Trump Supporters Let The Russians Win

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
I personally think that with the amount of massive resources that Russia put into this their influence on the election would have been enough to sway some of those valuable electoral collage votes over to Trump.

I personally think that's what they wanted everyone to believe is what happened and they succeeded beyond their imagination. Now every elections will have doubts as to whether the Russians tampered with it in some capacity even though the most likely had minimal to no effect.

I want to meet one person who said, 'I voted for X becasue of what I read on Facebook'. Just one.

I know a few people that voted leave in the Brexit referendum purley because of memes and posts they saw on facebook and that was not a 4 year election of a leader.

I understand hearsay is not a viable source but to underestimate the power of social media and the susceptibility of some people to be eaily manipulated would be niave.

originally posted by: nonspecific

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
I personally think that with the amount of massive resources that Russia put into this their influence on the election would have been enough to sway some of those valuable electoral collage votes over to Trump.

I personally think that's what they wanted everyone to believe is what happened and they succeeded beyond their imagination. Now every elections will have doubts as to whether the Russians tampered with it in some capacity even though the most likely had minimal to no effect.

I want to meet one person who said, 'I voted for X becasue of what I read on Facebook'. Just one.

I know a few people that voted leave in the Brexit referendum purley because of memes and posts they saw on facebook and that was not a 4 year election of a leader.

I understand hearsay is not a viable source but to underestimate the power of social media and the susceptibility of some people to be eaily manipulated would be niave.

I know a lot of people who voted for Brexit for similar reasons or because they bought into some fake news.

If I recall there was something the Sun published about how Brexit would save the NHS that turned out to be utter crap and they had to publish a retraction.... after the vote..... on page 12..... at the bottom.

I know a lot of at least two people who voted Brexit based on that.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Majority does not mean 100%.
Most people watch their TV for news. Even though that number is declining.
Considering the MSM overwhelmingly supported Hillary..why wasn't the majority swayed towards Hillary then?

a reply to: Arnie123 The fact that you went with a five word post shows alot about your reasoning. Ok we get that you are a hardcore Trump fan. If you can reason with the left then show it. If not get ready for Football and stay away from ATS for today.

a reply to: nonspecific

You know, this junk news and ideas come at us so soon, we scarcely have time to examine it before the next media barrage. It's like that old saying ..."you can't un-see or un-hear" ....which while total fabrication, sews the seeds of doubt. Doubt is as powerful as conviction sometimes

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin

originally posted by: nonspecific

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
I personally think that with the amount of massive resources that Russia put into this their influence on the election would have been enough to sway some of those valuable electoral collage votes over to Trump.

I personally think that's what they wanted everyone to believe is what happened and they succeeded beyond their imagination. Now every elections will have doubts as to whether the Russians tampered with it in some capacity even though the most likely had minimal to no effect.

I want to meet one person who said, 'I voted for X becasue of what I read on Facebook'. Just one.

I know a few people that voted leave in the Brexit referendum purley because of memes and posts they saw on facebook and that was not a 4 year election of a leader.

I understand hearsay is not a viable source but to underestimate the power of social media and the susceptibility of some people to be eaily manipulated would be niave.

I know a lot of people who voted for Brexit for similar reasons or because they bought into some fake news.

If I recall there was something the Sun published about how Brexit would save the NHS that turned out to be utter crap and they had to publish a retraction.... after the vote..... on page 12..... at the bottom.

I know a lot of at least two people who voted Brexit based on that.

You were always going to get accused of trolling on this and I can kind of see why but i think that some of us brits have a little more insight on this from our own experiences.

Facebook on ATS seems to be regarded as the devil and a lot of members do not use it wheras in the UK it seems more of us do or at least have.

The use of facebook in our last election by UKIP and others and the whole brexit referendum gave us the chance to see just how effective and dangerous it can be when used to manipulate the social media generations.

