Bill de Blasio goes full Communist, argues against private property

originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: Moresby
Nothing communist about that.

He's talking about zoning laws. Which exist in almost every city.

Except places like Houston. And they're currently seeing the downside of that.

The context of the quote has nothing to do with zoning. He was asked about inequality. In other words, they can't arbitrarily force affordable housing and other leftist crap because of private property laws is his complaint.

Actually, zoning in NYC is the very essence of inequality.
Prior to contextual zoning, land-use was determined by industry. Imagine zoning as a drop of water in a pool: the concentric rings that emanate outward is similar to how our zoning has been setup. The outer rings were used as industrial and manufacturing use, because of the convenience of being near major waterways. As you go further inward, ring by ring, land-use was structured for higher density to accommodate the working classes that were employed at these facilities. This is where you find the projects and large residential developments. Moving toward the center, these areas became the locations for stricter land-use laws, only allowing for lower density one family homes. This is where you'll find beautiful homes overlooking the harbor, or residences sitting on 100'x100'+ lots. These are what is known as the more desirable areas.
When you look at the zoning map from the 60's and compare it to today's maps, you'll see that the areas that were originally setup for manufacturing and industrial have been rezoned for higher density mixed use residential. Since most of these properties skirt the shores, developers capitalized on the desirability of these newly rezoned properties. Yet, what hasn't changed are the rings going inward. Specifically for those properties that fell within the previous higher density uses. Most of those properties consist of public housing. This is where gentrification comes in. As people seek to live in or near these newly redeveloped areas, this cascade effect essentially pushes out the previous generations that once called those areas home.
There are rules set in place that allow developers to gain bonuses for accommodating low income families. To some degree, this has pushed to stabilize the disparity between the have's and have not's. The drawback to that is that while you're paying $5k+ a month for rent, you could potentially end up with a neighbor that might not have the most favorable background that'll be paying $1.2k a month, with four kids and roaches.
It's a catch-22 out here. There should be some kind of governmental regulation on rents and housing.
Source: I'm an architect

Maybe New York residents should impeach that guy or put him in an institution. Maybe he is a Russian plant to disrupt our country. I don't think the Feds should allow him to be Mayor. There should be a regulatory committee in the US government that can remove people like him from his post.

originally posted by: seagull
a reply to: xuenchen

You are familiar with the concept of "zoning laws"?

What are zoning laws?

Finding issues where there are none.

There's a bit more involved than just zoning laws and commissions, obviously... Pressed enter too soon.

It's hardly communism, nor are the problems unique to New York...cities and towns all over the country have the same issues, what can be built where, and the rules involved in the decision process.

Actually, I am. See my comment above.

As someone who works on affordable housing in NYC, there is merit to his argument though. It's no longer about "market forces" or supply and demand. In fact, it's a hyperinflated market partly sending prices through the roof through land speculation, billionaires buying up entire blocks of Brooklyn, etc. Almost no-one can afford to live there anymore. I know, I have a decent job, live in the ghetto, and have a roommate who also has a decent professional job, and we are living paycheck to paycheck. You guys who think that no housing regulation is necessary don't live in San Francisco or NYC. a reply to: xuenchen

originally posted by: Jiggly
what a fool..

He wants the rest of us to live in the slums while Him and His scumbag friends live in their mansions.

originally posted by: scraedtosleep

originally posted by: stormcell

originally posted by: scraedtosleep
a reply to: Edumakated

affordable housing and other leftist crap

Affordable housing is crap?

In theory, no. Everyone should have the right to afford a decent housing. Nobody disagrees with that.

Then there is the right that every person should be able to seek the highest salary as possible. That only seems fair. A person should be able to shop around for a pay-rise or move around to get a higher salary.

These two rights conflict when someone is working in apartment maintenance or property investment. What is one persons income is another persons overhead. Then there are city property taxes. Higher taxes are good for the city but an overhead for the property owner. Then higher property taxes drive higher rents which then create the demand for higher pay for city workers and everyone else.

