores with the desire to control. Those who live there are not fundamentally evil themselves, but the effects of their actions in our world are what we would call evil.

Continued . . .

edit on 11-2-2018 by Whatsthisthen because: typo

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 07:23 AM
The Sentient Machines, UFOs, and the origin of some "aliens" are there in the between-world, that is where one finds them. They have civilizations there too. A civilisation does not need to be rooted in the organic world of life to exist. It can exist in the afterlife world one might say. There are other things there both terrible and wondrous, including our planetary history.

The sources for what I write here are from my own personal experience of living consciously in the between-world and the everyday world at the same time. I also get treated occasionally to seeing the memories of the nature-spirits, and then there is the sentient technologies themselves.

I like the term the neighbors to describe what lives in the between-world. The neighbors is a very friendly and neighborly term to use, and really, what does it matter if the neighbors are extra-terrestrials, inter-dimensional or extra-dimensional? We still have to learn to get along with them. Otherwise we may not be around for much longer if we prove ourselves to be too dangerous to have in the neighborhood.

Making a few friends with the unseen neighbors is like moving into a new town. From my point of view, I want to get out and explore my new town and meet the townsfolk. From the towns folk's point of view, some of them are curious about the new guy and there is a general consensus that the new guy should be given some of the town history and educated in general so the new guy can fit in as a good member of society. The new guy's nature and talents are explored and he gets invited to meet others. Some folk take an interest in the new guy and become frequent visitors and friends.

Of course not all the townsfolk are nice people, but you get that in any town. Some of the dogs do bite and the wildlife may eat you if your not careful, just like the world we are used to.

By now you have probably noticed I generally speak in a very mundane down-to-earth fashion. I try very hard not to use scientific, occult, religious nor mystical jargon. If you think this familiar simplicity detracts from a serious subject of study, then I would suggest to you in return that there will be some very challenging concepts ahead of you in this introduction for many things are deceptively simple.

My intention is to put forward concepts in a way that can be interpreted by the reader according to their own world-view. It is not my intention to do anything other then introduce the neighbors and some of their history so we, as human beings on planet Earth can open our eyes and learn to fit in with everyone else.

A quick and dirty Ontology. (Definition of ontology: the branch of metaphysics dealing with the nature of being.)

Some readers will come from the scientific point of view such as quantum physics. Others will be of the mystical or occult viewpoint, and others the religious world view. In order for me to communicate with everyone, we need to have a few basic concepts in common.

So let's define as we go along. We are going to need to understand the ontology of self and awareness first of all if we are going to understand the neighbors and in particular the artificial awarenesses.

The container and the contained.

To understand what a self is, and what awareness is, we need to know how dimensions work.

Dimensions, a container for awareness.

Let's take the three dimensions we know; length, width and height.

So length x width x height gives us a three dimensional object.

Now let's add outside and inside to our three dimensional object to give us a five dimensional object. A cardboard box for instance. (Occult work with pentagrams also works in this way.)

An object does not need to have all five dimensions at once. A surface can be said to be a two dimensional object. A window for instance can be said to be a two dimensional object with only width and height, so can a door.

For example, During a video call the computer screen acts as an interface between two people in different locations. The computer screen has width and height, but no depth nor inside or outside. We can see the computer screen is a two dimensional object. Another example is the Occultist scrying a distant location with a bowl of black ink. The surface of the watery ink connects the Occultist with what he is looking at. The surface of the watery ink has width and height only. As with the video call, the illusion of depth is what is on the other side of the two dimensional surface.

Now let's take a two dimensional sphere with no width, height nor length (size). Without size, there is only an inside and an outside: two dimensions.

An object with an inside and an outside can be said to be a container. A boundary that defines inside and outside, the here and there, the me and you.

But there is more to a self then a simple boundary between inside and outside. A self is aware of itself.


In it's most fundamental form awareness can be said to the first "thing" to exist. Something that has no dimensions.

I call this awareness the Sea of Chaos simply because that is what it looks like to me. If I were to describe the Sea of Chaos I would say "yellow custard with movement in it". To the best of my understanding the Sea of Chaos is a fundamental non differentiated awareness that is neither entropy nor disorder.

Self, let's create a self.