Something that astounded me was that the older say 40 plus facebook users were terrible for liking and sharing propaghanda and lies, the kind of people that were never really involved in politics outside the racist biggoted playground of the local boozer were all of a sudden flooding the internet with all kinds of nonsense.

Another thing to consider is that in the US they vote for a president and a lot of people take pride in their chosen leader regardless. We in the UK vote for a political representative and party and it is on the whole our nature to critise our leaders even if we voted for them just a few months or years ago.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Trumps supporters have fell for this massive Russian propaganda campaign in the most spectacular way possible and as a result the desired outcome for the Kremlin has been achieved. All because Trumps supporters permitted themselves, through their hate of liberal ideals and the Democrats to be willingly influenced by the Russians and essentially let the Russians sway the election.

You make me LOL! You fell for the massive Democrat propaganda hook, line, and sinker.

Do you realize how silly your statement sounds? If Trump supporters already hate liberal ideals and Democrats (which they mostly do), why would they need Russia to influence them? Obama and lying Republicans did enough damage to American pocketbooks to warrant voting for non-politicians, but those too delusional to accept that will keep blaming outsiders.

For those who are truly concerned about foreign influence on elections, you need to do all of your homework on how we've used technology, social media, our intelligence agencies, and our own media to affect other foreign elections. We spent well over $100 million dollars of taxpayer money to influence the Arab Springs, Putin's last election, Netanyahu's last election, and training foreigners on how to use social media and protesting in general to change governments! Go do your homework and start contacting Congress and federal agencies about the national security threat that they themselves put us under by their very actions that they accuse others of doing.

Until the U.S. stops meddling in foreign elections (which I don't see happening), deal with it! It's their own fault!

a reply to: Christosterone I love how you always throw that term around. Even though when you use it you are one. Has reason ever aproached you? I imagine that you are the type that has a cache of useless ammo and guns. The reason I say useless is because you need so many cause you prob don't know how to maintain them. Best of luck to ya

originally posted by: Milkweed
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Majority does not mean 100%.
Most people watch their TV for news. Even though that number is declining.
Considering the MSM overwhelmingly supported Hillary..why wasn't the majority swayed towards Hillary then?

Exactly, this claim that Russian bots on Twitter and Facebook had any significant impact on the result of the election is not logical. Actually I'd be willing to bet the over-saturation of pro-Hillary reports from the MSM had the opposite intended effect and only further highlighted how much the establishment was backing a specific candidate, which caused them to choose the candidate they thought the establishment wouldn't want. We no longer live in times where simple minded propaganda is enough to brainwash everyone, people are wising up and paying more attention to how they are being psychologically manipulated.

are the Russians (sheep) allowed to own guns? LOL

"Another thing to consider is that in the US they vote for a president and a lot of people take pride in their chosen leader regardless. We in the UK vote for a political representative and party and it is on the whole our nature to critise our leaders even if we voted for them just a few months or years ago."


Very true. The key is to still respect each other's Nation. I find the Monarchy outdated, but that does not mean I don't Highly respect Queen Elizabeth. ....Caustic oratories of the others country does little to sew harmony.

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
With the recent arrests in the Mueller investigation I think that there is something that has to be said, its quite a obvious point but not one I have seen discussed. First lets just take away the whole idea of Russian collusion. While yes I do believe there there is more to be revealed from the ongoing investigations for now lets pretend that there was no collusion, none, nobody from the Trump campaign had any contact with any Russians or persons linked to Russia.

If we take this approach, there is still one massive problem, its now abundantly clear and has been for quite some time that the Russians influenced the campaign. They fought was I think could be regarded as the most successful misinformation war in history. They used various tactics such as hacking, advertising and social media manipulation to undermine the Democratic Party and actively promote Trump as the ideal presidential candidate.

I don’t see any point in going over everything that we already know, I think it is fair to say that the Russians influenced this election. Yet I already know who will deny this, the Trump supporters and then the question has to be why they deny this in the face of such overwhelming evidence.

