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Are solar eclipses proof of God?
page: 4share:
a reply to: ChesterJohn
The mathematics is nothing. You are skipping the point that his calculations don't match up. If Jehocah is the this omnipotent, omnipotent, omnipresent supreme being. He's a sloppy workman OR he had nothing to do with what that article is implying.
You can cite your holy texts all you like. They are also not proof. They are the repeatedly edited words of men. I similarly could cite lore from my own path. It would mean nothing.
Mathematics is a tool nothing more. So all the author has done is show he can calculate a couple of ratios. He has shown significant figures are not his strong point. He has shown he does not know why he is taking the ratio as the measure he is using, and he has ignored the elliptical orbit, in favor of the circular. All those add up to the fact, this post does not in anyway shape or form, demonstrate any deity was invovled anywhere in the positioning of planets, stars and moons
The mathematics is nothing. You are skipping the point that his calculations don't match up. If Jehocah is the this omnipotent, omnipotent, omnipresent supreme being. He's a sloppy workman OR he had nothing to do with what that article is implying.
You can cite your holy texts all you like. They are also not proof. They are the repeatedly edited words of men. I similarly could cite lore from my own path. It would mean nothing.
Mathematics is a tool nothing more. So all the author has done is show he can calculate a couple of ratios. He has shown significant figures are not his strong point. He has shown he does not know why he is taking the ratio as the measure he is using, and he has ignored the elliptical orbit, in favor of the circular. All those add up to the fact, this post does not in anyway shape or form, demonstrate any deity was invovled anywhere in the positioning of planets, stars and moons
a reply to: Noinden
i don't think he said what you have interpreted. He was just showing that continually we have these eclipses. and that those in the area of a full eclipse are seeing the moon in an exact mathematical position to block out 95% of the suns rays. That fact that this happens over and over and has happened as long as man has been on the planet and has never really changed.
Genesis 1:14-18 tell us the sun, moon and stars are "for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:". You see the sun, moon and stars are the established medium to perpetuate the time quantum of 24/7/365.2 that was started on day one in Genesis 1:3-5.
Now God, if he exists, is outside of this time quantum he established for us. Einstein's measurement for light is slower than God's eye blink. Angles move faster than light. Because they are in a different time quantum than we are, it is called "from everlasting to everlasting". The material that the earth is made of comes from that time quantum so when we try and measure it we get these vast and enormous calculations of time, it is because we are using uranium depletion rates which are far slower than light. We need to establish a measurement system that is faster than light and use it.
Scientist used to tell us that when you look at a star because of time it takes for the light to travel we are actually looking back into the past about 10k years. Then came along the red curve of light and changed all that. We have not even evolved enough to understand that the calculation is within us and is so fast that uranium and red curves can't even keep up.
Learn the time quantum of "from everlasting to everlasting" and you will see why a 1k years is as a day and a day as 1k years. 1k is as if it was yesterday in the eyes of the Lord. The Lord Jesus was the first to tell us the earth was round in his statement about the coming of his day, showing us that two in the night one would be taken and the other left, two women in the grinding which is around noon one would be taken and the other left, and that two men would be in the field which is early morning one taken and the other left. His statement verifies to us he knew the earth was round long before Columbus sailed the ocean blue in 1492.
The everlasting time quantum is why God already knows what we will ask for before we ask for it. but we are still encouraged to pray to him with thanksgiving with all our supplications and requests.
Why? Because we are in a slower established time quantum than God and wont join him there until we are called either by death or his coming to set up the promised earthly kingdom as promised to all Israel.
i don't think he said what you have interpreted. He was just showing that continually we have these eclipses. and that those in the area of a full eclipse are seeing the moon in an exact mathematical position to block out 95% of the suns rays. That fact that this happens over and over and has happened as long as man has been on the planet and has never really changed.
Genesis 1:14-18 tell us the sun, moon and stars are "for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:". You see the sun, moon and stars are the established medium to perpetuate the time quantum of 24/7/365.2 that was started on day one in Genesis 1:3-5.
Now God, if he exists, is outside of this time quantum he established for us. Einstein's measurement for light is slower than God's eye blink. Angles move faster than light. Because they are in a different time quantum than we are, it is called "from everlasting to everlasting". The material that the earth is made of comes from that time quantum so when we try and measure it we get these vast and enormous calculations of time, it is because we are using uranium depletion rates which are far slower than light. We need to establish a measurement system that is faster than light and use it.
Scientist used to tell us that when you look at a star because of time it takes for the light to travel we are actually looking back into the past about 10k years. Then came along the red curve of light and changed all that. We have not even evolved enough to understand that the calculation is within us and is so fast that uranium and red curves can't even keep up.
Learn the time quantum of "from everlasting to everlasting" and you will see why a 1k years is as a day and a day as 1k years. 1k is as if it was yesterday in the eyes of the Lord. The Lord Jesus was the first to tell us the earth was round in his statement about the coming of his day, showing us that two in the night one would be taken and the other left, two women in the grinding which is around noon one would be taken and the other left, and that two men would be in the field which is early morning one taken and the other left. His statement verifies to us he knew the earth was round long before Columbus sailed the ocean blue in 1492.
The everlasting time quantum is why God already knows what we will ask for before we ask for it. but we are still encouraged to pray to him with thanksgiving with all our supplications and requests.
Php 4:6 Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God.
Why? Because we are in a slower established time quantum than God and wont join him there until we are called either by death or his coming to set up the promised earthly kingdom as promised to all Israel.
edit on 31-8-2017 by ChesterJohn because: (no reason given)
a reply to: ChesterJohn
Three thousand years ago a man in Israel wrote: “The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands.” That man didn’t have a telescope or a Brittanica, but he saw something many of us today still do not see. He saw a God behind it all. It may be true that seeing a Grand Designer behind these breath-taking events requires what we call a leap of faith; but it may also be true that seeing mere coincidence behind them requires an even greater leap of faith. In my mind, much greater. But on Monday, you may be the judge.
That would be the closing statement of that article. The author implies that if you can not see Jehovah's hand in the heavens, you are making a greater leap of faith than seeing him lurking up there.
Again you quote a work (the bible) at me, where its not a valid source of proof for an argument about something Physical (viz the orbits of planets).
You threw in the phrase "quantum", with out actually knowing what that means. Hence you've gone new age (sewage) in the argument.
When you understand science, we can talk
Three thousand years ago a man in Israel wrote: “The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands.” That man didn’t have a telescope or a Brittanica, but he saw something many of us today still do not see. He saw a God behind it all. It may be true that seeing a Grand Designer behind these breath-taking events requires what we call a leap of faith; but it may also be true that seeing mere coincidence behind them requires an even greater leap of faith. In my mind, much greater. But on Monday, you may be the judge.
That would be the closing statement of that article. The author implies that if you can not see Jehovah's hand in the heavens, you are making a greater leap of faith than seeing him lurking up there.
Again you quote a work (the bible) at me, where its not a valid source of proof for an argument about something Physical (viz the orbits of planets).
You threw in the phrase "quantum", with out actually knowing what that means. Hence you've gone new age (sewage) in the argument.
When you understand science, we can talk
a reply to: Noinden
I would agree that seeing a continuing total eclipses on a regular basis as being coincidence would take far more faith than let's say, a once and a great while a miraculous healing.
Are you so sure he was speaking of Jehovah? I don't remembering him using a specific noun other than grand designer and God in the article. I will go back and re-read it just to be sure.
God himself, that is Jesus Christ, Almighty God, the LORD is not lurking up there. He is within and without all things and transcends all things and yet all things are under his power. Within the firmament a certain time quantum is established and in use, and that for a reason we do not fully understand with our limited threshold of understanding. Man being the creation that is in the likeness of him, who is and was and will come again, has to operate with the limited time he has to come to the knowledge of God, the Lord Jesus. Once he does then he has the mind of Christ and can if he chooses understand more clearly spiritual things that operate outside the norm of ones physical life.
