Has the seven year tribulation begun?

a reply to: GoShredAK

Yes it is the last day for all of us. If you believe time is irrelevant a day is unto a thousand thousand years we are all dieing less than seconds apart. We really don't understand the magnitude.

a reply to: enlightenedservant

"Ironically, I've come to the opposite conclusion. Humankind's numbers have grown immensely in the last 200 years or so"

We are working from rather more a substantial technological level and base than our predecessors though.

Without the renascence period, there could have been no industrial revolution aka no information age in which we live.

Keep in mind good and evil are very human constructs, whats good for humanity is neither here nor there, it's simply nature. It's not cruel simply efficient.

Wars do indeed create massive setbacks but they also advance our technological base in ways that may not transpire while we are at peace. Which is not to say that if Humanity had remained neutral to one another for the last 7000(recorded history) odd years we would not be further along technology wise but that's simply wishful thinking really when one considers the apex predatory species that is Humanity.

a reply to: Seede

Nephilim are apparently the offspring of fallen angels(watchers) and Human females. If they exist and or did exist and as to whether or not they possess a soul, well i cant see why not if they are sentient in the same manner us apparently clever Monkeys are.

Keep trying to second guess the deity and see where that gets you...

I'm not sure about the tribulation actually being 7 years long. It's my understanding that Jesus said those days would be cut short because many will lose their lives during this event. How can someone tie a number to the term "cut short"? That's from Matt 24:22.

I think the minor prophet Joel said people should not look forward to the day of YHWH. It is supposed to be a time when people are baptized with fire. At the deluge people were baptized with water. In this case the word baptize is not a good term but one denoting what kind of execution.

Matthew 24:21 Jesus describes the tribulation worse than anything ever seen on earth before. An event that kills many people. The only event in the bible that exterminated millions in the bible was the deluge. My guess is that the earth is going to heat up just like in the movie 2012 and cause some serious crustal damage. This will be the baptizing with fire event. Whatever causes this internal neutrino event (from 2012) will affect the other planets in the solar system as well. If I take what 2nd Peter had to say in a literal sense then the heavens will be on fire and molten too. I would imagine the asteroid belt and the many moons in the solar system will turn molten due to the same neutrino event. From 2 Peter 3:12. It is my understanding that these astro bodies will join together and make larger planetoids. This is the new heavens.

I think the end result of the massive earth movement is supposed to be a renewal of sorts. If anything survives it's supposed to be good for the new tenants.

Is this doom porn or what?

a reply to: GoShredAK

You conveniently ignore the 50's. Cold war, medical experimentation on negroes, aborigines, homosexuals. Priests molesting children. The US tarck record in installing regimes that killed millions in South America. Need I go on? The corruption has been around for a long time.

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: enlightenedservant

Wars do indeed create massive setbacks but they also advance our technological base in ways that may not transpire while we are at peace. Which is not to say that if Humanity had remained neutral to one another for the last 7000(recorded history) odd years we would not be further along technology wise but that's simply wishful thinking really when one considers the apex predatory species that is Humanity.

But it's not wars that advance our technological base. It's the intentional allocation of resources to the creation of new technology that advances our technological base. War makers and war profiteers have simply figured out easy ways to convince royals and elected officials to allocate considerable resources to their new technology: fear, greed, and maintaining power.

As long as people with power have a financial or political incentive to allocate taxpayer funds to war technology, they'll do that. And as long as the public has irrational fears about some bogeyman, then the public will happily allow their resources to go towards war based technology. The advancement of civilization is just a byproduct of this increased allocation of funds to specific forms of technology.

To relate that to this thread, I'll offer a dream I have. I think the next major form of humans will not have the self destructive tendencies that Homo Sapiens have. I'm imagining and almost wishing for a Hominid species that instinctively thinks as a collective. The simply idea of "collective preservation & advancement" would eliminate our "sins" of greed & envy, and possibly also the "sins" of gluttony and sloth since those hominids wouldn't want to waste the resources that could be helping the collective (as in, the resources of excess food that could've fed another community member and the resource of potential labor that a slothful person wastes).

So with that in mind, a civilization of those hominids (I'll call them Homo Hippy-itus) would never have to worry about the boom & bust cycle that every civilization typically has. It would be a constant stream of upgrades, and with no greed or selfishness, ideas like patents wouldn't exist. That means that every advance from one community would automatically be shared with every other community. And they'd never have to worry about the destruction of priceless archives, libraries, and teachings from ancient civilizations due to warfare & homo sapiens' tendency for genociding portions of itself. Put in modern terms, just look at how much we've advanced in less than 100 years of computers and space travel. Now imagine a network of civilizations that only allocate their resources to the advancement of technology and the preservation (and improvement) of life. They would theoretically blow past us in terms of advancements because they'd never divert resources to learn or upgrade the methods to kill ourselves.

