House Intelligence FISA memo released: What it says

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: AboveBoard

I'll answer. If it turns out it's all lies and never happened and no one at the FBI had an agenda to hurt Trump rather than seek truth then the story should be dropped.

Now what if they did have an agenda and the memo is true?

If the conspiracy narrative presented by Nunes and amplified by the Right wing is true, that the FBI dishonestly obtained a FISA warrant, then whatever the appropriate legal action something like that would normally generate should happen.

Remember that we don’t know all the facts, the FBI and House IC members who have seen the intelligence and McCabe’s full testimony are saying it’s creating a false narrative that would require more revelations of top secret material to counteract.

They are claiming an abuse of power and mishandling of classified materials by Nunes and his staff.

This is very serious, no?

We should get to see the evidence against the memo as well as the memo
Itself.

a reply to: face23785

Yes, agree and see your point.

My point on the prior warrant was it expired and the FBI
did nothing for years. Hence, I believe that The FBI looked in
its basket and tried to find a matchstick in which to light a fire,
to use to put in motion The Insurance Policy.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Because Carter Page is a US citizen. There are laws that govern such, and usually they have to have the evidence and probable cause present there to support such. And from what I understand Carter Page was already suspected and in very deep, as they have transcripts of Carter Pages involvement with know Russian intelligence agents, going back to 2013.

originally posted by: AboveBoard
What if the memo narrative is a lie?

What if you are being manipulated into believing malfeasance on the part of the FBI and DOJ when there is none?

Please give me an honest answer to this.

I'm open to that possibility. I have no problem beleiving this is a poitical hit job that doesn't give full context, but I'm also having problems coming up with realistic "context" that absolves some of the apparent wrongdoing. There are a few things that I can see being possibly misleading if some other evidence is being omitted, but that would still not solve all the problems the document lays out.
But you are absolutely right, let's shine light on all of it and see what's what. If there is an outright lie, I want to see it. If there is exculpatory evidence thst might be mitigating, let's see it. Why is only one faction seemingly trying to do that while the factions with the most to lose are screaming to redact or disallow entirely the release because it might disclose "sources and methods" which don't appear in the memo?

a reply to: luthier

Awesome. Make a thread about it. This is about criminal activity of the FBI and Democrats colluding to illegally spy on a candidate and what should happen to those people if they did it.

a reply to: sdcigarpig

The memo says that yes, during the intial request for the warrant, and the three times they went to get the warrant reauthorized, they knew that steele was doing oppo research on the part of the DNC and hillarys team.

The fbi knew this, and did not tell the fisa court this relevant info.

originally posted by: Grambler


Again, you yourself for pages said Page admitted he met with sechin; you were wrong, as was the dossier.

Can you help me out with that? I have been through my posts in thread...Where did I say it was Sechin?

you say "for pages" I claimed this?

Point me to a post here.

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: luthier
FUNNY NOBODY is mentioning FISA as the problem.

Looks like people don't actually care about America. They want to punish a party.


Nobody questioning the judges or the process?

Hmm

FISA is not the problem as the law is designed for foreign nationals. The issue comes with US agencies who have access to it lying to the courts in order to obtain information on US nationals.

I am in favor of amending FISA to create very severe penalties for violating segments of the law.

Good for you.

I would say a program that was abused over 75 times during ashcroft and surely as many during Obama has some real problems.

originally posted by: face23785
According to Catherine Herridge, the dossier wasn't just included, it was the top line item on the FISA application.

If that was their best evidence, they had nothing. Disgraceful. The judge they tricked has got to be furious.

Unless the Judge was a liberal!

a reply to: AboveBoard

I'm all for full disclosure. I don't want punishment to advance an agenda. I want criminals to be punished. Let's verify a crime was committed and have bipartisan outrage. Lock up any president who does this.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: luthier

Awesome. Make a thread about it. This is about criminal activity of the FBI and Democrats colluding to illegally spy on a candidate and what should happen to those people if they did it.

OK. It seems to say this fisa warrant was granted after carter page left the campaign. And that it doesn't discredit mueller.

As I have said repeatedly, I also remain 100 percent confident in Special Counsel Robert Mueller. The contents of this memo do not - in any way - discredit his investigation. TREY GOWDY

It seems some people are reading more than is there.

originally posted by: CrawlingChaos
a reply to: theantediluvian

No, Comey's statement was that the dossier was salacious and unverified.

He didn't state "parts"...

And you ignored the most important part, the fact he stated the dossier as a whole was unverified.

I know that you probably believe that. It's only been said 20k times in the last week. Hell, it's right in the memo. Gotta give it to the GOP — they sure have their messaging down.

However, it's not what was said. Have you actually referenced the quote? (transcript)

COMEY: I didn't use the term counterintelligence. I was briefing him about salacious and unverified material. It was in a context of that that he had a strong and defensive reaction about that not being true. My reading of it was it was important for me to assure him we were not person investigating him. So the context then was actually narrower, focused on what I just talked to him about. It was very important because it was, first, true, and second, I was worried very much about being in kind of a J. Edgar Hoover-type situation. I didn't want him thinking I was briefing him on this to sort of hang it over him in some way. I was briefing him on it because, because we had been told by the media it was about to launch. We didn't want to be keeping that from him. He needed to know this was being said. I was very keen not to leave him with an impression that the bureau was trying to do something to him. So that's the context in which I said, sir, we're not personally investigating you.