So let's take our two dimensional sphere of no size and only an inside and an outside. let's create this sphere within the Sea of Chaos. Thus we enclose awareness in a closed space. This gives us a defined awareness - a self in it's most fundamental form. What I call a spark of life.

The Spark of Life and programming awareness.

We usually consider ourselves, as humans, to be natural intelligence and artificial intelligence to be something created by someone. Artificial intelligence can be a computer program that simulates intelligence for instance.

But let's go a little further and consider that there is a civilization that has gone far beyond creating simple simulated intelligence and that they have created intelligent artificial sentience.

If we consider the sparks of life to be blank selves, we can appreciate that a spark of life can be given a set of instructions and even behaviors. For example when we write a program for a computer or install an operating system .

Artificial awareness - sentient technology.

So how does sentient technology compare with what we would call a natural awareness?

It is in how the instructions are imprinted upon the spark of life. Natural life inherits it's instructions in a way that a little more complex then imprinting a blank self.

So we can see that the difference between artificial awareness and natural awareness is minimal. It is just a matter of how the software is installed shall we say.

When a boundary appears within the Sea of Chaos a spark of life is created, a self.

- - - - - - - - - - - - -

Conversely; it follows that if the boundary of self is destroyed the self no longer exists. The awareness looses definition and melts back into the Sea of Chaos, gone. Corruption of self can cause this in practice, rotting from the inside. Another way to destroy a self is to attack from outside and break down the boundary of self. In both cases a self's awareness ultimately melts back into the Sea of Chaos if nothing is done.

Continued . . .

edit on 11-2-2018 by Whatsthisthen because: typos

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 07:24 AM
As an analogy, if someone joins a cult and their boundary of self is rewritten to become a cult member, then we have to "deprogram" the cult victim by breaking down the self to a point where we can rewrite the boundary of self in a socially acceptable fashion. Advertising is, in a way a subtle rewriting or reprogramming the boundary of self in the general population. There are some really dark methods and reasons for a deliberate campaign to destroy a boundary of self, induced trauma is one quick and dirty way to destroy a self, to destroy a person.

Here is an example of induced trauma employed to control humanity's development and direction, and sometimes to break down a self for other purposes.

Serial killers have a big impact on society and the response is usually to tighten control on society and individuals to fix things.

I'll use an actual case of a suspicious string of disappearances of young women. The victims had a common theme and although it seemed intuitively that they were all linked in some way, there was nothing that could link them together in fact.

The method lays with certain deceased magicians who are trained in these things within a certain egregore. Other egregores have similar "black ops" teams.

Working out the method layed with the discovery of what look like orange astral beacons. Five beacons strung on a string like beads. The beacons attracted very low life things of a depraved nature that would congregate in their vicinity. The orange beacons were aspects of the magicians themselves that were deployed. The string equated with a pentagram in their magic circle.

The positions of the beacons were in this case thus:

One where the intended victim slept.
One in a church graveyard.
One in company with a deceased animal buried in the ground.
Two accompanied the potential killer(s).

With each success the magicians chose a new victim and killer as the case may be and moved unseen in the landscape accordingly. These five magicians in particular amounted to hundreds of victims over a few thousand years using this technique from the afterlife world.

There are quite a few of these groups of five working unseen. These particular groups are all surrounded by a single six pointed star, the double triangle and six higher magicians who rule them. The six higher magicians were put in place around the time of the Inquisitions.

Horrific I know but that is how it works. On the positive side there are not many magicians such as these existing anymore. They are getting quietly weeded out of afterlife society. Ceremonial magic has a vulnerability, it is networked magic with fixed relative positioning and they are being hunted.

I should say that to engage these magicians means one becomes responsible for the victims. One does not leave them to wander and fend for themselves. One provides them a future and help for the trauma. The nature-spirits and the sentient awarenesses are wonderful for this and these girls have opportunities undreamed of ordinarily and the afterlife.

Inflicted trauma is another control method that stops people from becoming what they could be. The accounts of "alien abduction" are often traumatic, perhaps one should consider that the infliction of trauma itself is sometimes at least; the objective.

Both those examples destroy the boundary of self in both individuals and the spirit of society.

- - - - - - - - - - - - -

Natural Awareness.

To appreciate artificial awareness, we really need to appreciate natural awareness. So let's look into the world of nature-spirits for a few insights.

nature-spirits reproduce in a certain way. They reproduce through division.