In the past he was known by other names. the problem is Moses by inspiration of God penned the book of Genesis and as such inserted the term LORD (JHVH in the transliteration of the Hebrew), God was also used, as was Almighty God, Lord of Hosts, He was not known by the name Jehovah by Abraham, Issac or Jacob according to Exodus 6:3. It was not until the LORD God Almighty was bringing out the ones he chose from Abraham's son Jacob, grandson to be specific, that he told the nation Israel his name was Jehovah. We know him today as Jesus Christ, Emmanuel, The Saviour of mankind, the Word, the Lord, Master etc.
The Word of God is truth, it is pure, it is wisdom for the simple, though you may not believe it as proof of anything physical yet I showed you by those very words that Jesus in 30BC knew the earth was round and that at different points on the earth it is night, mid-day and morning and that all at once one would be taken and the other left. If you read the Bible and know it well enough the following verse cross-references to Revelation 19:17-18. It also shows men knew how weather patterns traveled.
The planets including the earth may orbit around the sun, or the sun and the others planets can be orbiting around the earth. Both geo-centric and helio-centric models cause the exact same orbitals patterns as we have observe them for thousands of years.
I know exactly how I am using the meaning of Quantum, in this case I used it as "measurement", more specifically a time measurement and I believe I have made that very clear in the discussion. And as many other English words they have more than one meaning. That is the beauty of the preserved word of God in English, those English words that God has preserved his word into are for us to study. All their meanings give us insight into the mind of the God who created language.
I have brought no new age sewage into the discussion, I do not see our discussion as an argument. As an argument is something a little more emotional than a true dialog or discussion. I have been civil and polite to you throughout our discourse. In arguments people tend not to be so polite, however now that you used the term argument in the conversation that explains why you have been using some terms that others may construe as impolite and insulting. I chose to over look them as mere axioms of your particular vernacular seeing I don't know you personally.
We can discuss Bible which has many scientific facts in it, and we can talk any time you are willing. Seeing the OP does include a grand designer, that the author of the article calls God, and his view like mine is the God of the Bible, I think it is allowable for us to talk about both science and the Bible.
I clearly made it evident I know about the red shift, the curve of red light as it travels through the firmament/space. And about uranium depletion in what is known as carbon dating. I have also delivered babies, stitched up wounds and diagnosed fungal infections though I am not a Doctor. I am also a good cook with a variety of cuisines like baklava and stuffed grape leaves from Greece, Welsh leg of lamb, Polish Byelorussian Kolduny, and an all American favorite with my own special sauce pizza. I also have rebuilt car and small engines, I rebuilt and restored 2 1982 Yamaha Maxim 400's, I Restored a 21ft Cristcraft Continental, and helped build a 40ft Cherubini Sailboat. I have built houses and am currently in the process of a bath and bedroom suite in out current residence, and in my spare time I am also restoring a 1906 Wellington upright Piano.
So there are far more topics we could talk about than just science so called and the Bible. But I warn you I tend to bring the Bible into many things I talk about. So be prepared. I come here to discuss the Bible foremost but I am open to other topics. Sometimes I am completely off and others I am completely spot on.
I hope our conversations has been enlightening to you. if not well my words were not wasted.
be blessed.
I would agree that seeing a continuing total eclipses on a regular basis as being coincidence would take far more faith than let's say, a once and a great while a miraculous healing.
Are you so sure he was speaking of Jehovah? I don't remembering him using a specific noun other than grand designer and God in the article. I will go back and re-read it just to be sure.
God himself, that is Jesus Christ, Almighty God, the LORD is not lurking up there. He is within and without all things and transcends all things and yet all things are under his power. Within the firmament a certain time quantum is established and in use, and that for a reason we do not fully understand with our limited threshold of understanding. Man being the creation that is in the likeness of him, who is and was and will come again, has to operate with the limited time he has to come to the knowledge of God, the Lord Jesus. Once he does then he has the mind of Christ and can if he chooses understand more clearly spiritual things that operate outside the norm of ones physical life.
In the past he was known by other names. the problem is Moses by inspiration of God penned the book of Genesis and as such inserted the term LORD (JHVH in the transliteration of the Hebrew), God was also used, as was Almighty God, Lord of Hosts, He was not known by the name Jehovah by Abraham, Issac or Jacob according to Exodus 6:3. It was not until the LORD God Almighty was bringing out the ones he chose from Abraham's son Jacob, grandson to be specific, that he told the nation Israel his name was Jehovah. We know him today as Jesus Christ, Emmanuel, The Saviour of mankind, the Word, the Lord, Master etc.
The Word of God is truth, it is pure, it is wisdom for the simple, though you may not believe it as proof of anything physical yet I showed you by those very words that Jesus in 30BC knew the earth was round and that at different points on the earth it is night, mid-day and morning and that all at once one would be taken and the other left. If you read the Bible and know it well enough the following verse cross-references to Revelation 19:17-18. It also shows men knew how weather patterns traveled.
The planets including the earth may orbit around the sun, or the sun and the others planets can be orbiting around the earth. Both geo-centric and helio-centric models cause the exact same orbitals patterns as we have observe them for thousands of years.
I know exactly how I am using the meaning of Quantum, in this case I used it as "measurement", more specifically a time measurement and I believe I have made that very clear in the discussion. And as many other English words they have more than one meaning. That is the beauty of the preserved word of God in English, those English words that God has preserved his word into are for us to study. All their meanings give us insight into the mind of the God who created language.
I have brought no new age sewage into the discussion, I do not see our discussion as an argument. As an argument is something a little more emotional than a true dialog or discussion. I have been civil and polite to you throughout our discourse. In arguments people tend not to be so polite, however now that you used the term argument in the conversation that explains why you have been using some terms that others may construe as impolite and insulting. I chose to over look them as mere axioms of your particular vernacular seeing I don't know you personally.
We can discuss Bible which has many scientific facts in it, and we can talk any time you are willing. Seeing the OP does include a grand designer, that the author of the article calls God, and his view like mine is the God of the Bible, I think it is allowable for us to talk about both science and the Bible.
I clearly made it evident I know about the red shift, the curve of red light as it travels through the firmament/space. And about uranium depletion in what is known as carbon dating. I have also delivered babies, stitched up wounds and diagnosed fungal infections though I am not a Doctor. I am also a good cook with a variety of cuisines like baklava and stuffed grape leaves from Greece, Welsh leg of lamb, Polish Byelorussian Kolduny, and an all American favorite with my own special sauce pizza. I also have rebuilt car and small engines, I rebuilt and restored 2 1982 Yamaha Maxim 400's, I Restored a 21ft Cristcraft Continental, and helped build a 40ft Cherubini Sailboat. I have built houses and am currently in the process of a bath and bedroom suite in out current residence, and in my spare time I am also restoring a 1906 Wellington upright Piano.
So there are far more topics we could talk about than just science so called and the Bible. But I warn you I tend to bring the Bible into many things I talk about. So be prepared. I come here to discuss the Bible foremost but I am open to other topics. Sometimes I am completely off and others I am completely spot on.
I hope our conversations has been enlightening to you. if not well my words were not wasted.
be blessed.
edit on 31-8-2017 by ChesterJohn because: (no reason given)
a reply to: ChesterJohn
Prove that the word of God is pure. How is it purer than say the Prophesy of An Morrigan? The Bible is a book that was made by committee (they chose what books went into it) and has been edited between and with in languages. IF that is pure, I'd hate to see impure
I reiterate you do not know science. The moment you used "quantum" by itself, you walked down the path of of pseudoscience. Quantum what? It is not a word one uses by its self like you did.
You tooted your own horn to try and give yourself credibility.
I am a scientist (several degrees and diplomas). I work in science (and not academia). I know science. I too cook, several different cuisines. I study Fairbairn-Sykes and Nelson Comabtives, and I'm a Pagan scholar. It returns to the only fact that matters here, is I work in Science. I'm trained in science. Thus the author of that article committed no science. he barely did mathematics.
