Call Me Old Fashioned...But Why Should There Be A 3rd Gender Option On A License?

I just read this and I can't understand why this is even being considered. It's getting to a point, where local and state governments are now bowing down to ridiculous and controversial claims by a particular group. I've read that Germany, Australia, Nepal and Pakistan are now offering a third gender option on official forms, but does that mean the United States should too?

Vermont residents who don't identify as male or female may soon be able to choose another gender on their licenses.

Vermont Public Radio reports the Department of Motor Vehicles' new computer system will allow a third gender option.

Vermont Human Rights Commission Executive Director Karen Richards says the proposed change would help protect transgender Vermonters during traffic stops. Richards says acknowledgement is an important step for the state.

www.foxnews.com...

How is this going to "protect" transgender people? Aren't police agencies up to date on the topic of sexual identity? I've never heard of a trans girl or guy being arrested or harrassed on a traffic stop. It doesn't mean it hasn't happened somewhere, but it was probably due to the officer's personal bias against trans gender people, not because of the personal information on their license. Identifying with another gender doesn’t magically convert you to that sex; it’s a personal choice to live as a different sex. In biology class, I was taught that gender is determined by your 26th chromosomes (x and y chromosomes)....XX is a female, XY is a male. You're either born with a penis, or a vagina....or in rare cases, both (hermaphroditism).

I'm the father of a gay son and I'm OK with that. I love him and support him, because he's happy. Matter of fact, I'm OK with anyone who chooses to live their life the way they want, as long as they're happy in their own skin. However, living as a transgender person doesn't change their sex, nor should their lifestyle be a reason for a state to change the way it issues out licenses and other forms of IDs.

How we fundamentally distinguish male and female then is based upon the two biological roles in reproduction. A human individual that has the basic capacity to reproduce with the female is biologically and truly a male. A human individual that has the basic capacity to reproduce with a male is biologically and truly a female. Male and female are defined in reference to each other, which is why they are correlative terms.

www.thepublicdiscourse.com...

So, how do we have an intelligent conversation on this topic, when many people take the attitude of this person:

We, the society, choose the gender we want to acknowledge. We as a society need to become more aware of what genders are out there, understand them, and add them to our gender binary glasses. That's how we're going to become more inclusive. Stop leaving out or disrespecting people's genders because you don't understand them. Ask them questions, and if they get annoyed by the question then do your own research. Stop saying that a trans girl is a guy when she's not. It's unacceptable and very ignorant.

www.theodysseyonline.com...

I respect a person's right to live out their life as the "gender" they choose. However, is it not "unacceptable and very ignorant" to say a trans girl isn't biologically a guy, or vice versa? Why should a state even consider issuing licenses based on a person's gender, when ID's have historically been based on a person's sex? Isn't your gender "officially" on your birth certificate? If you surgically change your gender, to add "the right parts", that doesn't change your biology. What if a person is gender fluid and changes their identity from transgender back to the gender they were at birth?Wouldn't this be problematic for a state issuing licenses based on gender? Am I old fashioned, confused or both? What's your opinion?

a reply to: shawmanfromny

Vermont residents who don't identify as male or female may soon be able to choose another gender on their licenses.

So when the cops pull you over, walk to your window and ask for your license they know right away how to approach you.

For anyone who isn't familiar with how police behave towards you , the second thing out of their mouths after, "hi, how ya doing", is "got any ID"?

Theres a reason for that. They are trained never to believe anything you say up front, until they have a look at , run thru the computer and decide how to approach you further, from your ID.

All that is based on your record, priors, status, warrants, X-cetera.

a reply to: shawmanfromny

It's ok man... Some day in the not too far off future, you'll have the ability to change your baby's sex right out of the womb. Hell, they're already doing it IN the womb.


What's taboo today will be normal tomorrow. Just keep eating what they force feed ya. If you don't conform, you're not human!




Conform or be Cast Out!

why even have gender on a license?

license`s have photos on them, if you don`t look like the photo ,and are suspected of committing a crime,then the police should detain you until you can provide proof of who you are,regardless of whether you identify as male,female or a potato on your license.

originally posted by: shawmanfromny
How is this going to "protect" transgender people? Aren't police agencies up to date on the topic of sexual identity? I've never heard of a trans girl or guy being arrested or harrassed on a traffic stop. It doesn't mean it hasn't happened somewhere, but it was probably due to the officer's personal bias against trans gender people, not because of the personal information on their license.

it definitely does happen. legally validating it on the license offers a reminder to the officer that it's official, that's where the protection comes in. it's not absolute, but it's a start.

a reply to: intrptr

I understand what you're saying, but I haven't heard of it becoming a daily problem. My brother-in-law is a lieutenant in my cities police department and isn't aware of any past incidents where a transgender person was harassed at a traffic stop. Proper training is the key...not changing the way we issue licenses.

This article is from 2013 and I'm sure police agencies around the country are fully aware of this issue by now.