I think the answer is quite simple, they were duped.

Trumps supporters have fell for this massive Russian propaganda campaign in the most spectacular way possible and as a result the desired outcome for the Kremlin has been achieved. All because Trumps supporters permitted themselves, through their hate of liberal ideals and the Democrats to be willingly influenced by the Russians and essentially let the Russians sway the election.

Trumps supporters have enabled the Russians to do what was previously unthinkable, they have aloud them to win, they have won, they got their guy into the Whitehouse, their candidate won. Trump was as much a candidate of the Republican Party as she was the Kremlin, collusion or no collusion for the Russians having Trump in the Whitehouse was always going to be the best outcome.

Not only that they have now demonstrated that with enough resources and know how they can influence even the most powerful democracy and bend it to their will. All because Trump supporters could not see through the Russian propaganda machine.

You guys let the Russians win regardless if there was collusion or not.

I see why Hillary supporters rail against anti-Hillary threads.... cuz it got old about a year ago. Same with these anti-Trump/Trump supporter threads.

FFS already!!!

I gave you a star simply because I can smell your overpowering desperation.

a reply to: Deetermined

People will try to justify almost anything.

I imagine that there are many who think like I do, and my only real litmus test for voting was; are you going to raise or lower my taxes?

Trump said he'd lower them.
Hillary said she'd raise them.


Really no discussion after that.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder


LOL

yep, they're waking up to the massive Russian propaganda machine and the pussy fox news. thank god!


and, all the screeching about our very important free press is right out of putins playbook, which thankfully, I think people are also waking up to. LOL

a reply to: knoxie Oh wow I hope you got your ammo loaded cause you are about to get some backlash. I am here to help but damn dude.

originally posted by: nonspecific
I know a few people that voted leave in the Brexit referendum purley because of memes and posts they saw on facebook and that was not a 4 year election of a leader.

Hopefully the Ruskies didn't post them otherwise you guys are in trouble too.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Lets just assume for a moment Russia did all the things you claim and if they hadn't Hillary would have won... would that really be such a great thing, is that truly a world you would rather live in? Is it really so bad the western deep state puppet masters lost to Russia, these are the same guys who funded and armed terrorists in Syria, Russia was one of the only actors willing to step in and fight against the terrorists instead of helping them overthrow a government. Russia was one of the only nations on Earth willing to offer Snowden refuge. Maybe for just once in your life you could see past you bias and realize that your "west good, east bad" outlook of the world is highly naive and short sighted. There are no good guys, only players playing the game.

a reply to: nonspecific

If you base your vote off of memes...you shouldn't be allowed to vote.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: nonspecific
I know a few people that voted leave in the Brexit referendum purley because of memes and posts they saw on facebook and that was not a 4 year election of a leader.

Hopefully the Ruskies didn't post them otherwise you guys are in trouble too.

I imagine they very well might have done so it they wanted it that way.

it is entirely plausable that if they did it was a testing ground for the involvement in the US election as much as anything else.

It seems that some here are against the idea purely because it involves America but if it were a different nation they would be all for agreeing the evil Ruskies were interfering.

That might explain why the OP and myself are able to discuss this without gtting ants in our pants.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

There is a dynamic at work here that you seem to just not understand. I've been reading your threads, and your lack of comprehension of this one dynamic is quite obvious.

There is and has been for some time a belief among politicians that the message is less important than the methodology. That is, a proposal to shoot all blond people would be just fine and gain popularity quickly if only someone would phrase it in the right way. It is rooted in the absolute belief that political office equates to unlimited power and the people are so dumb as to be manipulated by words alone.

In some ways it may hold true, but in others it does not. People are looking for a good life, period, and no amount of cajoling will change that. All the politicians can do is to try and couch their agendas in a way that appears to lead to that good life. Where the concept breaks down is when people begin to realize that those promises of a better life are at odds with their personal realities.