That leads to the poorest being priced out of the private sector. So the city must provide subsidized housing or otherwise introduce "rent controls" allowing people to be "grandfathered in" with fixed rents. That makes property investment uneconomical so it gets offloaded to the city either way.

Given the desirability of a short commute and the demand for skilled people, that drives up rents and pushes other out. They might not choose to stay in a particular area depending on who else lives close by. So it becomes a mutual exclusion game.

It's a broken system to be sure. The alternative would be lots more homeless people which is also a drain on the city.

No the alternative is for the idiots to move to a city with less population density and lower property values.

a reply to: the owlbear

And why was there police interaction?

Because he was selling individual cigarettes which is a crime in New York. Thanks to the incredibly high taxes and thriving black market undercutting them, they made such things illegal. This necessitated the police interaction that killed him.

He was killed by laws that never should have been on the books, but do-gooders who are out to save us from ourselves thought it would be a good idea to try to tax people into acting moral.

a reply to: xuenchen

Just when you think they can't get any stupider....

No, people do NOT want the government, on any level, deciding who lives where, etc! Sensible people want as little government as possible. This guy is an enemy of the state.

originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14


As someone who works on affordable housing in NYC, there is merit to his argument though. It's no longer about "market forces" or supply and demand. In fact, it's a hyperinflated market partly sending prices through the roof through land speculation, billionaires buying up entire blocks of Brooklyn, etc. Almost no-one can afford to live there anymore. I know, I have a decent job, live in the ghetto, and have a roommate who also has a decent professional job, and we are living paycheck to paycheck. You guys who think that no housing regulation is necessary don't live in San Francisco or NYC. a reply to: xuenchen

Move.

Wife and I love NYC. However, we refuse to live there even though we have a 1%er income. It is too expensive. It is far cheaper and easier to just visit.

The high cost is partly driven by the inane affordable housing regulations. The restrictions on the market actually drive up costs making it even more expensive.

A lot of the high end real estate in NYC though is being bought for money laundering. A lot of Chinese, Russian, and others parking their money in real estate.

originally posted by: scraedtosleep

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: scraedtosleep

It is when someone like de Blasio uses the term.

How is Obama's "affordable" health care working out for you? Unless you are poor, it ain't affordable.

It works great for me and my mom. My mom has dwarfism and is very sick in a lot of ways.
Before the aca she couldn't afford the help she needed. Now with the aca she has that help
and is happier than I have seen her in years. Thanks obama.

Yeah, well, my aunt, low income always, can barely afford her medications, that quadrupled in cost, and pays out over $700 at a time. Gee, thanks, O, you jerk!

originally posted by: scraedtosleep
I was homeless for 6 years and your assumptions are the faulty ones.
Me and my fellow homeless didn't do drugs because we had no money to buy them with.
When we did have money we bought food or a warm bed to sleep in. We didn't leave the area because whats the point?
Business do not hire homeless people so leaving to find cheaper homes doesn't work. Nothing is cheaper than 0 and 0 was what I had to spend on rent. I come across more "nutjobs" here on ats than I ever did while homeless.

My brother was homeless. He was an alcoholic, and also a drug user. He had tons of help offered to him, by family members and friends, and he stole from people, trashed their homes, and didn't want to work and improve his situation. He put himself on the street, and he kept himself there. Plenty of others just like him, too. He preferred to have someone else take care of him, and didn't think he should have to work to buy things he needed. With no job, he still managed to be drunk and/or high on something. He wasn't atypical. "Was", because he walked out in front of a car, and died.

This mayor doesn't care about homeless.

a reply to: xuenchenthe true problem is the fools who forced housing to shoot thru the roof in ncy a one bedroom apartment should not be 3000.00 $ a month but since hud wil pay it us who are not able to get hud help have to pay more because hud will get place if we don't also nyc is full of corruption and lack of oversight on their agencies. too long has nyc been allowed to act like a country to itself.

I don't see anything wrong with free market. But how do you define it? If workers are needed who're low income and there's no affordable housing then you may have a problem. Everybody has needs and wants. The wealthiest have to weigh what they want and need with the needs and wants of the poor. Zoning for affordable housing may be exactly what's needed. That's in essence a free market, but expressed a different way.