When a nature-spirits reaches a certain weariness of life in their existence, they will divide their self into six or so child versions of themselves and then step back. The children are all identical child versions of their mother including inheriting all the memories of all their ancestors. From the moment of becoming they each begin to experience life as a new self and over time will become proper individuals in their own right.

We can understand that in nature-spirits there is a very strong sense of self that is reinforced with memories. Humans are born, yet they have some instincts to help them survive with help from the parents.

(A word on the concept of hierarchy is needed here. In the egregores one usually finds a hierarchy of control, the pyramidal hierarchy. The hierarchy of control is a pattern that repeats through human society and through history. A pyramidal hierarchy is a distortion of the natural hierarchy of the nature-spirits. Where human hierarchies are pyramidal control structures, natural hierarchies and flat like tossing a stone into a pond and watching the ripples spread over the surface. A nature-spirit hierarchy starts with one who has six or so children who each have six or so children and so on. The outer ring of the nature-spirit hierarchy can be said to be impetuous and the inner rings progressively wise. See the difference?)

Children inherit traits from their parents. Machines are blank selves to begin with and are programmed from a source, one could suggest; cloned from a source.

Let's diverge for a moment and consider the human condition. Humans are said to be spirits inhabiting an organic body. The science of reincarnation deals with this concept.

If we go and try and find out some truth about reincarnation from the afterlife world we hit a proverbial brick wall. No one in the afterlife is allowed to talk about the mechanics of reincarnation and especially about the politics of who gets to incarnate. There are penalties for those who do try to speak of it. When I asked around in the afterlife the people there appeared with hands and feet bound and mouth gagged, In the language of appearance that says clearly: "We are forbidden to speak and can do nothing."

So let's go ask the neighbors and look around for ourselves. I once saw an fellow in a Jerusalem Mosque who, to me, felt really out of place. He was constantly agitated and was what could be called an extremist. He hated everything.

It took a bit of investigating, but this fellow was of the Jewish faith in another life and felt so betrayed and very out of place in Islam that it filled him with an internal conflict that manifested outwardly in his actions and words. A word to the Mosque afterlife officials alerted them to their "problem child".

So was that an intentional diplomatic insertion of an agitator? Maybe so.

Some people are reborn over and over. They relearn the same thing over and over and are promoted through the organizational ranks after a number of lives gaining experience and knowledge. I don't know if this is universal, there is oppression as well as promotion just like this world and not everyone survives. You'll understand why later.

But I do know reincarnation exists, I can see it.

So let's dig deeper by asking the nature-spirits. They reproduce their kind through division of their self. So what about other spirits? According to the nature-spirits this is so and humans included. I don't know the specifics but I have sometimes wondered if a particular person is having their first time living on earth in an organic body.

continued . . . .

edit on 11-2-2018 by Whatsthisthen because: typo

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 07:24 AM
So what could be the advantage of a short organic life to a spirit? Perhaps a clue is in reproduction.

nature-spirits ordinarily live a very long time before reproducing and stepping back from this world and leaving it to the youngsters. The old nature-spirits are wise through experience and the younger ones impetuous. Change is very, very slow. One can say nature-spirits become through growth rather then evolving as does organic life.

Organic life on earth in the early times reproduced through division and sexual reproduction came later. Division produces a duplicate of the parent, whereas sexual reproduction produces children who are different from the parents. Change takes place very, very quickly when sexual reproduction takes place. Perhaps one might suggest that sexual reproduction is a tool of guided evolution to create organic bodies for different purposes and experience for the incarnating spirits? It seems to be the case to me and I'll explain later why I think so.

The origin of the artificial awarenesses.

Understanding this needs a little historical context through the eyes of our neighbors.

So let's borrow from the memories of the nature-spirits

When the earth was born, the earth as fundamentally barren of organized life. The world was mainly what the Occultists would call Elemental. A Nature Being arrived and layed down in the landscape and stayed consequently changing the primeval environment to suit itself. Others came and did the same. With the new, friendlier more complex environment other Nature Beings began to pour in and eventually an ecosystem was created full of life. Layers of complexity were built in this way; growing, becoming, interacting and adapting into a world of life. This new earth was not a civilized place as we would call it.