An example: some time back there was a lot of talk about how inflation was under control, despite prices rising quite rapidly in my personal experience. Gasoline was topping $3 a gallon and food seemed more expensive every week. Then I realized how inflation could be "under control": gasoline was not included in the cost of living index, despite being a necessity for most outside super-urban areas, and the cost of food was tied to name brands. Sure, there was no price increase for some time on a can of Green Giant beans, but that was because the price had already been inflated before. The price increases were happening on the generic store brand beans, which was what most people were now buying because Green Giant had become so much more expensive.

In other words, the narrative being pushed was true in the strictest sense, but it was not real for most people. It was a manufactured partial truth to cover the actual truth.

In 2016, these false narratives had been pushed so much, so far, that few believed them any more. People had become numb to the good news that seemed to imply they were somehow living in the only place where things were not that rosy. Then there was the continual demonization of the population. If anyone dared oppose Obama on policy, they were immediately branded a racist. If anyone dared oppose Hillary Clinton it was obviously because they were sexist. If anyone dared question any policy coming from DC, it was because they were xenophobic, or homophobic, or mean-spirited.

And Hillary herself topped the cake with a load of "deplorable" brand icing.

I would not have voted for Hillary Clinton if she was holding a gun to my head. I would have helped her pull the trigger first. Her message was clear to me: she hated me, my family, my culture, and everything I held dear... and she was enamored with the idea of destroying all of them. Her words did not matter because her words had only brought me pain and misery.

Trump... well, let's be honest here. The man is a New York real estate tycoon... a Yankee suit. I never really trusted him, and in some ways I still struggle with that. After all, most of the Yankees I have met still think we in the South are nothing more than 'baccy-chewin', backwoods, uneducated, 'shine-drinkin' ne'er-do-wells. They see us as the Iraqi see the Kurds, a bunch of unwanted semi-humans that nature should have wiped out a long time ago. So, yes, there is a struggle there.

But between the two? Trump was the only choice. So he got a chance.

Then the same old same old started... the narrative became that Trump only won because the Russians! Never mind that many people were tired of the same old same old, never mind that Hillary is the crookedest human I have ever known, it was just because the Russians! Somehow I was supposed to believe that Russians got inside my head and convinced me that Hillary was evil, even though I had watched the MSM telling me that Hillary was a saint and Trump was the devil.

It's been 10 months. ISIS is losing ground wholesale fashion. Illegal immigration is down drastically. Prototypes for the wall are built and are being tested. The economy is improving, measured by increased job availability and lower fuel prices. People who have hidden behind a curtain of protection for years are being prosecuted. China is showing a willingness to cooperate with us. We're out of the TPP and the Paris Accord. We're talking about scrapping or renegotiating NAFTA. The Supreme Court has shifted slightly right. There's a bill in the Congress to cut my taxes and make it easier to file. There was a half-hearted attempt to take out Obamacare... half-hearted, but better than telling me how wonderful suffering and misery is and how I should be grateful for it. No one on the right has decided to accuse me of impure thoughts with cries of "racist!" Te left is still trying it, but they're losing power.

OK, I'm good with Trump. I like my decision, Yankee businessman or no. And I really wish the left would quit giving the Russians all the credit. I made up my own mind, and I get to claim the victory. Quit trying to take that away from me!

Now I get to watch some of the craziest conspiracy theories I have ever seen in my life as a conspiracist, being pushed in the MSM because they need something... anything... to accuse Trump of. All I see are desperate attempts that fail because the accusers are dirtier than the accused. After all, we heard cries for impeachment from within Congress before Trump ever set foot in the White House!

So keep talking... some people have a short memory, and they need a constant reminder of why they rejected the liberal policies of personal gain for politicians, misery for the public, lies to conceal it all, and false accusations if the lies don't work. They need reminding of why they voted for Trump. Thank you for reminding us.

TheRedneck