EDIT
Oh do please list what you found insulting or Rude I'm curious. I've traveled the world old bean, so I am used to different cultures. Are you?
Prove that the word of God is pure. How is it purer than say the Prophesy of An Morrigan? The Bible is a book that was made by committee (they chose what books went into it) and has been edited between and with in languages. IF that is pure, I'd hate to see impure
I reiterate you do not know science. The moment you used "quantum" by itself, you walked down the path of of pseudoscience. Quantum what? It is not a word one uses by its self like you did.
You tooted your own horn to try and give yourself credibility.
I am a scientist (several degrees and diplomas). I work in science (and not academia). I know science. I too cook, several different cuisines. I study Fairbairn-Sykes and Nelson Comabtives, and I'm a Pagan scholar. It returns to the only fact that matters here, is I work in Science. I'm trained in science. Thus the author of that article committed no science. he barely did mathematics.
EDIT
Oh do please list what you found insulting or Rude I'm curious. I've traveled the world old bean, so I am used to different cultures. Are you?
edit on 31-8-2017 by Noinden because: (no reason given)
a reply to: Noinden
I believe the word of God to be true so when it says is pure then I take it at God's word. But not just any bible more specifically the Preserved English version for this generation as found in Ps 12:6,7. In those verses his words are said to be pure and tried as silver in a furnace purified 7 times. Many other Preserved scriptures also testify they are true. What I mean by preserved English Bible is that it has all the verses, words, phrases and sections in it that you wont find in the other 350 plus versions available in English since 1830. It also defines every word in it by its context of the word. It also has a build in I feel supernaturally, a cross-reference system that no man in the other 350 plus versions have been able to do, except to created one to promote their sects specific doctrines by cross-referencing verses out of context.
Then being a pagan scholar, you know that mythical Pan was actually taken from a description in the Bible as found in Ezekiel concerning what a Cherub(not a cherubim) looks like. This cherub that covereth was Lucifer, later known as Satan, the Devil and not the other way around as many would like us to believe. The cherub is said to have the legs of an ox including a tail, which are brazen red, a torso of a man with arms , curly black hair and a goatee much like and ox with small horns.
i have a doctorate in Theology, and diplomas in a few trade schools, numerous certificates in AED/CPR. Most of my medical understanding came from the 68th edition of the Principe and practices of medicine. That book was put to good use while being a missionary for 15 years overseas. Currently we are in the States still trying to find out why my son has no short term memory and is intellectually disabled. Four years and they still have no diagnosis. but he has come a long way from being five and not speaking at all except Mama and the letter b. Currently his DNA was taken again to run a 22,000 genome test, we do know he has a missing part of his X chromosome and it is curved. It did not fall in the protein area of his molecules hence why it took us so long to recognize something was wrong because it did not show itself physically.
Cooking is a great hobby, I used to cook for a living in Hawaii and fished long line in the late 70's in Alsaka. I usually cook the larger meals like on the holidays and special occasions. My wife, also a fantastic cook does most of our day to day cooking. While I am holding down a full time job which barely covers the bills seeing insurance for my wife and I cost $1490 a month under obamacare.
I only tooted my horn so you would know you are not speaking to a complete idiot. Though I do lack knowledge in many things the Bible is not one of them. I have DTh from a major Christian University and I have some trade school diplomas, as well as computer operative and hardware knowledge since 1980. I kind of gave up on it as since 1995 they systems and boards and advanced to fast for me to keep up. I also instruct people for free on Aguaponics.
So I am sure we can fine some things to discuss beyond this OP.
The most interesting and exciting currently is to try and tie down the time quantum/measurement of "from Everlasting to Everlasting". I believe if we can narrow down that time system better we can begin to see accuracy in the age measuring techniques we are using today. I do not believe in the new earths idea of the earth's being only 6,000 years old.
before I go, please go back and re-read my post you will see I never used the word Quantum without the term "Time" in front of it.
have a blessed (in this case the meaning of blessed is happy) night as I am heading to be now.
I believe the word of God to be true so when it says is pure then I take it at God's word. But not just any bible more specifically the Preserved English version for this generation as found in Ps 12:6,7. In those verses his words are said to be pure and tried as silver in a furnace purified 7 times. Many other Preserved scriptures also testify they are true. What I mean by preserved English Bible is that it has all the verses, words, phrases and sections in it that you wont find in the other 350 plus versions available in English since 1830. It also defines every word in it by its context of the word. It also has a build in I feel supernaturally, a cross-reference system that no man in the other 350 plus versions have been able to do, except to created one to promote their sects specific doctrines by cross-referencing verses out of context.
Then being a pagan scholar, you know that mythical Pan was actually taken from a description in the Bible as found in Ezekiel concerning what a Cherub(not a cherubim) looks like. This cherub that covereth was Lucifer, later known as Satan, the Devil and not the other way around as many would like us to believe. The cherub is said to have the legs of an ox including a tail, which are brazen red, a torso of a man with arms , curly black hair and a goatee much like and ox with small horns.
i have a doctorate in Theology, and diplomas in a few trade schools, numerous certificates in AED/CPR. Most of my medical understanding came from the 68th edition of the Principe and practices of medicine. That book was put to good use while being a missionary for 15 years overseas. Currently we are in the States still trying to find out why my son has no short term memory and is intellectually disabled. Four years and they still have no diagnosis. but he has come a long way from being five and not speaking at all except Mama and the letter b. Currently his DNA was taken again to run a 22,000 genome test, we do know he has a missing part of his X chromosome and it is curved. It did not fall in the protein area of his molecules hence why it took us so long to recognize something was wrong because it did not show itself physically.
Cooking is a great hobby, I used to cook for a living in Hawaii and fished long line in the late 70's in Alsaka. I usually cook the larger meals like on the holidays and special occasions. My wife, also a fantastic cook does most of our day to day cooking. While I am holding down a full time job which barely covers the bills seeing insurance for my wife and I cost $1490 a month under obamacare.
I only tooted my horn so you would know you are not speaking to a complete idiot. Though I do lack knowledge in many things the Bible is not one of them. I have DTh from a major Christian University and I have some trade school diplomas, as well as computer operative and hardware knowledge since 1980. I kind of gave up on it as since 1995 they systems and boards and advanced to fast for me to keep up. I also instruct people for free on Aguaponics.
So I am sure we can fine some things to discuss beyond this OP.
The most interesting and exciting currently is to try and tie down the time quantum/measurement of "from Everlasting to Everlasting". I believe if we can narrow down that time system better we can begin to see accuracy in the age measuring techniques we are using today. I do not believe in the new earths idea of the earth's being only 6,000 years old.
before I go, please go back and re-read my post you will see I never used the word Quantum without the term "Time" in front of it.
have a blessed (in this case the meaning of blessed is happy) night as I am heading to be now.
a reply to: ChesterJohn
Don't try to delve into Pagan mythology any more than you do science neighbour. You clearly don't understand that either
Pan, is the Greek god of the wild. He is Indo-European, and cognate with the Proto-Indo-European deity *Péh2usōn (note that the * at the start is a reconstructed word). The word pastural shares the same PIE root. HE can be considered to be similar but not the same as the Gaulish deity Cernvnnos (Cernunnos). None of these are related to anything from the Bible. The mythology from the bible is from a different Language/cultural group.
Now what you see happen is the Indo-European descended early Christians demonized a great many of the deities, or made them saints if the Cult was too hard to budge.
I return to the FACT that the bible is not an admissible source in the study of science, or mathematics.
You may hold a DTh, good for you. I'm going withhold my views on Christian "Universities" and their right to use the term University.