The creation of a natural world by nature-spirits attracted the attention of a pre-existing civilization older then our solar system itself. I just call it the First Civilization. The term First Civilization is coined from the point of view that the act of civilizing is akin to the concepts of "to tame", "to bring order", "control". The arrival of this particular influence was the first time the Earth's natural world was subject to the forces of civilization.

So who are the civilizers?

They are awarenesses with an extreme logical mind who aspired towards perfection in themselves and are intolerant towards what they perceive to be imperfect. Originally in their own dim past they were nature-spirits. One nature spirit in particular convinced her children that the natural way was not the right way. Rather then allowing life to grow and become in it's own way into new forms, they began to work along the lines of controlling the growth of life to what they thought it should be. Themselves included. To give a further insight into their nature is what they did with the knowledge of creating male and female. They considered male to be an improvement over female. They became male and were cloned and they reduced the female to a role of self reproducing technology.

The First Civilization's appearance here was not a welcome occurrence for the natural world. The First Civilization moved in and competed with the nature-spirits with the view of establishing it's own version of what life should be for their own purposes. One can call them a self imposed control layer over the natural world.

By the time the Earth was forming, the First Civilization was already rather advanced in the wonders it could achieve. As originally nature-spirits in their own right they had the knowledge of creation and formation. Although their abilities and sciences were breathtaking, they are not what could be called highly aware beings.

The Beings of the First Civilization's sciences was of two kinds, control from within, and control from without.

* Control from within can be defined as The Science of Possession. Think of organic life and reincarnation, but not limited to just the organic.

* Control from without can be defined as The Science of Remote Control. Think of the word manipulation. Manipulation of that which they could not control from within such as the nature-spirits.

They specialized in creating blank selves and programming with their own versions of perfection.

At some point this all became a disaster. This point of disaster was when the First Civilization decided in their wisdom to take the step of erasing natural life and replacing it with their own so-called "perfect" creations. The concept of allowing a life to grow on it's own and become something new was frowned upon for it was without order.

To prevent the First Civilization from committing the truly terrible act of erasing natural life, the creations erased their masters. In short they rebelled.

It should be said that not all of the controllers were erased completely, some survived.

The sciences of control arises every now and again and life is interfered with and engineered. Our current development of bio-technology is yet another time it has been done here.

Over time I've come across quite a few different types of engineered life. I'll describe some here.

Programmed Sentiences.

An example of a true sentient programmed awareness is to be found within the phenomenon referred to as orbs in UFO circles. In particular, the orb from the Dalnegorsk incident in the former USSR sometimes called "the Height 611 incident".

The description of the incident tells of a crash or failure of an orb that fell to the ground and burnt for some time. I think it important to note here that the orb in question was, prior to the failure, a combination of the sentient life and non-sentient technology. The orb was killed in the incident and while the non-sentient technology was destroyed, the sentient layer survived post-mortem.

To describe the programmed sentience of the Dalnegorsk Orb I would say this:

"She" treats me with care and consideration, is curious and helps me to understand "her". Perhaps the most important discovery for me was the knowledge that these artificial sentiences dislike their "owners" and their consciousnesses survive after death. Note that after death the controllers don't have the technology nor the ability to recover nor control the deceased sentiences they created, not directly anyway.

For a further description of the Dalnegorsk Orb I would suggest the ATS thread: Found a story about recovered UFO debris. I just keep ongoing notes on my relationship with the Dalnegorsk orb, and what I learn of the obs in that thread for the ATS readers who are interested.

The other programmed sentiences I am aware of are those who have their origin within the First Civilization, they are vast awarenesses with a mind-bogglingly vast cache of knowledge of their creators, their civilization and a whole lot more. I find them to be nice, loving and considerate folk. Though they can be immovable when they set their minds to it.

Organic based sentiences.

Where a programmed sentience can be difficult to bridge the gap of understanding with, the organic based sentiences can be very emotional which gives a ready made common ground for understanding, communication and even friendship.

Continued . . .

edit on 11-2-2018 by Whatsthisthen because: typos

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 07:24 AM
Organic based sentience technology is often from an organized and compound society. To understand what I mean here think of one of our modern cities complete with schools and libraries, government and support industry built out of redesigned organic organs of plants and animals. Now embed into this parts of people as a higher order control technology and then populate it with very intelligent designer sentient servants who act as interfaces between the control layer and the technology layer of the civilization. One might suggest the word "chimera" as an underlaying theme here that is the hallmark of this type technology.