Being transgender has nothing to do with who you are attracted to for sex; it is not attached to sexual attraction identifiers such as being gay, lesbian, or bi-sexual. You can be transgender and also be gay, lesbian, bi-sexual, straight, or none of the above. Being trans is about your gender identity; it's who you feel and know you are. Our society develops a spectrum of gender possibilities from ultra-masculine to ultra-feminine and every variation in-between.

Normal reactions to meeting someone for the first time who is transgender is usually at first curiosity and then fear and disgust. Often times, it is the fear that encourages us to react with disbelief, skepticism, or intolerance. Being transgender is not contagious or a mental illness, yet some officers still make jokes, mock, and tease someone who is different from them. They bully, harass, disrespect, insult, and hurt persons that don't fit into their idea of what a person's gender identity.

Officers will be challenged to work with and respect transgender individuals rights regarding the use of public restrooms and other traditionally sex segregated facilities. Officers will have to be able to recognize hate crimes within the LGBT community and within LGBT couples for proper investigations.

We face many things on the street every daily that can bring harsh judgments and lawsuits. This is one area where simple training and awareness would go a long way toward protecting the rights of people not commonly understood by officers.

I encourage departments to add a unique individual to a civil lawsuit mitigation program and provide group training to assist officers with the challenge they face on the street. Awareness is knowledge. Knowledge is empowering. Being empowered allows for compassion and understanding for both communities.

www.policemag.com...

I think the person issuing the license should check either "looks male", "looks female", or "can't tell".

I had a cousin, born female, living as a transgender man. She was killed in an auto accident. The confusion of male to female identity caused a great problem identifying the body and contacting the family. This can be a very complex problem in the event of an emergency medical condition.

Unconscious and In the ER with your clothing cut off, the Medical staff needs to know if your plumbing matches your ID. Trying to obtain permission to treat, could mean the difference between life or death.

The so called leader of the past administration trying to push his own fancies and agenda.
a reply to: shawmanfromny

Just because you don’t know the difference between gender and biologically assigned sex does not mean the rest of us all have to conform to your ignorance.

Why do you even care!

Just tick the box that you identify with and don’t worry about what boxes other people are ticking.

Why is this even a issue for people??

a reply to: shawmanfromny

I understand what you're saying, but I haven't heard of it becoming a daily problem. My brother-in-law is a lieutenant in my cities police department and isn't aware of any past incidents where a transgender person was harassed at a traffic stop. Proper training is the key...not changing the way we issue licenses.

Oh I don't mean for harassment, just to be polite. Many people are on the lam for something, will lie their ass off at a traffic stop. Just show me your ID.

"Be right back".

Once they know all about you from the well of information on the never blinking, never forget, deep state computers... then they can return to your window and say Miss , Mister, mrs, ms, erm, uhh ma'am , sir, (insert name), Would you please get out of the car for me? They need to remain polite while violating your civil rights.

If a search becomes necessary its also important to identify gender before that too, lol.

I totally agree, two options are plenty.
Either an inny or an outty.

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
Just because you don’t know the difference between gender and biologically assigned sex does not mean the rest of us all have to conform to your ignorance.

There is no difference. The politically incorrect among you made that crap up... which is why you don't call it a sex change anymore.

a reply to: Nickn3

Life saving emergency medical intervention is applied regardless of 'gender', age , class, color, etc.

The issue is not once you get to the trauma room or the morgue, its the stamp on your license the police use to determine how to approach you as politely as possible.

If the coroner is digging thru your blood soaked wallet for ID, they usually already know what sex you are.

If they are cutting your clothing off in Emergency, they don't care.

Because some days, you feel like you have nuts, and some days you don't. Or at least, that's what the gender fluid like to think.

originally posted by: bluechevytree
why even have gender on a license?

license`s have photos on them, if you don`t look like the photo ,and are suspected of committing a crime,then the police should detain you until you can provide proof of who you are,regardless of whether you identify as male,female or a potato on your license.

Exactly. Hair colors change, styles change, eye colors with contacts... It all changes and not even important. Hell, I shave my head bald from time to time and grow a full beard because I like it. Face still stays the same for the most part.

Are you going to change your sex to the new 3rd option? If no why should you give a damn?.
Move on think of things that effect you let others live their life.

Let people be as they wish to be? They aren't in any way causing you harm or trouble.

It always seems to be those who simply lack the capacity to accept change that whether intended or not, prevent change.

a reply to: shawmanfromny

I personally identify as a mythical genius super-hero, "The Defender of Reasoning and Master of Lego".

Until there is a check box for me, I will never hold a drivers license in Vermont. They won't even allow you to wear a mask and cape while sitting your license photo.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Oh, I know the differences, the question is, do other people? I care, because I think this issue regarding Vermont's licensing procedure is foolish and can cause even MORE problems down the road. Why are you so wound up? Everyone has a right to their opinion, including you. I'm the father of a gay son and COULD CARE LESS how a person chooses to live their life. It's about a state potentially changing the way they issue out licenses, that I disagree with. That's MY OPINION.