As I said, you can quote the bible all you like at me, it holds no sway here. But out of good manners, here is something back at you
Mater mara rigani nertaca
Uxella uindape in louci riuri
Briga mara beretor in uaitei tuei
Uoretes silon tuon con deruolami
Benoulati epon ueidonti marcacon
Gutus nertomaros tuos radit
In surpritiia biuotutos
Matrona uxella
Breccata con marii roudoblatouon
Mater mater mater deiua uoretontipe
Benoulati epon rigani reidonti
Delua uer arescarus marcotegeson salacon
Anuides touetont
Dalli supritiii biuotutos
Ne appisiiont caiciiin
Mariias gdoniiodiias
Don't try to delve into Pagan mythology any more than you do science neighbour. You clearly don't understand that either
Pan, is the Greek god of the wild. He is Indo-European, and cognate with the Proto-Indo-European deity *Péh2usōn (note that the * at the start is a reconstructed word). The word pastural shares the same PIE root. HE can be considered to be similar but not the same as the Gaulish deity Cernvnnos (Cernunnos). None of these are related to anything from the Bible. The mythology from the bible is from a different Language/cultural group.
Now what you see happen is the Indo-European descended early Christians demonized a great many of the deities, or made them saints if the Cult was too hard to budge.
I return to the FACT that the bible is not an admissible source in the study of science, or mathematics.
You may hold a DTh, good for you. I'm going withhold my views on Christian "Universities" and their right to use the term University.
As I said, you can quote the bible all you like at me, it holds no sway here. But out of good manners, here is something back at you
Mater mara rigani nertaca
Uxella uindape in louci riuri
Briga mara beretor in uaitei tuei
Uoretes silon tuon con deruolami
Benoulati epon ueidonti marcacon
Gutus nertomaros tuos radit
In surpritiia biuotutos
Matrona uxella
Breccata con marii roudoblatouon
Mater mater mater deiua uoretontipe
Benoulati epon rigani reidonti
Delua uer arescarus marcotegeson salacon
Anuides touetont
Dalli supritiii biuotutos
Ne appisiiont caiciiin
Mariias gdoniiodiias
a reply to: Noinden
I had someone a little while back claim "we Christians stole our description of the Devil/Satan from the Greek god Pan". So I corrected him by saying it was actually stolen from the Bible and it fits well with Ezekiel's description of a cherub. Remember under the Bible all men come from one of three lines of the sons of Noe/Noah.
I have a well rounded, though not a deep as you may, understanding of many mythologies. So ease up there a little, "neighbour".
Oh, you can lambast Christian universities all you want around me. I wasted enough time and money with them. They are actually created to create an elite class of religious Christians, some of which may not even be saved. So today many wont even consider you for a pastorate unless you have a Doctorate in Divinity. As far as I am concerned men have turned the calling of God into a means of employment. In the middle of my years at college I learned that it is their way or the highway. I even started a thread on the subject called The Conspiracy of the Religious Elite
I will take the Bible over any modern ape-man ideas on anything of science so called.
So you can quote a Gaulish poem it doesn't prove anything or make any difference to me or my understanding of who you are or are not. Speak clear English and you will always have my attention. I can always use the knowledge if it is true wisdom indeed. Paul said if you speak in an unknown tongue and no one interprets it is wasted and useless sounds. Speak to me five words of clear speech that give clear understanding and it is better than ten thousand in an unknown language.
I value your time you spend in response even if you don't agree with the article or the math. Pretty much you can google and see that his math is correct even if you feel it is sloppy. Oh, and I agree the measurements are off by a few degrees which adds to the uniqueness of each event as seen from the earths surface. Does it prove their is a God or Intelligence behind the planetary system of the earth? No, but anytime you have a repetitive event take place at differing times and places it is far from mere coincidence.
I challenge you to go and put together both the Helio/Geo-centric models (you can make them out of paper) and see that what I said about the two models, that they show the same movements of the planets as we see them today and have been going on long before you or I entered this world.
I am interested in knowing why you chose to use the Noun "Jehovah" and attributed it to his article when he had not? Are you Jewish by genealogy and thereby used it out of familiar understanding of the Tanak?
I do not believe I spoke anything to you, or the others who are reading these posts that could not be clearly understood. Like my use of quantum for measurement is not that just mere semantics? Even if you don't want to or choose not to believe the Bible as a source of anything Scientific, Mathematical, Economical or Spiritual value, it still is better than some of the stuff I have read coming from Stephen Hawking or published in OMNI magazine. Though I find his writings, and many of the articles in OMNI interesting, I often see God through the words and findings of these non-believers. Maybe much as in the way the author of the article about eclipses seems to think he may see God through the, poor or not, mathematical equations that routinely take place and have done so for as long as men have been on this planet.
I, like you, have seen a lot of things and have done many things in our short years on this planet, almost 60 for me. But in a moment in the blink of an eye, you or I could be taken from this earth. Then what, Nothing? I choose to believe God has a plan for all of us. Whether we want to be part of his plan or not is our personal choice. So there is no need to knock people for believing in Christian values and ways or if they see God in something. I tend to think there are far more posers who call themselves Christians than there are genuine down to earth Blood bought Saints today than in the centuries past. And the organized church will probably get worse before it gets any better.
You live in a very intriguing part of the world, I have been fascinated by some of the landscapes I have seen from there. And I have had the pleasure of meeting some of the native Maori while I lived in Hawaii some years ago. New Zealand is one of the places I hope to visit some day, God willing. I have a close friend who lives in Christchurch, her father had me purchase and send him a set of Journals of Gen. Robert E Lee, basically they were his war notes, thoughts, Ideas, orders and charges he gave during the civil war. The first edition set I was able to get him were actually owned previously from one of Gen Lee's nephews and I found them in an old tobacco warehouse in Lynchburg Va.
Sorry to have bored you so here is where I will leave off by saying, be blessed my ATS friend.
I had someone a little while back claim "we Christians stole our description of the Devil/Satan from the Greek god Pan". So I corrected him by saying it was actually stolen from the Bible and it fits well with Ezekiel's description of a cherub. Remember under the Bible all men come from one of three lines of the sons of Noe/Noah.
I have a well rounded, though not a deep as you may, understanding of many mythologies. So ease up there a little, "neighbour".
Oh, you can lambast Christian universities all you want around me. I wasted enough time and money with them. They are actually created to create an elite class of religious Christians, some of which may not even be saved. So today many wont even consider you for a pastorate unless you have a Doctorate in Divinity. As far as I am concerned men have turned the calling of God into a means of employment. In the middle of my years at college I learned that it is their way or the highway. I even started a thread on the subject called The Conspiracy of the Religious Elite
I will take the Bible over any modern ape-man ideas on anything of science so called.
So you can quote a Gaulish poem it doesn't prove anything or make any difference to me or my understanding of who you are or are not. Speak clear English and you will always have my attention. I can always use the knowledge if it is true wisdom indeed. Paul said if you speak in an unknown tongue and no one interprets it is wasted and useless sounds. Speak to me five words of clear speech that give clear understanding and it is better than ten thousand in an unknown language.
I value your time you spend in response even if you don't agree with the article or the math. Pretty much you can google and see that his math is correct even if you feel it is sloppy. Oh, and I agree the measurements are off by a few degrees which adds to the uniqueness of each event as seen from the earths surface. Does it prove their is a God or Intelligence behind the planetary system of the earth? No, but anytime you have a repetitive event take place at differing times and places it is far from mere coincidence.
I challenge you to go and put together both the Helio/Geo-centric models (you can make them out of paper) and see that what I said about the two models, that they show the same movements of the planets as we see them today and have been going on long before you or I entered this world.
I am interested in knowing why you chose to use the Noun "Jehovah" and attributed it to his article when he had not? Are you Jewish by genealogy and thereby used it out of familiar understanding of the Tanak?
I do not believe I spoke anything to you, or the others who are reading these posts that could not be clearly understood. Like my use of quantum for measurement is not that just mere semantics? Even if you don't want to or choose not to believe the Bible as a source of anything Scientific, Mathematical, Economical or Spiritual value, it still is better than some of the stuff I have read coming from Stephen Hawking or published in OMNI magazine. Though I find his writings, and many of the articles in OMNI interesting, I often see God through the words and findings of these non-believers. Maybe much as in the way the author of the article about eclipses seems to think he may see God through the, poor or not, mathematical equations that routinely take place and have done so for as long as men have been on this planet.