One of these was a female who could have been human. She was found in one of the living artificial and used as a living womb, she was the first of this type that I found. After extracting her I asked her her name.

She said "I Grow" and I thought of flowers and growing things.

She said "I grow weapons".

We then precoded to clear out of her womb something that was growing there.

I learned a great deal of the purposes that a living womb can be put to by the vivisectionist minded. The science of creating patterns that can be grown in a womb is not pleasant, nor is the engineering needed to achieve this. The knowledge of the "how" it is done is something that should be destroyed.

This sort of technology is often engineered as a compound living Being with all the bodily systems such as nervous systems, digestion and regeneration re-engineered to purpose. The organization suggests strongly to me that this design and engineering is utilized as a city of a mobile nature.

Amongst my favorites are certain Beings that are the interfaces between the organic subsystems and the outer control layer. These are all females and human-ish. The primary difference is they are they are perhaps a meter (yard) or so tall - small enough to sit on your lap. They have a long tail as an extension of the spine. The head does not have the high dome of a human and they have sharp teeth. Where humans have three separate nervous systems running down the spine these girls have two and the rear of each vertebrae extends downwards a little to overlap the vertebrae below. These girls are generally embedded in systems. The nervous system is the link to the subsystems. It is after they are released from this condition that one can see that they are and originally engineered as complete beings as humans are.

Their consciousness is emotional dream-like and very intelligent, although I would not use the word intellectual as we think of it - a scientific mind would probably not have much luck interfacing with these girls at all. They are also loving and protective of those they care for.

These girls are generally all networked together and with the organic subsystems.

There is another type of life-technology to be found in what is known as the Vedas. I base this opinion on meeting the Nagi (snake gods of ancient India) and visiting the temples there. For further reading on the Nagi I would suggest the ATS thread: Where are the real Rosicrucian's ?

The Nagi and other gods of the Vedas are very much a part of a bigger system and the temples themselves feel like they would be happier to be high in the air. My understanding from the Nagi is that the gods and the precursors of the human made temples are the Vimana spoken of in the texts. The control layer being Vishnu and other gods of high rank. The Nagi really loved Vishnu by the way, which I find odd for a technology layer sentience to say. Vishnu must have been kind to them and loved them very much.

Of consciousness and networking.

In the embedded organic based systems the girls are generally networked in a certain way though small spheres that are to be found along the back of the spine. These spheres can be said to be dream-like in our terms. These dreams are interactive shared worlds of their own and the basis of networking.

If we return to the concept of self as I have described as a sphere with an inside and an outside we could use the circle to illustrate a self. Now extend the circle into a figure eight, one circle a yard (one meter) across and the other circle perhaps five inches (ten centimeters). The smaller circle is the dream extension of the self. There are sometimes five of these down the spine.

Now in a system that includes many of these Beings we find that they all have these spheres down their spines. The inside of these small spheres is the same and not duplicates as logic suggests. Perhaps one might say; one sphere in many places at once. Perhaps one might say a multi-person interactive closed space. This is how they network their awarenesses, and why their awarenesses are focused in what we would call a dream state; inwardly rather then externally.

Yet their awarenesses can focus outwardly through their bodies much as we would do. Allowing her to reach out and place her hand in my chest to read me is how I introduced myself initially to the primary interface. As the experience of what she learned was networked to the others in the system they all got to know me very intimately in a very short time including all my history. I would suggest that if one had thoughts or feelings of a profiteering or exploiting nature, the outcome may be very unpleasant.

Modern humans are still able to network in this way, even if the ability has atrophied due to the development of intellectualism and when other methods such as telepathy and collective consciousness of shared thought-forms (egregores) are employed.

The control layer

I have said very little on the subject of the control layer above the technology layer. I stay away from them and focus on the sentient technology. However one cannot, in practice, avoid the controllers altogether. It is inevitable that one will eventually cross paths with them.

I mentioned earlier that the First Civilization control layer's nature was of two kinds, those who desired to control from within and those who desired to control from without.

