Wells Fargo CEO admits he won’t use his tax windfall to create more jobs

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: introvert

How much do you want to bet that the savings for the average American will last JUST long enough to where Trump can get out of office and the sudden "tax hike" (which is probably part of the tax bill to begin with) can't be blamed on him but the next president. Kind of like how the 56+ months of job growth we had under Obama is now Trump's doing in his supporters' opinions.

The piss in the bucket savings the average American will see will be eaten up by what most American's do with their tax refunds. They will spend it. Which is what they should do.

And while I do not see how this tax plan is a huge success for Trump, other than to say that Trump and the GOP finally got something accomplished, I don't see how we can use this as a negative towards Trump either.

It's just another "typical" tax plan like we have seen before. Trump is carrying the same torch as did the man that came before him.

originally posted by: seasonal
a reply to: Southern Guardian

Of course the major portion of tax savings to corps will not create US jobs, it will increase already very very good profits.

The jobs left the US because of cheap labor-doesn't matter if it is factory or computer programmers. Cheap labor, with the profit driven Corps it is the only logical steps to increase profits and keep share holders smiling.

It is called race to the bottom, and it will not change as our system is set up for never ending debt and we are neck deep in it ($20,000,000,000,000). In my opinion cutting taxes is irresponsible til the the US is in better financial shape. This shows us how piss poor our leadership is.

.

No, no, no...we need to cut taxes to the rich, give a temporary tax break to the middle class, and increase the military spending. It's how we make america great!

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: introvert

How much do you want to bet that the savings for the average American will last JUST long enough to where Trump can get out of office and the sudden "tax hike" (which is probably part of the tax bill to begin with) can't be blamed on him but the next president. Kind of like how the 56+ months of job growth we had under Obama is now Trump's doing in his supporters' opinions.

The piss in the bucket savings the average American will see will be eaten up by what most American's do with their tax refunds. They will spend it. Which is what they should do.

And while I do not see how this tax plan is a huge success for Trump, other than to say that Trump and the GOP finally got something accomplished, I don't see how we can use this as a negative towards Trump either.

It's just another "typical" tax plan like we have seen before. Trump is carrying the same torch as did the man that came before him.

Considering the average american hardly pays any taxes it only stands to reason the average american's tax savings would not be that high in dollar amount. It is hard to cut taxes when you don't pay them. The vast majority of any tax cut by definition has to go to those who pay the most. It is simple mathematics.

With that said, I am disappointed the GOP didn't swing for the fences and offer up real revolutionary tax reform by completely simplifying the tax code by essentially throwing 90% of it out the window and moving to a flat tax. They were probably trying to do this by doubling the standard deduction so that vast majority don't need to itemize, but I think we need real reform that guts the IRS and eliminates the political favors of the tax code across the board.

a reply to: Edumakated

Considering the average american hardly pays any taxes it only stands to reason the average american's tax savings would not be that high in dollar amount. It is hard to cut taxes when you don't pay them. The vast majority of any tax cut by definition has to go to those who pay the most. It is simple mathematics.

I agree.

With that said, I am disappointed the GOP didn't swing for the fences and offer up real revolutionary tax reform by completely simplifying the tax code by essentially throwing 90% of it out the window and moving to a flat tax. They were probably trying to do this by doubling the standard deduction so that vast majority don't need to itemize, but I think we need real reform that guts the IRS and eliminates the political favors of the tax code across the board.

The GOP may talk a good game, but they are not about to simplify the tax code to such an extreme.

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: introvert

Well it doubles the standard deduction, increases child tax credits and cuts about 2% from each bracket. Like I said read the bill not CNN

I have read it and you appear to be a good example of what I am talking about.

Throw the American people a small bone and they will love you for it.

Doubles the standard deduction?

Big #ing deal! The way taxes work, that does not amount to much at all.

And yet you would desire people pay more.

originally posted by: angeldoll
a reply to: Southern Guardian

According to polls, Trump's tax plan is less popular than Bill Clinton's tax increase.

Because the media has convinced people that letting the government extort money from them is patriotic.

originally posted by: Wardaddy454

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: introvert

Well it doubles the standard deduction, increases child tax credits and cuts about 2% from each bracket. Like I said read the bill not CNN

I have read it and you appear to be a good example of what I am talking about.