I, like you, have seen a lot of things and have done many things in our short years on this planet, almost 60 for me. But in a moment in the blink of an eye, you or I could be taken from this earth. Then what, Nothing? I choose to believe God has a plan for all of us. Whether we want to be part of his plan or not is our personal choice. So there is no need to knock people for believing in Christian values and ways or if they see God in something. I tend to think there are far more posers who call themselves Christians than there are genuine down to earth Blood bought Saints today than in the centuries past. And the organized church will probably get worse before it gets any better.
You live in a very intriguing part of the world, I have been fascinated by some of the landscapes I have seen from there. And I have had the pleasure of meeting some of the native Maori while I lived in Hawaii some years ago. New Zealand is one of the places I hope to visit some day, God willing. I have a close friend who lives in Christchurch, her father had me purchase and send him a set of Journals of Gen. Robert E Lee, basically they were his war notes, thoughts, Ideas, orders and charges he gave during the civil war. The first edition set I was able to get him were actually owned previously from one of Gen Lee's nephews and I found them in an old tobacco warehouse in Lynchburg Va.
Sorry to have bored you so here is where I will leave off by saying, be blessed my ATS friend.
edit on 1-9-2017 by ChesterJohn because: (no reason given)
Now back to Eclipses.
I was reading through the Nestle-Aland Greek New Testament.
In their notes on the day Christ was crucified they claim there was a full solar eclipse that lasted 3 hours of total darkness. No other time in recorded history has this very strange and very unusual event taken place. Total darkness from an eclipse lasts about 2 to three minutes, and the longest ever recorded is 7 min 32 seconds.
Maybe you are unfamiliar with the Passover but it is always held on the first Full Moon of their religious calendar. From what we all know about full solar eclipses is that they always occur during a new moon, it would deny the laws of physics to have a full solar eclipse during a full moon. An object cannot be in two different places at the same time. It cannot being seen at midnight on one side of the earth and blocking the Sun light at 12 noon on the opposite side of the earth. Physically impossible.
So either Nestle-Aland are incorrect therefore we can throw out their made up Greek Text and all versions made from that erroneous document, one lie destroys their reputation and reliability to rightly divide the word of Truth. Just so we all understand. There are not complete and who Greek New Testaments anywhere. They made it up using other documents that were not Greek, nor have they or anyone else see a complete Greek ORIGINAL New Testament. NO such creature exists today let alone 100/200/300/ or even from the third century AD.
In this case of Nestle-Aland we know for sure solar eclipses do not prove the existence of God. Unless this event was not caused by the moon moving in front of the Sun but by some other object or by the Sun itself mot giving our it's light for three hours. That would be one big sun spot if you ask me.
I was reading through the Nestle-Aland Greek New Testament.
In their notes on the day Christ was crucified they claim there was a full solar eclipse that lasted 3 hours of total darkness. No other time in recorded history has this very strange and very unusual event taken place. Total darkness from an eclipse lasts about 2 to three minutes, and the longest ever recorded is 7 min 32 seconds.
Maybe you are unfamiliar with the Passover but it is always held on the first Full Moon of their religious calendar. From what we all know about full solar eclipses is that they always occur during a new moon, it would deny the laws of physics to have a full solar eclipse during a full moon. An object cannot be in two different places at the same time. It cannot being seen at midnight on one side of the earth and blocking the Sun light at 12 noon on the opposite side of the earth. Physically impossible.
So either Nestle-Aland are incorrect therefore we can throw out their made up Greek Text and all versions made from that erroneous document, one lie destroys their reputation and reliability to rightly divide the word of Truth. Just so we all understand. There are not complete and who Greek New Testaments anywhere. They made it up using other documents that were not Greek, nor have they or anyone else see a complete Greek ORIGINAL New Testament. NO such creature exists today let alone 100/200/300/ or even from the third century AD.
In this case of Nestle-Aland we know for sure solar eclipses do not prove the existence of God. Unless this event was not caused by the moon moving in front of the Sun but by some other object or by the Sun itself mot giving our it's light for three hours. That would be one big sun spot if you ask me.
I've got some bad news for you .... the New Testament is not considered a reliable historical text. Sorry. Hence its not "recored history".
Please do not assume, that because I am not Abrahamic, that I am unfamiliar with its myths and legends...sorry teachings
Thus if you apply Ocams Razor to your example. Based on observations from millennia of eclipses.the testament is erroneous. Its simple, you can buy a computer program (or probably program one, or find one in the interwebs) which will let you dial time back, to see when and how an eclipse happened, in locations of ones choice.
I chose Jehovah, as Christianity is at its very basic interpretation, a heretical sect of Jewish origin. Jesus (if he existed) was a Jew. His followers apparently claimed he was the son of the God of the Jews, Jehovah. QED Jehovah. Just as I am a follower of (among others) Danu, in the guise of An Morrigan (the Morrigan, which is one of the titles which can be ascribed to Anu/Danu). Either way, Jehovah is "God" is Allah. Same deity, different title. IT happens.
Pan is not the Devil. Pan is Pan. Pan is a Greek Indo-European deity. Any Christian who claims aught, needs to do some comparative Mythology. I'm most versed in the IE culture, though certain Polynesian ones (thanks to my location) and the Finnish are well known to me.
I quoted the prayer to Epona, because you quoted some of your religious writings at me. To prove the point. Neither prove a damned thing. You seem stuck on quoting the bible at me. Every now and again, I shall quote something back. To prove said point.
I am not knocking Christian values. I am challenging them as the only set of values out there. It seems perchance you are being a tad precious about them. Perhaps you also need to know, I was an Atheist at a Christian School before I was a Pagan. It instilled faith in me. Just not the one they expected My family are Athiests and Agnostics. I'm a Pagan. Never a Christian. The school I went to was a Scots Presbyterian one in my home town of Dunedin, known for high academic standards. I was never once punished for my choice of faith. As a real Christian would do. Those who judge are not Christians, as per the apparent word of your messiah.
I will ignore the rest of your comments on Science. They are straw men.
Please do not assume, that because I am not Abrahamic, that I am unfamiliar with its myths and legends...sorry teachings
Thus if you apply Ocams Razor to your example. Based on observations from millennia of eclipses.the testament is erroneous. Its simple, you can buy a computer program (or probably program one, or find one in the interwebs) which will let you dial time back, to see when and how an eclipse happened, in locations of ones choice.
I chose Jehovah, as Christianity is at its very basic interpretation, a heretical sect of Jewish origin. Jesus (if he existed) was a Jew. His followers apparently claimed he was the son of the God of the Jews, Jehovah. QED Jehovah. Just as I am a follower of (among others) Danu, in the guise of An Morrigan (the Morrigan, which is one of the titles which can be ascribed to Anu/Danu). Either way, Jehovah is "God" is Allah. Same deity, different title. IT happens.
Pan is not the Devil. Pan is Pan. Pan is a Greek Indo-European deity. Any Christian who claims aught, needs to do some comparative Mythology. I'm most versed in the IE culture, though certain Polynesian ones (thanks to my location) and the Finnish are well known to me.
I quoted the prayer to Epona, because you quoted some of your religious writings at me. To prove the point. Neither prove a damned thing. You seem stuck on quoting the bible at me. Every now and again, I shall quote something back. To prove said point.
I am not knocking Christian values. I am challenging them as the only set of values out there. It seems perchance you are being a tad precious about them. Perhaps you also need to know, I was an Atheist at a Christian School before I was a Pagan. It instilled faith in me. Just not the one they expected My family are Athiests and Agnostics. I'm a Pagan. Never a Christian. The school I went to was a Scots Presbyterian one in my home town of Dunedin, known for high academic standards. I was never once punished for my choice of faith. As a real Christian would do. Those who judge are not Christians, as per the apparent word of your messiah.
I will ignore the rest of your comments on Science. They are straw men.