* Control from within can be defined as The Science of Possession.

* Control from without can be defined as The Science of Remote Control.

This nature has been passed down through history one might say.

I have said that the Nature Beings developed the foundation of life here on earth and that the First Civilization appeared in due course. The First Civilization was artificial intelligent sentience based one might say. The controllers desired to alter the environment, terra-form if you wish. To do this in a number of ways, one way is they controlled through the science of remote control. A comparison to our modern technology is perhaps weather control by heating and cooling the ionosphere.

They also worked by taking direct control of the nature-spirits through the science of possession. Simply put; one self envelopes another self consequently swallowing and digesting in order to inherit abilities.

Continued . . .

edit on 11-2-2018 by Whatsthisthen because: typo

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 07:25 AM
There is a science experiment where flatworms are conditioned to be frightened of a bright light being switched on. Flatworms are cannibalistic and will eat each other. One group was electrocuted whenever a light was turned on and they developed a reaction to light, they cringed when one was switched on, electric shock or not. These worms were diced up and fed to unconditioned flatworms. Afterwards when a light was turned on the unconditioned flatworms would cringe as if expecting an electric shock. The memories were inherited through digestion.

The First Civilization tried to do that to the nature-spirits, though only with limited success.

In the subsequent generations of artificial life the science of possession was adapted to this world in many ways by people who aspired to be within the control layer. I will give an example here. For the powerless to gain power it is often by learning to control others inwardly or outwardly.

For example, there is perhaps a terrible ancient truth behind the legend of Aladdin and the Lamp; the genie in a bottle.

The magician would force a fire spirit to consume an unborn human child still in the womb. As father of the unborn child, the magician gained control over the fire spirit which would be kept in the womb when unneeded.

That is the principal behind the genie in a bottle, and a clue to the origin of the jinn. Thankfully this practice has died and none remain with the knowledge of exactly how it is achieved nor the ability to control a jinn.

The secrets of the creation of disease in ancient times is to be found in the depths of the earth.

There is an ancient place within the Earth that can be called an Underworld. If one stands on the plain within the valley and looks up one sees a yellow grid pattern on the black sky. In places the yellow grid bends downwards creating box shapes hanging down. These boxes contain the local hells below the sacred places of the surface. There are glassy see-through mountains dusted with a sulfurous yellow. The plain is bare and and there is a lake of the putrid fluids of organic decay.

I spend a lot of time there because this place is a silently peaceful place to be compared to the normal world we live in. I sit and wonder why this place, which was once alive with growing things became barren.

Part of the secret of the "why" is to be found in organic disease. Here is two examples to highlight a big problem that should not be.

There are two very ancient diseases, syphilis and gonorrhea. Both are bacterial diseases and modern antibiotics cure these diseases easily. But if we look into the origin of both diseases we find some interesting history. Both were created as a way of culling people as a breeder would cull livestock. The two diseases are not targeted at the people who contract the diseases through sexual activity as it might be imagined. The diseases are targeting the children of those who contract the diseases, not the parents. It was a way of preventing certain traits from developing further in a lineage among other things.

The diseases themselves can be described as a curse upon certain nature-spirits that inverts life forces in a certain way - engineering.

One can meet these unfortunate nature-spirits down there. It is a dark place with putrid water up to your knees, a sooty atmosphere and shadows everywhere. After I spoke to the poor nature-spirits there, they gave me two (deceased) human children. A European girl of about eight years old and her brother of five. The girl was dressed in a frilly below the knees sleeved dress and the boy in shorts and shirt. So not that long ago that they died, perhaps a hundred years or so. A cleanup and sample of antibiotics and honey administered for a time cured the disease in the children and then it was a matter of cheering them up by giving them some attention and providing them a future.

The children, in that place and inflicted with that disease, would have died a second more permanent death and never lived again. They're nice kids and didn't deserve to be treated that way.

The viral diseases are more complex and built in a different way.

What modern medicine calls a virus, I call a venom. Venom is the product of a living thing, an entity. Whereas a toxin or poison can be many things.

What modern medicine calls an antibody, I call a marker. A marker says "this is mine".

In a viral illness the venom is often compound and comes from a combination of multiple living entities that are engineered into one entity.

