Trump Slashes Size of Bears Ears and Grand Staircase Monuments

a reply to: burdman30ott6

I live in red state Idaho in small town. The hicks vote republican for one reason for 25 years now. To control vaginas.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: TobyFlenderson

Then how did we get one party, the Republican Party, in charge of 30 states and all of federal level? Somebody must think the Republican Party is looking out for them.

Because in the grand scheme of things, Republican domestic policy speaks to the concerns of rural Americans a lot more than Democrat social policy does. Rural Americans statistically care about their second amendment rights, as little federal involvement in their daily comings and goings as possible, and local authority to set policy over issues like development, wildlife resource management, natural resource management, education, etc. Democrats seem to approach social policy from this concept of superiority by which metropolitan ideals represent the pinnacle and are obviously the role model and goal of every American. They espouse a position by which one's institutional education qualifications and number of special interest organizations you're a member of dictate how important your opinion should be and how much more "qualified" you are to set policy over all the uneducated, uncultured rural urchins. Urban Americans care about federally dominated social policy, using politics to save the world from tradition and culture whereas rural Americans believe their traditions and culture can save them from politics.

Most rural Conservative voters aren't voting Republican because we think the GOP is looking out for us, we vote Republican because we believe the GOP will leave us alone, neither helping us nor (as is the case too frequently with Democrats) hindering us or holding us back.

Bingo!I just wish that the Feds would declare gigantic National Monuments east of the Mississippi all the way into the east coast,just like they do out here in the west.I think that would usher in a big change in opinion from the left.

originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: burdman30ott6

I live in red state Idaho in small town. The hicks vote republican for one reason for 25 years now. To control vaginas.

The victim card is another reason rural Americans tend to not vote for Democrats... generally speaking, nobody plays the victim card as quickly or as ridiculously as the smattering of Democrats in those rural, Conservative areas.

Let me ask you this, how has your "vagina been controlled" in Idaho? Are abortions illegal? Is rape legal? Are girls being subjected to promised betrothings? Are women not allowed to own land or vote? What is the metric you're using to claim vaginas are being controlled in Idaho?

a reply to: burdman30ott6

My personal favorite law other than the list of laws for abortion, is the one where religious people can let their 6 yr old die of fevers and any curable disease because of god.

a reply to: MOMof3

I would suggest it all depends on one's perspective. If you think either party on the Fed level is interested in you then I would say we have a fundamental disagreement that will not be resolved via discussion.

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
One of the biggest gifts America has to its people and the world is the large amount of public land we have.

It gives opportunities to city dwellers go experience the awesomeness of Mother nature and also preserves vast amounts of different regions do people can see first hand the rich diversity our large country has to offer.

President Trump sharply reduced the size of two national monuments in Utah on Monday by some two

This is slightly off topic but I need to say it, right up to this point I thought Trump had ordered two statues to be trimmed down by a couple of feet. I hadn't heaed of Bears Ears or Grand Staircase before.

I'm off to have a look-see...

Now at least they can go back to handicapped accessible areas. That was a major issue.

originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: burdman30ott6

My personal favorite law other than the list of laws for abortion, is the one where religious people can let their 6 yr old die of fevers and any curable disease because of god.

What's that got to do with vaginas?

Another win!

originally posted by: kurthall
a reply to: CriticalStinker



I am not sure how many of you have driven across the United States, but I have driven from Chicago to So Cali, where I live, and there is a whole lot of NOTHING between here and there. Once its is done, there will be no going back. Something special taken for granted, ruined by the wealthy for the wealthy.

Why this administration takes us BACKWARD, the others that come to mind, Allowing "Elephant Trophies" back into the country, and that makes me sick.

www.businessinsider.com...

Then we have the Paris agreement.

Another one, is the "travel ban". Why? Because back when trump first wanted to implement it, it was only supposed to be a few months. It has now been 11 since he took office, the damn travel ban that was so important SHOULD HAVE ALREADY BEEN LIFTED.

So that Temporary ban that now goes into affect, what exactly is trump going to accomplish with this "temporary" ban, that he could not the past 11 months.....NOTHING. Or are we just going to ban them for good? That is NOT what trump said back in January.

Sympathy there,
It all shows the total disregard that this man has for anything when he has a need, and when there is an opportunity for him to make ugly dictat to please the Hooray Henries.
Anyway Trump has an awful habit of shooting himself in the foot when he crows..he did it a few days ago with 'Muslim' tweet when you regard his continued stance that the travel ban was not about religious discrimination, while he has yet again shown that it clearly is by his tweet....not something it seems in the remit of this latest decision by the SCOTUS which was about the emergency injunction which they have concluded, not unanimously, was unnecessary, but not a final ruling...not really being fair to people travelling IMHO though, never mind 'extreme vetting'.
So I guess he will crow his way into disaster over this latest gaff some way or other...I don't even think of it as wishful thinking, he is so flawed. People in the US will realise it sooner or later, as I did years ago by his antics over here.

I need to leave ATS. It gets me crazy. Not the subject but some of the responses on this thread.

You're typing a statement on the internet. The same internet which holds copious amounts of information contrary to which you claim. I understand there are Trump haters. Fine. It's a free country. He's an easy target. But not every single thing he does is new, unique to him, or criminal. Why the hysteria? You do know his predecessor's administration opened 2.5 times more land to oil and gas companies than were set aside for conservation?