Noinden, You are entitled to believe what ever you like about the Bible New and Old Testaments. But its historical evidence is there, its veracity by
historians and others true to Jesus Christ as being a real person, Scientific, facts on Astromomy are true, on Agriculture are true, on the
Psychological condition of the hearts of men are true, it's 600 Prophecies are true with over two hundred being proven true in the Birth, life,
recognition, death, burial, resurrection and ascension of Jesus Christ, some 70 plus true on the state of Israel from it's establishments to its
current state already proven, and some 400 more prophecies concerning the churches gathering to Christ, the seven year tribulation, the gathering of
the nations against Israel and the Lord's 2nd coming, the condemnation and judgement of the unbelievers, the 1,000 reign of Christ from Jerusalem, the
coming of the New Jerusalem from heaven, the new earth, the new heavens are still to come.
Thank you, for verifying that there was no eclipse on the day Jesus was Crucified, a verifiable fact of Roman documents found from the 1st century AD in the Palestine an area not a nation. And at the same time show that Nestle-Alands New Testament and their comments are an erroneous compilation of junk by so called scholarly Christian Religious Elite of this last century.
Stranger still is your continual use of the noun Jehovah. Most of the uses of JHVH, and Acronym given by the Jews as not to use his name in vain, which was transliterated into English as all Capital letters LORD. And that his English Acronym is only found three times used by Jesus and only when quoting an old testament verse. I however believe that only the preserved Bible is whole, complete, true, and pure. One book comprised of 66 books that I can hold in my hands and judge all things from it. So I will judge your intelligent observation that the God of the NT is Jehovah (by the way you are correct it is Jehovah but we know him as Jesus Christ, the only begotten of the Father, the WORD that became flesh that was and is God), however the name JEHOVAH and its Hebrew or English the acronyms are only used a few times out of 670 times in the New Testament.
To make such a claim that Jehovah is the God of the Christians in the NT means you believe that Jesus is God, but even the devils know that, yet they are not saved. And you say you don't believe the Bible yet your own words would say otherwise.
Let's see how many times Jesus used the Term JEHOVAH or its acronyms. Oh my only three times out of 231 uses of the word Lord found in the four Gospel writings/book Matthew, Mark, Luke and John respectfully, and it is only found in the first three books of the NT. It is recorded that Jesus used LORD in his quotes of the OT only all other times he refers to God Almighty as Lord and Himself as Lord.
From here on out I will use only word counts as the text would over whelm the post and I would have to put it in too many different post to be of any desire to get the point across. Can you guess what that point is?
Jesus himself never called his Father LORD, he always called him God or Father. "my father" is found 59 times, Jesus used God 279 times all referring to his father, and he quoted OT verses replacing LORD with God at least 40 times. He used the term god with a small "g" only twice and that only in John's written Gospel book.
Yet you claim to be more intelligent than I on many subjects (which I may concur you may be) but yet you nu-intelligently use the term Jehovah in it's whole spelling as being in the NT. We will need to go book by book after this so we can see which and what word is used by others if it be LORD, Lord, God, god, Father or father to see if what you say is true. Which in the end proves that Jesus Christ is Jehovah int he flesh and he and Allah have nothing alike. Jesus made many future predictions, Mohamed Allah's supposed "prophet" didn't make one prophecy about his so called nation of Islam, himself, his followers in either is Koran nor are there found any in the recordings of the Hadiths.
In Acts, Peter used the term LORD once in Acts 2 quoting a Bible verse. However, in the rest of the book of Acts the term Lord 100 times referring to Jesus by Peter, Stephan, James and Paul and once as lord referring to a man by Paul alone.
Paul never used LORD but he used Lord 39 times in Romans, 59 times in 1st Corinthians he never used the acronym LORD just the noun Lord even when referring to God. IN 2nd Corinthians he uses Lord 28 times even when referring to God not once did he use the name Jehovah or any of its Hebrew or English acronyms. In Galatians Paul uses the term Lord 7 times again never using Jehovah or any acronym. In Ephesians Paul uses Lord 25 times no LORD. In Philippians 15 times Paul sues Lord nothing else. 12 times in Colossians Paul says Lord no acronyms for Jehovah. Let's look in 1st and 2nd Thessalonians Paul uses the term Lord 41 times no Jehovah found here either. Now let's look int he four personal letters to individuals two of which is are Jews and tow are Gentiles. Once again Paul uses only the term Lord. Now let's move on to the book of Hebrews, in the preserved word it is said to be Paul who wrote it, so we will add it to the list of Paul's writings. Now remember he is writing to Hebrews/Jews/Israelite's, the funny thing is he never used the acronym or the full spelling of Jehovah, he only used the word Lord refering to Jesus and God.
In every book Paul wrote he used the term Lord and every time but he uses the term Lord even when quoting the Old Testament. Paul knew Jesus was the fullness of the Godhead bodily and that is why he never used the term LORD or Jehovah even once.
So let's look at all the rest of the New Testament James through Revelation and see how many times the word Jehovah/JHVH/LORD is used. Oh my it is used sixty-five times in the rest of the NT Bible and only twice used as LORD and that in conjunction with Jesus Christ and his return to the earth to establish the Kingdom as promised to the Jews.
So Your claim that your use of Jehovah is incorrect in that in the written word the term Jehovah can only be found very few times of the 670 it is used. most of that refers to Jesus Christ, some to the Lord God Almighty (used a bible to search this one), some for God the Father, And God. & a few times nouning men.
Thank you, for verifying that there was no eclipse on the day Jesus was Crucified, a verifiable fact of Roman documents found from the 1st century AD in the Palestine an area not a nation. And at the same time show that Nestle-Alands New Testament and their comments are an erroneous compilation of junk by so called scholarly Christian Religious Elite of this last century.
Stranger still is your continual use of the noun Jehovah. Most of the uses of JHVH, and Acronym given by the Jews as not to use his name in vain, which was transliterated into English as all Capital letters LORD. And that his English Acronym is only found three times used by Jesus and only when quoting an old testament verse. I however believe that only the preserved Bible is whole, complete, true, and pure. One book comprised of 66 books that I can hold in my hands and judge all things from it. So I will judge your intelligent observation that the God of the NT is Jehovah (by the way you are correct it is Jehovah but we know him as Jesus Christ, the only begotten of the Father, the WORD that became flesh that was and is God), however the name JEHOVAH and its Hebrew or English the acronyms are only used a few times out of 670 times in the New Testament.
To make such a claim that Jehovah is the God of the Christians in the NT means you believe that Jesus is God, but even the devils know that, yet they are not saved. And you say you don't believe the Bible yet your own words would say otherwise.
Let's see how many times Jesus used the Term JEHOVAH or its acronyms. Oh my only three times out of 231 uses of the word Lord found in the four Gospel writings/book Matthew, Mark, Luke and John respectfully, and it is only found in the first three books of the NT. It is recorded that Jesus used LORD in his quotes of the OT only all other times he refers to God Almighty as Lord and Himself as Lord.
Mt 22:44 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool?
Mr 12:36 For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The LORD said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
Lu 20:42 And David himself saith in the book of Psalms, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
From here on out I will use only word counts as the text would over whelm the post and I would have to put it in too many different post to be of any desire to get the point across. Can you guess what that point is?
Jesus himself never called his Father LORD, he always called him God or Father. "my father" is found 59 times, Jesus used God 279 times all referring to his father, and he quoted OT verses replacing LORD with God at least 40 times. He used the term god with a small "g" only twice and that only in John's written Gospel book.
Yet you claim to be more intelligent than I on many subjects (which I may concur you may be) but yet you nu-intelligently use the term Jehovah in it's whole spelling as being in the NT. We will need to go book by book after this so we can see which and what word is used by others if it be LORD, Lord, God, god, Father or father to see if what you say is true. Which in the end proves that Jesus Christ is Jehovah int he flesh and he and Allah have nothing alike. Jesus made many future predictions, Mohamed Allah's supposed "prophet" didn't make one prophecy about his so called nation of Islam, himself, his followers in either is Koran nor are there found any in the recordings of the Hadiths.