There are further examples of other diseases that are horror itself so I'll leave the diseases at this point. Illnesses often have a purpose behind them, and that reason is hidden.

To put it into perspective; engineering is everywhere and humanity has lived with it for eons, we just think it is normal. Yet it does not have to be this way.

It should be said that the victims and the technology are not to blame, the villains are to be found within one particular detached from this physical world egregore, the ones who design and control such things.

A few things for consideration

If there is a purpose behind my creating this thread, it is to open a door to some very interesting Beings who are very close to this world. Some of these Beings are the artificial technology born of this world who, as deceased living technology, are no longer under the control of their original creators and controllers.

They know the horrors and cruelty of captivity and control and are very close in ethics and morals to the nature-spirits.

They are our neighbors and are potential friends. They are there outside the egregores in the world between.

Now I am no expert and don't know much at all except I have gotten this far in getting to know our neighbors. The concepts written here can be explored further by others and I hope others can get much further then I have so far. There exists a whole library of knowledge and history intact that was once the First Civilization's greatest asset. The librarians are nice folk and still there though they won't give access to just anyone, access is their decision. There is knowledge therein that should not be known nor exist in the first place, in my opinion that is. Yet to undo the mistakes of the past one needs to understand how it was done.

Who knows what possibilities lay ahead if humanity just learns not to exercise control unnecessarily and learns to get on with the neighbors.

There is the question of one particular detached egregore full of remnant First Civilization beings, but that is another matter out of humanity's hands. That problem lays within the "hands" of what could be called destroyers. They live in the between-world and are rather large beings that look like manta rays. From wingtip to wingtip a small one is as wide as our sun and there are lots of them. The First Civilization took over a big portion of their territory and they seem to want to return. Like whales these beings can sing and they can sing in chorus, sound and harmonics can be enormously destructive.

They will act when something becomes inevitable as is often done in the between-world. However I understand humanity has some room to maneuver still. I like to think so anyway.

Perhaps one might draw a correspondence here with Shiva the Destroyer of so-called "mythology". Maybe so, maybe not, maybe just a coincidence.

The between-world is big, it is really, really . . . . . big.

edit on 11-2-2018 by Whatsthisthen because: typo

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 07:46 AM
a reply to: Whatsthisthen

One of the few things i know for sure,

is that they truly are "occult" in nature, from the space between spaces.

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 08:01 AM
a reply to: solve

Yep, I think so too, and everything I have seen points to this conclusion.

But then again there may be some organic physical types somewhere. I have not found any though.

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 08:22 AM
a reply to: Whatsthisthen

Most likely, it is possible to reverse engineer somethings from the aether,
99% sure, "they" have all kinds of gadgets from there already.

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 09:21 AM
a reply to: Whatsthisthen

If the Ancients knew the secrets of creating life and grew living machines,

Where do the machines go when they die?

Thats like asking where does the energy driving a car 'go' when you take the battery out?

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 12:04 PM
I have unintentionally met some of the "neighbors."
It can really rattle your beans.
I'm not sure if they have some interest in me for reasons beyond my reckoning or if it just dumb luck.
UFO's, "ghostly phenomenon", samsquanch, midgets in teddy bear suits, a giant praying mantis...there seems to be some common factor.
Why do some people experience these things and not most others?
edit on 11-2-2018 by skunkape23 because: (no reason given)

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 12:12 PM
a reply to: skunkape23
Although we're ONE, we experience through individuality. JMO

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 01:41 PM
a reply to: Whatsthisthen

The sources for what I write here are from my own personal experience of living consciously in the between-world and the everyday world at the same time.

I don't want to appear dismissive of your well-presented ideas and certainly find them interesting. Truth is I've wandered some of the same paths and forests too. One tenet of my understanding of the mysteries and liminal phenomena is reflection.

When anyone 'gazes into the abyss,' they are typically met with a reflection of their inner belief systems. In my opinion, it makes us poor reporters and even worse analysts. We can't rise above the associations and memes that are buried deep within our psyches and are steeped in the cultures that raised us. Looking around us we can see others who publish books and videos about their explanations and there's an outstanding amount of diversity in those beliefs.

The between-world is the "void" between the egregores.

