I hate all images of people smoking cigarettes

a reply to: puzzlesphere

Again, why would the studies solely concerning separate chemicals and their dangers to the human body that happen to be in industrial produced tobacco be false.

Your arguments doesn’t even stand up to logic.

Why would medical studies concerning the hazards of smoking be fabricated. You have cherry picked propaganda bought by the tobacco industry?

Shameful that you would defend industrial tobacco that has been proven dangers, proven to lie, proven to conspire to hide the dangers of smoking, and proven to manipulate the addictiveness of their products.

If anything, I am not addicted to a product produced by corporations that have to spend millions on lobbying and bought research. Can you say the same.... or can you quit smoking anytime......

I never started smoking, save at least 2000 a year, and don’t support a blatantly deceitful industry.

Good luck to you.

a reply to: neutronflux

I did answer your question.

I linked to a second hand smoke toxicology study dealing exactly with the chemicals in cigarettes, then showed the amount of cigarettes you would need in a small room within an hour time period, for a subset of the supposedly most dangerous chemicals in cigarettes, to have those chemicals reach dangerous levels for humans, based on known safe toxicology limits.

The exceedingly minuscule amount of those chemicals in a single cigarette, or even a pack of cigarettes, is well below other daily sources of those same chemicals.

For instance, Benzene and it's derivatives is in many daily activities. That slightly sweet smell in petrol when filling your car is Benzene, and a minute spent filling your car exposes you to magnitudes higher levels than even prolonged cigarette use.

That's my whole point... that in moderation, cigarettes are significantly less harmful than many other daily activities. The hypocrisy is that smoking will be blamed for premature death, because it has those chemicals... yet other activities with much higher exposure rates are ignored.

a reply to: neutronflux

Actually it does. Delayed gratification can be much more rewarding in the long run, but the instant endorphins released when doing an enjoyable activity have been proven to have an anti-oxidant effect on a person, which contributes to a good quality of life. You know... the small pleasures are good in moderation.

I am truly sorry for your loss, but blaming a single source for diseases that have been shown to be multi-factorial is not an honest assessment.

You are getting very emotional, which is what has been achieved by the anti-smoking lobby... turn it into an emotional debate rather than a factual one.

a reply to: neutronflux

Again, you are getting emotional and are attacking the debater rather than arguing with facts.

Many sources have been provided to you at your request, yet you dismiss them all (likely without having read them) as propaganda.

The sources I have provided are unbiased (which are very hard to find) as they usually are weighted to either side, and can be a struggle to identify the actual raw data.

Then you finish your post on a very snarky comment. (Not that it's any of your business) but I enjoy the occasional smoke, I often stop for weeks on end (because smoking isn't actually as physically addictive as its made out to be, mentally addictive, yes, but so is everything in life) depending on work commitments, yet will definitely enjoy a smoke in moderation.

If you want to just swallow the media pill, fine. I am trying to be objective, and look for the facts, which are few and far between in this topic.

Good luck to you.

a reply to: intrepid

Most people who claim they can quit really can't. When you get cancer we will see if you still think it's funny.

a reply to: dfnj2015

so what do never smokers quit when they get cancer? Or do they just think its funny from the git go?

originally posted by: dfnj2015
Cigarettes are so disgusting and unhealthy. I just hate them. I can't stand it when I see it in people's avatars, images on the net, or characters smoking on TV shows and movies. More people die from cigarette cancers than terrorism by huge amounts. Yet people are puffing away all worried about the A-rabs coming here to commit acts of terrorism. Cigarettes are so bad. Just gross.

Sounds like you are an ex smoker... by any chance?

I know shortly after I quit I 'hated' smokers because I still wanted to smoke in a bad way.

Part envy, part repulsion, ex smokers tend to focus on cigarettes more.

a reply to: roguetechie

www.quitsmokingsupport.com...

Cigarette smoke contains over 4,000 chemicals, including 43 known cancer-causing (carcinogenic) compounds and 400 other toxins. These include nicotine, tar, and carbon monoxide, as well as formaldehyde, ammonia, hydrogen cyanide, arsenic, and DDT.