The Federal Government "owns" nearly a third of the geographical US. Over 630 million acres. The various parcels have varying degrees of use restrictions. A small percentage (NP's, NM's, NWR's) are highly restricted. The majority are already open to grazing, mining, timber, etc.

If this change of hands back to the state of Utah (presumably) stands, it has yet to be seen what will happen to it. Some states do a better job of preserving natural heritage than the Federal government. Of course, some don't. If the new chunk of land has only been a NM for less than a year, obviously it is not a "pristine" piece of wild lands safely under the watchful eye of the incorruptible Uncle Sam since the Earth's crust cooled.

It has been under the control of various government agencies (federal, state, tribal) for a long time. During that same time it has been exposed to the pressures of extractive industries and has survived well enough to be considered a NM. Why the problem now?

Lobbyists can get to any level of government. If you really are paying attention, oil/gas/timber/mining has held sway with all of them for years. There seems to be this bugaboo in the MSM today that vast tracts of wilderness were paved over in a day all thanks to the Evil One. This is simply not true. The loss of wild lands has sadly been on a declining trajectory for decades.

Maybe if the federal government stops taking land out west where few live and instead they take vast swaths of suburban America for re-wilding, would the emotional outpouring sound the same?

History of the parcel/s:
en.wikipedia.org...

Latest Administrations Conserving Public Lands:
wilderness.org...

What has become of Bears Ears and Grand Staircase-Escalante:
www.sltrib.com...

originally posted by: Butterfinger
Cut the area down for what?

I dont know what you all are thinking this means, it doesnt open it all up to strip mining or fracking.

This is still government property, the only difference is you wont get jailed or fined for running cattle through it or camping or fishing or biking...this is all allowed in those areas now, not construction or deforestation or anything drastic to the environment.

kinda brings it back inline prior to the previous admin who stripped those rights away from people who had the right for so many years to carry out such things aswell. just setting it back to how it should be

originally posted by: ABNARTY
I need to leave ATS. It gets me crazy. Not the subject but some of the responses on this thread.

You're typing a statement on the internet. The same internet which holds copious amounts of information contrary to which you claim. I understand there are Trump haters. Fine. It's a free country. He's an easy target. But not every single thing he does is new, unique to him, or criminal. Why the hysteria? You do know his predecessor's administration opened 2.5 times more land to oil and gas companies than were set aside for conservation?

If you mean Obama, I do believe he came under fire in 2015 for demanding more information on the methods used in Fracking, accusing him of trying to do away with jobs...blah blah.
It is the states who do most of the regulating, and as far as fracking is concerned many have gone clean daft, they don't...(just like the police don't all report crime) report on wells, what type of well, etc, etc.
States like Colorado....84,000 wells, Kansas and Texas...303,900 wells have thousands of wells with even no direct information on all types of well, in some cases no information on where the wells are. That's just crazy.

originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: burdman30ott6

My personal favorite law other than the list of laws for abortion, is the one where religious people can let their 6 yr old die of fevers and any curable disease because of god.

...and this equals "controling vaginas" in what way, exactly? You seem to have beef with the Followers of Christ sect, which isn't a political issue so much as a religious one. Staying on topic, however, what specific "list of laws" for abortion are you referencing which have made Idaho a state of Republicans "controlling vaginas?"

originally posted by: Hazardous1408
a reply to: Butterfinger

Are you familiar with the term “full of sh*t”?

Here is a good example of it...

...it doesnt open it all up to strip mining or fracking.

The decision to reduce Bears Ears is expected to set off a legal battle that could alter the course of American land conservation, putting dozens of other monuments at risk and possibly opening millions of preserved public acres to oil and gas extraction, mining, logging and other commercial activities.

Is your attempt to muddy the waters due to forgivable ignorance or do you just feel the need to defend Trump at all costs?

Are you familiar with the term NYT?

That alone should tell you the words you quoted are completely contrived and have nothing to do with reality.

And that isn't defending Trump, it's defending sanity.

By the way, there is no difference between “full of sh*t” and New York Times!

a reply to: Butterfinger

That's some wishful thinking right there. To think this administrations only goal was to let cattle graze on gov't land and give to the people is purely naive. The land is gonna lose its federal protection and sold to the highest bidder. Maybe cattlemen will buy up some of the acreage but you better believe the wealthy elite behind all the money in our land will suck it all up.

I do hope in years time your perception is right but that's a pipe dream.

a reply to: ABNARTY

I need to leave ATS. It gets me crazy. Not the subject but some of the responses on this thread.

I understand there are Trump haters. Fine. It's a free country. He's an easy target. But not every single thing he does is new, unique to him, or criminal. Why the hysteria?

It's like some Trump supporters have complete amnesia over the attacks thrown Obama's way while president and even now. Trump is neither the first nor the last president who have/will be blamed for things they didn't do. He is not unique.

a reply to: CriticalStinker

What a shame...Shame on you Trump for destroying our national Monuments.

a reply to: lostbook

Again, I don't want this to be partisan.

I want there to be a collective realization that we have been sold out for years.

If you want, I could give examples on either side of the isle.

While this is wrong, we've been trained to focus on players, not the ball.

Let's get money out of politics.

I do not know if the "yay"-sayers in this thread are naive (thinking that the areas will stay to be peaceful and quite as they were before) or have their own fingers in the matter - getting moneys out of it.

Because who could be so dumb to believe that releasing the protectionate-status on a parcel of land will make it become more beautiful or more for the people per se?

Why? Because "the people"? Don't be ridiculous!