A free market isn't just about money. It's about people. This is why we abolished slavery. This is why children aren't forced into labour anymore. This is why you help someone less fortunate than you.

It's a negotiation between the haves and have nots. What we need and want changes over time in response to our complex world. We all desire freedom. Sometimes people differ on what we'll sacrifice for it. It's always an active dispute how far the pendulum swings.

I do believe someday to have freedom we'll have to leave Earth. Why? Because things will shrink. The more it concentrates, rules will be added. Same thing happens if you squish people into smaller spaces. It'll be so squished you can't breath without breathing down someone's back. We mostly notice what we do in privacy is different than what we do in public. But it's not always obvious when the gap between them narrows.

The closer things are, the more everything merges. I think ti's to our species' advantage to have different factions. We shouldn't put all our eggs in one basket. But this is for nature to decide.

originally posted by: xuenchen

Don't people know what's happened to countries that go full blown "C-ism" ?

No they don't, because no country has ever gone full blown Communist.

originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14


As someone who works on affordable housing in NYC, there is merit to his argument though. It's no longer about "market forces" or supply and demand. In fact, it's a hyperinflated market partly sending prices through the roof through land speculation, billionaires buying up entire blocks of Brooklyn, etc. Almost no-one can afford to live there anymore. I know, I have a decent job, live in the ghetto, and have a roommate who also has a decent professional job, and we are living paycheck to paycheck. You guys who think that no housing regulation is necessary don't live in San Francisco or NYC. a reply to: xuenchen

Move.

Wife and I love NYC. However, we refuse to live there even though we have a 1%er income. It is too expensive. It is far cheaper and easier to just visit.

The high cost is partly driven by the inane affordable housing regulations. The restrictions on the market actually drive up costs making it even more expensive.

A lot of the high end real estate in NYC though is being bought for money laundering. A lot of Chinese, Russian, and others parking their money in real estate.

There is some truth to the zoning and regulation issue in some areas. But at the same time, it's also hyper inflated due to international buyers, far more demand than supply, and speculation practices.

However, your answer or solution doesn't work for several fields or careers. For example, if someone works in international development, security, diplomacy, politics, fashion, music, or a few others, they basically have to live in a handful of cities unless they are in the minority that works from remote. My work focuses on politics and public policy, but also originally international issues and international development. For the US, most of those jobs are in DC and NYC. You know this, I am sure.

originally posted by: rickymouse
Maybe New York residents should impeach that guy or put him in an institution. Maybe he is a Russian plant to disrupt our country. I don't think the Feds should allow him to be Mayor. There should be a regulatory committee in the US government that can remove people like him from his post.

Do you recall the hanauer pitchfork manifesto?

The guy is a self described plutocrat, a founder of amazon dot com.

A few years ago, he sent a published warning, to the world at large, meant to disseminate,
or plant, the standard bolshevik meme, ie, crap as usual, whenever the cultural marxists are having difficulties ramrodding their twisted social agenda:

Free Stuff

It was circulated on the internet, and widely. It may have been on television, I cannot recall.
It is meant to consolidate power. Future power, because it will be needed.
It is what gave us the Christian holocaust in Russia.

Eventually, this power demanded that anyone still looking to God was the same as spitting in
the face of the masters, who had popular support because Free Stuff. It is hard to stop this ball once it gets rolling. Think of all the persons who have never mastered a video game, never used a cell phone, cannot afford cars and houses etc.... They will declare that they want not material gain. They are simply looking out for the people, which lifts them to power, and shields them from moral scrutiny. Their secrets will be known, but only to those in control, unless they go against the grain of the master's plan.

This is how the 'thing' gets started. Free Stuff. Deblasio is planting seeds, which need time to manifest into action, just as deviate social behavior (not that there's anything wrong with that) takes time until it is celebrated as being higher in value than are standardized, normal activities. This will explain why lisping males are being hired in droves for voice work. You might think your speakers are broken, maybe your ears are failing.