I can even imagine their main political parties being a "life extension party" and a "quality of life party". Their main arguments being whether to focus on extending the human life span through gene editing and cyborg technology or to improve the quality of life for all humans by automating daily functions and improving our infrastructures. Both of those examples would involve "the intentional allocation of resources to the creation of new technology", yet neither involves warfare. See how that works?


In short, if we're going to say this in religious terms, I think it's the Devil/Shaytan who convinces people that we can only advance as a collective by killing each other. He and his minions have convinced large portions of most/all societies that we need to sacrifice others in order to advance. I see that mindset as a modern form of human sacrifice that's far too easily justified by others, usually in the form of military & security spending.

a reply to: ketsuko

The quote from Timothy could apply equally to the times when the Popes fought each other during the Middle Ages

originally posted by: GoShredAK
I have run into a few people who are utterly convinced that we are living in the end times described in the book of revelation.

I am not so certain this is true myself but when I consider all of the signs that have occurred It really seems like a possibility.

I know people have been saying the end is near in every generation but this time feels different.

I am just curious what the members of ATS think?

Do you believe the seven year tribulation has begun?

Or do you think this is all nonsense?

If you do believe we are living out the end times, what exactly is going to happen? How do you think it'll play out?

My opinion is it will be a sort of repeat of the times of Noah and the flood.

The nephilim and there offspring the rephaim are among us, hiding somewhere, soon to be unleashed and wreak havoc upon mankind.

Natural disasters will occur more frequently and become much more devastating.

While all this is happening the world will gradually fall into anarchy.

What does everybody else think?

I have to admit that once in a while I even wonder this! So many things make you think it. But in the end I always go with what I think Jesus is saying in the bible. That HOUR represents the seven year period.


King James Version
Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

ASV
Because thou didst keep the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of trial, that hour which is to come upon the whole world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

a reply to: GoShredAK

Tribulation has not yet started.... it will start AFTER the fallen one takes over a human body and starts his physical rule INSIDE A HUMAN BODY by using heavenly signs and wonders making people think he is God...... as he sits on the throne in the third built Jewish Temple in Jerusalem.....which construction is ready.....

The Jewish temple never was where the Dome of the Rock is at.... its hundreds of meters from the dome. Now we wait for the next move.

a reply to: ntech



you get it....

from your post...verse 14; that event would be verse 14. Based on a reading of the entire Matthew 24 prophecy.

14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

the Virgo constellation & the once in history configuration with 12 'stars', sun/moon/ et al... is being satisified in Rev. 12

but the 2nd 'sign' of the Virgo unique configuration (satisifying the All Nations as witness to Gospel requirement) still needs to be fulfilled...
namely the Woman is hidden in the wilderness ...while at the same time the Dragon sweeps 1/3 of the Stars onto the Earth


so, imho... from the September 2017 Sign-in-the-heavens (Virgo/also Rev 12) until the time when 1/3 of the 'Stars' are cast to Earth which could very well be a window of years up to 40 years....
As an possible example we could look at the time interval between the Burial of Christ & destruction-of-Temple in 70AD the Death/Burial to symbolize the Gospel/Sign in Heaven and the Temple Destruction to symbolize the End-of-Age/Day-of-the-Lord

I think 40 years is way too long for the Dragon to Sweep 1/3 of the stars from heaven (which interprets into fallen Angels inhabiting Earth, taking over men's minds As in the days of Noah...

I think that Satan/Lucifer can reestablish the Pre-Flood World in as little as 4 years, not 40...partly because the scriptures use the term... for a season often in the prophecy about the end-times/Great Tribulation era


just a little brain storming about the recent events and were the prophetic time-line is at present

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: GoShredAK
I am not sure where people are getting "seven year tribulation" from.
As far as I know, the "seven years" theme is based on the "weeks of years" passage in Daniel ch11, but the same passage has the trouble occupying only the second half of that final week, following the establishment of the "abomination" and the end of the tradtional offerings. So the usual calculation is three and a half years.

In my opinion, the "seven" is a symbolic number, not a literal number, so there is no point in trying to calculate when this period begins and ends.
But I am ready to equate the "abomination" with the events of Revelation ch13. In other words, when there is a leader with world-wide power demanding to be worshipped and imprisoning or executing those who refuse, then we can say that the tribulation has begun.
Until we actually see that happening, don't worry about it. Let events happen in their own time.

Daniel 9:27 is where they get the 7 year tribulation.

a reply to: filthyphilanthropist
That's the verse I meant- I was carelessly citing the wrong chapter.
But my observations still apply. That verse gives one week of "covenant", but only half a week of "tribulation", identifying that with the effects of "causing sacrifice to cease".
That is why the traditional calculation, based on a more careful reading, has been three and a half years of tribulation.