In Acts, Peter used the term LORD once in Acts 2 quoting a Bible verse. However, in the rest of the book of Acts the term Lord 100 times referring to Jesus by Peter, Stephan, James and Paul and once as lord referring to a man by Paul alone.
Paul never used LORD but he used Lord 39 times in Romans, 59 times in 1st Corinthians he never used the acronym LORD just the noun Lord even when referring to God. IN 2nd Corinthians he uses Lord 28 times even when referring to God not once did he use the name Jehovah or any of its Hebrew or English acronyms. In Galatians Paul uses the term Lord 7 times again never using Jehovah or any acronym. In Ephesians Paul uses Lord 25 times no LORD. In Philippians 15 times Paul sues Lord nothing else. 12 times in Colossians Paul says Lord no acronyms for Jehovah. Let's look in 1st and 2nd Thessalonians Paul uses the term Lord 41 times no Jehovah found here either. Now let's look int he four personal letters to individuals two of which is are Jews and tow are Gentiles. Once again Paul uses only the term Lord. Now let's move on to the book of Hebrews, in the preserved word it is said to be Paul who wrote it, so we will add it to the list of Paul's writings. Now remember he is writing to Hebrews/Jews/Israelite's, the funny thing is he never used the acronym or the full spelling of Jehovah, he only used the word Lord refering to Jesus and God.
In every book Paul wrote he used the term Lord and every time but he uses the term Lord even when quoting the Old Testament. Paul knew Jesus was the fullness of the Godhead bodily and that is why he never used the term LORD or Jehovah even once.
So let's look at all the rest of the New Testament James through Revelation and see how many times the word Jehovah/JHVH/LORD is used. Oh my it is used sixty-five times in the rest of the NT Bible and only twice used as LORD and that in conjunction with Jesus Christ and his return to the earth to establish the Kingdom as promised to the Jews.
Re 19:12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.
So Your claim that your use of Jehovah is incorrect in that in the written word the term Jehovah can only be found very few times of the 670 it is used. most of that refers to Jesus Christ, some to the Lord God Almighty (used a bible to search this one), some for God the Father, And God. & a few times nouning men.
edit on 4-9-2017 by ChesterJohn because: (no reason given)
a reply to: Noinden
what ever you quote please do so in English.
Thanks for your ammo against Nestle-Aland and their erroneous conclusion of an eclipse during the Crucifixion.
Your mythologies are the MYTHS which are nothing more than a set of beliefs or assumptions in this case about the Bible being one of many recurrent narratives or themes, so you read them all and believe none, yet a true form of MYTHOS is combining all the Myths you have knowledge of and its rhetoric of the so called myths which when scientifically applied will create a conforming image in a linear progression toward the truth. That is Myths when joined together and then eliminating that which is in them that don't show unity in a scientific observation of said myths, then in the end will remove all that man has added and then lead you to only one final truth,
what ever you quote please do so in English.
Thanks for your ammo against Nestle-Aland and their erroneous conclusion of an eclipse during the Crucifixion.
Your mythologies are the MYTHS which are nothing more than a set of beliefs or assumptions in this case about the Bible being one of many recurrent narratives or themes, so you read them all and believe none, yet a true form of MYTHOS is combining all the Myths you have knowledge of and its rhetoric of the so called myths which when scientifically applied will create a conforming image in a linear progression toward the truth. That is Myths when joined together and then eliminating that which is in them that don't show unity in a scientific observation of said myths, then in the end will remove all that man has added and then lead you to only one final truth,
GOD!
.edit on 4-9-2017 by ChesterJohn because: (no reason given)
a reply to: ChesterJohn
Neighbour, I am not going to quote something that may be lost in translation. My point was it has meaning to me. I understood it. Your bible quotes are meaningless to me. Thus it appears you miss the point repeatedly. However as you can't do the leg work. I have a translation at the bottom in Italics (1)
You are getting very defensive over your mythology (the bible). It is not a historically accurate document. No matter how much you wish it were so. I certainly would never claim the Lebor Gabála Érenn was historically accurate. I take what I need from it. Yet you are deciding my spiritual framework is inferior to your spiritual frame work. You don't know anything about my beliefs.
The fact remains Christianity is at its beginning a Jewish Sect. As I said the Bible is not a historically accurate doccument (more correctly a collected and selected set of doccuments. Which has been heavily edited, translated from several languages through several languages, to several other languages. You can quote Saul sorry Paul all you like. It does not mean the truth is different
I will return to the fact. You can not demonstrate deity, deities, or holy pasta using mathematics. First you must be able to measure the divine, which would require the definintion of it, and thus placing a limit upon it.
Your little Deity is not proven. No matter how hard you wish, and dodge questions.
(1) Great mother, mighty queen Noble and shining in the light of Riuro Great might is borne in your blood With firm hand you help your offspring Mistress of horses, leader of horsemen Your strong voice speaks In the beauty of life August mother goddess Adorned by the magnificence of roses Mother, mother, mother, goddess and helper Mistress of horses, riding queen "Figure on the walls of sickening stables" Quoth the ignorant Blind to the beauty of life They do not see the vanity Of manmade pomp
Neighbour, I am not going to quote something that may be lost in translation. My point was it has meaning to me. I understood it. Your bible quotes are meaningless to me. Thus it appears you miss the point repeatedly. However as you can't do the leg work. I have a translation at the bottom in Italics (1)
You are getting very defensive over your mythology (the bible). It is not a historically accurate document. No matter how much you wish it were so. I certainly would never claim the Lebor Gabála Érenn was historically accurate. I take what I need from it. Yet you are deciding my spiritual framework is inferior to your spiritual frame work. You don't know anything about my beliefs.
The fact remains Christianity is at its beginning a Jewish Sect. As I said the Bible is not a historically accurate doccument (more correctly a collected and selected set of doccuments. Which has been heavily edited, translated from several languages through several languages, to several other languages. You can quote Saul sorry Paul all you like. It does not mean the truth is different
I will return to the fact. You can not demonstrate deity, deities, or holy pasta using mathematics. First you must be able to measure the divine, which would require the definintion of it, and thus placing a limit upon it.
Your little Deity is not proven. No matter how hard you wish, and dodge questions.
(1) Great mother, mighty queen Noble and shining in the light of Riuro Great might is borne in your blood With firm hand you help your offspring Mistress of horses, leader of horsemen Your strong voice speaks In the beauty of life August mother goddess Adorned by the magnificence of roses Mother, mother, mother, goddess and helper Mistress of horses, riding queen "Figure on the walls of sickening stables" Quoth the ignorant Blind to the beauty of life They do not see the vanity Of manmade pomp
edit on 4-9-2017 by Noinden because: (no reason given)
edit on
4-9-2017 by Noinden because: (no reason given)
a reply to: Noinden
I have read numerous reports, of which if you care to you can find in a simple google search that even atheist scientist agree that "some" bible facts are true. Having said that I believe as God said he would preserve his words to every generation forever. So for me there is one English version out of the nearly 400 English versions made since 1830 is the preserved word of God. Having said that I agree to your opinion that you don't believe the bible above any other Myth and challenged you to do what is to be done with Mythos, take them all eliminate that which does not agree in a systematic scientific way of observation and in the end only one thing remains GOD. I have read and studied many myths myself and have gone down this road in my BC days. And I can say affirmatively that in the end God is all there is.
Mathematics does not prove God in that I agree but were we not in agreement that eclipses which happen at mathematically determined times also do not prove God? So that statement is moot.
There is nothing in your poems that prove any point you have made. And I already read it in English, there by I make this statement "that I do see the beauty in life" and I agree that man made pomp is vanity and self serving. Even the Bible says such but seeing you do not wish the Bible to be quoted to you I shall stop.
For if you will not hear the word of God preserved for you in English unto this generation then you are without true wisdom but just empty pompery of self worth which stand not against the tides of time nor the seas of truth. Weak are the bones of men and the flesh which hangeth about them, and their ways are unknown even to themselves.