So all the independent research on the dangerous of formaldehyde, ammonia, hydrogen cyanide, arsenic, and DDT are false propaganda? It doesn’t take a genius to understand cigarettes are poisonous. Or is calling cigarettes poisonous a false statement? Can you prove otherwise?

You...

Because "your personal tragedy" outweighs everyone else's rights and obligates them to not even "think" anything contradictory!

Right?

Yeah, thought so...

You make me sick

Because I despise big tobacco, the lobbyists that put politicians in their pockets, big tobacco conspired to make their products more addictive, and conspired to hide the dangers of their products? Basically big tobacco hid everything that ATS tries to uncover.

Quote where my beef is with nicotine. Quote where I ever said people shouldn’t have the choice to smoke. Quote where I said people shouldn’t smoke home grown tobacco.

I am proud I make you F’n sick.

a reply to: neutronflux

It isn't up to anybody to prove "otherwise".

You have mentioned that studies were done on very dangerous chemicals.

You fail to understand that the poison is not in the substance, its in the dose!

Now just how much cyanide do you think is in the smoke from the burning of 19 grams of dried leaves?

originally posted by: TiredofControlFreaks
a reply to: neutronflux

It isn't up to anybody to prove "otherwise".

You have mentioned that studies were done on very dangerous chemicals.

You fail to understand that the poison is not in the substance, its in the dose!

Now just how much cyanide do you think is in the smoke from the burning of 19 grams of dried leaves?

www.quitsmokingsupport.com...

Cigarette smoke contains over 4,000 chemicals, including 43 known cancer-causing (carcinogenic) compounds and 400 other toxins. These include nicotine, tar, and carbon monoxide, as well as formaldehyde, ammonia, hydrogen cyanide, arsenic, and DDT.

Funny you ignore the actual chemical makeup? And the smoke is being drawn right into a living organ that has no skin to protect it. Smoke after smoke. Cigarette after cigarette. Pack after pack. Day after day. Week after week.

Is it false to say cigarettes expose the smoker to known poisons? Directly to 3 pounds of lungs before those poisons are diluted in the blood and body.

www.stopsmoking.news...

Thanks to a build up of TAR in the smoker’s lungs, up to a cup in each lung for the pack-a-day smoker, the tiny air sacks (alveoli) cannot expand properly and this keeps them from detoxifying properly, especially when most cessation (quit smoking) methods do NOT explain ANYTHING AT ALL about nutrition, nutrients, minerals, detoxification of chemicals, or the ammonia, bleach and pesticides contained in that tar in the lungs.

a reply to: neutronflux

everything you say sounds awful scientificy but why did you not just answer my question. I don't care if millions of known carcinogens are in the smoke,

Its the dosage that counts. In this case I know for a fact that dosage is in the parts per trillion range. That is 1 second in 32 years!

As for a cup of tar in the lungs. Now you are just being moronic! Your quoting ridiculous propaganda along the lines of the blacck lung lie.

a reply to: neutronflux

Look its all very very simple.

You claim to have lost people due to smoking. I am sorry for your loss but in order to blame it on smoking, you must have proof.

Surely you would not be making outragous claims without proof. You must have the proof close at hand. Surely you wouldn't misplace such important information!

Provide the proof that smoking is the CAUSE of any disease. Not associated with, not linked to, not correlated with but actual proof.

Is there any disease that never smokers don't get that smokers do????

a reply to: TiredofControlFreaks

Why do you over complicate that inhaling cigarette smoke is poisonous in every context of the word?

Is tar poisons? Does smoking cigarettes deposit tar in the lungs?

Is carbon monoxide poisonous? Does smoking cigarettes put carbon monoxide in the blood and carry it to the brain?

Are formaldehyde, ammonia, hydrogen cyanide, arsenic, and DDT poisonous? Does smoking cigarettes put the listed poisonous in the blood which deposits them in the organs, effecting cell growth, and the ability the human body has in healing itself.

a reply to: TiredofControlFreaks

www.aofas.org...