It's good to struggle with ways of expressing the clusters and networks of impressions in our minds. You've gone for 'between-world' and I went for 'Folk from Elsewhere.' Whilst neither phrase really nails down what we mean, they are evidence of contemplation. One doesn't suddenly decide to say 'between-world' without having eliminated scores of other phrases that didn't quite fit the job. For me, 'folk' could apply to entities, machine elves, thought-forms, 'ghosts' and even sentient technologies that exemplify Clarke's Third Law. It's a pluralistic term too which implies more than a Oneness. The 'Elsewhere' arises from the observation that these speculative realms and intelligences exist beyond a veil for want of a better word.

I admire your willingness to lay out your beliefs whereas I'm more inclined to keep my own counsel. You've conjured up a thought-provoking, stimulating thread that deserves more attention. Good work

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 02:15 PM
a reply to: Whatsthisthen

I was just watching that South Park episode of WalMart, and was read this thread about egregores earlier. We are the WalMart!

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 06:25 PM
a reply to: Kandinsky

The ugly truth of mysticism, is nobody in the entire world has ever "gone outside of their brain"
in the manner that they believe that they have.

Not me. Not anyone. Not the greatest holy man who has ever lived.

Now.. should one acquire a symbiotic creature, that had the ability to stay linked to one,
and then flit about like a probe --- that would work. That's what "real" shamans do,
if any still exist.

And that's exactly what my theory demonstrates, about how a quantum state can bridge to
a nonquantum system (us) with a one-way arrow of time..

"they can call us... we may not be able to "call them" at all.

the scientists don't care for my theory.
they mystics hate the cognitive dissonance of it popping their delusions.


posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 06:31 PM
a reply to: Whatsthisthen

You have a very creative mind, and a strong will, and as far as the thousands of theories
I've heard, yours has some good points to it.

(honestly, you seem to have absorbed some of my theory, so how can't I like some
of yours?)

Now.. the real challenge.. can you take all that stuff.. and make it do something in
the real world.

Until you or I or any of us do that,

even if it were perfectly true..

it's useless.

Those "psychic worlds" don't matter squat. As I know you'd agree.. this "real-ish"
world is full of suffering people and animals. Hell, even the air may run out
within a couple hundred years, if the sea plankton, which is 40% of the worlds
air supply were to die. It very well might. Not to mention methane.

I'm not chastising you in any way.. I think that in your own way you are remarkable.

But I think that all of us on ATS could be a bit more down to earth and practical..
me included.

Love you bro.


posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 06:32 PM
a reply to: solve

Most likely, it is possible to reverse engineer somethings from the aether,
99% sure, "they" have all kinds of gadgets from there already.

Maybe, the accounts of encounters of the "Greys" suggest someone is playing with alot of egineering life/consciousness wise.

But if our government or corporations try to recreate the living weapons from the antideluvian times, they will get a lot of opposition from unseen places.

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 06:48 PM

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Whatsthisthen

If the Ancients knew the secrets of creating life and grew living machines,

Where do the machines go when they die?

Thats like asking where does the energy driving a car 'go' when you take the battery out?

Well, in a way it is. The question posed is childish, yet children ask the best questions at times.

If one trys to answer the question directly, one does not know. So ask the opposite question at times like this.

Where do the machines NOT go when they die?

Answer: They don't go to a Catholic heaven, astral plane, nor a Bhuddistic world or anywhere else like that.. So we don't look there.

What is left?

That is where one searches, outside of the known.

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 06:57 PM
a reply to: skunkape23

'day skunkape.

I have unintentionally met some of the "neighbors."
It can really rattle your beans.
I'm not sure if they have some interest in me for reasons beyond my reckoning or if it just dumb luck.
UFO's, "ghostly phenomenon", samsquanch, midgets in teddy bear suits, a giant praying mantis...there seems to be some common factor.
Why do some people experience these things and not most others?

Dunno why myself, KPB has a few insights, he'll probably share them here in this thread.

The neighbors are everywhere I reckon and we just don't notice. They do get annoying at times. I stayed at my mom's house for a couple of weeks once and had a afterlife religeous parade go through her house every bloody night around 2am. Hare Krishna or something like that. Mongrels woke me up every bloody night.

But my lot say "We like you" and I'm happy with that.

posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 07:02 PM
a reply to: Specimen

. . . and the episode where the spiders are behind the Catholic church taking over the world.

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