He never refers to the dossier as "salacious and unverified" — he says he was briefing him about salacious and unverified material to which he a strong personal reaction about it being untrue. He's clearly referencing material about Trump, which would include the pee pee tape thing, which is the only part of the dossier that could be described as "salacious." If you know what the word "salacious" means, you know that nothing else in the dossier could be described that way.

And what part of the dossier would Trump have a "strong and defensive reaction about that not being true" to? He has no way of knowing personally if most of the dossier is true or not. He does however know if he had hookers pee on his bed in a Moscow hotel room.

Another context clue is the reference to Hoover who of course is known for keeping secret files with dirt on peoples' sexual proclivities and misadventures.

originally posted by: Asktheanimals
TLDR version:
The FBI and Democratic party used Fusion GPS to obtain fraudulent warrants from the FISA court to spy on the President-elect Donald Trump and his campaign.

Mueller, Comey, McCabe and many top Democrats colluded on this.

Quoted for others.

This is the conclusion I too have reached, thus is the crux of the whole issue.

originally posted by: sdcigarpig
a reply to: Xcathdra

Because Carter Page is a US citizen. There are laws that govern such, and usually they have to have the evidence and probable cause present there to support such. And from what I understand Carter Page was already suspected and in very deep, as they have transcripts of Carter Pages involvement with know Russian intelligence agents, going back to 2013.

I am intimately familiar with how our system works and the requirements for warrants. As a US citizen there was no need to get a FISA warrant to investigate any crimes he committed as a normal court could issue a warrant. My point was the only reason for a FISA warrant was to justify access to Trump and other campaign officials. A normal warrant would not allow the broad net.

Secondly FISA material is classified, keeping it out of the public realm and FOIA exempt.

The purpose of the FISA warrant was to conceal the FBI/DOJ crimes.

James Comey
✔ @Comey

That’s it?
Dishonest and misleading memo wrecked the House intel committee,
destroyed trust with Intelligence Community,
damaged relationship with FISA court,
and inexcusably exposed classified investigation of an American citizen.
For what?
DOJ & FBI must keep doing their jobs.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: Murgatroid

The media either wont cover this or will cover it with spin for the sole purpose of trying to protect themselves from liability since they knowingly assisted in the criminal acts listed.

Exactly, here is how I see it:

Clinton vs. Trump? No, It’s the Media vs. America

The Mainstream Media Has Become A Criminal Accomplice To Naked Campaign Fraud And Election Theft



The collusion has made the MSM simply an organization of the Democrat Party

The critical knowledge to have about the media is to understand that Whoever Controls The Media Controls The World. It is also very important to really understand Who REALLY Controls The Mainstream Media?

Mainstream Media Must Be Shut Down The truth of the matter is that Donald Trump is showing the American people why the Mainstream Media — especially in its current incarnation — must be shut down and replaced ASAP. The amount of damage inflicted to the entire planetary civilization by the MSM is so pervasive, profound and pernicious that only by taking it over will anything on planet Earth ever change for the better.

The Mainstream Media Has Become A Criminal Accomplice To Naked Campaign Fraud And Election Theft

originally posted by: soberbacchus

James Comey
✔ @Comey

That’s it?
Dishonest and misleading memo wrecked the House intel committee,
destroyed trust with Intelligence Community,
damaged relationship with FISA court,
and inexcusably exposed classified investigation of an American citizen.
For what?
DOJ & FBI must keep doing their jobs.

You can hear the sound of panic and desperation from Comey.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: AboveBoard

I'll answer. If it turns out it's all lies and never happened and no one at the FBI had an agenda to hurt Trump rather than seek truth then the story should be dropped.

Now what if they did have an agenda and the memo is true?

The term "Secret Society" comes to mind. Oh and "Missing Text Messages". And what's that damage control term Comey was directed to describe Hillary's email situation again, just before the news of the investigation hit the news, was it??

originally posted by: luthier
FUNNY NOBODY is mentioning FISA as the problem.

Looks like people don't actually care about America. They want to punish a party.


Nobody questioning the judges or the process?

Hmm

You really don't think this will lead to an outcry over FISA abuse? Why do you think everyone was against release? Everybody is caught up in the specific example because it is politically loaded, but you can bet your bottom dollar there will be a reckoning with the FISA process when all this is eventually brought to light. What a prime example that even a politician might stop to think about. How hard will it be for an administration to surveil Congress (again, eh?) and apply pressure to people to come around? They might not care about you, but they probably care about being used and abused personally. Will the FISA debate go anywhere? That probably depends on how much noise people make and who is in office.

originally posted by: theantediluvian

An "essential" part of the allegations that have been, are being made and will be made is "...to spy on the Trump campaign."

Why else then??

originally posted by: Xcathdra
I am intimately familiar with how our system works and the requirements for warrants. As a US citizen there was no need to get a FISA warrant to investigate any crimes he committed as a normal court could issue a warrant. My point was the only reason for a FISA warrant was to justify access to Trump and other campaign officials. A normal warrant would not allow the broad net.

Secondly FISA material is classified, keeping it out of the public realm and FOIA exempt.