How does smoking affect healing after surgery?
The air we breathe is filled with oxygen, which is needed for most functions in the body, including healing after surgery. On a microscopic level, chemicals found in cigarette smoke cause many changes to the way the body handles oxygen. Hemoglobin, a molecule that carries oxygen throughout the body, cannot carry as much oxygen as usual when it is exposed to cigarette smoke. Tiny blood vessels in the body become narrow, which makes it more difficult for hemoglobin and oxygen to get to the tissues where they are needed.

In addition, smoking makes blood thicker so it doesn't flow as easily through narrowed blood vessels. Think about a busy four-lane highway filled with big trucks hauling precious cargo. If this were the body, smoking would have the effect of shutting the highway down to two lanes, shrinking the trucks down to small cars, and pouring sticky tar on the road. Much less cargo would get where it needed to go. In the same way, areas of the body that need oxygen (like your foot) go without. With less oxygen, the body has a more difficult time healing the skin where the surgery is performed.

If surgery involves the bones of the foot or ankle, smoking may prevent the bones from healing, which is called a nonunion. Current research shows that smokers may have anywhere from two to 10 times the risk of wound problems and/or nonunion after surgery.

In addition, smoking has been shown to make it more difficult for your body to fight off an infection after surgery. Chemicals in cigarette smoke limit the activity of infection-fighting cells called neutrophils. Neutrophils are “body guard” cells in the body. They restore a safe environment by getting rid of things that don't belong, like bacteria, before problems are caused. Without normal neutrophils, an infection could set in which may require antibiotics or even more surgery to cure. Smokers have been shown to have up to four times the risk of infection after foot surgery than nonsmokers.

New research also shows that some smokers may have more pain after surgery than nonsmokers. Chemicals in cigarette smoke may increase inflammation and affect the way the body interprets pain signals. Combined, this may increase the amount of pain experienced by smokers, which may persist long after the wound has healed.

a reply to: TiredofControlFreaks

I don’t care you smoke, but why are you so defensive that smoking is a horrible life choice? Especially if you are supporting big tobacco known to manipulate their products for increased addiction, and conspired to hide the dangerous of their products.

Again, big tobacco represent everything ATS tries to expose. Is that a false statement?

a reply to: neutronflux

You keep parroting the same anti-smoking propaganda, which is provably false. You have never addressed a single point I made in any of my posts... just keep saying that smoking is bad, like a well trained media monkey.

No-one has said smoking isn't bad, and that tobacco corporations haven't done a lot of underhanded stuff (like all big corporations)... but my point is, so are so many other daily activities, that are demonstrably worse than smoking, but the towed line is always that it's cigarettes fault... not any of the other daily activities that deliver much higher levels of the exact same chemicals that you are complaining about in smoke.

The concerted anti-smoking campaign is an assault on personal freedom and liberty, being used to slowly take away individual rights through social engineering and group think, and has become a massively lucrative industry that exerts pressure over policy under the guise of wanting to help people... bollocks... as always, money is at the core. It is a puritanical set of control freaks that want to control the global moral paradigm.

Let's teach facts, moderation, self control and self-determination... much more important and honest than saying that cigs are the most evil substance in the world... which is hogswash.

a reply to: neutronflux

you are aware, are you not, that smoking also has benefits?

a reply to: puzzlesphere

So you are down to it’s ok to be underhand because other people are?

And how does cigarette smoke, and the know toxins it contains, not fit the definition of poisonous for the smoker?

Again quote where I said people should not have the choice to smoke.

That doesn’t give big tobacco the right to miss lead and conspire to hid the dangerous of smoking. Sorry, you don’t come across for standing up for freedom. You come across as being apologetic, sympathetic, and as lobbyists for large corrupt big tobacco. And it is very sad. Again, is it true to say big tobacco engaged in behavior that ATS tries to expose.

originally posted by: TiredofControlFreaks
a reply to: neutronflux

you are aware, are you not, that smoking also has benefits?

Spoken like a true lobbyists.. by a large corporation know to conspire to hide the dangerous of smoking.

It is not worth it to me because of cost, don’t want to dump tar in my lungs, the reduction in quality of life, the reduction in life span, the smell, the damage it does to the interior of buildings, the increased in personal health cost, the way it reduces oxygen in the blood stream, it’s full of know toxins, the way it interferes with cell production, and the way it interferes with the way the body heals.