Throw the American people a small bone and they will love you for it.

Doubles the standard deduction?

Big #ing deal! The way taxes work, that does not amount to much at all.

And yet you would desire people pay more.

I said nothing of the sort.

The member I was conversing with had said this plan would benefit the lower and middle classes very highly. Which is a misrepresentation in my opinion, even with a doubling of the standard deduction.

It's small potatoes. Small bones for people to chew on while they think they got a sweet deal.

A doubling of the standard is not something to whoop and holler about or get on our knees and praise Trump/congress for.

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: Wardaddy454

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: introvert

Well it doubles the standard deduction, increases child tax credits and cuts about 2% from each bracket. Like I said read the bill not CNN

I have read it and you appear to be a good example of what I am talking about.

Throw the American people a small bone and they will love you for it.

Doubles the standard deduction?

Big #ing deal! The way taxes work, that does not amount to much at all.

And yet you would desire people pay more.

I said nothing of the sort.

The member I was conversing with had said this plan would benefit the lower and middle classes very highly. Which is a misrepresentation in my opinion, even with a doubling of the standard deduction.

It's small potatoes. Small bones for people to chew on while they think they got a sweet deal.

A doubling of the standard is not something to whoop and holler about or get on our knees and praise Trump/congress for.

You being a socialist says it all.

As for the tax plan, its a start in the right direction, until you guys see all the money people have and wanna take it by raising taxes again.

originally posted by: projectvxn

originally posted by: angeldoll
a reply to: Southern Guardian

According to polls, Trump's tax plan is less popular than Bill Clinton's tax increase.

Because the media has convinced people that letting the government extort money from them is patriotic.

What confuses me is how when govt. money is used to build bombs, spaceships, and pay the military it's patriotic,

but when govt. money is used to feed old people, and pay for their medicare, it's communism/socialism. How does that work?

originally posted by: olaru12

originally posted by: projectvxn

originally posted by: angeldoll
a reply to: Southern Guardian

According to polls, Trump's tax plan is less popular than Bill Clinton's tax increase.

Because the media has convinced people that letting the government extort money from them is patriotic.

What confuses me is how when govt. money is used to build bombs, spaceships, and pay the military it's patriotic,

but when govt. money is used to feed old people, and pay for their medicare, it's communism/socialism. odd.

There should be no confusion. The constitution lays out what the feds should be spending money on... the problem is politicians on both sides have chosen to ignore it.

It seems to me that the entire tax system is a mess, to say the least. The concept of the trickle down economics, while it sounds good, in reality does nothing for the average person on the street. And as it turns out there are a lot of tax breaks in it for those that are rich and in some sectors, while others are left without.

If they really wanted to do something with taxes, I would say overhaul the system, start from scratch, get rid of the old and start fresh with a new, keep it where anyone, from say a high school student to an older person no longer working can look and read, and figure it out, and be able to do such without having to use an expert in the process.

Right now there are far too many loopholes in the system, and it is highly abused by those with a lot. Personally I think a flat tax rate across the board would be far better than what we have, you make a dollar you pay a percentage of that back to the government and go with that.

originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: Southern Guardian

Lower and middle class also benefit highly... have you not read the bill?

I will "benefit highly"? I read the bill, all 500 pages of it. My household breaks even, no higher, no lower in the taxation department. After the so-called cuts expire, however, we all get the middle class tax shaft universally.

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: Wardaddy454

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: introvert

Well it doubles the standard deduction, increases child tax credits and cuts about 2% from each bracket. Like I said read the bill not CNN

I have read it and you appear to be a good example of what I am talking about.

Throw the American people a small bone and they will love you for it.

Doubles the standard deduction?

Big #ing deal! The way taxes work, that does not amount to much at all.

And yet you would desire people pay more.

I said nothing of the sort.

The member I was conversing with had said this plan would benefit the lower and middle classes very highly. Which is a misrepresentation in my opinion, even with a doubling of the standard deduction.

It's small potatoes. Small bones for people to chew on while they think they got a sweet deal.

A doubling of the standard is not something to whoop and holler about or get on our knees and praise Trump/congress for.