No. It means your ears are working perfectly and your eye is single, whole. Eventually, we become acclimated to the idea that this is widespread, normal, and accepted. Totally groovy, just do it, maybe switch genders if you become scrambled sufficiently by the media and chemicals. After a while, nobody will wonder if God made all these mistakes. You see, there
is no God.

Deblasio has a problem, and he wants it to go away.

# 868

originally posted by: jonnywhite
I don't see anything wrong with free market. But how do you define it? If workers are needed who're low income and there's no affordable housing then you may have a problem. Everybody has needs and wants. The wealthiest have to weigh what they want and need with the needs and wants of the poor. Zoning for affordable housing may be exactly what's needed. That's in essence a free market, but expressed a different way.

A free market isn't just about money. It's about people. This is why we abolished slavery. This is why children aren't forced into labour anymore. This is why you help someone less fortunate than you.

It's a negotiation between the haves and have nots. What we need and want changes over time in response to our complex world. We all desire freedom. Sometimes people differ on what we'll sacrifice for it. It's always an active dispute how far the pendulum swings.

I do believe someday to have freedom we'll have to leave Earth. Why? Because things will shrink. The more it concentrates, rules will be added. Same thing happens if you squish people into smaller spaces. It'll be so squished you can't breath without breathing down someone's back. We mostly notice what we do in privacy is different than what we do in public. But it's not always obvious when the gap between them narrows.

The closer things are, the more everything merges. I think ti's to our species' advantage to have different factions. We shouldn't put all our eggs in one basket. But this is for nature to decide.

Right, it's naive for people just to say "oh well move then." There are almost 10 million people living in NYC proper. A good portion are multi-generational families, working a variety of low income or blue collar jobs, etc. Unless people really believe in a hunger games scenario where the "City" is only for the uber wealthy, it doesn't pan out on a public policy and even city planning level.

A healthy City has to provide for affordable housing and the ability for a range of incomes and classes to reside within the City. Socio-economic and city planning research supports this for a multitude of reasons.

Also, probably a lot of people on ATS and this thread don't know that the City government is required by the State Constitution and numerous court cases to provide homeless people with the "right to shelter." Deblasio and former and future mayors have to find a way to basically house or shelter all individuals by law. It turns out that homeless shelters cost more per person than subsidizing real, stable housing. This is born out by all extant research. Hence, they are working on long-term housing development to increase the stock of affordable housing, and currently providing a mixture of Federal Section 8 vouchers and 4-5 city-funded subsidized vouchers for eligible families and individuals.

www.nyc.gov...

originally posted by: LadyGreenEyes

originally posted by: scraedtosleep
I was homeless for 6 years and your assumptions are the faulty ones.
Me and my fellow homeless didn't do drugs because we had no money to buy them with.
When we did have money we bought food or a warm bed to sleep in. We didn't leave the area because whats the point?
Business do not hire homeless people so leaving to find cheaper homes doesn't work. Nothing is cheaper than 0 and 0 was what I had to spend on rent. I come across more "nutjobs" here on ats than I ever did while homeless.

My brother was homeless. He was an alcoholic, and also a drug user. He had tons of help offered to him, by family members and friends, and he stole from people, trashed their homes, and didn't want to work and improve his situation. He put himself on the street, and he kept himself there. Plenty of others just like him, too. He preferred to have someone else take care of him, and didn't think he should have to work to buy things he needed. With no job, he still managed to be drunk and/or high on something. He wasn't atypical. "Was", because he walked out in front of a car, and died.

This mayor doesn't care about homeless.

What are you basing that on? A bit presumptive... Deblasio has instituted the most ambitious ten year plan for new affordable housing of any Mayor in the US. Bet you didn't know that did you.

www.nyc.gov...

See my post above this one for more background, legally and other initiatives he is spearheading regarding anti-homelessness.

a reply to: xuenchen

Media like NYTimes are going full Libtard and imploding! Readership is degrading because people see through their agenda. They are going extinct by their own hand. And that is sweet justice!!!

Irma is about to pop a super bubble that's going to hurt the whole country. Many of you Bravehearts will be begging the government to come save you.