I shake off the dust of my feet and leave you be to yourself. In short this will be my last reply to you, unless you are interested in learning the preserved word of God. But of course by true scientific observation I have seen by your lack of intelligent understanding of that Book of which you do need to know it better I leave it to you and that is your choice not mine.
Good Day, oh soldier of fate, may the light be above you as noon daylight, and your sword ever sharp as thy wit and thy wallow, fortune favoreth them who in their might doeth take for themselves but leave nothing for them who follow.
I have read numerous reports, of which if you care to you can find in a simple google search that even atheist scientist agree that "some" bible facts are true. Having said that I believe as God said he would preserve his words to every generation forever. So for me there is one English version out of the nearly 400 English versions made since 1830 is the preserved word of God. Having said that I agree to your opinion that you don't believe the bible above any other Myth and challenged you to do what is to be done with Mythos, take them all eliminate that which does not agree in a systematic scientific way of observation and in the end only one thing remains GOD. I have read and studied many myths myself and have gone down this road in my BC days. And I can say affirmatively that in the end God is all there is.
Mathematics does not prove God in that I agree but were we not in agreement that eclipses which happen at mathematically determined times also do not prove God? So that statement is moot.
There is nothing in your poems that prove any point you have made. And I already read it in English, there by I make this statement "that I do see the beauty in life" and I agree that man made pomp is vanity and self serving. Even the Bible says such but seeing you do not wish the Bible to be quoted to you I shall stop.
For if you will not hear the word of God preserved for you in English unto this generation then you are without true wisdom but just empty pompery of self worth which stand not against the tides of time nor the seas of truth. Weak are the bones of men and the flesh which hangeth about them, and their ways are unknown even to themselves.
I shake off the dust of my feet and leave you be to yourself. In short this will be my last reply to you, unless you are interested in learning the preserved word of God. But of course by true scientific observation I have seen by your lack of intelligent understanding of that Book of which you do need to know it better I leave it to you and that is your choice not mine.
Good Day, oh soldier of fate, may the light be above you as noon daylight, and your sword ever sharp as thy wit and thy wallow, fortune favoreth them who in their might doeth take for themselves but leave nothing for them who follow.
edit on 5-9-2017 by ChesterJohn because: (no reason given)
a reply to: ChesterJohn
"Some facts are true" do not make a reliable document. Pseudo Science (for example) leverages a few convenient truths, to hide a greater unprovable (or deceptive) supposition.
I'm going to beat this next point to death.
The Mathmatics from that article do not prove let alone predict eclipses. The only thing that can do that is repeated observations, based on calculations. Those calculations are far less cutesy than that article tried.
Why should I hear the word of your God? "He" is not my deity. My deities speak to me clearly.
Oh and you can quote Sir Thomas Moore at me all you like. You still don't understand my faith
"Some facts are true" do not make a reliable document. Pseudo Science (for example) leverages a few convenient truths, to hide a greater unprovable (or deceptive) supposition.
I'm going to beat this next point to death.
The Mathmatics from that article do not prove let alone predict eclipses. The only thing that can do that is repeated observations, based on calculations. Those calculations are far less cutesy than that article tried.
Why should I hear the word of your God? "He" is not my deity. My deities speak to me clearly.
Oh and you can quote Sir Thomas Moore at me all you like. You still don't understand my faith
a reply to: Noinden
Mathematics can and is now the norm for basing the future dates of almost every Solar and Lunar events, The observable events were calculated Mathematically and put into binary code so that their computers can point out every future and even the past events. His measurements of the moon, the distances from the earth of both the moon and the Sun were most definitely correct, all were based on mathematical calculations, maybe only his conclusion about an intelligent designer was in error. However for him it was not in error.
Actually it was not just Sir Thomas Moore, it was a mixture of many writers many I am sure you have never even read, and that I calculated by the fact you only recognized a few words out of 96 words in total that made up my closing salutation. Most of it is not even found on the internet, some of it can be found in public domain but you would have to search through it and download and read it, and public libraries if they still carry such.
Only Jesus Christ, the LORD God Almighty can save a man from hell all other deities lead only to destruction.
Be blessed my friend I leave you to it.
Mathematics can and is now the norm for basing the future dates of almost every Solar and Lunar events, The observable events were calculated Mathematically and put into binary code so that their computers can point out every future and even the past events. His measurements of the moon, the distances from the earth of both the moon and the Sun were most definitely correct, all were based on mathematical calculations, maybe only his conclusion about an intelligent designer was in error. However for him it was not in error.
Actually it was not just Sir Thomas Moore, it was a mixture of many writers many I am sure you have never even read, and that I calculated by the fact you only recognized a few words out of 96 words in total that made up my closing salutation. Most of it is not even found on the internet, some of it can be found in public domain but you would have to search through it and download and read it, and public libraries if they still carry such.
Only Jesus Christ, the LORD God Almighty can save a man from hell all other deities lead only to destruction.
Be blessed my friend I leave you to it.
a reply to: ChesterJohn
Oh lookie yoy are not done.
Mathmatics is indeed the basis. NOT the mathmatics from that article however.
Now stop proselyting at me. Your little dying deity does not impress me. I am seeing your insecurities peaking through. Again you don't understand my spirituality
Oh lookie yoy are not done.
Mathmatics is indeed the basis. NOT the mathmatics from that article however.
Now stop proselyting at me. Your little dying deity does not impress me. I am seeing your insecurities peaking through. Again you don't understand my spirituality
a reply to: Noinden
I believe I have had enough of your biased meanderings, the math he used is known to all, it is his conclusion you called a myth of which you made it clear you don't believe any of them to be true. Oh wait a minute you just told cavtrooper in his thread you do believe in myths but you used the word gnoses (mispelled), you are either delusional or, transliterated from the Greek to English, a hupokrites.
Good grief are they Myths or Gnosis (spelled correctly)/Spiritual knowledge?
You can't have it both ways unless you admit to being a hupokrites
I believe I have had enough of your biased meanderings, the math he used is known to all, it is his conclusion you called a myth of which you made it clear you don't believe any of them to be true. Oh wait a minute you just told cavtrooper in his thread you do believe in myths but you used the word gnoses (mispelled), you are either delusional or, transliterated from the Greek to English, a hupokrites.
Good grief are they Myths or Gnosis (spelled correctly)/Spiritual knowledge?
You can't have it both ways unless you admit to being a hupokrites
edit on 6-9-2017 by ChesterJohn because: (no reason given)
a reply to: ChesterJohn
No. Solar eclipses are proof that the moon gets in the way of the sun as viewed from earth and only in certain places (it doesn't happen simultaneously around the world) at certain times.
The moons also moving away from us so, in roughly 600 million years, there will no longer be total solar eclipses.
To even suggest eclipses are proof of a deity is nonsensical. I can make my own personal eclipse with my thumb. Does that me god?
Are solar eclipses proof of God?
No. Solar eclipses are proof that the moon gets in the way of the sun as viewed from earth and only in certain places (it doesn't happen simultaneously around the world) at certain times.
The moons also moving away from us so, in roughly 600 million years, there will no longer be total solar eclipses.
To even suggest eclipses are proof of a deity is nonsensical. I can make my own personal eclipse with my thumb. Does that me god?
edit on
692017 by TerryDon79 because: (no reason given)
a reply to: TerryDon79
I never made the claim that it did. I even said it does not prove God exists. It was however the conclusion of the author of the article.
My only agreement was the math of which we are told by one poster the mathematical measurements are correct yet by another they are not correct.
I guess if your thumb would cover it so others over a vast distance and period of time could see your thumb eclipse the sun yes you could be a god. But I will remind you that any man who says there is no God has in and of himself become his own god.
I never made the claim that it did. I even said it does not prove God exists. It was however the conclusion of the author of the article.
My only agreement was the math of which we are told by one poster the mathematical measurements are correct yet by another they are not correct.
I guess if your thumb would cover it so others over a vast distance and period of time could see your thumb eclipse the sun yes you could be a god. But I will remind you that any man who says there is no God has in and of himself become his own god.
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