In other words, he rules for a period of time, but the first half of that period is quiet and trouble-free. Just as, in Revelation, the Beast rules for "one hour", but first half of his rule is the "half an hour of silence in heaven" (Revelation ch8v1). Then he sets up the "abomination", heaven starts getting noisy with angry thunders, and the tribulation occupies the second half of his rule.

a reply to: enlightenedservant

It may be an intentional allocation of resources that advance the creation of new technology but the allocation is generally down to furthering an agenda of producing weapons of war.

Unfortunately, enlightenedservant war has its place within our race as i'm afraid it always has done. Good and evil are simply human construct we utilise to justify or condemn our actions. Religion is another creation of humanity directly linked to power and control, simply another construct designed to keep the status quo in place.

a reply to: andy06shake

a reply to: Seede Nephilim are apparently the offspring of fallen angels(watchers) and Human females. If they exist and or did exist and as to whether or not they possess a soul, well i cant see why not if they are sentient in the same manner us apparently clever Monkeys are.

But you seem to be uncertain of the question asked. I realize that the Giants were the offspring of the celestial and terrestrial unions of procreation and I realize that the Nephilim were the offspring of the Giants and that the Elioud were the offspring of the Nephilim but that was not my question.

My question is that if all this be true then what connection does it have with the tribulation? Are the Angels, Giants, Nephilim, and the Eliouds all spirits and have no physicality? If so then what effect do they have with the tribulation of the terrestrial world? If they have survived then how did they survive when the Genesis account tells us that all life left upon the earth was exterminated? Even if they did survive what is the role they play in the demise of the tribulation of Jacob?

An antichrist is always a terrestrial entity while a Satan is always a spiritual entity. It has to be crucial in determining what is meant by the OP's statement of mentioning Nephilim in connection with the first resurrection of Revelation. Not trying to be a clever monkey but simply asking a question which the OP has quantified.

a reply to: DISRAELI

In other words, he rules for a period of time, but the first half of that period is quiet and trouble-free. Just as, in Revelation, the Beast rules for "one hour", but first half of his rule is the "half an hour of silence in heaven" (Revelation ch8v1). Then he sets up the "abomination", heaven starts getting noisy with angry thunders, and the tribulation occupies the second half of his rule.

Would you explain how the sacrifice and oblation can cease [in Daniel 9:27] when the sacrifice does not exist today? Would the sacrifice have to be reinstated with the third temple before the tribulation starts?

a reply to: Seede
At the time when Daniel was written, the sacrifice was the central act connecting God with his worshippers.
Perhaps, for a future fulfilment, we should understand the nearest Christian equivalent, namely the Lord's Supper, the Eucharist (this does not mean that I accept the idea that the Eucharist is an act of sacrifice).
Paul said that the Lord's Supper would be a proclamation "until he comes". It seems plausible to me that a false Christ would make a point of saying "I'm here, now, so you don't have to do it any more", and forbidding the assembly of those Christian groups which refused to comply.
Alternatively, the forbidding of Christian assembly in general, apart from those meetings which accepted his claim, would have the same effect.

DISRAELI it seems we are very close. Two things I know have not happened yet that should occur during or pre- seven year period. First, the destruction of Damascus (Isaiah 17) still must happen before it all unravels. Remember, we came close with Obama's "red line" and president Trumps bombing of the Syrian/Russian base.
Secondly, the economy must be collapsed to bring about a cashless one world economic system, with the eventual 'Mark of the Beast" controlling everyone and everything economically.

This is a short list of what has already happened:

Daniel 12:7 ...when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.
The post modern church is a sham, with a form of Godliness with no power. It's praise (which God supposedly inhabits) is nothing more than sounding brass and tinkling cymbals. There will be NO REVIVAL without REPENTANCE.

Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations, and then shall the end come.
The Internet/5 G/WiFi and satellite communications have accomplished this.

Mark 13:10 And the gospel must first be published among all nations.
The American Bible Society can probably tell one just how complete this prophecy is to completion.

I Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition.
Of course the "falling away" is 501c3, which is apostate. The LBJ agreement with church leaders to abandon their responsibility and authority to be at the forefront in selecting political leadership in order to "get a free one" (tax exempt status) from the Mystery Babylon whore won't cut it.

The man of sin revealed himself in the temple (US Congressional building) where he gave the house of the strong man (US Military) over to the Sodomites by resending DADT. If the military is divided, then the house cannot stand. Also the kingdom will come to desolation. Therefore we have the Obamanation of Desolation.

a reply to: Seede

It's all just more than lightly stories mate, there is not one credible shred of evidence to support the existence of angels any more than there is to support Jesus existed.

The simple fact is that organised religious practice is designed to facilitate the control constructs it is laced with, to keep the status quo in place.

The only thing that will save humanity will be humanity.

a reply to: andy06shake

You haven't dug very deep. . If theism was a control mechanism we wouldn't need the perversion (religion).

So tell me, why was the first version the rebel version, and only the revisions are "submit to authority" narratives?

PS, angels are harmonics from radio signals.