BS. A couple thousand dollars of my own money not taken from me each year as it has been in past years is absolutely a sweet deal. Understanding I will not see what I actually want, that being a dismantling of the illogical, questionably Constitutional, and certainly conflicting of interest tax system in it's entirety, this tax plan does represent a "sweet deal" for the middle class. As for the "poor", it represents a very sweet deal to them when compared to what I would advocate. Personally, I think we need to have a much more fair system... in that I mean either nobody pays income tax or every earner pays income tax. Just because someone is "poor" shouldn't abdicate them from the responsibilities demanded of the rest of us. If most Americans are demanded to pay net positive income tax on their earnings, all Americans should be required to do so. It's called "equal treatment under the law" and it is absolutely necessary to avoid having nonsense like Kept Voters who whore their vote in exchange for political positions that redistribute more of others' money directly into their accounts.

originally posted by: Nyiah
After the so-called cuts expire, however, we all get the middle class tax shaft universally.

Yup, so let me ask you this... in that 2024 election, who ya gonna vote for? The party that cuts your taxes or the one that always votes to raise them? The expiration clause was a brilliant move that will force some voters to actually consider the ramifications of their vote for a change.

a reply to: introvert

You want to "see a tax", plan? Stop buying sh*t you don't need, and buy only what you need. This "tax plan" offers that. It's up to you to be ignorant, and stick your neck in the same noose twice.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: Nyiah
After the so-called cuts expire, however, we all get the middle class tax shaft universally.

Yup, so let me ask you this... in that 2024 election, who ya gonna vote for? The party that cuts your taxes or the one that always votes to raise them? The expiration clause was a brilliant move that will force some voters to actually consider the ramifications of their vote for a change.

I don't vote strictly partisan to begin with, my vote rests on track record rather than party. Who I will vote for rests entirely on how they stack up in comparing their records with their campaign promises.

It's kind of how voting SHOULD be, party is insignificant next to "work history".

a reply to: Nyiah

The gods guns and Girls crowd don’t care about the future. The rich found another way to raid the treasury and the anti abortionist got their Supreme Court. Another trump supporter in another thread said the promise of higher wages is a lie.
Middle class bend over.

originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: Nyiah

The gods guns and Girls crowd don’t care about the future. The rich found another way to raid the treasury and the anti abortionist got their Supreme Court. Another trump supporter in another thread said the promise of higher wages is a lie.
Middle class bend over.

I don't even think it's worthwhile to offer them Vaseline to soften to surprise at this point. This is a lesson of hoodwinking that NEEDS to be learned, harshly. All of our go-forth-and-procreate big family republican members are going to suffer hard for this mistake.

a reply to: olaru12

Well, as far as the military is concerned, there is a constitutional authority.

There is also constitutional authority for the public funding of science and art.

I believe in social programs. The libertarian ideal that the private sector can handle it all(charity for poor people via churches and community programs) is a fairy tale that only works within small, homogenous, communities. Just like Socialism.

So therefore in our modern society, I am willing to contribute, passively through taxation, for the good of my fellow citizens. This does not mean that I want high taxes to pay for waste and government pet projects that help no one but political cronies. I will take any tax cut I can get, and what I do pay I want to see used wisely, constitutionally, and for the actual betterment of society.

All too often social programs are used as a workaround to constitutional rights. Like drug testing welfare recipients. It is a legal doctrine that is nonsensical to me, that anything the government provides comes with the price of giving up liberties. That should never be the case; the notion that government can simply waive off its constitutional mandates; that providing a service is legal reason enough for the violation.

Tax cuts shouldn't have to be "paid for". They should simply not spend that money. We are going to run into some fiscal realities sooner or later that will ensure our collective unhappiness should nothing continue to be done.

That said, the bigger issue here is cutting spending. While I have seen some positive signs here and there, they have been mostly symbolic, with little substance to speak of. That is a legitimate criticism of the President's fiduciary performance. I welcome the Republican tax bill, but it will not mean much if the government continues to increase spending. There are plenty of places where HUGE cuts can be made without "putting granny in the street". Sky-is-falling politics is getting us nowhere.

a reply to: Wardaddy454

You being a socialist says it all.

As for the tax plan, its a start in the right direction, until you guys see all the money people have and wanna take it by raising taxes again.

No. It doesn't say it all.

Your projection is not a valid argument.